If you think they are hypocrites but continue to listen to them and give them money then aren't you also a hypocrite? Maybe you should boycott them.
To an extent yea. I loved them for their music but also foolishly believed in the other stuff too. Now I think the other stuff is bogus. Makes me like them less but I'm still a fan of their music and their performances. Maybe not all about them as I was before. Maybe time will heal some wounds. I am certainly a hypocrite in many different aspects of my life though. I recognize it.
Being a fan and being in this forum are optional parts of your life. If it doesn't bring you pleasure and you're unable to see the many positives then it might be time to take a break.
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore
If you think they are hypocrites but continue to listen to them and give them money then aren't you also a hypocrite? Maybe you should boycott them.
To an extent yea. I loved them for their music but also foolishly believed in the other stuff too. Now I think the other stuff is bogus. Makes me like them less but I'm still a fan of their music and their performances. Maybe not all about them as I was before. Maybe time will heal some wounds. I am certainly a hypocrite in many different aspects of my life though. I recognize it.
Being a fan and being in this forum are optional parts of your life. If it doesn't bring you pleasure and you're unable to see the many positives then it might be time to take a break.
Well said!!!
9/1-9/2/2000 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 4/28/2003 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA 5/3/2003 - Bryce Jordan Center, State College, PA 7/5-7/6/2003 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 7/13/2003 - Hershey Park, Hershey, PA 10/1/2004 - Sovereign Center, Reading, PA 9/1/2005 - Gorge, George, WA 10/03/2005 - Wachovia Center, Phila, PA 5/27-5/28/2006 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 6/16/2008 - Columbia, SC 6/19-6/20/2008 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 6/24-6/25 - Madison Square Garden 10/28-10/31/2008 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA 9/22/2012 - MidTown, Atlanta, GA 10/21-10/22 - Wells Fargo Center, Phila, PA 10/30/2013 - Charlotte, NC 04/21/2016 - Columbia, SC ......
Let it go...it happened 2 days ago and he just gave a horrible explanation last night and the jazz fest show is the next one. Its still relevant. I mean NOBODY is talking about the boycott anymore in terms of the positive it has done for repealing the law. But when you make a choice like that that has negative ramifications, then you need to live with it for a bit.
I think its fair for people like me to point out what hypocrites they are. Especially when I was so naive to believe they weren't like that.
Taking money from Shell Oil is a pretty big example of hypocrisy. I'm fine w/ accepting them as hypocrites (or if they apologized and said they made the wrong decision in cancelling NC). I'd like people blasting those fans for being critical of the band to at least acknowledge they are hypocrites. I don't think that is asking too much.
no, you just don't get it. this band cannot possibly support every cause out there. they can't. otherwise they would cease to exist. it's really very simple. it's not hypocritical. at least they are doing SOMETHING.
If I make a donation to Crohn's and Colitis foundation of Canada, but not Heart and Stroke, that makes me an asshole?
Let it go...it happened 2 days ago and he just gave a horrible explanation last night and the jazz fest show is the next one. Its still relevant. I mean NOBODY is talking about the boycott anymore in terms of the positive it has done for repealing the law. But when you make a choice like that that has negative ramifications, then you need to live with it for a bit.
I think its fair for people like me to point out what hypocrites they are. Especially when I was so naive to believe they weren't like that.
Taking money from Shell Oil is a pretty big example of hypocrisy. I'm fine w/ accepting them as hypocrites (or if they apologized and said they made the wrong decision in cancelling NC). I'd like people blasting those fans for being critical of the band to at least acknowledge they are hypocrites. I don't think that is asking too much.
no, you just don't get it. this band cannot possibly support every cause out there. they can't. otherwise they would cease to exist. it's really very simple. it's not hypocritical. at least they are doing SOMETHING.
If I make a donation to Crohn's and Colitis foundation of Canada, but not Heart and Stroke, that makes me an asshole?
If you say you are for environment and against greedy corporations and are standing up saying the world is getting warmer and we need to do something about it - and you accept a gig sponsored by Shell Oil. Yes, you are being hypocritical.
Let it go...it happened 2 days ago and he just gave a horrible explanation last night and the jazz fest show is the next one. Its still relevant. I mean NOBODY is talking about the boycott anymore in terms of the positive it has done for repealing the law. But when you make a choice like that that has negative ramifications, then you need to live with it for a bit.
I think its fair for people like me to point out what hypocrites they are. Especially when I was so naive to believe they weren't like that.
Taking money from Shell Oil is a pretty big example of hypocrisy. I'm fine w/ accepting them as hypocrites (or if they apologized and said they made the wrong decision in cancelling NC). I'd like people blasting those fans for being critical of the band to at least acknowledge they are hypocrites. I don't think that is asking too much.
no, you just don't get it. this band cannot possibly support every cause out there. they can't. otherwise they would cease to exist. it's really very simple. it's not hypocritical. at least they are doing SOMETHING.
If I make a donation to Crohn's and Colitis foundation of Canada, but not Heart and Stroke, that makes me an asshole?
If you say you are for environment and against greedy corporations and are standing up saying the world is getting warmer and we need to do something about it - and you accept a gig sponsored by Shell Oil. Yes, you are being hypocritical.
then, by extension, if you don't cancel your membership this instant, you are being hypocritical.
ALL festivals are sponsored by something. with the amount of money they donate to worthy causes, most of which we don't even know about, they take a lot of the money they make from playing a festival like that and raise funds/awareness/both and do something good.
If you think they are hypocrites but continue to listen to them and give them money then aren't you also a hypocrite? Maybe you should boycott them.
To an extent yea. I loved them for their music but also foolishly believed in the other stuff too. Now I think the other stuff is bogus. Makes me like them less but I'm still a fan of their music and their performances. Maybe not all about them as I was before. Maybe time will heal some wounds. I am certainly a hypocrite in many different aspects of my life though. I recognize it.
LOL. this is so ridiculous. so playing a festival sponsored by shell completely negates all of the other amazing things this band has done for the world. jesus christ. tell that to all the kids who have a skateboard park via the generosity of Jeff Ament. to name ONE cause.
I think it would be hypocritical if they worked for Shell, or did a PR event touring Shell, a TV commercial supporting them, or a banner on their tour bus for Shell that would help offset the cost of touring.
I don't like buying goods made in countries where there is child labor, but I cannot always find the product I'm looking for without going way beyond, spending time researching, traveling or whatever to find a product made responsibly.
If the festival is to happen at all, they have to have sponsors. Pearl Jam has a definite following and we part of their belief system as well. So do they shut fans out and not play in places where there is an inkling of an issue that doesn't coincide with their moral beliefs? There has to be a happy medium.
If they didn't use TM and only played venues that would allow them full control of ticket sales, that would definitely lessen the locations they can play, and limit the amount of tickets available, they would get griped out for that. You can't please all the people all the time and we usually can't have things both ways. Some things go one way and some go the other way and we hope we can sleep with ourselves at night. js.
Amy The Great #74594
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016 Missoula MT 2018
If you are trying to promote change by economic hits like they did by boycotting in NC then yes, stay committed to that approach. If PJ said they would not play Jazz Fest until Jazz Fest stopped accepting Shell Oil as a major sponsor, that has way more teeth then cancelling a performance in NC for a law that the businesses and the cities (and their representatives in the legislature) already are against and most likely will be repealed via courts as opposed to the state legislature.
I get it. You guys don't think they are hypocrites. This band doesn't do anything you disagree with.
9/1-9/2/2000 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 4/28/2003 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA 5/3/2003 - Bryce Jordan Center, State College, PA 7/5-7/6/2003 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 7/13/2003 - Hershey Park, Hershey, PA 10/1/2004 - Sovereign Center, Reading, PA 9/1/2005 - Gorge, George, WA 10/03/2005 - Wachovia Center, Phila, PA 5/27-5/28/2006 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 6/16/2008 - Columbia, SC 6/19-6/20/2008 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ 6/24-6/25 - Madison Square Garden 10/28-10/31/2008 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA 9/22/2012 - MidTown, Atlanta, GA 10/21-10/22 - Wells Fargo Center, Phila, PA 10/30/2013 - Charlotte, NC 04/21/2016 - Columbia, SC ......
If you are trying to promote change by economic hits like they did by boycotting in NC then yes, stay committed to that approach. If PJ said they would not play Jazz Fest until Jazz Fest stopped accepting Shell Oil as a major sponsor, that has way more teeth then cancelling a performance in NC for a law that the businesses and the cities (and their representatives in the legislature) already are against and most likely will be repealed via courts as opposed to the state legislature.
I get it. You guys don't think they are hypocrites. This band doesn't do anything you disagree with.
ah, and there it is. I was waiting for it. the obligatory "the band can do no wrong in your eyes" lazy approach. that's bullshit and you know it.
the NC cancellation was human rights issue. that's about as big as it gets. it's probably been Ed's biggest issue since the beginning. Do I think they did it just because Bruce did? yep. would I have been pissed had I had tickets. yep. but in the end, they are the ones in control of their own destiny, so, so be it.
What's wrong with Shell Oil? How do you get to shows OP? Canoe?
Chicago 6/29/98, Alpine Valley(EV) 6/13/99, Alpine Valley 10/08/00, Chicago 10/09/00, Phoenix 10/20/00, Orlando 4/12/03, Tampa 4/13/03, San Diego 6/05/03, Vegas 6/06/03, Phoenix 6/07/03, Chicago 6/18/03, Alpine Valley 6/21/03, Orlando 10/08/04, D.C. 10/11/04, Chicago 5/16/06, Chicago 5/17/06, LA 7/12/08, Chicago 8/23/09, Chicago 8/24/09, LA 10/07/09, San Diego 10/09/09 (Front Row Center, Finally), Phoenix(EV) 11/4/11, Wrigley 7/19/13, Phoenix 11/19/13, Denver 10/22/14, Wrigley 8/20/16, Wrigley 8/22/16
For me it's not about agreeing with them, I choose not to judge their actions as they choose not to judge my actions.
Amy The Great #74594
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016 Missoula MT 2018
I cant believe the garbage posted on this forum the last few weeks. People take the horrible stances and try to blow it out of proportion thinking they are so profound. Apples and Oranges guys... this protest really bring them out of the woodwork.
This! Also, for those criticizing PJ's "politics," here's an idea. Start your own band and do whatever the fuck you want. Let PJ do their thing. Don't like it? Respectfully disagree and move on, keep quiet, or step aside. Plenty of others waiting to step in and fill the open space left in your absence.
If you think they are hypocrites but continue to listen to them and give them money then aren't you also a hypocrite? Maybe you should boycott them.
To an extent yea. I loved them for their music but also foolishly believed in the other stuff too. Now I think the other stuff is bogus. Makes me like them less but I'm still a fan of their music and their performances. Maybe not all about them as I was before. Maybe time will heal some wounds. I am certainly a hypocrite in many different aspects of my life though. I recognize it.
To an extent? No, sorry, but after all of the rather illogical crap you have been spewing about what the band should and shouldn't be doing in order to fulfill your Jesus complex with regards to them, yes, you are a massive hypocrite if you don't boycott the band, their shows, their music, get rid of any PJ merch you have, etc. If you refuse to do that you are just as bad as you are blabbing about the band being for not fighting every fucking cause on the face of the planet while ignoring all pleas for using logic in your arguments.
But yes, we're hypocrites. Anyone who claims they aren't is a liar too. So if you know this why are you so upset?
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
Comments
Well said!!!
4/28/2003 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA
5/3/2003 - Bryce Jordan Center, State College, PA
7/5-7/6/2003 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
7/13/2003 - Hershey Park, Hershey, PA
10/1/2004 - Sovereign Center, Reading, PA
9/1/2005 - Gorge, George, WA
10/03/2005 - Wachovia Center, Phila, PA
5/27-5/28/2006 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
6/16/2008 - Columbia, SC
6/19-6/20/2008 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
6/24-6/25 - Madison Square Garden
10/28-10/31/2008 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA
9/22/2012 - MidTown, Atlanta, GA
10/21-10/22 - Wells Fargo Center, Phila, PA
10/30/2013 - Charlotte, NC
04/21/2016 - Columbia, SC
......
If I make a donation to Crohn's and Colitis foundation of Canada, but not Heart and Stroke, that makes me an asshole?
www.headstonesband.com
ALL festivals are sponsored by something. with the amount of money they donate to worthy causes, most of which we don't even know about, they take a lot of the money they make from playing a festival like that and raise funds/awareness/both and do something good.
www.headstonesband.com
www.headstonesband.com
I don't like buying goods made in countries where there is child labor, but I cannot always find the product I'm looking for without going way beyond, spending time researching, traveling or whatever to find a product made responsibly.
If the festival is to happen at all, they have to have sponsors. Pearl Jam has a definite following and we part of their belief system as well. So do they shut fans out and not play in places where there is an inkling of an issue that doesn't coincide with their moral beliefs? There has to be a happy medium.
If they didn't use TM and only played venues that would allow them full control of ticket sales, that would definitely lessen the locations they can play, and limit the amount of tickets available, they would get griped out for that. You can't please all the people all the time and we usually can't have things both ways. Some things go one way and some go the other way and we hope we can sleep with ourselves at night. js.
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016
Missoula MT 2018
I get it. You guys don't think they are hypocrites. This band doesn't do anything you disagree with.
4/28/2003 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA
5/3/2003 - Bryce Jordan Center, State College, PA
7/5-7/6/2003 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
7/13/2003 - Hershey Park, Hershey, PA
10/1/2004 - Sovereign Center, Reading, PA
9/1/2005 - Gorge, George, WA
10/03/2005 - Wachovia Center, Phila, PA
5/27-5/28/2006 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
6/16/2008 - Columbia, SC
6/19-6/20/2008 - Tweeter Center, Camden, NJ
6/24-6/25 - Madison Square Garden
10/28-10/31/2008 - The Spectrum, Phila, PA
9/22/2012 - MidTown, Atlanta, GA
10/21-10/22 - Wells Fargo Center, Phila, PA
10/30/2013 - Charlotte, NC
04/21/2016 - Columbia, SC
......
the NC cancellation was human rights issue. that's about as big as it gets. it's probably been Ed's biggest issue since the beginning. Do I think they did it just because Bruce did? yep. would I have been pissed had I had tickets. yep. but in the end, they are the ones in control of their own destiny, so, so be it.
www.headstonesband.com
www.headstonesband.com
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016
Missoula MT 2018
Also, for those criticizing PJ's "politics," here's an idea. Start your own band and do whatever the fuck you want. Let PJ do their thing. Don't like it? Respectfully disagree and move on, keep quiet, or step aside. Plenty of others waiting to step in and fill the open space left in your absence.
But yes, we're hypocrites. Anyone who claims they aren't is a liar too. So if you know this why are you so upset?