#47 - Musk/trump/Vance

Choccoloccotide

mickeyrat said:

teskeinc said:

Choccoloccotide said:

mickeyrat said:

Go Beavers said:

teskeinc said:

Go Beavers said:

Choccoloccotide said:

With the DoD, FDA, & DoJ employees all threatening to quit b/c of the Hegseth, Kennedy & Gaetz appointments, and the impending shutdown of the DoEd.  The DOGE’s job got a lot easier.  Change is needed and change is coming.  The people voted for this.

Dept of Ed won’t get eliminated because it’ll require 60 votes in the Senate. Maybe they’ll be some budget cuts so some kids with disabilities lose services and low income students get less Pell Grant money. So…yay? 

It’s in Project 2025 so it has to happen right?

Trolling doesn’t really work with me. I replied to a comment about dismantling the Dept of Ed, which republicans have been talking about doing two years after it was put in place. Trump wanted that the first go around. That won’t happen, but with all the excitement about budget cuts, I’m sure republicans will try that route for some fodder for the base and so they can act like they’re doing something that they think is helpful. 

unless thune kills the filibuster

Thune is a rino, which means he is beholden to the DC establishment and uniparty.  So don’t worry, he want erase the filibuster.  Trump can still radically change the dept though and essentially neuter it and give back control to the individual States, and I’m good with that outcome as well.  

Only the protectors of Democracy would kill the filibuster and pack the Supreme Court. Fortunately they can’t for at least 4 more years. Hopefully longer.

which suggests the gop are the detroyers of democracy and the party that actually did pack the court. on to phase 2 I guess.

Tesk was being sarcastic 😂 b/c the DEMOCRATS under Harry Reid already did away with the filibuster way back in 2013 for judicial and executive nominees.  You can thank DEMOCRATS for the Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Barrett confirmations, b/c these confirmations would have failed otherwise.  😂😂😂

Choccoloccotide

josevolution said:

Has he put out anything on that great healthcare bill he’s been promising for 10 years 😂😂 they’ll kill ACÁ which by the way lots of hillbillies MAGA voters are on can’t wait till they realize they can’t get any healthcare for their children or themselves 

Trump has said on multiple occasions that he isn’t going to kill ACA, UNTIL there is something better to replace it with.

Halifax2TheMax

Choccoloccotide said:

josevolution said:

Has he put out anything on that great healthcare bill he’s been promising for 10 years 😂😂 they’ll kill ACÁ which by the way lots of hillbillies MAGA voters are on can’t wait till they realize they can’t get any healthcare for their children or themselves 

Trump has said on multiple occasions that he isn’t going to kill ACA, UNTIL there is something better to replace it with.

Tell us about the “something.” Is it a “concept of a plan?”

Choccoloccotide

We won’t know till they announce something.  I suspect something to be announced no earlier than Fall 2025 on healthcare.  There are just more pressing issues to deal with.  Right now the focus is on securing the border, downsizing govt bureaucracy, and lifting the burden of inflation off the people so they don’t have to  worry about whether they can buy groceries or pay the rent.  I know this isn’t what you want to hear, but it’s the reality of the situation the Biden regime has put us in.

josevolution

Choccoloccotide said:

josevolution said:

Has he put out anything on that great healthcare bill he’s been promising for 10 years 😂😂 they’ll kill ACÁ which by the way lots of hillbillies MAGA voters are on can’t wait till they realize they can’t get any healthcare for their children or themselves 

Trump has said on multiple occasions that he isn’t going to kill ACA, UNTIL there is something better to replace it with.

He literally said I have a concept of a plan 😂 concept fucking 10 years and all he and Republicans can come up with is a concept 😂 I have a concept to let’s make sure we insure as many middle class and below the poverty line Americans! 

Choccoloccotide

Chill out 😂. A concept is an idea, not a plan.  Trump is the most transparent president we’ve ever had.  When there is a plan you’ll know.  

josevolution

Choccoloccotide said:

Chill out 😂. A concept is an idea, not a plan.  Trump is the most transparent president we’ve ever had.  When there is a plan you’ll know.  

10 years 😂😂 maybe Junior will come up with one? Wait did you just write Transparent to describe the rapist? Can you post the medical report from his assassination event? We know more about the JFK assassination which took place 70 years ago! 

Choccoloccotide

Nobody can have a semi coherent convo about politics with you.  You’re over the top sensationalism is very off putting and you offer no facts about anything.  

josevolution

Choccoloccotide said:

Nobody can have a semi coherent convo about politics with you.  You’re over the top sensationalism is very off putting and you offer no facts about anything.  

Im literally asking you to back up your statement! You wrote he’s thee most transparent president ever! Does releasing a medical report or tax information not a show of transparency? 

Choccoloccotide

So you don’t believe he was shot?  🤣. Talk about conspiracy theories 🤣🤣🤣

josevolution

Choccoloccotide said:

So you don’t believe he was shot?  🤣. Talk about conspiracy theories 🤣🤣🤣

What? Who said anything about believing the event happened? I’m asking you if he’s so transparent what happened to releasing a full medical report on his treatment at the hospital he was taken to? Go back and look up Regan medical records from when he was shot! 

mace1229

tbergs said:

mace1229 said:

Go Beavers said:

mace1229 said:

tbergs said:

mace1229 said:

brianlux said:

I've been hesitant to post some thoughts I've had recently because we're really early in the most dysfunctional period in American history, but I'm curious as to what you some of you think about this, so here goes:

I think that if Harris had won the election, her voters would have responded with joy, happiness, celebration, etc.  I don't get the feeling that way about the MAGA fans.  They seem either subdued, snarky/troll like, and often angry- not anger like the disappointment type anger we Harris voters feel, but just the usual mean bully style anger.  Part of that, I suppose, is that's just how some people are normally. But my guess is that part of it is because I think deep down, MAGA fans know they have fucked up themselves (as well as everybody else)by electing the Felon into office.  There's a lot being said about how the felon and his pals have made promises they cannot and don't intend to keep, and I think a lot of MAGAs know that.  OOOPS, too late!  

For those of us who love democracy and freedom from tyranny, it's important to keep this point in the foreground and made recognizable because it's almost blatantly evident and those voters need to own it.

I know this will irritate several people here, but I will try to ignore their responses and answer your question. 

First, it's the loudest people we see and remember. Half of the voting population voted for trump, so it's safe to assume they represent roughly half the country (same with Harris). I don't see half the country acting like how you described. Half are not snarky, rude, angry, etc. Thats just the 5% (or whatever percent you want to give it) that make their voices the loudest.

There are messed up things all around us, but I see most people, on both sides, as generally good. I keep hearing about J6 and a list of bad or annoying things republican voters have done. But I can list the same things about groups who lean left. Did we forget the "fiery but peaceful" riots? Burning down police buildings, fast food chains and even small businesses. Several police were ambushed and murdered, and sometimes to the cheers of witnesses. And those same police had groups protesting at the hospital that were trying to save their lives, chanting to let the pigs die.
Those are horrible people in my opinion. But I also know they don't represent the majority of the groups they are associated with either. 
What I find interesting is everything the right does seems to get replayed. But the 2020 riots seem all but forgotten. Maybe someone has brought it up and I missed it, but I haven't heard anyone talk about how FEMA had directed volunteers to skip trump houses for hurricane relief. If that doesn't fit the same behavior you're talking about, then I don't know what does. But again, that does not represent the majority of people who voted against trump. Most people are generally good. They have different opinions on what will get the country back on top. Maybe they don't follow the news and are less aware. Maybe they have different filters on what they believe is true or not. Whatever the reason for how they voted. But our perceptions and stereotypes of voters on both sides only reflect the loudest, and usually most obnoxious, of that group. At the core this country is still filled with good people who want to do the right thing. 

Thanks for the response on this Mace. You put a lot in here, but I'm just going to focus on the FEMA example. In that instance, a single employee was at fault, not FEMA in general, and ultimately fired. No prominent, or even reasonable person, on the dems side is defending it. Seems like it was handled appropriately. On the other hand, many of the things you're listing, people, including the incoming president, still to this day defend or downplay. 

I agree with you here. She said it was common practice and she was directed by her supervisors, she was just the one who left a paper trail. But I'm not convinced of that yet.
But my point is the horrible things that happen don't typically represent the majority. Most FEMA people want to help everyone, Just like most registered republicans are not happy with what happened on J6. They don't want protestors storming the capitol building and trashing the place. It was a relatively small number. I know it was a few thousand I believe, but I say relatively small compared to the 75 million who voted for trump who want to see that.

Most republicans are fine with J6. Only 1/3rd strongly disapprove, and 2/3rds support the pardons. The party’s rotten from the inside and the only way forward is widespread recognition of this. 

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/jan-6-opinion-poll-republican-disapproval-wanes-2024-01-06/

2/3 still disagree, that's not most being fine. 1/3 "strongly" disagree, 1/3 disagree, and 1/3 approve. That 1/3 approving is larger than I thought it was, but it's gone up since 2021.

That's because republican leadership and Trump have framed it as weaponization of the DOJ and a day of love, so revisionist history works once again to the Rs favor.

I doubt you'll find one democrat looking back on the Floyd riots and saying anything supportive. They will probably still say that it points to a larger systemic problem with LE culture in general and advocate for reform, but that's just common fucking sense.

At the time a lot of people refused to condemn the riots. I don’t know that’s change a lot in the last 4 years or not.

Philly NJ

mrussel1 said:

teskeinc said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I keep hearing people comparing J6 to the george floyd riots. Seriously, one you had all of them of one political persuasion, the other there was no way to tell. I mean, democrats don't typically wear flaming red moron beacons on their heads. Are you trying to tell me that NO republicans/R voters cared about the death of an unarmed black man at the hands of a cop? so if that's what you're saying, what does that reveal about those voters?

That's a good example of how some people with confused agendas will often grab at straws to make a point that is not fully formed.  They are often the same people that make decisions that they think are in their best interest yet are really the opposite.  Thus, 47.

Do you think people who voted against 10-15 million illegal immigrants entering the country under Biden/Harris are ever going to regret that? C’mon.

You think people voting against DEI, woke, Transgendered weirdo stuff are going to regret that too? 

Maybe one day you’ll realize that people vote on policy and issues, not good vibes and feelings. 

So the govt is going to outlaw diversity initiatives at corporations?  Are they going to outlaw a man getting a surgery or declaring he’s a female? Will the make it illegal for me to call myself she or they?

 These are the policies you are expecting to be enacted?

Corporations are already getting rid of DEI on their own. Wonder why?

Philly NJ

mrussel1 said:

teskeinc said:

mrussel1 said:

teskeinc said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I keep hearing people comparing J6 to the george floyd riots. Seriously, one you had all of them of one political persuasion, the other there was no way to tell. I mean, democrats don't typically wear flaming red moron beacons on their heads. Are you trying to tell me that NO republicans/R voters cared about the death of an unarmed black man at the hands of a cop? so if that's what you're saying, what does that reveal about those voters?

That's a good example of how some people with confused agendas will often grab at straws to make a point that is not fully formed.  They are often the same people that make decisions that they think are in their best interest yet are really the opposite.  Thus, 47.

Do you think people who voted against 10-15 million illegal immigrants entering the country under Biden/Harris are ever going to regret that? C’mon.

You think people voting against DEI, woke, Transgendered weirdo stuff are going to regret that too? 

Maybe one day you’ll realize that people vote on policy and issues, not good vibes and feelings. 

So the govt is going to outlaw diversity initiatives at corporations?  Are they going to outlaw a man getting a surgery or declaring he’s a female? Will the make it illegal for me to call myself she or they?

 These are the policies you are expecting to be enacted?

Not going to outlaw it. Private companies can do what they like as it should be. Just won’t have to worry about it in our government anymore. 

Why didn’t the Republican led House put forth such a bill in the last two years?

They did, along with several State Legislators.

mrussel1

Philly NJ said:

mrussel1 said:

teskeinc said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

I keep hearing people comparing J6 to the george floyd riots. Seriously, one you had all of them of one political persuasion, the other there was no way to tell. I mean, democrats don't typically wear flaming red moron beacons on their heads. Are you trying to tell me that NO republicans/R voters cared about the death of an unarmed black man at the hands of a cop? so if that's what you're saying, what does that reveal about those voters?

That's a good example of how some people with confused agendas will often grab at straws to make a point that is not fully formed.  They are often the same people that make decisions that they think are in their best interest yet are really the opposite.  Thus, 47.

Do you think people who voted against 10-15 million illegal immigrants entering the country under Biden/Harris are ever going to regret that? C’mon.

You think people voting against DEI, woke, Transgendered weirdo stuff are going to regret that too? 

Maybe one day you’ll realize that people vote on policy and issues, not good vibes and feelings. 

So the govt is going to outlaw diversity initiatives at corporations?  Are they going to outlaw a man getting a surgery or declaring he’s a female? Will the make it illegal for me to call myself she or they?

 These are the policies you are expecting to be enacted?

Corporations are already getting rid of DEI on their own. Wonder why?

Likely because it oversteers.  But that's not really the question.  I asked how the gov't will do this, along with banning trans people.  

And what is the bill that the House GOP put forth?  I don't recall anything coming to the senate.  

Gern Blansten

mace1229 said:

tbergs said:

mace1229 said:

Go Beavers said:

mace1229 said:

tbergs said:

mace1229 said:

brianlux said:

I've been hesitant to post some thoughts I've had recently because we're really early in the most dysfunctional period in American history, but I'm curious as to what you some of you think about this, so here goes:

I think that if Harris had won the election, her voters would have responded with joy, happiness, celebration, etc.  I don't get the feeling that way about the MAGA fans.  They seem either subdued, snarky/troll like, and often angry- not anger like the disappointment type anger we Harris voters feel, but just the usual mean bully style anger.  Part of that, I suppose, is that's just how some people are normally. But my guess is that part of it is because I think deep down, MAGA fans know they have fucked up themselves (as well as everybody else)by electing the Felon into office.  There's a lot being said about how the felon and his pals have made promises they cannot and don't intend to keep, and I think a lot of MAGAs know that.  OOOPS, too late!  

For those of us who love democracy and freedom from tyranny, it's important to keep this point in the foreground and made recognizable because it's almost blatantly evident and those voters need to own it.

I know this will irritate several people here, but I will try to ignore their responses and answer your question. 

First, it's the loudest people we see and remember. Half of the voting population voted for trump, so it's safe to assume they represent roughly half the country (same with Harris). I don't see half the country acting like how you described. Half are not snarky, rude, angry, etc. Thats just the 5% (or whatever percent you want to give it) that make their voices the loudest.

There are messed up things all around us, but I see most people, on both sides, as generally good. I keep hearing about J6 and a list of bad or annoying things republican voters have done. But I can list the same things about groups who lean left. Did we forget the "fiery but peaceful" riots? Burning down police buildings, fast food chains and even small businesses. Several police were ambushed and murdered, and sometimes to the cheers of witnesses. And those same police had groups protesting at the hospital that were trying to save their lives, chanting to let the pigs die.
Those are horrible people in my opinion. But I also know they don't represent the majority of the groups they are associated with either. 
What I find interesting is everything the right does seems to get replayed. But the 2020 riots seem all but forgotten. Maybe someone has brought it up and I missed it, but I haven't heard anyone talk about how FEMA had directed volunteers to skip trump houses for hurricane relief. If that doesn't fit the same behavior you're talking about, then I don't know what does. But again, that does not represent the majority of people who voted against trump. Most people are generally good. They have different opinions on what will get the country back on top. Maybe they don't follow the news and are less aware. Maybe they have different filters on what they believe is true or not. Whatever the reason for how they voted. But our perceptions and stereotypes of voters on both sides only reflect the loudest, and usually most obnoxious, of that group. At the core this country is still filled with good people who want to do the right thing. 

Thanks for the response on this Mace. You put a lot in here, but I'm just going to focus on the FEMA example. In that instance, a single employee was at fault, not FEMA in general, and ultimately fired. No prominent, or even reasonable person, on the dems side is defending it. Seems like it was handled appropriately. On the other hand, many of the things you're listing, people, including the incoming president, still to this day defend or downplay. 

I agree with you here. She said it was common practice and she was directed by her supervisors, she was just the one who left a paper trail. But I'm not convinced of that yet.
But my point is the horrible things that happen don't typically represent the majority. Most FEMA people want to help everyone, Just like most registered republicans are not happy with what happened on J6. They don't want protestors storming the capitol building and trashing the place. It was a relatively small number. I know it was a few thousand I believe, but I say relatively small compared to the 75 million who voted for trump who want to see that.

Most republicans are fine with J6. Only 1/3rd strongly disapprove, and 2/3rds support the pardons. The party’s rotten from the inside and the only way forward is widespread recognition of this. 

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/jan-6-opinion-poll-republican-disapproval-wanes-2024-01-06/

2/3 still disagree, that's not most being fine. 1/3 "strongly" disagree, 1/3 disagree, and 1/3 approve. That 1/3 approving is larger than I thought it was, but it's gone up since 2021.

That's because republican leadership and Trump have framed it as weaponization of the DOJ and a day of love, so revisionist history works once again to the Rs favor.

I doubt you'll find one democrat looking back on the Floyd riots and saying anything supportive. They will probably still say that it points to a larger systemic problem with LE culture in general and advocate for reform, but that's just common fucking sense.

At the time a lot of people refused to condemn the riots. I don’t know that’s change a lot in the last 4 years or not.

We see this a lot but what is the evidence of people refusing to condemn riots? We're those statements made by people that were reported? 

Lerxst1992

Choccoloccotide said:

We won’t know till they announce something.  I suspect something to be announced no earlier than Fall 2025 on healthcare.  There are just more pressing issues to deal with.  Right now the focus is on securing the border, downsizing govt bureaucracy, and lifting the burden of inflation off the people so they don’t have to  worry about whether they can buy groceries or pay the rent.  I know this isn’t what you want to hear, but it’s the reality of the situation the Biden regime has put us in.

We have only been waiting FIFTEEN YEARS for a republican healthcare plan in response to ACA. How many Americans have died since they promised us a healthcare plan? (And inflation started with the supply chain breaking under Trump's covid year. That's a knock on Biden/Harris for not making that argument.)

At what point will you admit this country is absolutely crazy for trusting republicans? RFK? Tulsi? Or will it take Hulk Hogan to be nominated as Treasury secretary? Will you admit it then, or will the lure of the cult still be too strong?

mickeyrat

Choccoloccotide said:

mickeyrat said:

teskeinc said:

Choccoloccotide said:

mickeyrat said:

Go Beavers said:

teskeinc said:

Go Beavers said:

Choccoloccotide said:

With the DoD, FDA, & DoJ employees all threatening to quit b/c of the Hegseth, Kennedy & Gaetz appointments, and the impending shutdown of the DoEd.  The DOGE’s job got a lot easier.  Change is needed and change is coming.  The people voted for this.

Dept of Ed won’t get eliminated because it’ll require 60 votes in the Senate. Maybe they’ll be some budget cuts so some kids with disabilities lose services and low income students get less Pell Grant money. So…yay? 

It’s in Project 2025 so it has to happen right?

Trolling doesn’t really work with me. I replied to a comment about dismantling the Dept of Ed, which republicans have been talking about doing two years after it was put in place. Trump wanted that the first go around. That won’t happen, but with all the excitement about budget cuts, I’m sure republicans will try that route for some fodder for the base and so they can act like they’re doing something that they think is helpful. 

unless thune kills the filibuster

Thune is a rino, which means he is beholden to the DC establishment and uniparty.  So don’t worry, he want erase the filibuster.  Trump can still radically change the dept though and essentially neuter it and give back control to the individual States, and I’m good with that outcome as well.  

Only the protectors of Democracy would kill the filibuster and pack the Supreme Court. Fortunately they can’t for at least 4 more years. Hopefully longer.

which suggests the gop are the detroyers of democracy and the party that actually did pack the court. on to phase 2 I guess.

Tesk was being sarcastic 😂 b/c the DEMOCRATS under Harry Reid already did away with the filibuster way back in 2013 for judicial and executive nominees.  You can thank DEMOCRATS for the Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Barrett confirmations, b/c these confirmations would have failed otherwise.  😂😂😂

mcconnel killed it for scotus. reid dor liwer court appointments. 

facts matter

Go Beavers

Choccoloccotide said:

mickeyrat said:

Go Beavers said:

teskeinc said:

Go Beavers said:

Choccoloccotide said:

With the DoD, FDA, & DoJ employees all threatening to quit b/c of the Hegseth, Kennedy & Gaetz appointments, and the impending shutdown of the DoEd.  The DOGE’s job got a lot easier.  Change is needed and change is coming.  The people voted for this.

Dept of Ed won’t get eliminated because it’ll require 60 votes in the Senate. Maybe they’ll be some budget cuts so some kids with disabilities lose services and low income students get less Pell Grant money. So…yay? 

It’s in Project 2025 so it has to happen right?

Trolling doesn’t really work with me. I replied to a comment about dismantling the Dept of Ed, which republicans have been talking about doing two years after it was put in place. Trump wanted that the first go around. That won’t happen, but with all the excitement about budget cuts, I’m sure republicans will try that route for some fodder for the base and so they can act like they’re doing something that they think is helpful. 

unless thune kills the filibuster

Thune is a rino, which means he is beholden to the DC establishment and uniparty.  So don’t worry, he want erase the filibuster.  Trump can still radically change the dept though and essentially neuter it and give back control to the individual States, and I’m good with that outcome as well.  

He can’t radically change it. Congress can though. This is the line of thinking that brings up the authoritarian label, if you’re ever wondering. 

Go Beavers

Choccoloccotide said:

josevolution said:

Has he put out anything on that great healthcare bill he’s been promising for 10 years 😂😂 they’ll kill ACÁ which by the way lots of hillbillies MAGA voters are on can’t wait till they realize they can’t get any healthcare for their children or themselves 

Trump has said on multiple occasions that he isn’t going to kill ACA, UNTIL there is something better to replace it with.

Right after infrastructure week.