Nassau Coliseum 2003

Sobelberg8

This is considered to be one of the most controversial moments in the history of Pearl Jam. We saw how it played out on PJ20 and how the band’s reaction to what happened was split. Jeff called it art, Matt was fearing for his safety. Any way you slice it, the crowd’s actions in Uniondale that night were inexcusable.

We went into full detail this week how the situation went down with a lot of focus on the why. Why did the crowd react the way they did? What was the community on Long Island like in a post-9/11 world? Living there at the time and seeing some things I wish I hadn’t seen (I’ll get real personal and pretty angry in this one) I’ll share with you guys my thoughts on the mindset of people who were continuing to grieve from the attacks and why they were so sensitive to anything perceived as anti-American.

if you can’t handle anything political or controversial right now, stay away from this one

pjl44

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

on2legs

I was there.  It was tough. The 9/11 nerve was still raw.  While I don’t agree with it,  I  don’t think the crowds reaction was inexcusable.  When I say that I’m referring to the booing.  I was on the floor that night and didn’t see anything else inappropriate.  

RS65573

I was 12th row center. People were throwing change and it looked like a riot was about to break out. I left with my arm hair standing on end like I was about to get jumped.
Best Know Your Rights in history...WORTH IT!
A feeling I will never forget. 

pjl44

on2legs said:

I was there.  It was tough. The 9/11 nerve was still raw.  While I don’t agree with it,  I  don’t think the crowds reaction was inexcusable.  When I say that I’m referring to the booing.  I was on the floor that night and didn’t see anything else inappropriate.  

My feelings exactly 

mcgruff10

on2legs said:

I was there.  It was tough. The 9/11 nerve was still raw.  While I don’t agree with it,  I  don’t think the crowds reaction was inexcusable.  When I say that I’m referring to the booing.  I was on the floor that night and didn’t see anything else inappropriate.  

Agree with all of this.  I was in the first few rows on the floor in front of Stone and it went from being one of the best shows ever to one of the if not the most controversial shows in the history of the band.  At the end of the show I was just kind of in shock as to what just happened.  

Sobelberg8

on2legs said:

I was there.  It was tough. The 9/11 nerve was still raw.  While I don’t agree with it,  I  don’t think the crowds reaction was inexcusable.  When I say that I’m referring to the booing.  I was on the floor that night and didn’t see anything else inappropriate.  

Yeah it was really tough to defend the crowd for their actions. booing is fine, putting the band in harm’s way is not. I think we all get why people were upset and it hit way too close to home, the sensitivity in that area at the time was at an all time high, jingoism and blind patriotism because they felt their anger was justifiable after the tragedy. 

I’ll ask you to listen to this so we can continue this discussion. We told a first hand account from this night that could’ve potentially led to a dangerous situation  

Sobelberg8

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

RS65573

Sobelberg8 unfortunately I'm old and I'm never going to listen to a podcast like this. If you typed it up, id read it, comment and probably love it. For what its worth.

pjl44

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

Sobelberg8

RS65573 said:

Sobelberg8 unfortunately I'm old and I'm never going to listen to a podcast like this. If you typed it up, id read it, comment and probably love it. For what its worth.

Podcasts don’t have age limits. If you have time, try giving it a shot. I get that it’s long, can always listen to it in pieces. It’s basically listening to the boot while hearing us talk about what you’re listening to. From one Pearl Jam fan to another, I would be honored if you gave it a try.

Sobelberg8

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

pjl44

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Sobelberg8

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Why even bother combatting what the band said? They left the stage early because they thought it was a risk and they were uncomfortable (mainly Mike and Matt). Matt said he had never been physically hurt at a show before that. You can’t compare it to other situations, they are their own separate entities. If the band was concerned for their safety and people in the crowd, who again the person I spoke with had shit flying all over his head 20 days after undergoing major neck surgery, there would’ve been serious issues had he of been hit in the head, if they had safety concerns leave it at that. 

mcgruff10

I don’t recall anyone throwing anything, they were just booing. I wasn’t fearing for my safety at all.  

Sobelberg8

mcgruff10 said:

I don’t recall anyone throwing anything, they were just booing. 

It doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. You can’t visibly see anything from the video either but there is definitely a moment early in Know Your Rights where Mike or Stone hesitates for a second. Can’t say for sure what it is but it didn’t sound like a natural pause

Sobelberg8

Everything here seems to be about everyone’s personal account. Everyone’s stories are different. Just because you personally didn’t feel there was a safety risk doesn’t mean that others didn’t feel the same way. This is as honest of a band and group of individuals that I can think of, if they say they felt at risk or uncomfortable there’s no reason not to trust them. The same way there’s no reason not to trust your accounts that you didn’t feel like there was a safety risk. Everyone has a different story to tell from this from different perspectives. 

Good open honest conversation. Not hating on anyone here. Just defending those who need to be heard

mcgruff10

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Why even bother combatting what the band said? They left the stage early because they thought it was a risk and they were uncomfortable (mainly Mike and Matt). Matt said he had never been physically hurt at a show before that. You can’t compare it to other situations, they are their own separate entities. If the band was concerned for their safety and people in the crowd, who again the person I spoke with had shit flying all over his head 20 days after undergoing major neck surgery, there would’ve been serious issues had he of been hit in the head, if they had safety concerns leave it at that. 

I thought they left early because they lost the crowd and ed was obviously pissed, not because they were fearing for their safety. Matt was physically hurt?  I've never heard of that, do you have a link?
And I have never seen evidence of anything being thrown and if anything was thrown it definitely didn't reach the stage.  Ed is not bashful about pointing out that kind of behavior (quarter incident boston 98, indio 93).

Spiritual_Chaos

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

I still don't see what those in the crowd didn't understand about or couldn't separate about what Eddie said.

...I mean... come on...

Edit: maybe I am misremembering what Eddie said... but I don't think so..

pjl44

Spiritual_Chaos said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

I still don't see what those in the crowd didn't understand about or couldn't separate about what Eddie said.

...I mean... come on...

Edit: maybe I am misremembering what Eddie said... but I don't think so..

It was the Bush mask and song choice. Given the area and timing, people were still pretty sensitive. I don't think there's anything wrong with what Ed did but it was provocative like good art often is.

pjl44

Also, I hope anyone who was hit by a flying t-shirt was able to quickly get it off their shoulder before it did too much damage

on2legs

I saw zero that would lead me to believe their safety was at risk anymore than at Yankee stadium when we boo Giancarlo Stanton for another strikeout.  

It was definitely tense but I doubt they would have stayed for another song if the band felt unsafe. 

Sobelberg8

mcgruff10 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Why even bother combatting what the band said? They left the stage early because they thought it was a risk and they were uncomfortable (mainly Mike and Matt). Matt said he had never been physically hurt at a show before that. You can’t compare it to other situations, they are their own separate entities. If the band was concerned for their safety and people in the crowd, who again the person I spoke with had shit flying all over his head 20 days after undergoing major neck surgery, there would’ve been serious issues had he of been hit in the head, if they had safety concerns leave it at that. 

I thought they left early because they lost the crowd and ed was obviously pissed, not because they were fearing for their safety. Matt was physically hurt?  I've never heard of that, do you have a link?
And I have never seen evidence of anything being thrown and if anything was thrown it definitely didn't reach the stage.  Ed is not bashful about pointing out that kind of behavior (quarter incident boston 98, indio 93).

So I took the quote out of context a little bit. “Trying to hurt us” and physically hurt are two different things, but I think it’s tough to argue that he didn’t consider it a safety risk. This is from the PJ20 book

RS65573

I 100% saw change thrown and felt unsafe on the floor, behind you guys I guess...12 row ish, maybe 15 Id have to check my stub.

JimmyV

Matt's comment seems pretty cut and dried.

on2legs

Sobelberg8 said:

mcgruff10 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Why even bother combatting what the band said? They left the stage early because they thought it was a risk and they were uncomfortable (mainly Mike and Matt). Matt said he had never been physically hurt at a show before that. You can’t compare it to other situations, they are their own separate entities. If the band was concerned for their safety and people in the crowd, who again the person I spoke with had shit flying all over his head 20 days after undergoing major neck surgery, there would’ve been serious issues had he of been hit in the head, if they had safety concerns leave it at that. 

I thought they left early because they lost the crowd and ed was obviously pissed, not because they were fearing for their safety. Matt was physically hurt?  I've never heard of that, do you have a link?
And I have never seen evidence of anything being thrown and if anything was thrown it definitely didn't reach the stage.  Ed is not bashful about pointing out that kind of behavior (quarter incident boston 98, indio 93).

So I took the quote out of context a little bit. “Trying to hurt us” and physically hurt are two different things, but I think it’s tough to argue that he didn’t consider it a safety risk. This is from the PJ20 book

But how much of a safety risk is there when you stay and play two more songs?  

RS65573

When those 2 songs are more antagonizing the crowd...the safety risk is increasing. And smile was next if I recall....not gonna get smile.

on2legs

RS65573 said:

When those 2 songs are more antagonizing the crowd...the safety risk is increasing. And smile was next if I recall....not gonna get smile.

Ed walked off before smile because he was pissed.  Not because he was afraid. 

Spiritual_Chaos

pjl44 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

I still don't see what those in the crowd didn't understand about or couldn't separate about what Eddie said.

...I mean... come on...

Edit: maybe I am misremembering what Eddie said... but I don't think so..

It was the Bush mask and song choice. Given the area and timing, people were still pretty sensitive. I don't think there's anything wrong with what Ed did but it was provocative like good art often is.

Criticizing a war criminal and an unjust war slaughtering thousands of civilians =/= 9/11

Still don't see why it would be hard to separate. The mask or the song.

Never gotten that moment. Even in the cinema in copenhagen when I saw the doc it was like - what even is this...

mcgruff10

RS65573 said:

I 100% saw change thrown and felt unsafe on the floor, behind you guys I guess...12 row ish, maybe 15 Id have to check my stub.

What do you expect, you were in the cheap seats?
I'm really surprised ed didn't address the quarters being thrown at the show.  
1:37 of the vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXm0ZSWX_UA

Sobelberg8

on2legs said:

Sobelberg8 said:

mcgruff10 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

Sobelberg8 said:

pjl44 said:

I was at that show. You can disagree with the sentiment, but the crowd was well within their rights. Political statements can be antagonistic - that's just how it goes.

Ed said it, good open and honest debate. They were allowed to feel the way they did in the same way that Ed and the band were allowed to feel how they did. It was black and white to them, and maybe the crowd didn’t understand/didn’t want to understand where Ed was coming from, regardless of all of that, they had zero business throwing quarters and shirts onto the stage putting their safety at risk

I agree with Jeff's statement the most - that was definitely art. I've never experienced a performer-audience interaction close to that in 20ish years of going to shows. Ed had every right to say his piece and the crowd had every right to express themselves vocally back.

I was in the 5th row and there was no imminent danger. People should not be throwing change or t-shirts but it's an embellishment to say that anyone's safety was at risk.

As mentioned in one of the other comments, we have an account from the show that we told in the episode that suggests otherwise

I've been to plenty of shows with isolated incidents of safety risk

Why even bother combatting what the band said? They left the stage early because they thought it was a risk and they were uncomfortable (mainly Mike and Matt). Matt said he had never been physically hurt at a show before that. You can’t compare it to other situations, they are their own separate entities. If the band was concerned for their safety and people in the crowd, who again the person I spoke with had shit flying all over his head 20 days after undergoing major neck surgery, there would’ve been serious issues had he of been hit in the head, if they had safety concerns leave it at that. 

I thought they left early because they lost the crowd and ed was obviously pissed, not because they were fearing for their safety. Matt was physically hurt?  I've never heard of that, do you have a link?
And I have never seen evidence of anything being thrown and if anything was thrown it definitely didn't reach the stage.  Ed is not bashful about pointing out that kind of behavior (quarter incident boston 98, indio 93).

So I took the quote out of context a little bit. “Trying to hurt us” and physically hurt are two different things, but I think it’s tough to argue that he didn’t consider it a safety risk. This is from the PJ20 book

But how much of a safety risk is there when you stay and play two more songs?  

Enough to cut 3 songs of the 5 they had left. (Smile, no one was smiling, Soldier of Love, no one wanted a love song, and Indifference, I think they were trying to make a difference, yes way) I’m sure if it got worse during Know Your Rights they would’ve cut it off. It might’ve just been from that time frame of him making out with the mask to him finishing the speech. Maybe a little into The Clash and RITFW. Pro shot footage is on the deluxe bluray of PJ20 and that is something I do not own. I have a friend who does and is probably gonna look into it to see what he sees. Regardless, they felt uncomfortable, they made a decision that was best for them and I’m sure they are thinking in their minds that a much higher percentage of people than not deserve a proper finish to a show, why let those fans down because of a couple of assholes?