Honest question: Eddie Vedder has supported both Ralph Nader & Bernie Sanders

Big Bank Hank

So why all the harsh feeling towards Progressives? We are only trying to make the world a better place, and care about our fellow humans over the corporations. I am not even going to debate anyone, I just ask that you keep the language clean and within the forum rules. I am trying to understand how people are willing to settle for the lesser of two evils and not demanding something better, and how one can just throw in the cards so easily. Rock the Vote was a great thing and I would hope the band could do something similar in 2020 to get a better person in the White House. Activism is a great thing, I was a community organizer for Socialist Alternative and participated in the marches that ended up getting the $15.00 an hour minimum wage here in Seattle, activism and caring and not giving up works. By the way the war is still going. And the Democrats have been eagerly supporting war for a long time, they don't even bother hiding it anymore.

Go Beavers

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

Big Bank Hank

Go Beavers said:

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

LOL, that's hilarious because I can go back and pull all the anti-progressive quotes with links, so you ain't gotta lie to kick it bro

tbergs

Big Bank Hank said:

Go Beavers said:

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

LOL, that's hilarious because I can go back and pull all the anti-progressive quotes with links, so you ain't gotta lie to kick it bro

He's not lying. He's expressing to you that you aren't conveying your views very well so people have not responded in ways that you were hoping. It's not about being right or wrong. This forum can handle different views if you bring intellectual thought and substance to the discussion. And yeah, you might get people who will outright tear your point apart while someone else agrees with everything you say.

Big Bank Hank

tbergs said:

Big Bank Hank said:

Go Beavers said:

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

LOL, that's hilarious because I can go back and pull all the anti-progressive quotes with links, so you ain't gotta lie to kick it bro

He's not lying. He's expressing to you that you aren't conveying your views very well so people have not responded in ways that you were hoping. It's not about being right or wrong. This forum can handle different views if you bring intellectual thought and substance to the discussion. And yeah, you might get people who will outright tear your point apart while someone else agrees with everything you say.

but there has been no tearing apart, just name calling, I can pull up all the comments, with links, unless ya'll just like lying & making stuff up with someone you disagree with?

brianlux

Part of the problem, Hank, is with labels.  If people calls themselves "conservative" or "liberal" or "progressive" or whatever, those who define themselves otherwise will often be critical of what they perceive as their opposite.  I'm basically a progressive but I generally don't refer to myself as such because being progressive on some issues, on others I am more liberal, on some rather conservative and even on some fairly neutral or even apathetic. 

So if we look at each issue and learn that matters to us and we learn what we can about it and keep an open mind while using critical thinking, we may not need to label ourselves.  Just do what makes sense and you won't need a label and in doing so, you might have a better chance of all of us finding good solutions.

Also consider that the world is not just a human place.  Animals, plants, rocks- they are not conservative, liberal or progressive.  They are subject to our whims.

Big Bank Hank

brianlux said:

Part of the problem, Hank, is with labels.  If people calls themselves "conservative" or "liberal" or "progressive" or whatever, those who define themselves otherwise will often be critical of what they perceive as their opposite.  I'm basically a progressive but I generally don't refer to myself as such because being progressive on some issues, on others I am more liberal, on some rather conservative and even on some fairly neutral or even apathetic. 

So if we look at each issue and learn that matters to us and we learn what we can about it and keep an open mind while using critical thinking, we may not need to label ourselves.  Just do what makes sense and you won't need a label and in doing so, you might have a better chance of all of us finding good solutions.

Also consider that the world is not just a human place.  Animals, plants, rocks- they are not conservative, liberal or progressive.  They are subject to our whims.

But Brian, both parties support fracking, so how much longer will we have those things? 

tbergs

Big Bank Hank said:

tbergs said:

Big Bank Hank said:

Go Beavers said:

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

LOL, that's hilarious because I can go back and pull all the anti-progressive quotes with links, so you ain't gotta lie to kick it bro

He's not lying. He's expressing to you that you aren't conveying your views very well so people have not responded in ways that you were hoping. It's not about being right or wrong. This forum can handle different views if you bring intellectual thought and substance to the discussion. And yeah, you might get people who will outright tear your point apart while someone else agrees with everything you say.

but there has been no tearing apart, just name calling, I can pull up all the comments, with links, unless ya'll just like lying & making stuff up with someone you disagree with?

I guess I didn't see any name calling, but I haven't analyzed every thread. I saw a lot of people who disagreed with the content of your posts. Like Brian stated above, I don't think a lot of us align with any specific political party. A few of us fall on the extremes of both ends, but for the most part we are in the middle looking to support a person who will bring about the most positive impact. Republicans seem to be failing more miserably than Dems right now. There will never be a perfect candidate or political party, but we each have to decide what matters the most. There are very few one issue voters, but abortion and the 2nd amendment always float to the top for many voters.

Big Bank Hank

tbergs said:

Big Bank Hank said:

tbergs said:

Big Bank Hank said:

Go Beavers said:

It’s not harsh feelings toward progressives, it’s harsh feelings about your communication style. 

LOL, that's hilarious because I can go back and pull all the anti-progressive quotes with links, so you ain't gotta lie to kick it bro

He's not lying. He's expressing to you that you aren't conveying your views very well so people have not responded in ways that you were hoping. It's not about being right or wrong. This forum can handle different views if you bring intellectual thought and substance to the discussion. And yeah, you might get people who will outright tear your point apart while someone else agrees with everything you say.

but there has been no tearing apart, just name calling, I can pull up all the comments, with links, unless ya'll just like lying & making stuff up with someone you disagree with?

I guess I didn't see any name calling, but I haven't analyzed every thread. I saw a lot of people who disagreed with the content of your posts. Like Brian stated above, I don't think a lot of us align with any specific political party. A few of us fall on the extremes of both ends, but for the most part we are in the middle looking to support a person who will bring about the most positive impact. Republicans seem to be failing more miserably than Dems right now. There will never be a perfect candidate or political party, but we each have to decide what matters the most. There are very few one issue voters, but abortion and the 2nd amendment always float to the top for many voters.

Making you think you have a choice is the illusion, all the policies both parties have in common are extremely destructive, by limiting you to the 2 party system (that are far more similar than not), they box you in to their agenda if you just give up and go along with it, and accept trash even if it is the lesser of two evil instead of fighting for something better. The ruling Party in Greece that won the last election only received 4% of the vote just 4 years earlier, so it's important not to give up and throw in the towel.

oftenreading

Greece has a substantially different political system. What “works” there, and I use the word “works” cautiously, doesn’t work in the USA. I’m not sure you really want to be emulating the Greek style of government anyway.

Big Bank Hank

This is why the Democratic Party is just as useless as the Republicans, because none of the second part applies to either party, expect more, demand people to lead us who love us and care about us, and I can't believe this is even controversial, SMH

Big Bank Hank

oftenreading said:

Greece has a substantially different political system. What “works” there, and I use the word “works” cautiously, doesn’t work in the USA. I’m not sure you really want to be emulating the Greek style of government anyway.

True

brianlux

Big Bank Hank said:

brianlux said:

Part of the problem, Hank, is with labels.  If people calls themselves "conservative" or "liberal" or "progressive" or whatever, those who define themselves otherwise will often be critical of what they perceive as their opposite.  I'm basically a progressive but I generally don't refer to myself as such because being progressive on some issues, on others I am more liberal, on some rather conservative and even on some fairly neutral or even apathetic. 

So if we look at each issue and learn that matters to us and we learn what we can about it and keep an open mind while using critical thinking, we may not need to label ourselves.  Just do what makes sense and you won't need a label and in doing so, you might have a better chance of all of us finding good solutions.

Also consider that the world is not just a human place.  Animals, plants, rocks- they are not conservative, liberal or progressive.  They are subject to our whims.

But Brian, both parties support fracking, so how much longer will we have those things? 

Good point.  The Democratic party has shown itself to be more environmentally conscious and concerned than the Republican by far but that's a bit like saying they made it to second base instead of striking out. Neither is a run and until someone comes home, both are game losers.

Big Bank Hank

brianlux said:

Big Bank Hank said:

brianlux said:

Part of the problem, Hank, is with labels.  If people calls themselves "conservative" or "liberal" or "progressive" or whatever, those who define themselves otherwise will often be critical of what they perceive as their opposite.  I'm basically a progressive but I generally don't refer to myself as such because being progressive on some issues, on others I am more liberal, on some rather conservative and even on some fairly neutral or even apathetic. 

So if we look at each issue and learn that matters to us and we learn what we can about it and keep an open mind while using critical thinking, we may not need to label ourselves.  Just do what makes sense and you won't need a label and in doing so, you might have a better chance of all of us finding good solutions.

Also consider that the world is not just a human place.  Animals, plants, rocks- they are not conservative, liberal or progressive.  They are subject to our whims.

But Brian, both parties support fracking, so how much longer will we have those things? 

Good point.  The Democratic party has shown itself to be more environmentally conscious and concerned than the Republican by far but that's a bit like saying they made it to second base instead of striking out. Neither is a run and until someone comes home, both are game losers.

Halifax2TheMax

Big Bank Hank said:

brianlux said:

Big Bank Hank said:

brianlux said:

Part of the problem, Hank, is with labels.  If people calls themselves "conservative" or "liberal" or "progressive" or whatever, those who define themselves otherwise will often be critical of what they perceive as their opposite.  I'm basically a progressive but I generally don't refer to myself as such because being progressive on some issues, on others I am more liberal, on some rather conservative and even on some fairly neutral or even apathetic. 

So if we look at each issue and learn that matters to us and we learn what we can about it and keep an open mind while using critical thinking, we may not need to label ourselves.  Just do what makes sense and you won't need a label and in doing so, you might have a better chance of all of us finding good solutions.

Also consider that the world is not just a human place.  Animals, plants, rocks- they are not conservative, liberal or progressive.  They are subject to our whims.

But Brian, both parties support fracking, so how much longer will we have those things? 

Good point.  The Democratic party has shown itself to be more environmentally conscious and concerned than the Republican by far but that's a bit like saying they made it to second base instead of striking out. Neither is a run and until someone comes home, both are game losers.

Bull crappy.

dignin

mfc2006

dignin said:

And now I have coffee all over my screen. Haha!

brianlux

dignin said:

Atra!  Atra!  Dondr! Khaaaard!

-Naoh, Amoukar and Gaw

my2hands

Chewy is the man!

Big Bank Hank

brianlux said:

dignin said:

Atra!  Atra!  Dondr! Khaaaard!

-Naoh, Amoukar and Gaw

ha ha

Big Bank Hank

dignin said:

I used to eat the C3PO cereal when it came out

Smellyman

 agree with Chewie

F Me In The Brain

Big Bank Hank

F Me In The Brain said:

completely unrelated

rgambs

I agree with nearly every progressive principle and goal for society, but I don't fit in with progressive crowds because I'm pragmatic.
The thing that you aren't seeing is that the harsh feeling you mention in the OP often flows FROM progressives, not to progressives.
Look at the language you've used, not just the language used toward you.  Calling people sheep is never going to do anything but make the name caller look like a loon.
Hard-left progressives have no compromise and therefore they get nothing done in the real world.
In the real world if you don't choose the lesser of evils you will be stuck with the greater evil.
Period.
That pragmatism puts progressives at odds with me.  I accept them, they don't accept me.

Big Bank Hank

rgambs said:

I agree with nearly every progressive principle and goal for society, but I don't fit in with progressive crowds because I'm pragmatic.
The thing that you aren't seeing is that the harsh feeling you mention in the OP often flows FROM progressives, not to progressives.
Look at the language you've used, not just the language used toward you.  Calling people sheep is never going to do anything but make the name caller look like a loon.
Hard-left progressives have no compromise and therefore they get nothing done in the real world.
In the real world if you don't choose the lesser of evils you will be stuck with the greater evil.
Period.
That pragmatism puts progressives at odds with me.  I accept them, they don't accept me.

That's complete BS, why do democrats refer to Progressives as "Alt-Left" that's highly disrespectful. And the sheep part, is the fact that Democrats actually believe the CIA is telling the truth, even though they have a long history of doing everything except tell the truth, it's ridiculous and no one would bet their lives or their family's lives on it, because deep down inside they know they are completely full of shit, and are only going along with it to fit their agenda, or Cognitive Dissonance, either way, that is sheep-like behavior, so I don't back track from that at all, I feel like I am living in the twilight zone, Americans citizens actually believing the CIA, lol, that's straight loony tunes.

oftenreading

I’ve never heard a Democrat use the term alt-left. You know who does use the term alt left? Trump and others on the right. 

As for for cognitive dissonance, I would think that would be something you would struggle with, given the way you venerate “experts” who fit your worldview while denigrating others who believe experts you find fault with. 

Big Bank Hank

oftenreading said:

I’ve never heard a Democrat use the term alt-left. You know who does use the term alt left? Trump and others on the right. 

As for for cognitive dissonance, I would think that would be something you would struggle with, given the way you venerate “experts” who fit your worldview while denigrating others who believe experts you find fault with. 

whatever dude, if I had cognitive dissonance I would just accept everything I was told instead of actually researching it, so keep on believing. Believe me, my life would be so much fucking easier if I had cognitive dissonance and I could just accept everything on TV & from the government and just accept it, and I could live my life in ignorance, there is something to be said for that, but I had to move to Seattle, the Socialist capital of the USA.

Halifax2TheMax

Big Bank Hank said:

oftenreading said:

I’ve never heard a Democrat use the term alt-left. You know who does use the term alt left? Trump and others on the right. 

As for for cognitive dissonance, I would think that would be something you would struggle with, given the way you venerate “experts” who fit your worldview while denigrating others who believe experts you find fault with. 

whatever dude, if I had cognitive dissonance I would just accept everything I was told instead of actually researching it, so keep on believing. Believe me, my life would be so much fucking easier if I had cognitive dissonance and I could just accept everything on TV & from the government and just accept it, and I could live my life in ignorance, there is something to be said for that, but I had to move to Seattle, the Socialist capital of the USA.

Are you part of the “general population” or alt-population, one that has a monopoly on truth and access to “real” information? What percentage of the population are you and of which you belong?

Big Bank Hank

oftenreading said:

I’ve never heard a Democrat use the term alt-left. You know who does use the term alt left? Trump and others on the right. 

As for for cognitive dissonance, I would think that would be something you would struggle with, given the way you venerate “experts” who fit your worldview while denigrating others who believe experts you find fault with. 

Corporate Democrats Now Calling Progressives The "Alt-Left"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4M4Yj6y0j0

oftenreading

I think you may be using the term “cognitive dissonance” in a non-traditional way.