COVID and band members

Go Beavers

RiotAct10 said:

sdharv1919 said:

Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates.  Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).

https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1528725880268128256?s=20&t=vVaYxMXSgXw8uo4ZX6BgIw

Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?

That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done. 

SHZA

MD190661 said:

I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.

They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.

By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home 

HughFreakingDillon

nothing is 100% effective. no one said there was. 

Get_Right

Go Beavers said:

RiotAct10 said:

sdharv1919 said:

Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates.  Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).

https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1528725880268128256?s=20&t=vVaYxMXSgXw8uo4ZX6BgIw

Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?

That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done. 

It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.   

Loujoe

Can we get back to the fast food talk? It's McDaniels not Mcdonalds, the rhymes are Darrell's, but the burgers are Ronald's!

sdharv1919

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

RiotAct10 said:

sdharv1919 said:

Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates.  Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).

https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1528725880268128256?s=20&t=vVaYxMXSgXw8uo4ZX6BgIw

Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?

That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done. 

It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.   

Here are 3 to chew on:

https://www.cureus.com/articles/93826-correlation-between-mask-compliance-and-covid-19-outcomes-in-europe

https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4586/rr-6

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

sdharv1919

sdharv1919 said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

RiotAct10 said:

sdharv1919 said:

Everywhere in the world, mask usage is not associated with lower infection rates.  Only well-fitted N95s offer any measure of protection (to the wearer).

https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1528725880268128256?s=20&t=vVaYxMXSgXw8uo4ZX6BgIw

Can you elaborate on what you said and the study you posted, because I am not seeing the connection. The word "mask" is used one time in the article, and while it says they were required "on campus", I am not seeing anything about where cases happened, such as dorm rooms, parties, classrooms, etc. In fact it seems to suggest it all started when students went home for Thanksgiving, or at least that is what I am seeing. How are you drawing from this study that masks don't work?

That’s just it. It’s not a study on mask effectiveness, it’s just looking at spread amongst the students. A study about masks would require a control group, which very few have done. 

It is a study that benchmarks the mask mandate, not the effectiveness of a mask.   

Here are 3 to chew on:

https://www.cureus.com/articles/93826-correlation-between-mask-compliance-and-covid-19-outcomes-in-europe

https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4586/rr-6

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

And....

https://academic.oup.com/jid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/infdis/jiac195/6582941

DM282158

Fast food debate > Covid debate

Does Chipotle count as fast food? Because if so, hands down the best. 

SHZA

.HughFreakingDillon said:

nothing is 100% effective. no one said there was. 

Exactly. So why criticize the maskless for taking risks when the mask wearer is as well 

HughFreakingDillon

so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's. 

MD190661

SHZA said:

MD190661 said:

I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.

They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.

By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home 

Or just wear a mask and have a good time. I didn't get sick. My maskless friends did. Not sure why this is so hard for people. Well fitting masks help prevent spread of disease. Wore a tight N95 the whole time. 

thomascbullock

OceansJenny said:

Tjm007 said:

Does anyone know if Matt or Jeff were actually unwell or did they just fail a test ?

We aren’t going to have this information offered to us.

It might even be complicated for insurance reasons to be straightforward about this.

ddeschler

My daughter loves Chipotle, but my wife hates it.  I think it's okay, but only if I have that green tabasco hot sauce.  I used to like it more, but it has faded with time in my food hierarchy.

mpedone

ddeschler said:

My daughter loves Chipotle, but my wife hates it.  I think it's okay, but only if I have that green tabasco hot sauce.  I used to like it more, but it has faded with time in my food hierarchy.

I love it, especially the guac. It's SO MUCH FOOD, though! I used to have pretty bad anxiety about ordering, but I'm way better about it now.

SHZA

MD190661 said:

SHZA said:

MD190661 said:

I wore a mask at both Oakland shows. My friends who I went with each night both got Covid while not wearing a mask. I didn't.

They then got their families sick. One needed to go to the ER. Take it for what it’s worth. Can’t understand not trying to protect yourself or others around you during a COVID surge.

By that logic, you should have stayed home. There's no evidence that masks are 100% effective. Can't understand why you would go to a show with 18,000 other people and risk contracting covid instead of protecting yourself and others by staying home 

Or just wear a mask and have a good time. I didn't get sick. My maskless friends did. Not sure why this is so hard for people. Well fitting masks help prevent spread of disease. Wore a tight N95 the whole time. 

Or don't wear a mask and have a good time. I and many others didn't and didn't get sick. Do you know for a fact that no one with a mask got sick or spread the virus? Staying home is a more effective way to prevent the spread of disease than wearing a mask to a crowded indoor venue where thousands of people are packed tightly together and singing for hours. If that is the priority, why not stay home?

SHZA

HughFreakingDillon said:

so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's. 

Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical. 

Sarava

I hope the guys got through their bouts of Covid and are well again.

HughFreakingDillon

SHZA said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's. 

Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical. 

It's not hypocritical. masks don't necessarily help the mask wearer, they help those around the mask wearer, so the person wearing the mask annoyed at you not wearing one is annoyed because you aren't doing your part to stop it. they are. 

smile6680

Lerxst1992 said:

Tjm007 said:

JABK said:

Tool is about to wrap up a month long arena tour in Europe, and I attended the show in Stockholm. Maybe PJ should ask Tool for some advice what they've done to reduce the risk for infection? Of course luck is also involved when talking about Covid...

PJ need to travel forward 2 years in time to 2022. The solution is to not test every morning and come to work unless you feel ill. 

Hiding in a bubble prevents exposure to lots of common bugs and viruses - simply storing up trouble for the future of your immune system.

Two more years, Covid could still be here. At that point, maybe it’s time to consider whether they want a road life at all. If someone in the band is high risk,I get the caution, but perhaps they should not be in a touring band if there is an elevated health risk.

 Otherwise, plenty of other bands are playing hundreds of shows with no known issues. PJ gets thru five before issues emerge. They seemingly are doing something very different than most of the other bands. 

There are tons of risks greater than Covid at shows. Saw Primus the other day, mostly packed in GA. Moshing and crowd surfing were rampant. Huge risk. Packed in like sardines, a young lady passed out. Luckily they got her out, but it wasn’t easy for security and it took time. Risks at these shows are everywhere.

This is a reasonable post. I agree, except for them doing something different. Who really knows why they can't seem to make it work. I guess we will continue to speculate on why.

RatherStarved

HughFreakingDillon said:

SHZA said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

so it's 100% or nothing to you? the science is sound. masks stop a good amount of the droplets that contain the virus. cloth masks provide the least protection (you know, the ones our favourite band sells?). Medical masks are the next best after KN95's. 

Not at all. I just find it arbitrary to criticize someone with no mask for not doing everything possible to "stop the spread" when the same could be said about the mask wearer. If the mask isn't 100% effective, they are still incurring a risk of infection and spread that could be eliminated by staying home. But he wants to see the show, so he's willing to tolerate some level of risk of contracting the virus and spreading it to others while wearing a mask. The person without the mask is willing to tolerate a somewhat higher risk to enjoy the show without a mask. The mask wearer deeming his own risk-taking as acceptable but the maskless person's risk unacceptable is arbitrary and hypocritical. 

It's not hypocritical. masks don't necessarily help the mask wearer, they help those around the mask wearer, so the person wearing the mask annoyed at you not wearing one is annoyed because you aren't doing your part to stop it. they are. 

True, but with mask mandates mostly gone now, you can’t really have an issue with someone else deciding not to wear one.  Even though it’s kind of dumb that the mandates are gone in large indoor venues.  I’m a mask-wearing show-goer and I think SHZA has a decent point - that’s the amount of risk I’m willing to take.  It’s less risk than a non-mask wearing show-goer and more than a person who stays home 24/7.  How much more or less depends on the quality of the mask and how often I take it off for a beer.  Or three.