“PJ Premium” on Ticketmaster?

cmalisze

pistol3 said:

Yeah I don't quite get the complete unconditional love for all involved with the ticket prices (Band, 10 club, etc).  I think it's okay to call things out that are BS.  Obviously it's ridiculous, otherwise there wouldn't be so many tickets still available.

Blind loyalty. 

Poncier

JBob87 said:

Things that can't be done:

- Eliminate PJ Platinum / TM price gouging

Oh that can be done. And its all up to PJ.

on2legs

Put me in the band/fan club unconditional love category!

mpedone

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

Vedd Hedd said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

They did change the system. 

What other bands can you NOT resale except for “face” outside of NY and CO due to laws?  That’s progress.  They did it. Plenty bands can but don’t. 

They secure 50-75% of the venue for fan club. Newsflash fan club is an elite way to get tickets before general public.  Kudos to them for cutting those deals. 

If they toured more the demand wouldn’t  be as great in certain markets 

Platinum ain’t going away so move on. Ain’t on them. It’s a TM/LN creation. 

Everyone buys merch. How ya feel that The promoters get anywhere from 15- 25% of the sales?  So we are all giving them more money.   

TM/ LN are full on scams BUT until someone comes alone and buys the venues to control the system , it ain’t gonna change. The best everyone can hope for is what this band does for its fans. 

Enjoy the shows if you’re going and be happy that you got your tickets for the lowest price available  

For some now not to see that the locking of tickets and the F2F only option to sell is only enhancing the problem is hilarious. This is exactly how they (PJ and TM) manipulate the market. This is the start of the problem. It is not a free market. We have been lied to. Does the Ten Club have good intentions? I'd love to believe so. I just can't believe they are this ignorant while also having the best of intentions. Do they have a choice? Possibly not but, come by it honestly. 

a free market would be all the tickets sold on TM and fan club gets nothing. Ya want that chaos? I don’t. Would rather know a nice portion of fans got tixs

Define a free market? Our definition may be different. 

I'm curious as to your definition.

Wikipedia gives a fair definition......I bolded a few key points. The current situation with PJ tickets and always with TM shows we are not participating in a free market with either business (PJ/TM.) 

In economics, a free market is a system in which the prices for goods and services are self-regulated by buyers and sellers negotiating in an open market without market coercions. In a free market, the laws and forces of supply and demand are free from any intervention by a government or other authority other than those interventions which are made to prohibit market coercions. Examples of such prohibited market coercions include: economic privilege, monopolies, and artificial scarcities. Proponents of the concept of free market contrast it with a regulated market in which a government intervenes in the exchange of property for any reason other than reducing market coercions.

"Free markets" are never free.  They are always upended by something.  Whether that is something like Ticketmaster or Disney (artificial scarcities) or market coercions (business or government interference)....it never works out for the consumer in America. 

I say America, because most other nations dont seem to have this level of problems with late stage capitalism. 

So are you saying we should bend over and take it? I prefer to call out hypocrisy as I see it, no matter who the culprit is. Sadly, in this instance the guilty parties are TM (who has always been guilty) and now PJ (who I hold in high regard.) I will always speak truth to power.....

Sadly...these lyrics ring even more true now and are relevant to the Ten Club....

"We can scream, out our doors
Behind the wall a fat man snores"

You've convinced me. I will follow your lead and... um, keep giving the Ten Club my money and keep seeing the band live in concert? I'll even keep buying merch. That'll show 'em!

You're right. We should all be quiet, grin and bear it. Unless you're in the band, apparently. 

Might as well, if all you're going to do about a band you think are greedy, hypocritical, sell-outs is complain about them being greedy while still giving them your money.

Man o man......this is exactly the problem. We wonder why the "elite" and/or "premium" mentality among the privileged exists only to continually enable these individuals to negatively impact the common man. I mean why did Ed bring a Bush mask on stage? Bush was already President. His words didn't matter then anymore than mine do now to PJ apologists. Change doesn't start at the zero hour when PJ is signing the agreement with TM. It starts now for next tour. Keep enabling and apologizing for the Ten Club/band it will only get worse. It may continually get worse no matter what, admittedly. If you are not a part of a solution you are a part of the problem.....

They protested Bush, and they supported candidates that opposed him, and efforts to get more people to the polls to vote against him. They didn't donate money to his campaign. I'm not an apologist or blindly loyal, I just don't see how talking about this here is being "part of the solution". You're not buying Premium tickets? Great! Neither are the rest of us. Next idea?

cmalisze

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

Vedd Hedd said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

They did change the system. 

What other bands can you NOT resale except for “face” outside of NY and CO due to laws?  That’s progress.  They did it. Plenty bands can but don’t. 

They secure 50-75% of the venue for fan club. Newsflash fan club is an elite way to get tickets before general public.  Kudos to them for cutting those deals. 

If they toured more the demand wouldn’t  be as great in certain markets 

Platinum ain’t going away so move on. Ain’t on them. It’s a TM/LN creation. 

Everyone buys merch. How ya feel that The promoters get anywhere from 15- 25% of the sales?  So we are all giving them more money.   

TM/ LN are full on scams BUT until someone comes alone and buys the venues to control the system , it ain’t gonna change. The best everyone can hope for is what this band does for its fans. 

Enjoy the shows if you’re going and be happy that you got your tickets for the lowest price available  

For some now not to see that the locking of tickets and the F2F only option to sell is only enhancing the problem is hilarious. This is exactly how they (PJ and TM) manipulate the market. This is the start of the problem. It is not a free market. We have been lied to. Does the Ten Club have good intentions? I'd love to believe so. I just can't believe they are this ignorant while also having the best of intentions. Do they have a choice? Possibly not but, come by it honestly. 

a free market would be all the tickets sold on TM and fan club gets nothing. Ya want that chaos? I don’t. Would rather know a nice portion of fans got tixs

Define a free market? Our definition may be different. 

I'm curious as to your definition.

Wikipedia gives a fair definition......I bolded a few key points. The current situation with PJ tickets and always with TM shows we are not participating in a free market with either business (PJ/TM.) 

In economics, a free market is a system in which the prices for goods and services are self-regulated by buyers and sellers negotiating in an open market without market coercions. In a free market, the laws and forces of supply and demand are free from any intervention by a government or other authority other than those interventions which are made to prohibit market coercions. Examples of such prohibited market coercions include: economic privilege, monopolies, and artificial scarcities. Proponents of the concept of free market contrast it with a regulated market in which a government intervenes in the exchange of property for any reason other than reducing market coercions.

"Free markets" are never free.  They are always upended by something.  Whether that is something like Ticketmaster or Disney (artificial scarcities) or market coercions (business or government interference)....it never works out for the consumer in America. 

I say America, because most other nations dont seem to have this level of problems with late stage capitalism. 

So are you saying we should bend over and take it? I prefer to call out hypocrisy as I see it, no matter who the culprit is. Sadly, in this instance the guilty parties are TM (who has always been guilty) and now PJ (who I hold in high regard.) I will always speak truth to power.....

Sadly...these lyrics ring even more true now and are relevant to the Ten Club....

"We can scream, out our doors
Behind the wall a fat man snores"

You've convinced me. I will follow your lead and... um, keep giving the Ten Club my money and keep seeing the band live in concert? I'll even keep buying merch. That'll show 'em!

You're right. We should all be quiet, grin and bear it. Unless you're in the band, apparently. 

Might as well, if all you're going to do about a band you think are greedy, hypocritical, sell-outs is complain about them being greedy while still giving them your money.

Man o man......this is exactly the problem. We wonder why the "elite" and/or "premium" mentality among the privileged exists only to continually enable these individuals to negatively impact the common man. I mean why did Ed bring a Bush mask on stage? Bush was already President. His words didn't matter then anymore than mine do now to PJ apologists. Change doesn't start at the zero hour when PJ is signing the agreement with TM. It starts now for next tour. Keep enabling and apologizing for the Ten Club/band it will only get worse. It may continually get worse no matter what, admittedly. If you are not a part of a solution you are a part of the problem.....

They protested Bush, and they supported candidates that opposed him, and efforts to get more people to the polls to vote against him. They didn't donate money to his campaign. I'm not an apologist or blindly loyal, I just don't see how talking about this here is being "part of the solution". You're not buying Premium tickets? Great! Neither are the rest of us. Next idea?

I can tell you that staying silent.....gushing with admiration while being taken advantage of.....turning away......or being loyally blind is NOT a solution. You missed a vital word when suggesting I'm not buying "Premium" tickets......no......I am not buying "PJ Premium" tickets. Huge difference and if you cannot see that then therein lies the initial problem. 

mpedone

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

pistol3

Well, being that we have very little actual power to affect change, bitching about it is the start.  Bring attention to things, and change can occur.  Just because someone isn't offering up the situation altering solution doesn't mean there isn't a problem.  

cmalisze

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

mpedone

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

Thank you, this was very well stated. Have you tried to send this directly to the Ten Club? I don't have faith that much of what is posted on the forum gets to the people who matter, but perhaps direct communication?

cmalisze

mpedone said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

Thank you, this was very well stated. Have you tried to send this directly to the Ten Club? I don't have faith that much of what is posted on the forum gets to the people who matter, but perhaps direct communication?

And I thank you for dealing with me! But to be 100% transparent.....I would absolutely be supportive of the "old" way where "PJ Premium" didn't exist and the tickets weren't transferable etc. Or as a compromise.....GA $$$ Lower Level $$ Upper Level $ as an acceptable structure. 

Still need Oakland!!!

JP218404

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

I just had tickets transferred to me  so not sure why this is one of your issues. 

cmalisze

JP218404 said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

I just had tickets transferred to me  so not sure why this is one of your issues. 

What show?

helplessdancer

wow 23 pages...i am not a fan of premium priced tickets. nuff said.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6Hzr3h9g0k

pjl44

cmalisze said:

pistol3 said:

Yeah I don't quite get the complete unconditional love for all involved with the ticket prices (Band, 10 club, etc).  I think it's okay to call things out that are BS.  Obviously it's ridiculous, otherwise there wouldn't be so many tickets still available.

Blind loyalty. 

It's not loyalty or unconditional love. It's the opposite. It's not giving a shit and having a healthy relationship with a rock band. They're a business, I'm a customer. I wouldn't pay more than 200ish bucks for a typical Pearl Jam ticket but couldn't care less if someone else does.

cmalisze

pjl44 said:

cmalisze said:

pistol3 said:

Yeah I don't quite get the complete unconditional love for all involved with the ticket prices (Band, 10 club, etc).  I think it's okay to call things out that are BS.  Obviously it's ridiculous, otherwise there wouldn't be so many tickets still available.

Blind loyalty. 

It's not loyalty or unconditional love. It's the opposite. It's not giving a shit and having a healthy relationship with a rock band. They're a business, I'm a customer. I wouldn't pay more than 200ish bucks for a typical Pearl Jam ticket but couldn't care less if someone else does.

I now have this understanding.  Wish I did a few weeks ago.  People apologizing for and solely blaming TM are loyally blind. A difference.  

foriginalsin

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

Clearly, no one thinks this is an ideal situation with Ticketmaster. 

Just to be clear, you were ok with the relationship with Ticketmaster for the last 25 years, but now this is too much? Ticketmasters shenanigans have been fucking pearl jam their entire career. But now you’re really upset? 

I mean pearl jam was complicit with Ticketmaster since the beginning. Doesnt this make you a hypocrite for supporting them up until now? 

on2legs

 Pearl Jam is a business.  They’re uniquely talented and entitled to cash in on those talents.  They could soak us for a ton more per ticket.  But they don't.  They make a lot of money but they leave a lot on the table too.  

People can have integrity and also make a lot of money.  They’re not mutually exclusive things.  And they’re not hypocrites.  Ed told us long ago that file sharing ended album sales as a source of revenue and that touring would be the replacement.  

I get you can be unhappy with the change.  But that’s part of life. Holding them to stuff they said 30 years ago when no one even knew what Napster was or even what the internet was is an impossible standard.  

No one says we all have to agree.  But interjecting the same sourpuss comments page after page in every thread is bordering on obsessive.  

cmalisze

foriginalsin said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

Clearly, no one thinks this is an ideal situation with Ticketmaster. 

Just to be clear, you were ok with the relationship with Ticketmaster for the last 25 years, but now this is too much? Ticketmasters shenanigans have been fucking pearl jam their entire career. But now you’re really upset? 

I mean pearl jam was complicit with Ticketmaster since the beginning. Doesnt this make you a hypocrite for supporting them up until now? 

Comical. Having to work for and working with are different in so many ways.  I do not believe TM's shenanigans have hurt PJ to much extent aside from not being an equal at their bargaining opportunities with TM. I'm fairly certain they're all ok. RIGHTFULLY SO. I've happily and will continue to contribute to it.  The shenanigans you speak of have and always will hurt fans. Before "PJ Premium" it seemed as if PJ was still working for TM out of necessity to be as successful as they as want to be financially.  This is still the case now but x50 (see MSG) while still being told the same message when things weren't nearly this egregious. 

cmalisze

cmalisze said:

foriginalsin said:

cmalisze said:

mpedone said:

I keep literally asking you what we can do to affect change, and all you keep telling me I'm being "blindly loyal".

1. Speak truth to power. Call out the situation as you see it. If you see it as "no harm" then please state the case why. I see it as fans being taken advantage of, significantly, which is why I continually state my position. 
2. . Provide specific examples of hypocrisy. There are plenty in this circumstance. I would assume the Ten Club and/or the band would take it to heart and make necessary adjustments to not be considered hypocrites or greedy elite individuals by a large contingency of their fan base. 
3. Do not buy PJ Premium or any seat, for that matter, UNTIL F2F is released to better understand all options. Then proceed as you feel fit. 
4. Demand the ability to transfer tickets. This is imperative. This is the #1 culprit to how fans are being manipulated. Our inability to transfer tickets makes for their ability to have "PJ Premium" seats set at an astronomical above "market" price. The market for seats is manipulated. 
5. Demand for transparency. When will F2F sales be enabled? "Spring" is not an acceptable answer any longer because our trust is broken. Some shows are less than a month away and our beloved Ten Club members are sweating over the chance of being stuck with $300 worth of seats that cannot be used. 
6. Demand the Ten Club forum allow for trades (not cash sales) of tickets on the forum for whatever both parties are agreeable to. I had a post taken down offering 2 seats for 1 because that is apparently scalping and against the rules of this forum. This is now another control mechanism. We can't suggest deals be made to benefit two willing parties but PJ/TM are comfortable with market manipulation and price gauging. Seems fair. 


I recognize "demands" are just that "demands." However there is strength in numbers and for all the apologists out there I assure you that you will, at some point, be disappointed in this process and to dismiss what many are saying because you personally are taken care of or happy with this tour's outcome is selfish.  It is easy not to care when your needs are met. I will also say this.... I was taken care of. I was chosen by the Ten Club for Vegas but now cannot go. I would love to sell these seats on F2F......donate them....or trade them to a fan dying to go to Vegas but what's good for one isn't good for the other in this "relationship." Not that hard to see... sadly. 

Clearly, no one thinks this is an ideal situation with Ticketmaster. 

Just to be clear, you were ok with the relationship with Ticketmaster for the last 25 years, but now this is too much? Ticketmasters shenanigans have been fucking pearl jam their entire career. But now you’re really upset? 

I mean pearl jam was complicit with Ticketmaster since the beginning. Doesnt this make you a hypocrite for supporting them up until now? 

Comical. Having to work for and working with are different in so many ways.  I do not believe TM's shenanigans have hurt PJ to much extent aside from not being an equal at their bargaining opportunities with TM. I'm fairly certain they're all ok. RIGHTFULLY SO. I've happily and will continue to contribute to it.  The shenanigans you speak of have and always will hurt fans. Before "PJ Premium" it seemed as if PJ was still working for TM out of necessity to be as successful as they as want to be financially, while calling them out. This is still the case now but now x50 (see MSG) while still being told the same message when prices weren't nearly this egregious. 

smile6680

JP218404 said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

cmalisze said:

JP218404 said:

pjl44 said:

Click through for the thread if you want a taste of the industry via Frank Turner

https://twitter.com/frankturner/status/1512007752012505091?t=Y3sdAruQ5sTiu85Pg_sU-g&s=19

It’s not easy. I work with bands that hit the road and next thing ya know they have to hold up a tour for a week affecting all the other bands on tour with them. 

They still have to pay the crew and now either have to get a hotel for 4 days, feed themselves more since they get no dinners from the promoters. Don’t get paid for the gigs and now have to figure out how to get back into the room they were playing cause the touring market is flooded

its Ugly out there 

If only millionaires made thousands less. 

Yeah cause the bands in a van are millionaires. 

I missed where in the PJ forum we aren't talking about PJ. Bands in vans are a separate conversation completely irrelevant to this one. 

The answer was the frank turner Twitter post

as far as PJ goes, they have been paying their crew and staff for 2+ years now  as they are employees.  You wanna go about millionaires. They could have told them to scratch. They didn’t. 

Is this accurate? Honest question