Labels, yea or nay?

hedonist

jnimhaoileoin said:

By the way, I am very happy to describe myself as an atheistic pacifist with left-wing socialist beliefs. I don't think this in any way makes me less of an individual or impinges upon my ability to think independently. Rather it gives me a sense of identity

You seem to have your head on pretty straight, Jenny

HughFreakingDillon

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

HughFreakingDillon

brianlux said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

Labels are pretty damn essential when having any discussion about politics. I don't know how it works in your country but parties are identified by labels and it just makes everything a lot easier. In Denmark, the statsminister is from the Venstre party, which literally means Left (though in English they're called the Liberal Party). Nearly every country in Europe has a Socialist party. It's just how things work. 

If we could agree that labels are vague or inaccurate (and I don't know you you do agree with that), then I would ask, what makes labels essential?  Should not something essential and important be precise and thoroughly understood as well?  Do people- or anybody for that matter- fir into a neat and tidy little description? 

And what is the "everything" you mention that labels make easy and why  is it this everything needs to be easy? 

I'm not trying to be belligerent with you, honestly, but I don't understand your argument.

if labels were to be accurate, there would be too many of them to go around and it would be too confusing and no one would know which way is up. 

and as to your "I'm a conservative because I fight for the conservation of the earth",  you know that "conservative" in the current political context of the word has zero do with envinronmental conservation. it's conserving their values, as you know. 

just stirring the pot, again, brian!

chadwick

labels help navigate one through the shithole that is life

jnimhaoileoin

hedonist said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

By the way, I am very happy to describe myself as an atheistic pacifist with left-wing socialist beliefs. I don't think this in any way makes me less of an individual or impinges upon my ability to think independently. Rather it gives me a sense of identity

You seem to have your head on pretty straight, Jenny

brianlux

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

Labels are pretty damn essential when having any discussion about politics. I don't know how it works in your country but parties are identified by labels and it just makes everything a lot easier. In Denmark, the statsminister is from the Venstre party, which literally means Left (though in English they're called the Liberal Party). Nearly every country in Europe has a Socialist party. It's just how things work. 

If we could agree that labels are vague or inaccurate (and I don't know you you do agree with that), then I would ask, what makes labels essential?  Should not something essential and important be precise and thoroughly understood as well?  Do people- or anybody for that matter- fir into a neat and tidy little description? 

And what is the "everything" you mention that labels make easy and why  is it this everything needs to be easy? 

I'm not trying to be belligerent with you, honestly, but I don't understand your argument.

if labels were to be accurate, there would be too many of them to go around and it would be too confusing and no one would know which way is up. 

and as to your "I'm a conservative because I fight for the conservation of the earth",  you know that "conservative" in the current political context of the word has zero do with envinronmental conservation. it's conserving their values, as you know. 

just stirring the pot, again, brian!

Double, double toil and trouble;
    Fire burn, and caldron bubble.

Go Beavers

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

PJ_Soul

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

oftenreading

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

brianlux

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

hedonist

I wonder if labels are used as an offense or defense.

HughFreakingDillon

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

brianlux

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

By  being massively obsessed with wanting to know every detail about everything,  I'm currently researching the condition of kitchen sink faucets in Fond du Lac, Wisconsin.

But no, seriously, when I read the above (and humorous responses to) concerns about security in Manitoba it peaked my curiosity and I went on-line to see what I could find and found an article on safety of travel in Winnepeg.  Other than the North End, it sounds like an interesting town.  (So I guess I am a little obsessed with wanting to know the details     )

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

Well it's really cheap to fly there from Vancouver because nobody really wants to go, so one day I might end up in Winnipeg for a PJ show, since it's the only city that my meager collection of airmiles will take me for free.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

Well it's really cheap to fly there from Vancouver because nobody really wants to go, so one day I might end up in Winnipeg for a PJ show, since it's the only city that my meager collection of airmiles will take me for free.

hmm, our friends from vancouver tell a different story about flight costs to here. they come every year. and honestly, I don't blame them. I don't hate it here, but going from living in vancouver and having to visit winnipeg is not exactly what I'd call "a good vacation choice". I have no interest in living in a big city like Vancouver, I love visiting there, but I'd prefer a burb than the city itself.

Stayed in Kits for a week at a condo on the water a few years back. it was glorious. 

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

Well it's really cheap to fly there from Vancouver because nobody really wants to go, so one day I might end up in Winnipeg for a PJ show, since it's the only city that my meager collection of airmiles will take me for free.

hmm, our friends from vancouver tell a different story about flight costs to here. they come every year. and honestly, I don't blame them. I don't hate it here, but going from living in vancouver and having to visit winnipeg is not exactly what I'd call "a good vacation choice". I have no interest in living in a big city like Vancouver, I love visiting there, but I'd prefer a burb than the city itself.

Stayed in Kits for a week at a condo on the water a few years back. it was glorious. 

Well, Calgary, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are the only 3 cities I can get to with 2000 airmiles, lol. It's all relative. There is no such thing as an actual cheap flight out of Vancouver. Airfares out of this place are all insane.

oftenreading

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

Well it's really cheap to fly there from Vancouver because nobody really wants to go, so one day I might end up in Winnipeg for a PJ show, since it's the only city that my meager collection of airmiles will take me for free.

hmm, our friends from vancouver tell a different story about flight costs to here. they come every year. and honestly, I don't blame them. I don't hate it here, but going from living in vancouver and having to visit winnipeg is not exactly what I'd call "a good vacation choice". I have no interest in living in a big city like Vancouver, I love visiting there, but I'd prefer a burb than the city itself.

Stayed in Kits for a week at a condo on the water a few years back. it was glorious. 

Well, Calgary, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are the only 3 cities I can get to with 2000 airmiles, lol. It's all relative. There is no such thing as an actual cheap flight out of Vancouver. Airfares out of this place are all insane.

Try flying from Victoria. Do you have any idea how much they charge for the 15 minute flight between Victoria and Vancouver? 

PJ_Soul

oftenreading said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

oftenreading said:

Go Beavers said:

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

dudeman said:

Some people have a desire, maybe even a need, to place others in a particular box. I assume that is so they know how to approach talking to them. I do it too but I see it as problematic. 

some also have a desire/need to be in a box themselves so they identify with a certain group and feel a part of something. 

I am liberal leaning. But I don't always vote liberal party. Actually, not just "not always", I don't vote consistently by party EVER. it is based on the issues of today, where I think my area/country needs to go socially, politically, globally, economically, and make my decision based on that. i have voted every single major party (there are 5 recognized) in Canada. 

I voted democrat provincially, but then they ran our economy into the toilet, so I voted conservative in the last election. Now that hoser spends most of his time at his residence in costa rica and it's apparently no one's business how much work he does while there. he won't even tell people how he communicates with his staff in Manitoba while there, citing "security concerns".

it is quite likely I won't be voting that party next time around. 

Manitoba has a Social Democrat party still??

Manitoba has security concerns?

I would have security concerns if I went to Manitoba.

(Sorry, HFD)

I hear The North End in Winnipeg has quite the night life (for the reckless and foolhardy, that is.)

Otherwise, sounds like a nice place.  Home town of Neil Young!

LOL. you guys. yes, we are the detroit of Canada. However, that's only in certain areas. Downtown and the burbs are fine. It's, as Brian said, the north end can get sketchy (HOW IN THE HELL DOES A CALIFORNIAN KNOW ABOUT WINNIPEG'S NORTH END???). But there's really no reason for anyone who doesn't live there to go there. 

Well it's really cheap to fly there from Vancouver because nobody really wants to go, so one day I might end up in Winnipeg for a PJ show, since it's the only city that my meager collection of airmiles will take me for free.

hmm, our friends from vancouver tell a different story about flight costs to here. they come every year. and honestly, I don't blame them. I don't hate it here, but going from living in vancouver and having to visit winnipeg is not exactly what I'd call "a good vacation choice". I have no interest in living in a big city like Vancouver, I love visiting there, but I'd prefer a burb than the city itself.

Stayed in Kits for a week at a condo on the water a few years back. it was glorious. 

Well, Calgary, Edmonton, and Winnipeg are the only 3 cities I can get to with 2000 airmiles, lol. It's all relative. There is no such thing as an actual cheap flight out of Vancouver. Airfares out of this place are all insane.

Try flying from Victoria. Do you have any idea how much they charge for the 15 minute flight between Victoria and Vancouver? 

It's insanity!!!
How much are those private float plane rides to and from Vancouver/Victoria? Maybe those are cheaper than going through the actual airport? I'm sure you've checked all options though. Have you heard about this private company planning on a super duper fast-ferry route for downtown Vancouver-Victoria? No word yet as far as pricing goes (I don't think), but that would likely be cheaper than flying in any case, and the downtown Vancouver port is SOOOO much more convenient than Tsawwassen, especially if you're going YVR.