George H.W. Bush, the 41st U.S. president and father of the 43rd, has died at age 94

124

Comments

  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 3,372
    Bob Dole standing up at the casket was a tear jerker....I don't care if you like him or not
    I went to CNN to watch the video.  Very touching.
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 3,372
    I’ve heard dogs bark and cats meow and squeal. I’ve seen dog shit and cat shit out and about in yards and gardens and elsewhere. I’ve cleaned up dog barf and car barf.

    There’s no rational way to choose one over the other; it just comes down to which you prefer. 
    Some prefer both.  My brother-in-law had both until his dog passed on...
  • OnWis97OnWis97 St. Paul, MNPosts: 1,242
    Dogs rule; cats drool!  (you know, metaphorically)
    1995 Milwaukee
    1998 Alpine, Alpine
    2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston
    2004 Boston, Boston
    2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty)
    2011 Alpine, Alpine
    2013 Wrigley
    2014 St. Paul
    2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley
    2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley
  • njnancynjnancy Northern New JerseyPosts: 3,546
    PJ_Soul said:
    George HW Bush's service dog Sully pays touching last tribute





    I kind of hate to burst the bubble, but apparently Sully was with Bush for less than six months. He was a trained service dog who assisted with tasks like opening the door and fetching objects. This is a great photo into which people read far more than is there. 
    How does this burst a bubble? I'm sure this dog understood that his charge was dead and is sad about it (no, I'm not anthropomorphizing. Dogs do indeed become attached to their owners and miss them - we all know that). 6 months is long enough for a dog and person to become attached IMO. I'm not reading any more into it than what it is: sad.
    Dogs miss their owners, sure, or at least some dogs, for some periods of time. It’s how people impute other thoughts and feelings to animals that annoys me. They are their own thing; they have completely their own behaviours and reactions. It does not alll revolve around us and it is not the same as ours, so it’s ridiculous and disrespectful to insist that their motives are the same as ours. 
    When my father died, his dog looked for him for about 6 months. He would run to the door and then walk away dejected when his smell and hearing realized it wasn't him. A jacket of my father's was on the back of his chair for about a month and his dog would circle the chair and finally lay down. He wasn't the same after my dad died. He lost part of his personality. We loved the dog but we weren't his owner. We weren't putting our feelings into the dog. The dog was looking for his owner and couldn't find him. 

    When my dog, Guinness, was 13 she slowly began to fail over a 3 month period. My brother had just died a couple of months prior but I finally made the decision to put her down.  I had to put aside my grief and realize she was in pain and was not happy. I carried her to the vet with my son on a body pillow after we spent some time in the backyard just for one last time but she just laid there. After the vet gave her a shot of anti-anxiety medication, my son and I were able to spend about 15 minutes saying good bye before they came back to put her to sleep. Guinness, had not been responsive to me in about a week but after she got the shot and the vet left us alone, she lifted up her head and licked my face. She did that twice. I, to this day, believe she was thanking me for putting her out of her misery. Dogs have feelings, dogs smile, dogs love their owners and owners love their dogs. The only time I saw my father cry was when he had to put down a dog. 

    Sully makes me cry. He's a good dog and I believe that he knows that his owner is gone and is in that box. They have sharp senses of smell and if nothing else, the clothing on Pres. Bush smells like him. Nobody made the dog lay down in that spot. It's where the dog chose to lay down while the Pres. lay in repose in Houston prior to coming to DC.  

    Life will go on for Sully, but it is touching and there is nothing wrong with feeling emotional when seeing the picture. 


  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    I’ve heard dogs bark and cats meow and squeal. I’ve seen dog shit and cat shit out and about in yards and gardens and elsewhere. I’ve cleaned up dog barf and car barf.

    There’s no rational way to choose one over the other; it just comes down to which you prefer. 
    I love both!
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 5,180
    Wow, take a break for a few hours and a thread about a dead president goes to shit over a dog posed in what is clearly meant to be a symbolic photo. If you haven't had a dog for a pet you may not be the best person to speak to how dogs act and the bond they form with their companion with them almost every hour of every day.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,166
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,047
    tbergs said:
    Wow, take a break for a few hours and a thread about a dead president goes to shit over a dog posed in what is clearly meant to be a symbolic photo. If you haven't had a dog for a pet you may not be the best person to speak to how dogs act and the bond they form with their companion with them almost every hour of every day.
    I’ve had dogs, I’ve had that bond. I stand by my position that we are reading something different into that bond than the dogs are. Of course, my position is affected by having a degree in zoology. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,047
    Also, most people here posting about their connection to dogs are talking about family pets over the lifetime of the pet, not a service dog over six months. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,166
    tbergs said:
    Wow, take a break for a few hours and a thread about a dead president goes to shit over a dog posed in what is clearly meant to be a symbolic photo. If you haven't had a dog for a pet you may not be the best person to speak to how dogs act and the bond they form with their companion with them almost every hour of every day.
    why do you assume that just because we don't agree with a point of view that we haven't been/aren't dog owners? I had a dog that our entire family loved and nearly worshipped for his entire 13 years. we knew the joy of having him as part of our family and the incredible pain of losing him when it was time. it was so painful losing him that we couldn't bear to get another one. it felt like replacing a family member. 

    my parents still have a giant pic of him and my cat over the bar in their basement. and he died 20 years ago. 
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    edited December 4
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,454
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    Outdoor cats, more than any other reason/predator, have decimated the North American song bird population. They kill for thrills rather than solely for necessity.

    Domestic cats kill between 1.4 and 3.7 billion birds and between 6.9 and 20.7 billion mammals (mostly mice, shrews, rabbits, squirrels, and voles) each year, according to a study published last year in Nature Communications.Dec 17, 2014

    https://www.businessinsider.com/cats-kill-billions-of-birds-and-mammals-each-year-2014-12
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    Outdoor cats, more than any other reason/predator, have decimated the North American song bird population. They kill for thrills rather than solely for necessity.

    Domestic cats kill between 1.4 and 3.7 billion birds and between 6.9 and 20.7 billion mammals (mostly mice, shrews, rabbits, squirrels, and voles) each year, according to a study published last year in Nature Communications.Dec 17, 2014

    https://www.businessinsider.com/cats-kill-billions-of-birds-and-mammals-each-year-2014-12
    People and human activity (cars, electrical wires, pesticides and other pollutants) kill far more than that. I'd prefer that domestic cats be allowed to prowl and humans do better about saving the birds. Not feral cats though. I don't want feral cats walking around at all - those poor things suffer horribly from disease and hunger and injury and exposure. I hope someday people can manage to end the problem of feral cats and stray dogs altogether.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 3,009
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,454
    Marra might like cats. But he also sees a bigger picture. In his day job, he and his team at the migratory bird center track the global movements of birds and tease apart threats to their existence. He knows that birds don’t just twit around pointlessly. They pollinate plants, spread seeds, control insects and protect environments from the effects of climate change; they are the glue that binds healthy ecosystems together. “Birds are critical,” he says. And outdoor cats, he and other ecologists have determined, are the leading human-influenced cause of dead birds.

    Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/#53vZmFKJxO0iyRHu.99
    Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
    Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    edited December 4
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
    Leash laws are about safety. Cats don't tend to bite people or maul people and other dogs to death, or jump up on them during walks and scare the shit out of them, lol! Nor do cats shit where people walk.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    Marra might like cats. But he also sees a bigger picture. In his day job, he and his team at the migratory bird center track the global movements of birds and tease apart threats to their existence. He knows that birds don’t just twit around pointlessly. They pollinate plants, spread seeds, control insects and protect environments from the effects of climate change; they are the glue that binds healthy ecosystems together. “Birds are critical,” he says. And outdoor cats, he and other ecologists have determined, are the leading human-influenced cause of dead birds.

    Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/#53vZmFKJxO0iyRHu.99
    Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
    Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/moral-cost-of-cats-180960505/
    My cat is an indoor cat, but if she wasn't, she'd be scared shitless of birds. :lol: If anything is getting killed, it would be my cat killed by the bird, lol.
    As I said, feral cats should not exist. If we could stop the feral cat problem, this bird problem you seem to be concerned about would not be such a problem. I still think it's weird to ban people from letting their cats into the yard (and they'll roam where they like). Dogs get to go outside all the time, to dog parks, on leash for walk, to the beach, and run around the back yard. It's totally unfair to expect that cats can't go outside. Obviously you can't walk cats and take them to parks and shit. Just letting them out is their only option. Some cats need this to be psychologically sound.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • njnancynjnancy Northern New JerseyPosts: 3,546
    PJ_Soul said:
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
    Leash laws are about safety. Cats don't tend to bite people or maul people and other dogs to death, or jump up on them during walks and scare the shit out of them, lol! Nor do cats shit where people walk.
    I find leash laws to be more for the safety of the dog here. There is traffic everywhere and if the dog were to just run (not bite or maul  :| ) as dogs do, there is a very good chance that they would be hit by a car. Imagine unleashed dogs walking around the streets of Manhattan. They would be running into traffic more than hurting people.
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    edited December 4
    njnancy said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
    Leash laws are about safety. Cats don't tend to bite people or maul people and other dogs to death, or jump up on them during walks and scare the shit out of them, lol! Nor do cats shit where people walk.
    I find leash laws to be more for the safety of the dog here. There is traffic everywhere and if the dog were to just run (not bite or maul  :| ) as dogs do, there is a very good chance that they would be hit by a car. Imagine unleashed dogs walking around the streets of Manhattan. They would be running into traffic more than hurting people.
    Fine, but that is not what leash laws are for at all. The LAWS are made because of public safety, and public complaints (and I'm not sure why the biting and mauling comment bothered you... It does happen obviously. I've actually been attacked by dogs 4 times in my life). Not because the law makers are worried about dogs bolting and getting run over. Especially since leash laws exist in quiet suburban and even some more rural areas, as well as in huge parks and on isolated trails, not just in cities. On leash laws are clearly not mainly made for the sake of dog safety.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • njnancynjnancy Northern New JerseyPosts: 3,546
    Each state and municipality has their own leash laws. West Virginia is the one state that does not have a leash law. And you are correct, in NJ at least it is so they do not annoy or harm people. 

    I have always had rescue dogs, my parents always had rescue dogs and I have a sore spot for the bad rap that certain dogs get when it is the owners who are responsible for their bad behavior. Most dogs would not go after a person in a violent way; but there are assumptions about dogs that I do not like. Just a personal peeve. 
  • njnancynjnancy Northern New JerseyPosts: 3,546
    Thread integrity - I am sure that Sully would not harm another dog or person unless they were attacking his owner. 
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    njnancy said:
    Each state and municipality has their own leash laws. West Virginia is the one state that does not have a leash law. And you are correct, in NJ at least it is so they do not annoy or harm people. 

    I have always had rescue dogs, my parents always had rescue dogs and I have a sore spot for the bad rap that certain dogs get when it is the owners who are responsible for their bad behavior. Most dogs would not go after a person in a violent way; but there are assumptions about dogs that I do not like. Just a personal peeve. 
    Yeah, they're all different depending on where you are.
    I absolutely love dogs. But I have also been attacked by dogs. It has nothing to do with a bad rap or whatever, and the reason a dog attacks someone is probably not that important to someone being attacked by a dog. Facts are facts. Leash laws are generally about public safety because dog attacks do happen, and because dogs do jump up on people against their wills (I personally love being jumped on by a happy dog as long as his feet aren't dirty), and dogs off leash do scare some people. I understand where you're coming from, but you also have to think about the people are ARE attacked by dogs (including me). Me, I don't expect most dogs to do any harm at all, and I love to see a happy dog running around off leash... But as a victim of dog attacks, I support laws that protect the public first. I also very, very much support laws that protect animals though. It's one of the main causes that I support. And all THAT said... I think pit bulls should be allowed to die out through breeding bans. I do want the ones that exist to be rescued and treated well too though.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • njnancynjnancy Northern New JerseyPosts: 3,546
    edited December 5
    One of the accomplishments that George HW Bush did that I personally appreciate is The Americans With Disabilities Act. I used to think it was only about widening of doors and street corner access. Anyone can be hit with a career ending disability at anytime. I appreciate everything that this law embodies. No person wants to become disabled, and many disabilities are not obvious, but they are real. So thank you Mr. President. 
    Post edited by njnancy on
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 3,009
    edited December 4
    PJ_Soul said:
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
    Leash laws are about safety. Cats don't tend to bite people or maul people and other dogs to death, or jump up on them during walks and scare the shit out of them, lol! Nor do cats shit where people walk.
    I agree with leash laws, I have no problem with them.
    i just don’t get why it isn’t applied to all pets.
    A cat may not maul l me to death, but I should be allowed to prevent it dome coming on my property and ruining my grass and other plants and making my dog go nuts. It’s my yard, get your stupid car out of it.
    Post edited by mace1229 on
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 44,252
    edited December 4
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    mace1229 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    Manitoba. And now that I think about it, it's probably a civic by law, not a provincial one. 
    Ohhh. I read Montana. But I guess the question applied equally to both, lol.
    I am still disturbed by this... Although would need to know more. I mean, who recommended it? If, say, the SPCA or something recommended it, then that's something I'd consider. Certainly indoor cats are a hell of a lot safer than outdoor, with dramatically longer average lifespans, and the overpopulation problem might be solved with such a bylaw... But on the other hand (and assuming we're not talking farming communities), I feel bad for those cats who really really want to be outside. I'm okay with indoor only cats if they are happy that way... but some cats were just born to roam, and I think they should be allowed to if the owners feel it's best for their pet's happiness.
    I actually think that would be a great law. I like cats too, but love dogs way more. 
    I just don't get it, just about every city has leash laws, but then cats are allowed to roam freely?
    And its not that I think its unfair to have leash laws for one and not the other, I just don't see how it could be allowed to allow your property (a cat) to roam freely on someone else's lawn. It drives my dog nuts, 9/10 if he's barking, its probably because our neighbor's cat was just there. He goes crazy over those cats, and when he's older I wouldn't be surprised if he injured himself try to chase one down. Keep your cat in your yard and I'll keep my dog in mine.
    Luckily I really like my neighbor and he's a good guy, so I don;t it bother me much. But if we didn't get along it'd be a different story.
    Leash laws are about safety. Cats don't tend to bite people or maul people and other dogs to death, or jump up on them during walks and scare the shit out of them, lol! Nor do cats shit where people walk.
    I agree with leash laws, I have no problem with them.
    i just don’t get why it isn’t applied to all pets.
    A cat may not maul l me to death, but I should be allowed to prevent it dome coming on my property and ruining my grass and other plants and making my dog go nuts. It’s my yard, get your stupid car out of it.
    Again, because of public safety being why the leash laws exists. Also, most cats cannot be on a leash, so that's a pretty major consideration. Some cats really need to be able to be outside for the sake of their well-being, but you can't generally walk a cat, or take them out to play at a cat park. It just doesn't work that way. The options available for dogs are not for cats. Certainly it sucks to have a cat wandering in your yard, but life isn't always fair. There are things you can do to deter cats from coming into your yard though. Google it - there are a ton of suggestions. :)
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 17,454
    Team Trump Treason would have been sweaty, out of breath and his hair disheveled at that distance. Should have taken a helicopter though.

    https://apple.news/A7uvHJAPBThmSrH7S3-1hHA
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 16,166
    PJ_Soul said:
    outdoor cats (unteathered) are outlawed in Manitoba. have been for many years. it's fucking creepy seeing my neighbours white cat teathered and walking in a circle with its belly on the ground

    I wonder how the rat and mice populations are doing in Montana? This is insane to me. So there are no barn/farm cats?? Aren't there a shitload of farms and barns in Montana??
    to answer your question though, i haven't noticed any increase at all in mice and rats, but rabbits and squirrels and chipmunks used to be seen rarely when i was a kid....now they fucking tear around like it's their playground. 

    it's pretty cute having baby bunnies in the yard in the spring. 

    not so cute throwing out eyeless baby bunnies from the fucking crows. 
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 3,372
    Former Secret Service agent: Why we loved Bush 41 (aka Timberwolf)

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/03/opinions/george-h-w-bush-support-law-enforcement-wackrow/index.html
  • WobbieWobbie Posts: 24,418
    tbergs said:
    Wow, take a break for a few hours and a thread about a dead president goes to shit over a dog posed in what is clearly meant to be a symbolic photo. If you haven't had a dog for a pet you may not be the best person to speak to how dogs act and the bond they form with their companion with them almost every hour of every day.
    I’ve had dogs, I’ve had that bond. I stand by my position that we are reading something different into that bond than the dogs are. Of course, my position is affected by having a degree in zoology. 

    had to throw that in, didn’t you?

    also, smartypants, I think “effected” may be the right word (at least here in the US) but I’m not 100% sure.
    If I had known then what I know now...

    Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
    VIC 07
    EV LA1 08
    Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
    Columbus 10
    EV LA 11
    Vancouver 11
    Missoula 12
    Portland 13, Spokane 13
    St. Paul 14, Denver 14
    Philly I & II, 16
Sign In or Register to comment.