Yeah, MIG I am thinking that is what I might do (as far as the cabinet goes anyways) I just want to make sure that I have the funds to do so. Who knows, maybe I'll find a sweet deal on a Bogner head someday.
Want my advice? Get the Groove Tubes cabinet, and get a Sovtek Mig to power it. That'll get you by for quite a while, and then you can upgrade to a Bogner amp in a couple years.
Sovtek patterned it's amps off the original Marshall head, affectionately known as the "plexi". They are simple, hand-wired, built with military surplus components. They are fairly cheap, and they have a phenomenal tone. All-tube, single-channel. You'd need a good distortion pedal with this one, but you'd be happy with the result.
It's just an option that I'm throwing out there. After you got a Bogner, you could always keep the MIG as a back-up (a good idea with any tube amp).
Dude.... Sweet. That MIG in the walnut cab with the maple face is nice and it'd match the groove tubes cab.
Probably get you out under 1000 still drive 2.5 hours to Calgary and check out the Bogner, but that rig will definately get you by until you can swing the Bogner. It's pretty punk too.
You are definately an EL-34 guy. The 6L6 is looser in the low end and glassy up top. (Fender) EL-34's are tighter and woolier (Marshall). But try them both, you may fall in love with the 6L6
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
Yeah, I will of course drive to Calgary to check out the Bogner's. But if I get the cab, I could always get a Bogner head later and power the cab with that. My Marshall will work for the time being. Do you see alot of these cabs popping up on e-bay...or are they pretty rare?
Yeah, I will of course drive to Calgary to check out the Bogner's. But if I get the cab, I could always get a Bogner head later and power the cab with that. My Marshall will work for the time being. Do you see alot of these cabs popping up on e-bay...or are they pretty rare?
You'll find similar cabs, but Groove Tubes cabs are fairly rare. I personally own a Crate cab that I retrofitted with Weber alnico 10's, and a Marshall cab that has Celestion 10's (same model as the Groove Tubes cab has). So it's hard to say... a lot of companies have 4x10" cabs, but if you really want that Groove Tubes cabinet (as opposed to a Matchless, Marshall, etc) then I'd jump on it. The problem there is buying it without hearing it... if you have doubts, don't do it, but if it speaks to you through your computer screen, go for it. I personally really like that cabinet... it would sound similar to my Marshall, just a little bit fuller (my Marshall isn't very deep, front-to-back) and probably be more solid (the Marshall isn't very hefty, but that makes it easier to move). The cabinet itself is probably similar to my Crate, built like a tank, very good resonance character, but with the more wooly Celestion ceramic speakers.
I'd agree with Paco on this one. EL-34's for you. The extra wattage is nice for the cleans, and the tonal character when it breaks up seems like it would be more your style. EL-34's are the defining character of Marshall amps, versus 6L6 tubes that define both Fender and Mesa Boogie. But always, if you can try both out, give 'em both a shot. Try the 6L6 model first, then if the EL-34's are better, there's no looking back.
...and if you don't like it, you can suck on an egg.
Dude.... Sweet. That MIG in the walnut cab with the maple face is nice and it'd match the groove tubes cab.
I want to get a second MIG soon... as a backup/stereo option. That walnut cab is pretty sweet, I love that it's all solid wood (no ply/veneer). The only critique I have is the lack of a ventilation panel on top, but there's plenty of breathing room on the back (and the stock box doesn't have a top-breather, either).
The site for the box builder is pretty damned nice...
For the price, Traynors are pretty damn good. I have a YCV40 running through a 2x12 cab with greenbacks and I can get a really impressive overdriven sound out of it. I will agree that the clean channel is the best part of the amp, but the drive channel on this bad boy is much smoother than say a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe, IMHO. With that said, it doesn't necessarily give you an ultra high gain sound like a Mesa unless you push it with some pedals.
I tried a couple different amps before I bought this one and, while it's no Bogner or other high end amp, it is a really good amp for the price.
Well a Mesa amp is in a different world, its all in what you want overall. I personally would rather find an old solid state amp then use a mesa, I can't stand the tones out of NOW A DAY's Mesa amps.
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I want to get a second MIG soon... as a backup/stereo option. That walnut cab is pretty sweet, I love that it's all solid wood (no ply/veneer). The only critique I have is the lack of a ventilation panel on top, but there's plenty of breathing room on the back (and the stock box doesn't have a top-breather, either).
The site for the box builder is pretty damned nice...
Nice, I'm wondering how difficult it would be to mount a tiny computer style rack fan inside and wire it up. It wouldn't take much current and It would certainly keep the tubes happier.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
My bass player is trying to steer me away from 4 X 10 cabs...he say the sound isn't as full as 4 X 12's....what are your opinions?? personally I haven't tried much of either. I noticed on the groove tubes site that they don't make a 4 X 12 cab....just 2 X 12. I also think that the head almost has more to do with the sound that you get that the cab does...thats not to say that the cab doesn't affect the sound. MIG, have you tried a groove tubes 4 X 10 cabinet before?
we currently have, in the warehouse, a shiva 1-12 combo with reverb. Sell price is $3399.99.
Shiva 2-12 combo is 3699.99 and the Head w/dual reverb is 3199.99
Let me know if you would like to set up an appointment
This is what the only dealership that sells Bogner close to me in Canada gave me for a price quote on these amps.....holy rip off compared to US prices. F*k it...i'll just buy it off E-bay
we currently have, in the warehouse, a shiva 1-12 combo with reverb. Sell price is $3399.99.
Shiva 2-12 combo is 3699.99 and the Head w/dual reverb is 3199.99
Let me know if you would like to set up an appointment
This is what the only dealership that sells Bogner close to me in Canada gave me for a price quote on these amps.....holy rip off compared to US prices. F*k it...i'll just buy it off E-bay
yeah, that's what I was afraid of.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
It was the same thing when I bought my PRS guitar...I saved $1200 from buying it off of E-bay. Damn Christmas season makes you broke, otherwise I'd buy that Cab.
It was the same thing when I bought my PRS guitar...I saved $1200 from buying it off of E-bay. Damn Christmas season makes you broke, otherwise I'd buy that Cab.
yeah, I think you're fine with a 4x10, you have to hear it to decide the difference IMHO it's not to terribly large in well built cabinet. Essentially you're talking about 8 inches of cone. 10"s still move plenty of air and have a slightly tighter response (many bass players love them for the punch)
Damn, Bogner and PRS. That's a good marriage.
Maybe see if you can't find an old JCM DSL 800 or 900 for the time being.
My Girlfriend said to me..."How many guitars do you need?" and I replied...."How many pairs of shoes do you need?" She got really quiet.
My bass player is trying to steer me away from 4 X 10 cabs...he say the sound isn't as full as 4 X 12's....what are your opinions??
Tell your bass player that he is SMOKING CRACK and he should SHUT UP.
Sorry, I get defensive...
My 4x10's (I have two) both push more air than a 2x12 cabinet. They don't have as much VOLUME as a 4x12" cabinet, but they definitely have a full sound. In fact, one reason I prefer 10" speakers for guitar is because they give you that really good low, chunky tone (like Paco said, one reason 10" speakers are so popular with bass players). But the best part about a 10" is that the low end is much more controlled, where on a 12" speaker, those low notes can really get muddy. You'll have much better intelligability in the low end with a 10" speaker. The funny thing is, most people who know will tell you that 12" speakers have a more trebly tone than a 10", which is kinda counterintuitive.
I also think that the head almost has more to do with the sound that you get that the cab does...thats not to say that the cab doesn't affect the sound. MIG, have you tried a groove tubes 4 X 10 cabinet before?
I agree, the head is more important to your overall tone. However, most people try an amp out, are 90% happy with the amp's tone, but don't ever look to the speakers to finish out that last 10%. Changing speakers will take your "pretty good" amp and turn it into a "hell yeah!" amp. I think that most people could care less what speakers they have, just look at all the guys out there playing all-tube Marshall heads into Behringer or Peavey 4x12" cabinets. Atrocious. I just advocate that people pay attention to the speakers and cabinet construction as part of their tone, too. It's like taking a guitar and replacing the pickups, but not caring what kind of wood the guitar body is. It's not as obvious, but it's important.
That being said, I've never plugged in a Groove Tubes cabinet, but I do have two 4x10 cabs, one of which has the exact same speakers as that Groove Tubes (my Marshall 1965B). And I love the tone. I switched to 10" speakers five years ago, and I've never looked back. Eventually, I'd like to add a 2x12" open-back cab to my 4x10" cab collection, but if I only use one cab, it's a closed-back 4x10".
Like I said earlier, if you don't believe in the cabinet and can't try it out (obviously), don't buy it. That's a big purchase to make without trying it out.
But if you ever get a chance to try the closed-back 2x10" Bogner Shiva combo amp... hehehe...
...and if you don't like it, you can suck on an egg.
Yeah MIG, I figure that cab probably sounds pretty good....if I only had the money, maybe after the new year. I told the guy to e-mail me if he puts it up on E-bay again *crossing fingers*...expenses just seem to be really tight around the holidays. I am really curious about what that cab would sound like with a Shiva or Ecstasy powering it though. MIG, what are you using to power your Marshall cab again?
Yeah MIG, I figure that cab probably sounds pretty good....if I only had the money, maybe after the new year. I told the guy to e-mail me if he puts it up on E-bay again *crossing fingers*...expenses just seem to be really tight around the holidays. I am really curious about what that cab would sound like with a Shiva or Ecstasy powering it though. MIG, what are you using to power your Marshall cab again?
I use a Sovtek Mig 50 head. That head and cab were practically made for each other... my babies, both of them! I ended up swapping the speakers in my Crate cab to a set of VERY nice Weber alnico speakers at the same time, and tried the amp with both cabs, and the Marshall cab just responded better. However, I kinda expected that... the Weber cab is really more suited to a Fender sound, would be perfect for a Bassman head. Especially if someone made a second back for it that was half-open. Alnico speakers really do need to breathe a little to come alive. (and me preaching so much about closed-back speaker cabs...)
Unfortunately, the only way to find out if an amp and cab sound good together is to plug the two in with the rest of your gear (guitar, pedals, etc) and play. But if you spend some time and research and find out what different things will and won't do for you, that helps a lot. If you ever get a chance to play through a good 4x10" guitar cab, try it out and see if the speakers are doing what you want.
I think you would also do VERY well with a Mesa Boogie 2x12" cabinet, if you wanted something you could test first. A 2x12" cab won't sound quite as loud as a 4x10"... I would say a 10" speaker puts out 75% of the volume as a 12" speaker, so a 2x12" would be equal to about a 3x10". But 2 Mesa 12" speakers will put out more volume than you'll ever need. You may not like their amps, but their cabs are top-notch.
...and if you don't like it, you can suck on an egg.
Comments
Dude.... Sweet. That MIG in the walnut cab with the maple face is nice and it'd match the groove tubes cab.
Probably get you out under 1000 still drive 2.5 hours to Calgary and check out the Bogner, but that rig will definately get you by until you can swing the Bogner. It's pretty punk too.
You are definately an EL-34 guy. The 6L6 is looser in the low end and glassy up top. (Fender) EL-34's are tighter and woolier (Marshall). But try them both, you may fall in love with the 6L6
You'll find similar cabs, but Groove Tubes cabs are fairly rare. I personally own a Crate cab that I retrofitted with Weber alnico 10's, and a Marshall cab that has Celestion 10's (same model as the Groove Tubes cab has). So it's hard to say... a lot of companies have 4x10" cabs, but if you really want that Groove Tubes cabinet (as opposed to a Matchless, Marshall, etc) then I'd jump on it. The problem there is buying it without hearing it... if you have doubts, don't do it, but if it speaks to you through your computer screen, go for it. I personally really like that cabinet... it would sound similar to my Marshall, just a little bit fuller (my Marshall isn't very deep, front-to-back) and probably be more solid (the Marshall isn't very hefty, but that makes it easier to move). The cabinet itself is probably similar to my Crate, built like a tank, very good resonance character, but with the more wooly Celestion ceramic speakers.
I'd agree with Paco on this one. EL-34's for you. The extra wattage is nice for the cleans, and the tonal character when it breaks up seems like it would be more your style. EL-34's are the defining character of Marshall amps, versus 6L6 tubes that define both Fender and Mesa Boogie. But always, if you can try both out, give 'em both a shot. Try the 6L6 model first, then if the EL-34's are better, there's no looking back.
I want to get a second MIG soon... as a backup/stereo option. That walnut cab is pretty sweet, I love that it's all solid wood (no ply/veneer). The only critique I have is the lack of a ventilation panel on top, but there's plenty of breathing room on the back (and the stock box doesn't have a top-breather, either).
The site for the box builder is pretty damned nice...
http://www.sultone.com/
Well a Mesa amp is in a different world, its all in what you want overall. I personally would rather find an old solid state amp then use a mesa, I can't stand the tones out of NOW A DAY's Mesa amps.
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Nice, I'm wondering how difficult it would be to mount a tiny computer style rack fan inside and wire it up. It wouldn't take much current and It would certainly keep the tubes happier.
Shiva 2-12 combo is 3699.99 and the Head w/dual reverb is 3199.99
Let me know if you would like to set up an appointment
This is what the only dealership that sells Bogner close to me in Canada gave me for a price quote on these amps.....holy rip off compared to US prices. F*k it...i'll just buy it off E-bay
yeah, that's what I was afraid of.
yeah, I think you're fine with a 4x10, you have to hear it to decide the difference IMHO it's not to terribly large in well built cabinet. Essentially you're talking about 8 inches of cone. 10"s still move plenty of air and have a slightly tighter response (many bass players love them for the punch)
Damn, Bogner and PRS. That's a good marriage.
Maybe see if you can't find an old JCM DSL 800 or 900 for the time being.
Tell your bass player that he is SMOKING CRACK and he should SHUT UP.
Sorry, I get defensive...
My 4x10's (I have two) both push more air than a 2x12 cabinet. They don't have as much VOLUME as a 4x12" cabinet, but they definitely have a full sound. In fact, one reason I prefer 10" speakers for guitar is because they give you that really good low, chunky tone (like Paco said, one reason 10" speakers are so popular with bass players). But the best part about a 10" is that the low end is much more controlled, where on a 12" speaker, those low notes can really get muddy. You'll have much better intelligability in the low end with a 10" speaker. The funny thing is, most people who know will tell you that 12" speakers have a more trebly tone than a 10", which is kinda counterintuitive.
I agree, the head is more important to your overall tone. However, most people try an amp out, are 90% happy with the amp's tone, but don't ever look to the speakers to finish out that last 10%. Changing speakers will take your "pretty good" amp and turn it into a "hell yeah!" amp. I think that most people could care less what speakers they have, just look at all the guys out there playing all-tube Marshall heads into Behringer or Peavey 4x12" cabinets. Atrocious. I just advocate that people pay attention to the speakers and cabinet construction as part of their tone, too. It's like taking a guitar and replacing the pickups, but not caring what kind of wood the guitar body is. It's not as obvious, but it's important.
That being said, I've never plugged in a Groove Tubes cabinet, but I do have two 4x10 cabs, one of which has the exact same speakers as that Groove Tubes (my Marshall 1965B). And I love the tone. I switched to 10" speakers five years ago, and I've never looked back. Eventually, I'd like to add a 2x12" open-back cab to my 4x10" cab collection, but if I only use one cab, it's a closed-back 4x10".
Like I said earlier, if you don't believe in the cabinet and can't try it out (obviously), don't buy it. That's a big purchase to make without trying it out.
But if you ever get a chance to try the closed-back 2x10" Bogner Shiva combo amp... hehehe...
I use a Sovtek Mig 50 head. That head and cab were practically made for each other... my babies, both of them! I ended up swapping the speakers in my Crate cab to a set of VERY nice Weber alnico speakers at the same time, and tried the amp with both cabs, and the Marshall cab just responded better. However, I kinda expected that... the Weber cab is really more suited to a Fender sound, would be perfect for a Bassman head. Especially if someone made a second back for it that was half-open. Alnico speakers really do need to breathe a little to come alive. (and me preaching so much about closed-back speaker cabs...)
Unfortunately, the only way to find out if an amp and cab sound good together is to plug the two in with the rest of your gear (guitar, pedals, etc) and play. But if you spend some time and research and find out what different things will and won't do for you, that helps a lot. If you ever get a chance to play through a good 4x10" guitar cab, try it out and see if the speakers are doing what you want.
I think you would also do VERY well with a Mesa Boogie 2x12" cabinet, if you wanted something you could test first. A 2x12" cab won't sound quite as loud as a 4x10"... I would say a 10" speaker puts out 75% of the volume as a 12" speaker, so a 2x12" would be equal to about a 3x10". But 2 Mesa 12" speakers will put out more volume than you'll ever need. You may not like their amps, but their cabs are top-notch.