does anyone else not get indie music?

pjfan020

Bands like the shins, modest mouse, bright eyes etc.. are vastly overrated to me. I was just curious as to what the big deal is with a lot of these artists. A lot of them have the same whiney out of key vocal approach that irritates the hell out of me. I mean i'm a huge dylan and neil young fan but some of these guys can't sing at all. Musically speaking a lot of them don't seem to have much talent either and it seems odd that some of these bands are so popular but aren't really that great at the instruments they play. My gf listens to a lot of the stuff so i hear it all the time and to be quite honest a lot of it sounds the same to me. If you listen to the stuff I'm not bashing you or anything, i'm just curious.

hendrix78

I agree. I liked indie music when it was bands like the Minutemen, Dinosaur Jr., and Screaming Trees. Most of the popular indie stuff now is incredibly boring to me. I don't find it rhythymically or melodically interesting. Where are the new bands with great singers and guitar players who write great riffs and use their instruments to push musical boundaries?

Blind Melon

No.

intodeep

I understand what you are saying. some of it i can't get into myself, but i love a lot of it.

You don't find a lot of guitar shredding in the sterotypical "indie rock" band. so if you are looking for mike mcready esq solo's it is usually not the place.

Although there are those bands that deliver that. Dinosaur Jr (J Mascis is a fucking god in my opinion on guitar) and Built to Spill are two great examples of where they have a lead guitarist that rips it up.

For me a lot of it is melody and song structure. Wilco writes some very simplistic songs but to me the lyrics are great and the overall melody is AWESOME (plus with nels cline in the band they do have a lead guitarist who can rip it up nels is bad ass!) The shins and arcade fire are like this too. Great melody in their songs and I tend to identify with their lyrics quite a bit.

They seem a bit more grown up in their lyrical content compared to some of the stuff you hear on the radio now adays (ie fall out boy, panic at hte disco, hinder etc)

I think Issac Brock (of modes mouse) and Jeff Tweedy (of wilco) are two of my favorite lyrcist. I just really enjoy what they tend to write and how they portray it.

Not to mention bands like the Flaming Lips... Their music and lyrics are just interesting. I don't think anyone can listen to the song Do you Realize and not be touched by it. One of my all time favorite songs. Simple lyrics and simple song structure but it just flows and has an overall wonderful feel.

So those are some of the reasons why i love a lot of indie rock. Some of it is crap... a lot of it is good. some of it is blown out of proportion and their is a hipster scene that is more worried about being the first to know about a band then actually enjoying the band and that sucks but some great music come out of that community.

Albums i love:
Flaming Lips- Soft bulliten
Dinosaur Jr- You're Living all over me
Modest Mouse- Lonely Crowded West
Built to SPill- Perfect From now On
Neutral milk hotel- in an areoplane over the sea
arcade fire- funeral
wilco- yankee hotel foxtrot


I think all of these are top notch!

Blind Melon

intodeep wrote:

I think Issac Brock (of modes mouse) and Jeff Tweedy (of wilco) are two of my favorite lyrcist. I just really enjoy what they tend to write and how they portray it.

Dude yeah, definitely. Isaac Brock is absolutely insane when it comes to lyrics.

intodeep wrote:

Modest Mouse- Lonesome Crowded West

Sorry, I just had to correct your error :-X

hendrix78

It isn't neccessarily the lack of guitar "shredding" that makes me not like most current indie music. I like alot of punk and artists like Dylan and Neil Young that have more simplistic guitar styles. I also love a lot of reggae, funk, and hip hop that contain no guitar solos. I like some Modest Mouse and Wilco stuff I've heard. I'm definitely the kind of listener that hardcore Modest Mouse fans despise, though, because I loved the 2 singles off their last album, but nothing else on the album really grabbed me. Those singles had great vocal melodies and interesting things going on musically, i.e. cool effects on the guitars, good grooves and good use of dynamics.

Based on the hype, I listened to samples of Arcade Fire and Bright Eyes and thought it was extremely boring. I should also point out that I don't really give a crap about lyrics. I appreciate it if a song has really good lyrics, but if the music is just a jangly guitar strum without an interesting groove to it, I'm not going to care how brilliant the words are.

One band that I have seen described as indie that I really like is the Hold Steady. While not too flashy, I like the guitar work on their most recent album, the songs are very catchy, and I like the "storytelling" vibe the vocals give it.

So I guess I like some indie music, but find most examples of the genre limited and boring.

p.s. I agree Mascis is a god on the guitar, and I really like Nels Cline (especially his work with Mike Watt) and Built to Spill. I guess I would just categorize these bands more as "alternative" rather than indie.

Todd76

hendrix78 wrote:

Based on the hype, I listened to samples of Arcade Fire and Bright Eyes and thought it was extremely boring.

While I do know of a couple people who dont care for Arcade Fire (which is fine I guess - to each their own) I have NEVER heard anyone describe them as "boring"....WOW

HoorayForHumans

it's actually just a conspiracy to make people feel out of the loop

musicismylife78

for me the appeal of indie music is the authenticity, and the emotion, the raw power. When Justin Timberlake or Hinder perform a song, its so formulaic, and lacks emotion, and the emotion that is conjured up is just superficial.

The power of a Damien Rice, or The Shins, or Modest Mouse or whoever, is that the emotion is the music. Its right there. For me, listening to Damien Rice's O for the first time, its shocking and disturbing how much power their is the music. It knocks the wind out of you. I get the feeling that indie artists speak from their heart, and play music from their heart. Its evident from the first chord on any of their records.

Indeed I love many major label artists, after all I am posting here on a Pearl Jam website. But for the most part, its all about the emotion. And in my view, listening to The Moon and Antartica by Modest Mouse, thats powerful stuff. its hard to deal with, hard to make sense of. But I think thats the point. Or listening to Bright Eyes. In my mind these bands arent out to swindle little children of their lawnmowing cash, they are out to make us feel something.

I feel the power of the music, and I feel the power that saying something in music can have.

Very rarely does that emotion seep through in a major label band. There are exceptions of course. But I mean, listen to a Bright Eyes song. he sounds like he is on the verge of a breakdown. Its real, exposed music. Thats what draws me to indie music.

I am sick of overprocessed, overcommercialized, overpromoted, filler. I need real stuff.

soulsinging

hendrix78 wrote:

It isn't neccessarily the lack of guitar "shredding" that makes me not like most current indie music. I like alot of punk and artists like Dylan and Neil Young that have more simplistic guitar styles. I also love a lot of reggae, funk, and hip hop that contain no guitar solos. I like some Modest Mouse and Wilco stuff I've heard. I'm definitely the kind of listener that hardcore Modest Mouse fans despise, though, because I loved the 2 singles off their last album, but nothing else on the album really grabbed me. Those singles had great vocal melodies and interesting things going on musically, i.e. cool effects on the guitars, good grooves and good use of dynamics.

Based on the hype, I listened to samples of Arcade Fire and Bright Eyes and thought it was extremely boring. I should also point out that I don't really give a crap about lyrics. I appreciate it if a song has really good lyrics, but if the music is just a jangly guitar strum without an interesting groove to it, I'm not going to care how brilliant the words are.

One band that I have seen described as indie that I really like is the Hold Steady. While not too flashy, I like the guitar work on their most recent album, the songs are very catchy, and I like the "storytelling" vibe the vocals give it.

So I guess I like some indie music, but find most examples of the genre limited and boring.

p.s. I agree Mascis is a god on the guitar, and I really like Nels Cline (especially his work with Mike Watt) and Built to Spill. I guess I would just categorize these bands more as "alternative" rather than indie.

im wondering what arcade fire you listened to that makes you say they're boring? bright eyes i can see, they're not for everyone. but arcade fire is so epic i think anyone could dig em.

hold steady are awesome though.

im with you though... ive never been a huge lyrics guy. im more about emotion and sound.

1STmammal2wearPants

i was that way with a lot of the music......before i discovered some of the bands that are "so-called" indie bands that are just plain old good music. ill agree with the whiney vocals of acts like bright eyes, but the shins to me are just fucking good pop music. it's not really indie. take a listen to 'chutes too narrow' and the song 'so says i.' it's beach boys written all over it- not indie music at all.

hendrix78

Maybe I should give the Arcade Fire another shot. It was a while ago and I don't remember what it sounded like very well. Maybe I just wasnt in the right mood for it that day. I agree it's all about the emotion, but the emotion honestly sounds forced in a lot of modern indie music to me. For my ears Neil Young's guitar solos on like a Hurricane are some of the most emotional musical experiences I've ever had. I remember seeing him with Crazy Horse close to ten years ago, and Like a Hurricane was so powerful, I could barely stand it.

I also love a lot of old blues music for emotional content. Love in Vain by Robert Johnson is a good example. Maybe most indie music just sounds too "white" for my taste (man, I hope I'm not gonna start some racial debate with that comment). I just mean I like some blues and soul influences in most of my music. Otis Redding is another good example of someone whose music is pure emotion to me.

No_ones_rival

these days indie is just another marketiong tool like grunge and alternative was in the 90's... but to answer your question, no, I really don't get most of it, however I can see how some would like it. There is some talent there, but just not my style

intodeep

Well I did not think the last Modest Mouse album was phenominal but i enjoyed it. Black Caddilacs was won of my favs on the album.

As for the Arcade Fire I have friends who don't like them who say they are boring or "wussy" music whatever that means. I would suggest checking out songs like powerout, rebellion (lies), wake up, and neiborhood #2 lakia. some of their more upbeat and cooler songs from that album i thought.

Neil's solo on Like a hurricane is one of my favorites ever. It is not technical but you know the guy playing is pooring his heart out into it.

pearljam_addiction

I love Indie Music, in the past couple of years it seems liek its the only type of music i buy. 70% of what i listen to nowadays are indie bands.

some of my favorites include:
Bloc Party
My Morning Jacket
Trail of Dead
Sleater Kinney
/kings of Leon
Damien Rice
arcade fire
broken social scene
Interpol
Sufjan stevens

musicismylife78

i totally agree with you about Uncle Neil. His guitar solos are incredible. And any song he performs has an amazing amount of emotion. I totally agree. Just listen to Southern man. Even his guitar sounds furious. Or listen to that song on the On the Beach record. Ambulence Blues. He is very powerful there. Powerful stuff.

But I think emotion can also be found on indie records. Maybe you will think indie music is phony, and thats fine, thats your perogative. But in my own personal opinion, indie music just has something about it that major label music doesnt. Its hard to explain, its just the way it is.

I had a thread on here awhile back, where I argued that indie label music was more artistic and they had more freedom. I think that is accurate. As always there are exceptions to every rule, but by and large an indie band will and does lay its emotions on the line, they say what they feel, whether the audience and the public want to hear it or not. An example being someone like Aesop Rock. He is an indie hip hop artist on Def Jux an indie label. Anyways, his music is strange, very abstract. He is one of the best rhymers in the game, and I consider him almost a Dylan in hip hop. Anyways one of his songs is about LSD, and its genious the last few minutes he starts rhyming things, and they all are statements that contain those letters for example "Lazy summer days
Like some decrepit" Sounds wierd, but its something I dont think a major label would approve of. Someone blantantly discussing this stuff.

Or Devendra Banhart. Someone who is very odd, who professes admiration for Charles Manson in interviews. Yet his music is so raw and so honest.

or Cat Power. That song "Names".

I dont think major labels support those types of bands or songs. They want the next hit. And lets be honest, the songs that have the most power to knock us off our feet, or to blow our minds, arent necessarily Billboard top 10 material.

As I said before I also think the fact that most indie bands arent fabulously wealthy also lends credence to their music. I dont think about money when I listen to Bright Eyes, or Cat Power, I listen to the music.

As far as why bands that were just named in this thread, why they are indie and why they would recommend indie music, is I think the same reasons I outlined.

There is a reason Fugazi isnt on a major label or Cat Power isnt, or Bright Eyes isnt or whoever. And its not because they arent talented, or deserving of a major label contract.

I just think its honesty. If you are on a major label raking in the cash you are less likely to be honest with yourself and the audience. Greed kicks in. Being yourself isnt as important as being sucessfull and profitable, in that world.
But an indie band doesnt have to deal with that.

musicismylife78

I just think very rarely do bands like Arcade Fire, or Built to Spill or Fugazi, appear on major labels. Usually whats the cream of the crop is in the underground.

Theres a hip hop poet I am a fan of Saul Williams. And he said one time, that he felt that all the good music he has to go searching for, online or at the record store. it isnt featured, or put on display or covered in the newsmedia. He said why should we have to search for good music, but the latest crap by Justin Timberlake is so easily accessible, it should be the other way around.

I completely agree. And I think he is on to something. Usually whats good, isnt on the cover of Spin or in the pages of Rolling Stone.

I mean does anyone here watch VH1 or MTV videos? Do you really think the stuff on those channells is the cream of the musical crop?

BetterManningNYG

s_rockvam wrote:

these days indie is just another marketiong tool like grunge and alternative was in the 90's...

this is a really important point. i guess it depends on how we define the genre in general. i like a lot of older indie music, but i really don't get this whole "mainstream indie" movement that's been going on for the last few years. i know that there are many legitimate indie bands out there, but i believe that there are just as many bands who maintain an indie appearance solely to achieve mainstream success. this notion is damaging to music in general. punk rock became compromised when "pop punk" came onto the scene, and i feel like some of these newer bands are having a similar effect on indie rock because they represent the same type of contradiction.

maybe these "phony" indie bands are the minority, but since my taste in music isn't really geared towards current indie, i have trouble figuring out who is legit and who isn't.

i also think that many of these hipster-types come across as pretentious. i don't have a problem with pretentious music in general, as i am a huge tool fan. but sometimes i'll talk to people who give off the impression that they are socially better than anyone who doesn't understand why their style of music is considered to be good. again, i'm sure it's a minority of indie bands who think along these lines. but i definitely have a problem with someone thinking that they're better than me just because their interpretation of how to play the guitar is different from my own.

"different" is probably the most important term here. all legitimate music is emotional, but individual people differ in terms of how they are impacted by different styles. for me, a lot of indie just doesn't contain the specific elements that appeal to me as a music fan (although i'm not gonna detail this any further because i don't think music should be broken down so objectively). and to be fair, there are some indie bands who i think are pretty good.... arcade fire, my morning jacket, built to spill, kings of leon... there's some good songwriting there. but if death cab for cutie finds its way onto my TV one more time, i'm gonna hit somebody.

and just for the record, i don't really listen to what's on the radio either. i gave that up ten years ago. there's some real bullshit out there in the mainstream right now. panic at the disco's music ranks among humanity's worst crimes.

letsongsprotest

Indie
Major Label
Grunge
Punk
Pop
Blah, blah, blah....


Good music is good music
Shitty music is shitty music

lucylespian

Reminds me of altlernative music when i was at Uni, the UNi radio station JJJ ised to flog it
Can't sing, can't play lets do a song for Triple J !!!!!

JOEJOEJOE

pjfan020 wrote:

Bands like the shins, modest mouse, bright eyes etc.. are vastly overrated to me. I was just curious as to what the big deal is with a lot of these artists. A lot of them have the same whiney out of key vocal approach that irritates the hell out of me. I mean i'm a huge dylan and neil young fan but some of these guys can't sing at all. Musically speaking a lot of them don't seem to have much talent either and it seems odd that some of these bands are so popular but aren't really that great at the instruments they play. My gf listens to a lot of the stuff so i hear it all the time and to be quite honest a lot of it sounds the same to me. If you listen to the stuff I'm not bashing you or anything, i'm just curious.

No matter what people think of the newer indie bands, I am glad the kids are into this stuff, as opposed to Limp Bisciut, Korn and the other Rap-rock bands that dominated a few years back!

Bright Eyes (Connor) is a great songwriter, and seems to have a way of speaking for many with his political/social commentary lyrics.

I agree that many of the vocals are whiney....Death Cab for Cutie really annoys me!

FreshTendrils

Indie is a label that really doesn't make any sense and people use it to describe a shitload of different styles and sound of music, a lot like how classic rock is used to define Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, and The Beatles. Crazy. Good music is good music, I don't care what genre/label its under.

Brainofdz

People get too hung up on labels. Good music is good music and vice versa.
That being said, I'm not a big fan of many of the popular bands that are branded "indie" these days: The Shins, Death Cab, Ben Kweller

Most of my favorites probably fall under the indie umbrella though

drew0

I think a lot of the stuff out today is vastly overrated, and they're hyping over nothing. From my perspective, they're just excited over it because it's the only half-way decent music that's come out in this pathetic decade.

Anyway, a lot of indie bands I like - Wilco is absolutely amazing, Modest Mouse is pretty good, and Bright Eyes can be alright depending on my mood and the song. I've recently gotten into the Shins, and while I think they're extremely good and talented, I think some people make them out to be a lot more then they are. One band that I cannot get into is Clap Your Hands Say Yeah!, which besides having a name that makes me want to cry, they sound like boring and just plain...bad. I can't get into Arcade Fire, or the Decemberists or a handful of other bands that I think are boring.

In other words, most people overrated it, you're right. Some of the bands can be great, others are just plain boring.

direwolf74

Indie bands that kick my ass on a daily basis:

Wilco
The Hold Steady
Neko Case
Arcade Fire
The Weakerthans
Sarah Harmer
Drive-By Truckers
The New Pornographers
Matt Mays & El Torpedo
The Constantines
Kathleen Edwards
Joel Plaskett Emergency

...just to name a few.

direwolf74

letsongsprotest wrote:

Indie
Major Label
Grunge
Punk
Pop
Blah, blah, blah....


Good music is good music
Shitty music is shitty music

Agreed!

BetterManningNYG

FreshTendrils wrote:

Indie is a label that really doesn't make any sense and people use it to describe a shitload of different styles and sound of music, a lot like how classic rock is used to define Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, and The Beatles. Crazy. Good music is good music, I don't care what genre/label its under.

very true. good music is good music.

the problem occurs when bands try to define themselves, not when others try to define them. there are so many bands that try to squeeze themselves into convenient, pre-packaged genres, and this is what detracts from the overall quality of the music more than anything else. i guess this has been going on for as long as music has been commercialized.

the best bands/artists are the ones who burst onto the scene with music that cannot be adequately described by any one specific genre... pearl jam, alice in chains, nirvana, mudhoney, jane's addiction, guns n' roses, the ramones, the who, black sabbath, led zeppelin, the doors, pink floyd, bob dylan, the beatles, etc, etc, etc...

also, i just decided that "mark lanegan" is a genre of music. i'm not sure what this has to do with anything but i'm kinda wasted so there you go...

pearljam_addiction

JOEJOEJOE wrote:

No matter what people think of the newer indie bands, I am glad the kids are into this stuff, as opposed to Limp Bisciut, Korn and the other Rap-rock bands that dominated a few years back!

Agreed, id rather kids today pick up a guitar and play rock music than pop or rap. i would rather see a kid dressed up as an emo poster child than one who is thugged-out listening to young jeezy or Dem franchise boys

brhf9

letsongsprotest wrote:

Indie
Major Label
Grunge
Punk
Pop
Blah, blah, blah....


Good music is good music
Shitty music is shitty music

(2)

Jeremy1012

I cant imagine how anyone could not like the Shins. they arent my normal type of music but I just cant argue with their songs. so catchy.


best indie band ever - pavement

Brainofdz

Jeremy1012 wrote:

I cant imagine how anyone could not like the Shins. they arent my normal type of music but I just cant argue with their songs. so catchy.


best indie band ever - pavement

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