I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
I have a hard time with incomplete shows. They should pick something else to release if a show has to be incomplete IMO.
if they went this route you are not getting anything prior to 2000 most likely then. Even 9.19.98 is technically incomplete.
how is the constitution hall show technically incomplete? is la complete?
CH is missing ledbetter, and I think one more song was only partially recorded. Not sure about LA. There has been a couple interviews where they said that while they recorded all the earlier shows, most of them are incomplete.
...got a mind full of questions and a teacher in my soul...
how is the constitution hall show technically incomplete? is la complete?
CH is missing ledbetter, and I think one more song was only partially recorded. Not sure about LA. There has been a couple interviews where they said that while they recorded all the earlier shows, most of them are incomplete.
DC had a personal moment before Ledbetter but they also claim that the tape stopped. Still a great Vault
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
Bellingham was played years ago on Sirius radio when the PJ channel launched. People recorded it, and it’s been available on PJ bootleg sites since.
I don't recall there being lossless copies, my recollection was it being broadcast a few months before, in any event the it was not a show that been stumbling around for decades.
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
Bellingham was played years ago on Sirius radio when the PJ channel launched. People recorded it, and it’s been available on PJ bootleg sites since.
I don't recall there being lossless copies, my recollection was it being broadcast a few months before, in any event the it was not a show that been stumbling around for decades.
I just meant the band had previously made the show available, making it an easy choice. I’m hoping in the future they’re more creative with their choices.
Pittsburgh 1998 • Pittsburgh 2006 • 2012 Isle Of Wight Festival • 2012 Made In America Festival • Baltimore 2013 • Seattle 2013 St. Paul 2014 • Mexico City 2015 • Philadelphia II 2016 • Ottawa 2016 • Amsterdam I & II 2018 • Wrigley Field II 2018 • Phoenix 2022 Apollo Theater 2022 • Chicago I 2023 • Baltimore 2024
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
I was excited for soldier field for that reason. But when the vault actually came out I was disappointed that the quality was still sub-par compared to other releases. I pretty much never listen to it for that reason, there's so many other live shows out there with near perfect recordings, that one just doesn't do anything for me.
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
Bellingham was played years ago on Sirius radio when the PJ channel launched. People recorded it, and it’s been available on PJ bootleg sites since.
I don't recall there being lossless copies, my recollection was it being broadcast a few months before, in any event the it was not a show that been stumbling around for decades.
I just meant the band had previously made the show available, making it an easy choice. I’m hoping in the future they’re more creative with their choices.
Understood. I do think from their standpoint, that particular show they felt good about it being unique and worth being on vinyl, I still find it to be with the two 1998 shows, the better ones. Constitution Hall, people forget, originally that was going to be the live 1998 release. It was rumored they had recorded the whole show and were assembling it for a live release. Then they cobbled together a more "highlights" live record instead.
I think I read an article where jeff said he was going through shows for it
Yeah, I think I remember seeing or hearing the same thing... Pretty sure Jeff said it in an interview at some point actually. Although after that it started feeling like they were at least sometimes choosing them as a reaction to unofficial bootlegged vinyl, i.e. release an official version to foil the bootleggers were released an illegal boot. Weren't the last two vaults like that?
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I'd be cool with a "Live in Two Legs" type release for the '96 tour if having complete shows is an issue.
Oh man. Absolutely
That would be awesome, but I wouldn't want it to actually be a vault release. They simply need to release another live compilation album. It's been 8 years since the last one, and the last one wasn't very good.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
I have a hard time with incomplete shows. They should pick something else to release if a show has to be incomplete IMO.
if they went this route you are not getting anything prior to 2000 most likely then. Even 9.19.98 is technically incomplete.
93 vault is complete
Never claimed it wasn't. I am just going by the facts that Brett Eliason himself has provided and others have confirmed. Most of the show recording on multi-track began in the fall of 1993 (note - most, not all, before anyone says BUT Drop in the Park) they added more and more tracking as touring continued, but ultimately up until the 2000 tour, Brett had multiple responsibilities, and recording the shows on multi track was not priority number 1.
I worry that they’ll just go for another easy release and do Berlin 96.
Which releases have been "easy releases" ?
Vegas, bellingham, soldier field and Missoula all had been previously mixed and released in some form. To me the idea of the vault is to release an rare gem that wasn’t widely available.
Bellingham? It had two tracks released across the Light Years singles variations. That was a good release. While there has always been a very nice audience recording available for that show, that is a very good Vault release.
Soldier Field was nice because it was upgrade off the tinny and shallow MONO-FM releases. It was a huge bummer that it was incomplete.
I have a hard time with incomplete shows. They should pick something else to release if a show has to be incomplete IMO.
if they went this route you are not getting anything prior to 2000 most likely then. Even 9.19.98 is technically incomplete.
93 vault is complete
Never claimed it wasn't. I am just going by the facts that Brett Eliason himself has provided and others have confirmed. Most of the show recording on multi-track began in the fall of 1993 (note - most, not all, before anyone says BUT Drop in the Park) they added more and more tracking as touring continued, but ultimately up until the 2000 tour, Brett had multiple responsibilities, and recording the shows on multi track was not priority number 1.
Understood, but I haven't seen anywhere where it is said most pre 2000 shows are incomplete. May have missed it though
Never claimed it wasn't. I am just going by the facts that Brett Eliason himself has provided and others have confirmed. Most of the show recording on multi-track began in the fall of 1993 (note - most, not all, before anyone says BUT Drop in the Park) they added more and more tracking as touring continued, but ultimately up until the 2000 tour, Brett had multiple responsibilities, and recording the shows on multi track was not priority number 1.
Understood, but I haven't seen anywhere where it is said most pre 2000 shows are incomplete. May have missed it though
Never claimed it wasn't. I am just going by the facts that Brett Eliason himself has provided and others have confirmed. Most of the show recording on multi-track began in the fall of 1993 (note - most, not all, before anyone says BUT Drop in the Park) they added more and more tracking as touring continued, but ultimately up until the 2000 tour, Brett had multiple responsibilities, and recording the shows on multi track was not priority number 1.
Understood, but I haven't seen anywhere where it is said most pre 2000 shows are incomplete. May have missed it though
I've read that. It doesn't say anything about most shows being incomplete. It says in 98 there were issues with tape lengths and tape flipping.
Never claimed it wasn't. I am just going by the facts that Brett Eliason himself has provided and others have confirmed. Most of the show recording on multi-track began in the fall of 1993 (note - most, not all, before anyone says BUT Drop in the Park) they added more and more tracking as touring continued, but ultimately up until the 2000 tour, Brett had multiple responsibilities, and recording the shows on multi track was not priority number 1.
Understood, but I haven't seen anywhere where it is said most pre 2000 shows are incomplete. May have missed it though
I've read that. It doesn't say anything about most shows being incomplete. It says in 98 there were issues with tape lengths and tape flipping.
I think you are taking a fairly conservative reading of that. Going by some basic facts alone - Orpheum theater tape issues with animal & go and IGaF on the tail end. DC 1998 tape ran out on Push Me Pull Me and Ledbetter. Even in 2000 at Bellingham they had an issue with one song on a tour they were planning on releasing every show from eventually. The entirety of the encore not being on ADAT multi track at Soldier Field.
There is an Eliason quote (or perhaps it was Burton) elsewhere I am trying to dig up where they explicitly state, we have gaps, big and small in most shows prior to the 2000 tour.
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
And he still gives his love,
he just gives it away...
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
I know at least one was intentionally edited because Eddie was talking about his ex-wife or something like that.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
Thank you! #4 missing Dead Man really makes me want a 98 Australia show. Possibly Perth. He busted out Dead Man in the middle of the show.
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
#5 is missing the My Way cover sung by that Elvis impersonator at the end of the show, I wonder why they haven't included it since there was a good recording of it on the 1995 xmas single.
Dead Man from #4 was included on the SBD version broadcasted on Sirius, and again I don't understand why it wasn't included on the actual Vault, I just remember (been a long time since I listened to it) it ending in a 'strange' way, kinda like Ed's forgetting or fuckin up with the final instrumental outro, but the song was basically complete, it wasn't by any mean something that ruined the performance of the song (let's not forget this band left untouched the trainwreck that was Satans Bed on the State College 2003 boot, but then again they completely edited out Come Back from Edmonton 2011, and that was also more funny than bad).
I think, between tape problems and the band (Ed, mostly) sometimes being not cool with releasing specific portions of show, these Vault shows are often likely to be cut somehow.
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
#5 is missing the My Way cover sung by that Elvis impersonator at the end of the show, I wonder why they haven't included it since there was a good recording of it on the 1995 xmas single.
Dead Man from #4 was included on the SBD version broadcasted on Sirius, and again I don't understand why it wasn't included on the actual Vault, I just remember (been a long time since I listened to it) it ending in a 'strange' way, kinda like Ed's forgetting or fuckin up with the final instrumental outro, but the song was basically complete, it wasn't by any mean something that ruined the performance of the song (let's not forget this band left untouched the trainwreck that was Satans Bed on the State College 2003 boot, but then again they completely edited out Come Back from Edmonton 2011, and that was also more funny than bad).
I think, between tape problems and the band (Ed, mostly) sometimes being not cool with releasing specific portions of show, these Vault shows are often likely to be cut somehow.
Santos or somebody said my way was actually during the opening act, not the encore
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
#5 is missing the My Way cover sung by that Elvis impersonator at the end of the show, I wonder why they haven't included it since there was a good recording of it on the 1995 xmas single.
Dead Man from #4 was included on the SBD version broadcasted on Sirius, and again I don't understand why it wasn't included on the actual Vault, I just remember (been a long time since I listened to it) it ending in a 'strange' way, kinda like Ed's forgetting or fuckin up with the final instrumental outro, but the song was basically complete, it wasn't by any mean something that ruined the performance of the song (let's not forget this band left untouched the trainwreck that was Satans Bed on the State College 2003 boot, but then again they completely edited out Come Back from Edmonton 2011, and that was also more funny than bad).
I think, between tape problems and the band (Ed, mostly) sometimes being not cool with releasing specific portions of show, these Vault shows are often likely to be cut somehow.
Dead Man faded out because over 2 full minutes are missing. I have the audience boot. The band/TC has said they didn't like how the transition sounded and lopped it off. For formatting purposes on 3 LPs, lopping off an incomplete song is not a big deal.
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
#5 is missing the My Way cover sung by that Elvis impersonator at the end of the show, I wonder why they haven't included it since there was a good recording of it on the 1995 xmas single.
Dead Man from #4 was included on the SBD version broadcasted on Sirius, and again I don't understand why it wasn't included on the actual Vault, I just remember (been a long time since I listened to it) it ending in a 'strange' way, kinda like Ed's forgetting or fuckin up with the final instrumental outro, but the song was basically complete, it wasn't by any mean something that ruined the performance of the song (let's not forget this band left untouched the trainwreck that was Satans Bed on the State College 2003 boot, but then again they completely edited out Come Back from Edmonton 2011, and that was also more funny than bad).
I think, between tape problems and the band (Ed, mostly) sometimes being not cool with releasing specific portions of show, these Vault shows are often likely to be cut somehow.
Santos or somebody said my way was actually during the opening act, not the encore
I guess PJ are in the clear and can’t be blamed further if they release shows that are as complete as possible - read all complete tracks recorded at a certain show also released on the vault. Hasn’t that been the case with the vault so far?
#1 missing baba #2 complete #3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter #4 missing dead man #5 complete #6 complete #7 missing encore (lp only) #8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
#5 is missing the My Way cover sung by that Elvis impersonator at the end of the show, I wonder why they haven't included it since there was a good recording of it on the 1995 xmas single.
Dead Man from #4 was included on the SBD version broadcasted on Sirius, and again I don't understand why it wasn't included on the actual Vault, I just remember (been a long time since I listened to it) it ending in a 'strange' way, kinda like Ed's forgetting or fuckin up with the final instrumental outro, but the song was basically complete, it wasn't by any mean something that ruined the performance of the song (let's not forget this band left untouched the trainwreck that was Satans Bed on the State College 2003 boot, but then again they completely edited out Come Back from Edmonton 2011, and that was also more funny than bad).
I think, between tape problems and the band (Ed, mostly) sometimes being not cool with releasing specific portions of show, these Vault shows are often likely to be cut somehow.
Dead Man faded out because over 2 full minutes are missing. I have the audience boot. The band/TC has said they didn't like how the transition sounded and lopped it off. For formatting purposes on 3 LPs, lopping off an incomplete song is not a big deal.
As I said, been a long time since I listened to it. I have the AUD source too, will check it out. Just a pity that happened during the most interesting song of the set (not saying the rest of the show is bad).
Comments
There has been a couple interviews where they said that while they recorded all the earlier shows, most of them are incomplete.
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http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
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http://www.hi5sports.org/ (Sports Program for Kids with Disabilities)
http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652
There is an Eliason quote (or perhaps it was Burton) elsewhere I am trying to dig up where they explicitly state, we have gaps, big and small in most shows prior to the 2000 tour.
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http://www.livefootsteps.org/user/?usr=3652
he just gives it away...
#2 complete
#3 missing half of push me pull me, Ledbetter
#4 missing dead man
#5 complete
#6 complete
#7 missing encore (lp only)
#8 complete (I think...dont have it yet)
2005 - St. John's 2
2006 - Toronto 1 & 2
2009 - Toronto
2011 - Toronto 1
2013 - Pittsburgh, Buffalo
2014 - Detroit
2016 - Ottawa, Toronto 1, Wrigley 1
2018 - Wrigley 1 & 2
2019 - Ohana Festival
2022 - Quebec, Ottawa, Hamilton, Toronto, Nashville
2023 - St. Paul 1 & 2
2024 - Vancouver 1 & 2, NYC 1 & 2, Fenway 1 & 2
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As I said, been a long time since I listened to it. I have the AUD source too, will check it out. Just a pity that happened during the most interesting song of the set (not saying the rest of the show is bad).