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Rock still dangerous, scary and evil?

musicismylife78musicismylife78 Posts: 6,116
edited August 2008 in Other Music
Seems like rock music has always been tied to the devil and scaring people. From Robert Johnson's infamous deal, to the Stones Sympathy for the Devil, to how parents react to alot of the music, to marilyn manson etc...

But as far as I can tell, it doesnt seem like music or rock music specificially is scary to people anymore. In many ways its what teens, rebellious individuals are SUPPOSED to listen to and be interested in. Its a given.

The Onion awhile back had a great article about how Marilyn manson felt left out because he wasnt scaring people anymore, his antics werent outrageous to anyone anymore. In many ways, as usual the parody of the onion is right on.

I cant think of many rock bands nowadays who like Led Zep or Sabbath, or Manson, who flirted with the devil and tried to scare america's parents.

Are we all so jaded and cynical now, that rock music doesnt scare us anymore? The way our grandparents reacted when our parents started listening to The Doors or The Beatles or Elvis. Even heavy metal nowadays isnt tied into the devil and evil and scariness anymore.

What happened?
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Yellow LedbellyYellow Ledbelly Posts: 3,749
    Rap took the scariness of music to whole new level and the metalheads just couldn't keep up
    All I have to do is revel in the everyday....then do it again tomorrow

    They say every sin is deadly but I believe they may be wrong...I'm guilty of all seven and I don't feel too bad at all
  • KannKann Posts: 1,146
    Yellow Ledbelly wrote:
    Rap took the scariness of music to whole new level and the metalheads just couldn't keep up
    That's a bit over the top to generalize to everyone but between some rappers being shot dead, some pop stars ending drunk and naked photos on internet, all the shitty shock reality tv etc. it may be true that metalheads were outbetted.
  • Brain Of EBrain Of E Posts: 499
    Yea, no wants to scare any one anyways. Most new bands/artists want to be able to market themselves to the widest audience as possible.
    Down in the hole, Jesus tries to crack a smile beneath another shovel load.
  • Yellow LedbellyYellow Ledbelly Posts: 3,749
    Brain Of E wrote:
    Yea, no wants to scare any one anyways. Most new bands/artists want to be able to market themselves to the widest audience as possible.
    I do believe rap did become the three-headed devil for a lot of religious and mommy groups therefore lessening the emphasis put on metal.....which makes sense because rap is far and away more popular in suburbia.

    E's point also carries some weight. It's a lot easier to sell a shiny red apple than a brown with worm holes
    All I have to do is revel in the everyday....then do it again tomorrow

    They say every sin is deadly but I believe they may be wrong...I'm guilty of all seven and I don't feel too bad at all
  • Gonzo1977Gonzo1977 Posts: 1,696
    Rock'n'Roll's more like a 70's horror flick these days. More often than not...the techniques and gimmics it uses to try and scare people only end up making it look more like a ridiculous comedy than a scary movie.

    Gimmic bands like GWAR and Manson will always piss off right wing christian soft brains and Tipper Gore alike who think that by listening to heavy metal that their kids will all of a sudden drop out of school, burn their bibles, and commit mass suicide.

    But the above only serves to piss people off rather then scare them.

    Besides...Alice Cooper and Kiss covered that ground a long long time ago.

    Unless you're going to go the Swedish Black Metal route and burn down churches, or set yourself on fire (for real) on stage...there really isn't much a new Rock'n'Roll band can do to scare the shit out of people anymore.

    TV and Video Games have basically desensitized North American Culture and made them pretty much immune to any sensationalism and spectical that Rock'n'Roll could possibly create.

    Christ!! Iggy Pop probably wouldn't even get banned anymore for whipping out his hammer on stage.

    The world has changed alot since Elvis's shaking hips.
  • PearlJamaholicPearlJamaholic Posts: 2,019
    the times have changed is all. once upon a time wanting to play guitar made you a rebel that would drop out of school and do drugs, now emo kids play guitar and are viewed as sensitive. the whole image has changed so everything after it has to change also.

    and i think another issue was that rock would corrupt kids, but thats been disproven and we cant go back to that. how many kids grew up listening to zeppelin and never worshipped satan? so now anyone that says (insert band) will be the down fall of the kids generation will be laughed at. what the band does on or off stage in no way seriously effects children.

    i grew up listening to nirvana and aic, yet i never did heroin. i think everyone knows, its just music and it touches emotions, but it rarely forces actions. if that was the case millions of cops would be dead based on the number of ratm albums sold.
    http://db.etree.org/PearlJamaholic
  • FinsburyParkCarrotsFinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Rock became assimilated into the establishment: the drug-addled hedonism and daft satan-worshipping excesses of indulged rockers was really no more excessive than that of, say, the British landed gentry and aristocracy. The media had fun portraying this as challenging the sexual and social mores of a generation, but really it wasn't that dangerous to society. Rockers getting political has always been more bothersome to the status quo, although half the time, it's clear these musicians are plastic revolutionaries: stoned millionaire bandwagon jumpers. By the time of Live Aid, the rocker with a conscience, the oxymoronic coked up champagne charlie who sang about freedom in the oppressed world, had lost the edgy fear factor of, say, an early seventies Lennon (an illegal alien in New York, himself allegedly shot in 1980 by a lone nut who saw him as a hypocrite).

    MTV had a role to play in taking rock from the underground to the mainstream, and cutting its goolies off in the process.




    If you like conspiracy theories about who sees rock as dangerous and why, you could go here:

    http://www.jfkmontreal.com/john_lennon/lennon_report.htm
  • Cropduster84Cropduster84 Posts: 1,283
    Nothing's shocking anymore.....
    'The more I studied religions the more I am convinced that man never worshipped anything but himself.' - Sir Richard Francis Burton
  • GardenpartyGardenparty Posts: 1,910
    The internet is the biggest culprit. Not because it is a bad resource but because the mystery is gone. I remember having to get my Pearl jam tour news by calling the 10club hotline phone number or seeing it in a magazine or on the news. That was exciting.

    Example: I used to think alice cooper and Manson were antichrists. Now i know that they're both pansies
    “I know this song so well, I can smoke a cigarette, have a drink, brush my teeth, take a shit, and mow the lawn while singing it. But I'll only be doing a couple of those things during this version.”
  • Gonzo1977Gonzo1977 Posts: 1,696
    Rock'n'Roll ceased to be scary when I saw Alice Cooper on the golf course.
  • DjangoDjango Posts: 152
    Check out the documentary GG Allin and the murder junkies: Hated

    If rock n'roll is about nihilism and not giving a shit about the rules, then for me GG Allin has got to be the essence of rock n'roll.

    All other "rock n'roll" bands Led Zep, the stones, U2 look like a bunch of careerist posers next to this guy. He clearly wasn't worried about selling records or doing deals with corporations or anything sensible like that. He's all about being in the moment.

    It's just a shame his music was shit.
  • GardenpartyGardenparty Posts: 1,910
    It is also possible that maybe we've just grown up. I don't really know how a 10-16 year old views music. I'm sure they believe some bands are pretty dangerous and buy into the associated hype (those Avenged Sevenfold flamers come to mind)
    “I know this song so well, I can smoke a cigarette, have a drink, brush my teeth, take a shit, and mow the lawn while singing it. But I'll only be doing a couple of those things during this version.”
  • FinsburyParkCarrotsFinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Django wrote:
    Check out the documentary GG Allin and the murder junkies: Hated

    If rock n'roll is about nihilism and not giving a shit about the rules, then for me GG Allin has got to be the essence of rock n'roll.

    All other "rock n'roll" bands Led Zep, the stones, U2 look like a bunch of careerist posers next to this guy. He clearly wasn't worried about selling records or doing deals with corporations or anything sensible like that. He's all about being in the moment.

    It's just a shame his music was shit.


    I have to disagree with you about GG Allin. There was nothing really dangerous about him, because there was nothing remotely glamorous about his bizarre kind of self-loathing hedonism. There was nothing scary about him as a rock figurehead, because he was too extreme in his onstage vices to be influential. (He was scary enough in his private life, though.) There was a band called The Flies back in the sixties, whose lead singer used to piss to the audience, so that had been done. There was nothing really evil about him either, as he was more pathetic than anything else. He seemed too fucked up even to be rock and roll. He was a sad and sorry case.
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    What about Norwegian metal bands? They still holding it down?
  • DjangoDjango Posts: 152
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    I have to disagree with you about GG Allin. There was nothing really dangerous about him, because there was nothing remotely glamorous about his bizarre kind of self-loathing hedonism. There was nothing scary about him as a rock figurehead, because he was too extreme in his onstage vices to be influential. (He was scary enough in his private life, though.) There was a band called The Flies back in the sixties, whose lead singer used to piss to the audience, so that had been done. There was nothing really evil about him either, as he was more pathetic than anything else. He seemed too fucked up even to be rock and roll. He was a sad and sorry case.


    Okay, name a more "dangerous" example of a rock n' roll performer than Mr. Allin
  • GardenpartyGardenparty Posts: 1,910
    Django wrote:
    Okay, name a more "dangerous" example of a rock n' roll performer than Mr. Allin

    These guys are still around. Some of them atleast:)


    Mayhem

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayhem_(band)
    “I know this song so well, I can smoke a cigarette, have a drink, brush my teeth, take a shit, and mow the lawn while singing it. But I'll only be doing a couple of those things during this version.”
  • FinsburyParkCarrotsFinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Django wrote:
    Okay, name a more "dangerous" example of a rock n' roll performer than Mr. Allin


    John Lennon.
  • searchlightsoulsearchlightsoul Posts: 583
    Gonzo1977 wrote:
    Rock'n'Roll ceased to be scary when I saw Alice Cooper on the golf course.

    or when he accepted god into his heart.
  • NevermindNevermind Posts: 1,006
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    Rock became assimilated into the establishment: the drug-addled hedonism and daft satan-worshipping excesses of indulged rockers was really no more excessive than that of, say, the British landed gentry and aristocracy. The media had fun portraying this as challenging the sexual and social mores of a generation, but really it wasn't that dangerous to society. Rockers getting political has always been more bothersome to the status quo, although half the time, it's clear these musicians are plastic revolutionaries: stoned millionaire bandwagon jumpers. By the time of Live Aid, the rocker with a conscience, the oxymoronic coked up champagne charlie who sang about freedom in the oppressed world, had lost the edgy fear factor of, say, an early seventies Lennon (an illegal alien in New York, himself allegedly shot in 1980 by a lone nut who saw him as a hypocrite).

    MTV had a role to play in taking rock from the underground to the mainstream, and cutting its goolies off in the process.




    If you like conspiracy theories about who sees rock as dangerous and why, you could go here:

    http://www.jfkmontreal.com/john_lennon/lennon_report.htm
    Check out what ODB has to say. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gfbyeqxywU&feature=related.
  • Jack_C_GregoryJack_C_Gregory Posts: 540
    There are still dangerous bands that are performing like the Black Metal Scandinavian bands that vocally support the burning of churches, and while some people listen to that kind of music, it doesn't even make a blip on the radar here because it's not on the pop charts or on Mtv. These kinds of bands have existed for some time but go unnoticed because they don't sell enough albums for major parent groups to be concerned. I'm positive if a band like Gorgoroth was burning up the charts in the U.S. and was on a tour of the states, there would be protest like you have never seen by parents groups. Parent groups in the U.S. tend to only protest when something is popular. Marylin Manson went virtually unnoticed with Portrait of an American Family and Smells Like Children, but then Anti-Christ Superstar took off on the Billboard charts and that's when the parent groups came out. Their publicity is only as good as whatever it is they are protesting.
  • Jeremy1012Jeremy1012 Posts: 7,170
    Gardenparty wrote:
    These guys are still around. Some of them atleast:)


    Mayhem

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayhem_(band)
    Hah yeah.


    And indeed most Norwegian Black Metal bands. People laugh at them for their silly make-up etc but these guys are crazy. When half of your band have been murdered by members of other other bands, there's something to worry about.

    I'm not going to link it because it's very graphic but if anyone wants to wikipedia Mayhem's vocalist Per Ohlin and see the kind of shit this band did, go for it. The picture on the page is not pretty. It's a genuine photo of his dead body and blown out brains with a shotgun next to him. It was used as the cover of a Mayhem bootleg :o
    "I remember one night at Muzdalifa with nothing but the sky overhead, I lay awake amid sleeping Muslim brothers and I learned that pilgrims from every land — every colour, and class, and rank; high officials and the beggar alike — all snored in the same language"
  • belfast1belfast1 Posts: 788
    Chris Cornell is still around - hahahahahahahahahahahhaaaa
    dublin 1996 london 2000 dublin 2006 prague 2006 copenhagen 2007 london 2007 rotterdam 2009 london 2009 dublin 2010 belfast 2010 vienna 2014 amsterdam 2014 london 2018
  • FinsburyParkCarrotsFinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Nevermind wrote:
    Check out what ODB has to say. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gfbyeqxywU&feature=related.


    I need an interpreter for that.
  • NevermindNevermind Posts: 1,006
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    I need an interpreter for that.
    George Bush and company was after him. Might shed some light on wether your site is legit or not.
  • FinsburyParkCarrotsFinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Nevermind wrote:
    George Bush and company was after him. Might shed some light on wether your site had any legitimacy.


    Maybe, maybe not. Why were they after him in particular? I couldn't see him as much of a threat, apart from coming across as a generic gangsta rapper. I couldn't understand a word he was saying, for a start.
  • NevermindNevermind Posts: 1,006
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    Maybe, maybe not. Why were they after him in particular? I couldn't see him as much of a threat, apart from coming across as a generic gangsta rapper. I couldn't understand a word he was saying, for a start.
    Im not sure. I'll look into it.
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    Jeremy1012 wrote:
    Hah yeah.


    And indeed most Norwegian Black Metal bands. People laugh at them for their silly make-up etc but these guys are crazy. When half of your band have been murdered by members of other other bands, there's something to worry about.

    I'm not going to link it because it's very graphic but if anyone wants to wikipedia Mayhem's vocalist Per Ohlin and see the kind of shit this band did, go for it. The picture on the page is not pretty. It's a genuine photo of his dead body and blown out brains with a shotgun next to him. It was used as the cover of a Mayhem bootleg :o


    Those guys truly scare me.
  • PearlJamaholicPearlJamaholic Posts: 2,019
    Jeremy1012 wrote:
    Hah yeah.


    And indeed most Norwegian Black Metal bands. People laugh at them for their silly make-up etc but these guys are crazy. When half of your band have been murdered by members of other other bands, there's something to worry about.

    I'm not going to link it because it's very graphic but if anyone wants to wikipedia Mayhem's vocalist Per Ohlin and see the kind of shit this band did, go for it. The picture on the page is not pretty. It's a genuine photo of his dead body and blown out brains with a shotgun next to him. It was used as the cover of a Mayhem bootleg :o

    though its more graphic the idea is not new, there is an elvis bootleg that its cover was elvis in his coffin.

    http://www.bootlegzone.com/album.php?name=ElvisSux005&section=30
    http://db.etree.org/PearlJamaholic
  • Vedderlution_BabyVedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    PearlJamaholic wrote:
    though its more graphic the idea is not new, there is an elvis bootleg that its cover was elvis in his coffin.

    http://www.bootlegzone.com/album.php?name=ElvisSux005&section=30



    Yea, but what Jeremy1012 mentioned just cranks it to 11. Apparently the guy that found him walked in, found the guy, went to a store, bought a disposable camera, went back, rearranged items (for better photos?), took pictures, THEN called the cops. Fucking nuts.
  • PearlJamaholicPearlJamaholic Posts: 2,019
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Yea, but what Jeremy1012 mentioned just cranks it to 11. Apparently the guy that found him walked in, found the guy, went to a store, bought a disposable camera, went back, rearranged items (for better photos?), took pictures, THEN called the cops. Fucking nuts.

    yeah i know the story, even rumored he ate some of the brain matter. but im just saying everything has been done, now thats all that is left is to crank it up to 11. morrison may or may not have pulled out his penis on stage, but some metal chick band, i can find the clip(but cant post it here) they fist some girl on stage.
    http://db.etree.org/PearlJamaholic
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