They've opened Pandora's box

jeffbr

Sorry, but this isn't a picket line. Where's the line? Is it at the NC border? Between all of its neighboring states? Nope. It is a boycott. And while I support businesses and artists participating in the boycott, I'll reiterate that it is not the only valid way to address the issue. There are valid arguments to be made for facing the issue head on. Here's one take from Salon (not a right-wing publication):
http://www.salon.com/2016/04/10/forget_the_boycott_this_is_how_we_teach_north_carolina_and_mississippi_a_lesson/

JP Losman

WRONG!

Joel McHale played and donated all of his proceeds. It was an awesome move. Bryan Adams I believe cancelled Mississippi not NC.

JP Losman

choop said:

ComeToTX said:

choop said:

Links to Florida's "bad" LGBT laws? Because I keep seeing that posted and it sounds like a repeated talking point with no basis in reality. I'll apologize when someone drops a link that shows Florida has state mandated discrimination on the books. Thanks.

Throughout most of Florida, it is legal to fire someone or deny them access to housing or public accommodations because they are lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender (LGBT). While it is illegal to discriminate in employment, housing and public accommodations based race, color, religion, sex, national origin, age, handicap or marital status, the LGBT community is currently left out of statewide non-discrimination protections.
http://www.eqfl.org/Discrimination

Did you even read the link you posted:
-Since 2004, Equality Florida has been working to pass a statewide bill that would include the LGBT community into current non-discrimination laws.
AND
-In fact, over 53% of Floridians live in a place that protects them from discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity.

So there has been progress in over half the state in 12 years. Not amazing, but not terrible, and not a step in the wrong direction like the NC law. This is a new law just added to the books. FL residents who have become activists have made tremendous progress updating the existing laws.

Much, much different animal here. There is no law in FL that blatantly discriminates like HB2.

There has been great progress in NC as well. Don't trivialize the efforts the activists here have made for social justice (which we were making before PJ cancelled as well as after). Florida's state legislature passed a very harsh, unreasonable anti abortion law. They have taken steps backwards too along the way. Let's not forget their racist pro nra stand your ground laws. And then there is all of the reported discrimination w/ no legal action towards LGBTQ community too. NC has voted blue before in presidential elections. This happened because of gerrymandering, not because of the will of the people.

patkelly12

What about climate change and lions? Have we already forsaken them? That would be shameful. Who is keeping track of the social justice hierarchy? Besides Clooney & Co.

jeffwalsh

This is an outrage. He said picket line, but there is no picket line! Songwriters using metaphors must be stopped and they should just tell us exactly what they mean...

jeffbr

jeffwalsh said:

This is an outrage. He said picket line, but there is no picket line! Songwriters using metaphors must be stopped and they should just tell us exactly what they mean...

Whatever. Words have meaning. And I support their boycott, just not their timing. I think they fucked their fans unnecessarily. It could have been handled in a much more controlled and mature way, rather than being petulant and showing complete disregard for the very people who make it possible for them to do what they do.

my2hands

I wonder how many people are in jail in Kentucky for draconian marijuana/drug war era laws?

Did they play NYC during the stop & frisk days when people with dark skin were disproportionately targeted?

How about their stance on gun control? How many states with strong stand your ground laws have they played the last few years?

Don't even get me started... love the cause, dont have a problem taking a stand, but who the fuck thought it would be a good idea to wait so long to cancel, especially with such a large travelling base? And announce it 2 hours before the show yesterday killing the great vibe so many of us had?

I will never forget this, my road trip days are likely over because of their 11th hour decision

It was a last minute kick in the nuts. Period.

ComeToTX

If they were proactive on this they should have released a statement when the law was signed or at least when Bruce cancelled and said if the law isn't repealed by 4/18 we will not play in Raleigh. That would have been the fair thing to do and a lot less of us would be upset.

my2hands

ComeToTX said:

If they were proactive on this they should have released a statement when the law was signed or at least when Bruce cancelled and said if the law isn't repealed by 4/18 we will not play in Raleigh. That would have been the fair thing to do and a lot less of us would be upset.

That would have worked... it's a lot better than keeping quiet for weeks just to cancel at the 11th hour

ComeToTX

Especially when it was being discussed on here and people were emailing. They used the fans as collateral damage on an issue that will be solved by the courts anyway.

vant0037

When does taking A stand mean you must now take ALL stands, especially when said stands are being picked for you?

hsohi

vant0037 said:

When does taking A stand mean you must now take ALL stands, especially when said stands are being picked for you?

Deep

PorchgirlCO

Just curious...has there been much press on their cancellation besides in rolling stone? I agree on the issues at hand, but like most, not on the timing.

jeffwalsh

Searching "Pearl Jam cancels north carolina" on Google News, it says there are 616 more articles on that topic, under the six it initially shows.

3days

vant0037 said:

When does taking A stand mean you must now take ALL stands, especially when said stands are being picked for you?

Yeah, it's the band's choice. They can decide for themselves when to boycott, what to boycott, and what time is best to announce a boycott. I'm confident that they didn't do this intentionally to hurt their fans. Every artist, company gets to decide the best way to deal with the situation. This is what they've chosen. Pandora's box has nothing to do with anything.

jeffwalsh

If you're going to follow the actual Pandora myth, though: "Pandora opened the jar and all the evils flew out, leaving only "Hope" inside once she had closed it again."

PorchgirlCO

jeffwalsh said:

Searching "Pearl Jam cancels north carolina" on Google News, it says there are 616 more articles on that topic, under the six it initially shows.

Just did that and quite a few for sure!

P34RL J4MM3R

OH SHI#, no more PEPSI in NC, now that's a deal breaker, I'm moving.



Here's a partial list of companies/artists besides Pearl Jam who have boycotted North Carolina so far:

Ringo Starr
Bryan Adams
Deutsche Bank
PayPal
Bruce Springsteen
Michael Moore
xHamster
Joel McHale
General Electric
the Dow Chemical Company
Pepsi
Hyatt
Hewlett Packard
Choice Hotels International
Whole Foods
Levis Strauss & Co.
Lionsgate
Boston
Cirque du Soleil

Sorry, but that's a picket line, and it's growing every day. Kudos to the band for understanding that the power to invoke change lies in numbers, and that a boycott only works if people/groups are willing to sacrifice and make unpopular decisions in order to achieve the end goal.

ComeToTX

That list is misleading. Some of those companies are threatening to boycott. Not all have actually done it.

and xhamster is a porn site. I've heard.

cincybearcat

How exactly does GE with a plant in NC and Pepsi with facilities here in NC boycott NC?

Vedd Hedd

Are we really arguing the semantics of the words "boycott" and "picket line" at this point?

KV4053

PorchgirlCO said:

Just curious...has there been much press on their cancellation besides in rolling stone? I agree on the issues at hand, but like most, not on the timing.

McCrory acknowledged the cancelation. He's the head of the target audience

my2hands

cincybearcat said:

How exactly does GE with a plant in NC and Pepsi with facilities here in NC boycott NC?

Something tells me I can still buy a Pepsi in North Carolina

jeffwalsh

ComeToTX said:

and xhamster is a porn site. I've heard.

No one in NC can verify that for you, since they'd have their porn access cut off since last week.

jakescarlett1

NC resident here. Going on 30+ years. About the law. Charlotte passed a law allowing the transgender community to use the bathroom they identify with. The mayoral legislation didn't like this. So, before Charlottes law took effect, and without any notice, news, debates, the mayor had a secretive emergency 12 hr session to pass a law stating that local governments could not pass policies on bathroom use (they had to abide by the state law of use the bathroom on your birth certificate), local governments can not pass minimum wage policies either now. Also, employees that are fired from their place of employment for reasons of religion, sex, age, gender, color, race, etc could no longer file complaints in state courts, but have to file in federal courts and the time frame went from 3 yrs to 180 days. (this happened because corporations were tired of all the discrimination suites brought against them, and since it has to be filed in federal courts now and the state allows 1/3 the time to process the file, which makes it much harder for a plaintiff to win, corporations get to keep more of their money to line the governors pockets with, and discriminate as they see fit). The good news is that when the legislation comes back for their mini session in 4 weeks, it'll be repealed. All the heavy hitting state educational centers, (Duke, UNC's system, etc), legislative groups (Raleigh, Durham, Charlotte) and big corporations new and old(textile groups, Labor groups, technology groups/RTP, etc) have denounced the new law. Believe me, this state can be ass-backwards, as all states can be, but the people that call NC home are mostly transplants from up north. And honestly, so am I. This is still a decent and fun state. This law will be over turned. It's apparent and unfortunately that PJ isn't aware of this. And it's unfortunate that this law even was passed in secret. No one voted on it. And unfortunately we can't repeal it fast enough to satisfy PJ, and have them play here :( mark my words, after the legislations mini session, it'll be off the books.

23scidoo

Stupids law's are everywhere, everyday..

somebodyelsessky2020

I don't have a dog in this fight but IMHO I would think playing the concert, talking about the subject matter a tiny bit during the show, donate all proceeds to education on the cause of the day.

The end

I just don't know what cancelling accomplishes here? Seems a little Trumpertantrum-ish

PJ_Soul

Tim Simmons said:

true, but there is a wave of momentum in getting these Anti-LGBT bills changed or veto'd. It's easier to add to the momentum than trying to start new movements.

Exactly.
This attitude of 'do everything or do nothing' makes NO sense to me.

dtr0624

its hypocris... they play in other states with similar laws and they play in countries where being anything but straight is illegal.... but they pick nc cause uncle bruce did it.. so much for standing out.. they jumped a bandwagon