Those who have had IGD issues: have you checked the alignment of your cartridge with a protractor to make sure it is set correctly?
Any time I encounter IGD or sibilance, correct alignment is the first thing I check. Even if your turntable was professionally set up for you, sometimes the cartridge will shift in the headshell over time and with use.
Alignment protractors can be bought very inexpensively or you can even print a template yourself for free from a number of online sources.
If hope can grow from dirt like me, it can be done. - EV
Those who have had IGD issues: have you checked the alignment of your cartridge with a protractor to make sure it is set correctly?
Any time I encounter IGD or sibilance, correct alignment is the first thing I check. Even if your turntable was professionally set up for you, sometimes the cartridge will shift in the headshell over time and with use.
Alignment protractors can be bought very inexpensively or you can even print a template yourself for free from a number of online sources.
I have not checked but this is also the only album I have this issue with that I have noticed.
Those who have had IGD issues: have you checked the alignment of your cartridge with a protractor to make sure it is set correctly?
Any time I encounter IGD or sibilance, correct alignment is the first thing I check. Even if your turntable was professionally set up for you, sometimes the cartridge will shift in the headshell over time and with use.
Alignment protractors can be bought very inexpensively or you can even print a template yourself for free from a number of online sources.
I dug out my alignment protractor and made an ever so slight cartridge adjustment at the 130mm setting. Then I measured the stylis force, which was spot on for my cartridge.
Replayed the RSD pressing - still encountered IGD. The overall sound is still dirty and very poor.
My Missoula variant arrived yesterday (Thanks @demetrios and Ear Candy !) It sounds far superior to the RSD pressing. Which was a relief as I was thinking I'd need to buy the 10C clear variant to get decent sound.
I've been listening to some Pink Floyd remasters and the RSD Talking Heads Live At WCOZ 77, which was cut at 45RPM. So perhaps my ears are spoiled and expect better sound.
Regardless, I'm highly disappointed in the RSD Dark Matter pressing.
Those who have had IGD issues: have you checked the alignment of your cartridge with a protractor to make sure it is set correctly?
Any time I encounter IGD or sibilance, correct alignment is the first thing I check. Even if your turntable was professionally set up for you, sometimes the cartridge will shift in the headshell over time and with use.
Alignment protractors can be bought very inexpensively or you can even print a template yourself for free from a number of online sources.
I dug out my alignment protractor and made the an ever so slight cartridge adjustment at the 130mm setting. Then I measured the stylis force, which was spot on for my cartridge.
Replayed the RSD pressing - still encountered IGD. The overall sound is still dirty and very poor.
My Missoula variant arrived yesterday (Thanks @demetrios and Ear Candy !) It sounds far superior to the RSD pressing. Which was a relief as I was thinking I'd need to buy the 10C clear variant to get decent sound.
I've been listening to some Pink Floyd remasters and the RSD Talking Heads Live At WCOZ 77, which was cut at 45RPM. So perhaps my ears are spoiled and expect better sound.
Regardless, I'm highly disappointed in the RSD Dark Matter pressing.
That's a bummer about the pressing. Thanks for taking the time to post your findings on your alignment.
Those Pink Floyd remasters are terrific!
If hope can grow from dirt like me, it can be done. - EV
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
Maybe, but I mean a lot of that is subjective. Literally a warning could be on any music, "Dont play this on a shitty system."
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
Maybe, but I mean a lot of that is subjective. Literally a warning could be on any music, "Dont play this on a shitty system."
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
I think amps mostly suck nowadays for vinyl.
if you have low power speakers though, that is not the AMP, I have an Onkyo manufactured in 2016 which sounds fine powering Klipsch RB-51-IIs, it has a minimum rating of 50 watts per channel and up to 100 watts at 8 ohm, the speakers are 75 watts. I still use a phono-pre instead of the onboard as that really allows vinyl to shine.
Basically anytime you upgrade your system you are going to see both benefits and drawbacks. But a Marantz with higher watt speakers is like drinking a great espresso after having dunkin donuts regular blend forever. The vinyl for these are still not peak, especially the city variants made at GZ, but definitely will sound better with your new system. What kind of turntable and cart are you using?
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
Maybe, but I mean a lot of that is subjective. Literally a warning could be on any music, "Dont play this on a shitty system."
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
I think amps mostly suck nowadays for vinyl.
My last comment was "some what" tongue in cheek. As @PB11041 said " The vinyl for these are still not peak, especially the city variants made at GZ ..."
Although my system is relatively low end, all my other vinyl sounds great to amazing depending on the pressing. As I mentioned earlier I've been listening to the Pink Floyd remasters which are next level and then put on the RSD Dark Matter and wonder why I paid nearly $50 for such a poor quality pressing.
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
Maybe, but I mean a lot of that is subjective. Literally a warning could be on any music, "Dont play this on a shitty system."
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
I think amps mostly suck nowadays for vinyl.
if you have low power speakers though, that is not the AMP, I have an Onkyo manufactured in 2016 which sounds fine powering Klipsch RB-51-IIs, it has a minimum rating of 50 watts per channel and up to 100 watts at 8 ohm, the speakers are 75 watts. I still use a phono-pre instead of the onboard as that really allows vinyl to shine.
Basically anytime you upgrade your system you are going to see both benefits and drawbacks. But a Marantz with higher watt speakers is like drinking a great espresso after having dunkin donuts regular blend forever. The vinyl for these are still not peak, especially the city variants made at GZ, but definitely will sound better with your new system. What kind of turntable and cart are you using?
I have a U-Turn Orbit, with an Ortofon blue. For my pre-amp (when not using the Marantz) is a Schiit Mani.
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
If that's the case there should be a warning label indicating the component and watt requirements necessary to achieve maximum sound quality.
Maybe, but I mean a lot of that is subjective. Literally a warning could be on any music, "Dont play this on a shitty system."
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
I think amps mostly suck nowadays for vinyl.
My last comment was "some what" tongue in cheek. As @PB11041 said " The vinyl for these are still not peak, especially the city variants made at GZ ..."
Although my system is relatively low end, all my other vinyl sounds great to amazing depending on the pressing. As I mentioned earlier I've been listening to the Pink Floyd remasters which are next level and then put on the RSD Dark Matter and wonder why I paid nearly $50 for such a poor quality pressing.
Yeah, I hear you. The variants are definitely not prime. I have a very old copy of Pink Floyd ABITW, and it sounds great on either system.
I've yet to spin any of my vinyl copies yet just because the Atmos bluray sounds way too good.
What are you playing the bluray on? I have a sonos atmos soundbar and a bluray play but my surrounds and sub aren't atoms so I don't know if I'm hearing it correclty.
Ok. So my clear arrived today from the 10c (US store).
Looking at the deadwax, its the same as the 10c. No notes on it being pressed at Pallas.
If you look at the Discogs listing for clear (rn, theres just Europe, no US listing), everything is the exact same except for the Pallas code. on my US ordered clear it is not listed after Matt@Metropolis=.
Probably worthwhile to add a US listing. I guess I'll order a clear from Europe and see if thats better.
Ok. So my clear arrived today. I cleaned it in a full cycle on my Degritter. That’s probably over kill, but if I’m doing an ABC with my 10c red and my Chicago variant, I want to be thorough.
I did an AB on the 10c and Chicago a few weeks back. Ultimately it was a toss up. Low end was better on the 10c, with the nights better on the Chicago variant. City variants are pressed at CZ and Furnace did the 10c (apparently).
so adding the clear to this mix I have to say sound wise it’s on par with the 10c. Deep low end but the highs aren’t really crisp. I will say the vinyl is light years quieter than the other two. This leads me to conclude it was probably pressed at Pallas because they have fantastic QC and are known as probably the best plant in the world.
Ultimately, it’s the mastering of the record that hurts the most. We all know it’s compressed to hell and it’s very noticeable here still.
So my advice if you want the best sounding colored copy, the 10c clear is the way to go.
Thanks for taking the time to compare the pressings. And thanks for the insight.
Ok. So my clear arrived today from the 10c (US store).
Looking at the deadwax, its the same as the 10c. No notes on it being pressed at Pallas.
If you look at the Discogs listing for clear (rn, theres just Europe, no US listing), everything is the exact same except for the Pallas code. on my US ordered clear it is not listed after Matt@Metropolis=.
Probably worthwhile to add a US listing. I guess I'll order a clear from Europe and see if thats better.
Thanks for sharing this info. Definitely not ordering the clear through 10C then. Was hoping for the Pallas edition.
Comments
Any time I encounter IGD or sibilance, correct alignment is the first thing I check. Even if your turntable was professionally set up for you, sometimes the cartridge will shift in the headshell over time and with use.
Alignment protractors can be bought very inexpensively or you can even print a template yourself for free from a number of online sources.
Replayed the RSD pressing - still encountered IGD. The overall sound is still dirty and very poor.
My Missoula variant arrived yesterday (Thanks @demetrios and Ear Candy !) It sounds far superior to the RSD pressing. Which was a relief as I was thinking I'd need to buy the 10C clear variant to get decent sound.
I've been listening to some Pink Floyd remasters
and the RSD Talking Heads Live At WCOZ 77, which was cut at 45RPM. So perhaps my ears are spoiled and expect better sound.
Regardless, I'm highly disappointed in the RSD Dark Matter pressing.
2005 The Gorge Amphitheatre, WA
Those Pink Floyd remasters are terrific!
So, I was listening to these variants using my tt and a newer (2019) Onkyo amp I have, not very powerful, 20W speakers, etc. The variants sounded muddy.
Then I got my new (vintage) Marantz Amp, and new 75W speakers, and holy cow, it opened up beautifully. I still think the Clear and Black are the best, but all of the variants I have sounded really pretty good. I wonder if just equipment is to blame for some of the sound.
Nuclear fission
where could one get the Pallas variant from? Universal-music.de has clear variant available, but is it this?
2005 The Gorge Amphitheatre, WA
The CD sounds great in my car and my CD player, sucks on my daughters Lil Boombox.
Same goes for vinyl...I think older records sound better than reissues, some people like the newer ones cause the have less damage. But it is what it is.
I think amps mostly suck nowadays for vinyl.
Nuclear fission
Basically anytime you upgrade your system you are going to see both benefits and drawbacks. But a Marantz with higher watt speakers is like drinking a great espresso after having dunkin donuts regular blend forever. The vinyl for these are still not peak, especially the city variants made at GZ, but definitely will sound better with your new system. What kind of turntable and cart are you using?
http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652
Although my system is relatively low end, all my other vinyl sounds great to amazing depending on the pressing. As I mentioned earlier I've been listening to the Pink Floyd remasters which are next level and then put on the RSD Dark Matter and wonder why I paid nearly $50 for such a poor quality pressing.
2005 The Gorge Amphitheatre, WA
Nuclear fission
Nuclear fission
http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652
https://www.discogs.com/release/30442613-Pearl-Jam-Dark-Matter
What are you playing the bluray on? I have a sonos atmos soundbar and a bluray play but my surrounds and sub aren't atoms so I don't know if I'm hearing it correclty.
Looking at the deadwax, its the same as the 10c. No notes on it being pressed at Pallas.
If you look at the Discogs listing for clear (rn, theres just Europe, no US listing), everything is the exact same except for the Pallas code. on my US ordered clear it is not listed after Matt@Metropolis=.
Probably worthwhile to add a US listing. I guess I'll order a clear from Europe and see if thats better.
2005 The Gorge Amphitheatre, WA