Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I have questions (and not necessarily for you given you wouldn't answer them anyways).
How did radicalization occur? At 15, how did she develop the mentality to leave the UK in pursuit of supporting the Islamic State?
Within her religious community, I'm assuming she came from a place of 'peace' and evolved to 'extremist'. Would that not be the natural progression unless she was borne into an extremist existence and had no need for adapting to such a doctrine?
My opinion is that these kids get picked on & on for their wearing of garb for their looks color of skin just plain racism against them that they feel they just don’t belong and then decide to go back ...
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I have questions (and not necessarily for you given you wouldn't answer them anyways).
How did radicalization occur? At 15, how did she develop the mentality to leave the UK in pursuit of supporting the Islamic State?
Within her religious community, I'm assuming she came from a place of 'peace' and evolved to 'extremist'. Would that not be the natural progression unless she was borne into an extremist existence and had no need for adapting to such a doctrine?
I already answered your first question by posting a link, and yet here you are complaining that I won't answer your questions. My, aren't you a little ray of sunshine to everyone this morning.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I followed the storey. I approve of what the UK has done. She is 15, she knew what she was doing...
I’m not sure that any of us know what we’re doing at 15. She seems to hold the same views now, but of course she’s also been immersed in them for the last four years.
What is your lower limit for “knowing what you’re doing”? 14? 12? 10? I had a 15 year old - they are fairly unrealistic about the world.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I followed the storey. I approve of what the UK has done. She is 15, she knew what she was doing...
I’m not sure that any of us know what we’re doing at 15. She seems to hold the same views now, but of course she’s also been immersed in them for the last four years.
What is your lower limit for “knowing what you’re doing”? 14? 12? 10? I had a 15 year old - they are fairly unrealistic about the world.
Yeah I tend to agree with you I remember my two when they we were 15 totally clueless as I was at the same age ..
Here in Canada criminal responsibility kicks in at age 12, by which point I certainly knew it was wrong to kill people, among other wrongdoings, so I have no issue holding these people responsible for their actions. They want to prove they're rehabilitated, they can do it the way I did as a young offender at 14: plead guilty to your crimes and do the punishment, then keep your nose clean.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
There is a reason we have a youth justice system; it recognizes that youth do not have the same cognitive abilities and, consequently, legal culpability as adults.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
There is a reason we have a youth justice system; it recognizes that youth do not have the same cognitive abilities and, consequently, legal culpability as adults.
Agreed, however there still need to be consequences for one's actions, and the Young Offenders Act (or whatever it's called now) does allow for prosecution as an adult for the most egregious offenders.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
There is a reason we have a youth justice system; it recognizes that youth do not have the same cognitive abilities and, consequently, legal culpability as adults.
Agreed, however there still need to be consequences for one's actions, and the Young Offenders Act (or whatever it's called now) does allow for prosecution as an adult for the most egregious offenders.
Sure does, and I would assume the UK has a similar mechanism. Does marrying someone and having their children fit into that category? Maybe some sort of general “aiding and abetting” charge.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I have questions (and not necessarily for you given you wouldn't answer them anyways).
How did radicalization occur? At 15, how did she develop the mentality to leave the UK in pursuit of supporting the Islamic State?
Within her religious community, I'm assuming she came from a place of 'peace' and evolved to 'extremist'. Would that not be the natural progression unless she was borne into an extremist existence and had no need for adapting to such a doctrine?
I already answered your first question by posting a link, and yet here you are complaining that I won't answer your questions. My, aren't you a little ray of sunshine to everyone this morning.
People are free to choose their levels of engagement and participation around here, but come on, man... it's pretty obvious I'm on your virtual ignore list.
Thanks for the link and story. I've seriously never heard of it before. I don't know where I'm at with it. On one hand... 15. On the other hand... well... no need to state the obvious.
There is a reason we have a youth justice system; it recognizes that youth do not have the same cognitive abilities and, consequently, legal culpability as adults.
Agreed, however there still need to be consequences for one's actions, and the Young Offenders Act (or whatever it's called now) does allow for prosecution as an adult for the most egregious offenders.
Sure does, and I would assume the UK has a similar mechanism. Does marrying someone and having their children fit into that category? Maybe some sort of general “aiding and abetting” charge.
Definitely "aiding and abetting", to say nothing of many countries' laws against supporting terrorist organizations specifically. I'm not comfortable with throwing due process out the window (it's one of the things that differentiate us from them), so we definitely need some sort of reasonable mechanism in place to deal with these...(I'll be nice and call them) people.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I have questions (and not necessarily for you given you wouldn't answer them anyways).
How did radicalization occur? At 15, how did she develop the mentality to leave the UK in pursuit of supporting the Islamic State?
Within her religious community, I'm assuming she came from a place of 'peace' and evolved to 'extremist'. Would that not be the natural progression unless she was borne into an extremist existence and had no need for adapting to such a doctrine?
I already answered your first question by posting a link, and yet here you are complaining that I won't answer your questions. My, aren't you a little ray of sunshine to everyone this morning.
People are free to choose their levels of engagement and participation around here, but come on, man... it's pretty obvious I'm on your virtual ignore list.
Thanks for the link and story. I've seriously never heard of it before. I don't know where I'm at with it. On one hand... 15. On the other hand... well... no need to state the obvious.
I have indeed not responded to many of your posts in the past, for good reason. Today I did, to try to get past that, and we see the result.
Anyway, life goes on, and this is but a minor part. Have a good Saturday.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
She'll end up being taken in by the Netherlands. She is not in the criminal justice system of the UK, they simply do not want her back, the country her parents are from do not want her...her decision, her choice, live with the consequences...
Shamima Begum left the UK at 15, along with two of her school friends, to join the Islamic State and was married to an ISIS fighter, a Dutch national. She had three children, all of whom died in infancy, the most recent only a few days ago at the age of 3 weeks, in a refugee camp. The UK had stripped her of citizenship and refused to allow her to return. It's been a major and contentious story in the UK.
I have questions (and not necessarily for you given you wouldn't answer them anyways).
How did radicalization occur? At 15, how did she develop the mentality to leave the UK in pursuit of supporting the Islamic State?
Within her religious community, I'm assuming she came from a place of 'peace' and evolved to 'extremist'. Would that not be the natural progression unless she was borne into an extremist existence and had no need for adapting to such a doctrine?
I already answered your first question by posting a link, and yet here you are complaining that I won't answer your questions. My, aren't you a little ray of sunshine to everyone this morning.
People are free to choose their levels of engagement and participation around here, but come on, man... it's pretty obvious I'm on your virtual ignore list.
Thanks for the link and story. I've seriously never heard of it before. I don't know where I'm at with it. On one hand... 15. On the other hand... well... no need to state the obvious.
I have indeed not responded to many of your posts in the past, for good reason. Today I did, to try to get past that, and we see the result.
Anyway, life goes on, and this is but a minor part. Have a good Saturday.
I guess I'm unloveable lol.
Have a good Saturday yourself. If it means anything to you... I'm drinking a Vancouver Island based Shipwreck IPA and staring at the vacuum cleaner that needs to turn on (I cross country skied earlier though!). Sooo... I'm supporting your local economy.
We all made mistakes at 15 but to fly to Syria, renounce your citizenship and fight for isis? Ugh I don’t know about that one. Sure we could have a trial but if one is found innocent then they have to leave the country.
Maybe Shamima wasn't the innocent victim she'd like everyone to believe? Common sense would seem to indicate that the bold move to join the ISIS ranks would have been enough to understand her complicity (we are supposed to believe she travelled there just to be a housewife?). According to reports, she was a member of the 'hisba' (which enforces Islamic Law) and reportedly carried an automatic weapon as well as stitched suicide bombers into explosive vests.
Maybe Shamima wasn't the innocent victim she'd like everyone to believe? Common sense would seem to indicate that the bold move to join the ISIS ranks would have been enough to understand her complicity (we are supposed to believe she travelled there just to be a housewife?). According to reports, she was a member of the 'hisba' (which enforces Islamic Law) and reportedly carried an automatic weapon as well as stitched suicide bombers into explosive vests.
"“I did stupid things, I regret it,” he said. “But I did not kill anyone. I did not want to commit any crime. I know I made a big mistake by joining a terrorist organization. I know you will give me the death penalty.”"
Ummmmm... 1) Yes you did stupid things 2) You regret because you lost 3) You joined a terrorist organization and supported them in their killings 4) You joining ISIS is a crime
Looks like France is pushing off on iraq what they do not have the guts to do themselves. I wonder what would happen to these guys if they were prosecuted in different countries. Like to see what the different outcomes could have been if they were prosecuted in France...or if they were american and prosecuted in America. Cause that Iraqi court doesn't really seem all that fair
The Iraqi court is a sham court that in no way reaches international legal standards, including use of torture to gain confessions. Hypocritical for anyone who claims to uphold rule of law to be in favour of this process.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
Is it that they do not want to deal with it, or is it that countries do not know how to handle these terrorists? The only real fair way to deal with them would be for the international community that was involved in the war against ISIS were to put them on trial and imprison them in the Iraq area. I definitely think Iraq and others who were victims should have a say. And they should serve their sentences in the region. I still do want them coming back to Canada. They left and choose to be traitors.
“There are the victims, thousands of victims, Yazidis who were captured and sold at markets as slaves. Who would agree to join an organization that committed these kinds of crimes?” Sucks to suck. Buh bye.
Comments
I already answered your first question by posting a link, and yet here you are complaining that I won't answer your questions. My, aren't you a little ray of sunshine to everyone this morning.
What is your lower limit for “knowing what you’re doing”? 14? 12? 10? I had a 15 year old - they are fairly unrealistic about the world.
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
People are free to choose their levels of engagement and participation around here, but come on, man... it's pretty obvious I'm on your virtual ignore list.
Thanks for the link and story. I've seriously never heard of it before. I don't know where I'm at with it. On one hand... 15. On the other hand... well... no need to state the obvious.
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 2022
Anyway, life goes on, and this is but a minor part. Have a good Saturday.
I guess I'm unloveable lol.
Have a good Saturday yourself. If it means anything to you... I'm drinking a Vancouver Island based Shipwreck IPA and staring at the vacuum cleaner that needs to turn on (I cross country skied earlier though!). Sooo... I'm supporting your local economy.
https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/shamima-begum-was-member-of-feared-isis-morality-police-in-syria/ar-BBVV0FQ?ocid=spartanntp
Ummmmm...
1) Yes you did stupid things
2) You regret because you lost
3) You joined a terrorist organization and supported them in their killings
4) You joining ISIS is a crime
Looks like France is pushing off on iraq what they do not have the guts to do themselves. I wonder what would happen to these guys if they were prosecuted in different countries. Like to see what the different outcomes could have been if they were prosecuted in France...or if they were american and prosecuted in America. Cause that Iraqi court doesn't really seem all that fair
Sucks to suck. Buh bye.
This asshole can stay in Syria or wherever he is. What a piece of human garbage he is...his parents should be in jail as well...