Springsteen at Australia Concert: 'We Stand Before You Embarrassed Americans'

cincybearcat

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

that's pretty friggin funny.  

Not really, it’s ignoring a lot of variables that have made men and women what they are today.

the women are better than men argument because we have no idea what women would do as they haven’t had the chance yet is pretty weak. I know what men did, women go to jail less currently so they must be better than men. 

cincybearcat

Sorry messed up quote feature. This place sucks on a phone.

you know, perhaps I’m arguing a completely different topic then was meant. So I’ll just stop.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

Really?  But it's a big factor....the gender role over time and how males and females have evolved.  Do you really think 1 gender is "better" than another?  I think this is very dangerous logic.

Ah nevermind, this is a better discussion to have in person.  

My point is that you have reduced massive complexity down to one factor that you are calling "gender role", without taking into account anything that it involves. It is not about one gender being better - no where in my post did I say that. 

But someone did and you responded to my post saying it’s not true. 

I clarified.

oftenreading

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

Really?  But it's a big factor....the gender role over time and how males and females have evolved.  Do you really think 1 gender is "better" than another?  I think this is very dangerous logic.

Ah nevermind, this is a better discussion to have in person.  

My point is that you have reduced massive complexity down to one factor that you are calling "gender role", without taking into account anything that it involves. It is not about one gender being better - no where in my post did I say that. 

But someone did and you responded to my post saying it’s not true. 

What? I’m not responsible for what other people say. I’m arguing against your premise that one “simple” little switch naturally flows to the conclusion you think. 

If you want to do a thought experiment, do the thought experiment. Don’t just posit the starting conditions and then jump to the conclusion you like. 

oftenreading

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

that's pretty friggin funny.  

Not really, it’s ignoring a lot of variables that have made men and women what they are today.

the women are better than men argument because we have no idea what women would do as they haven’t had the chance yet is pretty weak. I know what men did, women go to jail less currently so they must be better than men. 

At this point I have no idea what you’re arguing. It seems that you’re the one ignoring variables here, which was my point. 

cincybearcat

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

Really?  But it's a big factor....the gender role over time and how males and females have evolved.  Do you really think 1 gender is "better" than another?  I think this is very dangerous logic.

Ah nevermind, this is a better discussion to have in person.  

My point is that you have reduced massive complexity down to one factor that you are calling "gender role", without taking into account anything that it involves. It is not about one gender being better - no where in my post did I say that. 

But someone did and you responded to my post saying it’s not true. 

I clarified.

Ugh...yes I know. Jesus H Christ I’m not communicating well today.  

I wrobgky assumed that often responding to my response to your initial post (which you’ve clarified now) meant that often agreed with you. Apparently this was a mistake and often was only commenting on my specific post. It’s tough to have what I thought was 1 conversation between me a 3 people who disagree with me actually be 3 complete different discussions. Hahahahaha now I’m frustrated as hell at what would have likely been a 2 minute conversation at a bar. 

cincybearcat

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

Really?  But it's a big factor....the gender role over time and how males and females have evolved.  Do you really think 1 gender is "better" than another?  I think this is very dangerous logic.

Ah nevermind, this is a better discussion to have in person.  

My point is that you have reduced massive complexity down to one factor that you are calling "gender role", without taking into account anything that it involves. It is not about one gender being better - no where in my post did I say that. 

But someone did and you responded to my post saying it’s not true. 

What? I’m not responsible for what other people say. I’m arguing against your premise that one “simple” little switch naturally flows to the conclusion you think. 

If you want to do a thought experiment, do the thought experiment. Don’t just posit the starting conditions and then jump to the conclusion you like. 

What are you talking about? Don’t just post my opinion? That’s dumb. 

mrussel1

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

that's pretty friggin funny.  

Not really, it’s ignoring a lot of variables that have made men and women what they are today.

the women are better than men argument because we have no idea what women would do as they haven’t had the chance yet is pretty weak. I know what men did, women go to jail less currently so they must be better than men. 

Of course there are variables.  And there are many tribes around the world that historically had female leaders.  But you're challenging the entire basis of Western Culture for the past 2k+ years.  I'm not saying that women are genetically predisposed to being less corrupt morally than men, I'm saying that's how it is today.  And that is absolutely cultural at some level.  

Bentleyspop

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

njnancy

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I've been on a waiting list since he announced his Walter Kerr run. Enjoy!

oftenreading

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

oftenreading said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

cincybearcat said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

Women are better than men. This... coming from a man.

Don't get me wrong. I love being a man in all my manliness, but if we are being objective... women are the kinder, gentler gender that our species needs for direction. I believe the world would become a better place if women were placed in the most influential leadership spots.

This is bullshit.

Compare the number of men in prison to women, particularly for violent crimes.  That's an easy assessment.  

So this says women are better than men? C'mon, that is such a bullshit statement.  Just as bad as the reverse.  Someone's sex doesn;t make them better or worse.

Thirty Bills is going down the path of leadership.  I don't know if that is true or not.  I agree that they have not been given a chance to fuck it up like men have since the beginning of time.  But I am saying that women, on average, are morally superior than men.  Not every single one obviously.  This stat is an easy representation of that.  While when you start comparing races, you get into prejudicial justice system, socioeconomic conditions (which I think is the biggest factor in crime), you can throw most of that out when comparing men to women because I don't believe there is a great disparity between the number of men in poverty compared to women.  They tend to move together.  

yeah I don;t really agree.  If we could flip a switch and have the traditional gender roles reversed starting back to the beginning of time, I suspect you;d see a very similar world and one with more women in jail than men.  I think all that history and environment and macho crap would be built right into women instead of men.

Again - as we sit today I do feel that women in leadership positions would have a positive effect in a lot of areas.  But over the long haul, it would come back to human nature.  

"If we made everything different from the beginning of time, my argument works" is kind of weak. 

Really?  But it's a big factor....the gender role over time and how males and females have evolved.  Do you really think 1 gender is "better" than another?  I think this is very dangerous logic.

Ah nevermind, this is a better discussion to have in person.  

My point is that you have reduced massive complexity down to one factor that you are calling "gender role", without taking into account anything that it involves. It is not about one gender being better - no where in my post did I say that. 

But someone did and you responded to my post saying it’s not true. 

What? I’m not responsible for what other people say. I’m arguing against your premise that one “simple” little switch naturally flows to the conclusion you think. 

If you want to do a thought experiment, do the thought experiment. Don’t just posit the starting conditions and then jump to the conclusion you like. 

What are you talking about? Don’t just post my opinion? That’s dumb. 

Again, I have no idea what you’re arguing now, so I’m not even going to try to reply to it. 

mrussel1

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I tried to get tickets last year when I was in the city.. crazy how expensive the resales were.  Alas, I didn't get in.  

Bentleyspop

mrussel1 said:

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I tried to get tickets last year when I was in the city.. crazy how expensive the resales were.  Alas, I didn't get in.  

The show I went to in March I got mine by walking up to the window at 10:30 day of show (Thursday), and got one of the 8 sold out of the window that day.
$500 face but no other choice. Well worth it.

cincybearcat

Bentleyspop said:

mrussel1 said:

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I tried to get tickets last year when I was in the city.. crazy how expensive the resales were.  Alas, I didn't get in.  

The show I went to in March I got mine by walking up to the window at 10:30 day of show (Thursday), and got one of the 8 sold out of the window that day.
$500 face but no other choice. Well worth it.

$500? For Bruce? I’d go if paid $500.

But really for a fan that would be a cool show.

PJ_Soul

buck502000 said:

mrussel1 said:

buck502000 said:

Before I have no children and a barren womb.........

What does that mean?

They chose their careers before becoming Mothers and wives...

What the fuck???

mrussel1

Bentleyspop said:

mrussel1 said:

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I tried to get tickets last year when I was in the city.. crazy how expensive the resales were.  Alas, I didn't get in.  

The show I went to in March I got mine by walking up to the window at 10:30 day of show (Thursday), and got one of the 8 sold out of the window that day.
$500 face but no other choice. Well worth it.

You must have been right up front, I hope, for that price.  Once in a lifetime experience to see a legend with only his guitar.  There's precious few that can write poetry like Bruce.  

Bentleyspop

mrussel1 said:

Bentleyspop said:

mrussel1 said:

Bentleyspop said:

Keeping with thread integrity.....

I saw Bruce on Broadway back in March and loved the show so much I'm going back for a second time.

I tried to get tickets last year when I was in the city.. crazy how expensive the resales were.  Alas, I didn't get in.  

The show I went to in March I got mine by walking up to the window at 10:30 day of show (Thursday), and got one of the 8 sold out of the window that day.
$500 face but no other choice. Well worth it.

You must have been right up front, I hope, for that price.  Once in a lifetime experience to see a legend with only his guitar.  There's precious few that can write poetry like Bruce.  

Up front runs $850 face
$500 is rear orch
But with only 18 rows in the orchestra and no leg room there is no bad seat in the house

my2hands

No leg room sounds like every seat is bad 

mrussel1

my2hands said:

No leg room sounds like every seat is bad 

Yeah, I remember that about the Tower theater for TOTD.  Had never been there before, but boy were those seats tight.  Like a airplane from 1965.  

oftenreading

mrussel1 said:

my2hands said:

No leg room sounds like every seat is bad 

Yeah, I remember that about the Tower theater for TOTD.  Had never been there before, but boy were those seats tight.  Like a airplane from 1965.  

I had pretty short legs in 1965 so it’s hard to judge, but it seems to me that legroom in airplanes is getting tighter, not better, as they try to jam more people in.