Bernie Sanders for President

mrussel1

Free said:

They weren't protesters. They were delegates. Are we talking about the NV caucus?

It seems that there are multiple conversations happening. My points to you, Free, were about the NV convention this weekend, and what happened there, and afterwards.

Jason P

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

mrussel1

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

Hard to argue these odds.

PJ_Soul

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

No, I realize that you know they have the right to do it, but I'm talking about the attitude towards it (not you in particular). I.e. if a peaceful protestor gets attacked it's their fault for being there rather than the fault of the attacker, or at the very least they are not deserving of defense (akin to blaming rape victims when they wear short skirts, frankly). If peaceful protestors interrupt traffic or cause any inconvenience to anyone at any time they are the "enemy". This seems to be a very common attitude among Americans lately, and it is a dangerous trend IMO.

ckravitz

Free said:

Gern Blansten said:

PJPOWER said:

mrussel1 said:

No, I'm not being difficult. You are focused on Nevada convention rules. I don't give a shit. All of this was over 2 extra delegates for the National Convention. Have they lost their fucking minds? Does anyone think that this will change the convention outcome or the primaries that are completed?
By contrast, it made me focus on the behavior of the Sanders supporters, the anarchy, disruption to civil order, threatening of people, posting of address of Lange's grandchildren's fucking daycare. Are you fucking kidding me?

Yes, yes they have lost their fucking minds.
If someone cannot see how split the party is, then they are in total denial. I cannot count how many times I've heard Bernie supporters say "I will never vote for Hillary". My conclusion is that there are Bernie supporters and there are Democrats. They are not always one in the same as some assume. It is a little ironic how people were dissing "the opposition" about not having unity, boasting the love within the democratic and how well Clinton and Sanders were getting along and kissing each other's asses. Many Bernie supporters that I talk to hate Clinton as much as Trump...but saying that feeling is universal, but the sentiment definitely exists.

Right but as soon as Bernie tells his supporters to get behind Hillary they will.

I honestly can't see it happening anyway. The animosity between Sanders and Clinton is getting worse with every primary he wins, and the latest disaster in NV (please watch the 2 videos I posted), with the DNC accusation of Sanders supporters being violent when they're merely getting angry w/ the DNC chairwoman cheating? The media bullshit?

I doubt he supports his supporters voting for Clinton, if she's the candidate. This has become war, practically and it's not over yet.

You may be right, but I highly doubt it. I'm pretty sure Bernie, or anyone purporting to be a leader, understands that sometimes progress means not taking a step backwards. He may be at "war" with HRC at this point, but I'd bet he knows full well the importance of compromise and that the alternative is a comb-over, egomaniac, nut-job.

PJ_Soul

ckravitz said:

Free said:

Gern Blansten said:

PJPOWER said:

mrussel1 said:

No, I'm not being difficult. You are focused on Nevada convention rules. I don't give a shit. All of this was over 2 extra delegates for the National Convention. Have they lost their fucking minds? Does anyone think that this will change the convention outcome or the primaries that are completed?
By contrast, it made me focus on the behavior of the Sanders supporters, the anarchy, disruption to civil order, threatening of people, posting of address of Lange's grandchildren's fucking daycare. Are you fucking kidding me?

Yes, yes they have lost their fucking minds.
If someone cannot see how split the party is, then they are in total denial. I cannot count how many times I've heard Bernie supporters say "I will never vote for Hillary". My conclusion is that there are Bernie supporters and there are Democrats. They are not always one in the same as some assume. It is a little ironic how people were dissing "the opposition" about not having unity, boasting the love within the democratic and how well Clinton and Sanders were getting along and kissing each other's asses. Many Bernie supporters that I talk to hate Clinton as much as Trump...but saying that feeling is universal, but the sentiment definitely exists.

Right but as soon as Bernie tells his supporters to get behind Hillary they will.

I honestly can't see it happening anyway. The animosity between Sanders and Clinton is getting worse with every primary he wins, and the latest disaster in NV (please watch the 2 videos I posted), with the DNC accusation of Sanders supporters being violent when they're merely getting angry w/ the DNC chairwoman cheating? The media bullshit?

I doubt he supports his supporters voting for Clinton, if she's the candidate. This has become war, practically and it's not over yet.

You may be right, but I highly doubt it. I'm pretty sure Bernie, or anyone purporting to be a leader, understands that sometimes progress means not taking a step backwards. He may be at "war" with HRC at this point, but I'd bet he knows full well the importance of compromise and that the alternative is a comb-over, egomaniac, nut-job.

I agree.

Free

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

No, I realize that you know they have the right to do it, but I'm talking about the attitude towards it (not you in particular). I.e. if a peaceful protestor gets attacked it's their fault for being there rather than the fault of the attacker, or at the very least they are not deserving of defense (akin to blaming rape victims when they wear short skirts, frankly). If peaceful protestors interrupt traffic or cause any inconvenience to anyone at any time they are the "enemy". This seems to be a very common attitude among American lately, and it is a dangerous trend IMO.

Americans are in love with being offended about everything.

I forgot something, that goes w/ easily being offended: nothing is ever their fault either. Common 'Merican.

Bentleyspop

Free said:

Jason P said:

Free said:

Jason P said:

There are many news outlets with reports of Bernie supporters inciting violence and death threats in Nevada ... And not even against The Clown! Just do a quick google search.

The left is split. The GOP is going to rally around The Clown while the dems fight amounts each other for the next several months.

Clearly you haven't read any of my posts, certainly haven't watched the NV caucus video I posted.

Rather than post an actual SOURCE of these lies, (because as I said before, actual delegates AT the caucus have cited those lies to be the typical media making shit up again), you will just say "look at Google"?

This is the EXACT reason why the media makes it up: because gullible folks like you will believe everything they read on the Internet.

Rolling Stones:

rollingstone.com/politics/news/wtf-happened-at-the-nevada-democratic-state-convention-20160517?page=2

LA Times:

latimes.com/politics/la-na-sanders-convention-20160517-snap-story.html

CBS News:

cbsnews.com/news/security-concerns-end-nevada-democratic-convention/

As I posted, just Google it.

You just don't get it do you?

A firsthand video versus the mainstream media. Those posting on social networks with VIDEO of the caucus are first-hand accounts. There is no agenda! It's of the actual event not a news story.

You sound like Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin constantly yelling about the "mainstream media "

benjs

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

No, I realize that you know they have the right to do it, but I'm talking about the attitude towards it (not you in particular). I.e. if a peaceful protestor gets attacked it's their fault for being there rather than the fault of the attacker, or at the very least they are not deserving of defense (akin to blaming rape victims when they wear short skirts, frankly). If peaceful protestors interrupt traffic or cause any inconvenience to anyone at any time they are the "enemy". This seems to be a very common attitude among Americans lately, and it is a dangerous trend IMO.

It reminds me of George Carlin's sentiments on religion, where he says that religion only has a problem with murder if it's murdering someone who worships a different invisible man than the one you worship. It is human nature that the rules or values we see as rigid become incredibly flexible as the rules or values err on sides opposite of our own, and this is no different. It's not an American problem - it's a humanitarian epidemic. Our minds, our hunger, our greed, do not permit us to be truly idealistic. The violence always seems to be the fault of "the other side".

On the topic of violence with Sanders supporters specifically, if Sanders isn't condoning or inciting the violence, and his supporters are doing it of their own volition, I still fail to see how this reflects poorly on Sanders. If it's simply an attempt to say that Sanders supporters are barbaric and inhumane people and that these would be the citizens whose voices would be heard were Sanders elected - I would say that this is a fallacious attack, and is in stark contrast to the fact that when people talk about Trump inciting violence at his rallies (which he has, blatantly) - it's dismissed with a simple "yeah, but that's Trump" as though he's some loony with no power - and not the frontrunner for the Republican nominee.

Am I the only one who finds this all mind-boggling?

Free

Bentleyspop said:

Free said:

Jason P said:

Free said:

Jason P said:

There are many news outlets with reports of Bernie supporters inciting violence and death threats in Nevada ... And not even against The Clown! Just do a quick google search.

The left is split. The GOP is going to rally around The Clown while the dems fight amounts each other for the next several months.

Clearly you haven't read any of my posts, certainly haven't watched the NV caucus video I posted.

Rather than post an actual SOURCE of these lies, (because as I said before, actual delegates AT the caucus have cited those lies to be the typical media making shit up again), you will just say "look at Google"?

This is the EXACT reason why the media makes it up: because gullible folks like you will believe everything they read on the Internet.

Rolling Stones:

rollingstone.com/politics/news/wtf-happened-at-the-nevada-democratic-state-convention-20160517?page=2

LA Times:

latimes.com/politics/la-na-sanders-convention-20160517-snap-story.html

CBS News:

cbsnews.com/news/security-concerns-end-nevada-democratic-convention/

As I posted, just Google it.

You just don't get it do you?

A firsthand video versus the mainstream media. Those posting on social networks with VIDEO of the caucus are first-hand accounts. There is no agenda! It's of the actual event not a news story.

You sound like Rush Limbaugh and Sarah Palin constantly yelling about the "mainstream media "

Except I am at the other end of the spectrum. Hey, if you want to think they tell you factual info w/ no bias, please, continue to be naive.

mrussel1

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

Free

benjs said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

No, I realize that you know they have the right to do it, but I'm talking about the attitude towards it (not you in particular). I.e. if a peaceful protestor gets attacked it's their fault for being there rather than the fault of the attacker, or at the very least they are not deserving of defense (akin to blaming rape victims when they wear short skirts, frankly). If peaceful protestors interrupt traffic or cause any inconvenience to anyone at any time they are the "enemy". This seems to be a very common attitude among Americans lately, and it is a dangerous trend IMO.

It reminds me of George Carlin's sentiments on religion, where he says that religion only has a problem with murder if it's murdering someone who worships a different invisible man than the one you worship. It is human nature that the rules or values we see as rigid become incredibly flexible as the rules or values err on sides opposite of our own, and this is no different. It's not an American problem - it's a humanitarian epidemic. Our minds, our hunger, our greed, do not permit us to be truly idealistic. The violence always seems to be the fault of "the other side".

On the topic of violence with Sanders supporters specifically, if Sanders isn't condoning or inciting the violence, and his supporters are doing it of their own volition, I still fail to see how this reflects poorly on Sanders. If it's simply an attempt to say that Sanders supporters are barbaric and inhumane people and that these would be the citizens whose voices would be heard were Sanders elected - I would say that this is a fallacious attack, and is in stark contrast to the fact that when people talk about Trump inciting violence at his rallies (which he has, blatantly) - it's dismissed with a simple "yeah, but that's Trump" as though he's some loony with no power - and not the frontrunner for the Republican nominee.

Am I the only one who finds this all mind-boggling?

How sweet of mrussell above to quote Debbie Wasserman-Shultz, leader of the DNC who wants nothing more than Sanders to drop out and will stop at nothing - much like Clinton - including flat out lies like what she says here.

I was going to post the video (I still will - here http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/17/politics/bernie-sanders-nevada-democrats/

Free

mrussel1 said:

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

Source? Besides being from Wasserman Shultz, and the 2nd paragraph from Sanders?

mrussel1

Free said:

mrussel1 said:

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

Source? Besides being from Wasserman Shultz, and the 2nd paragraph from Sanders?

The one you attributed to me above is Benjs, not me.. And directly above is taken from Sanders statement posted on his site. Is that adequately sourced for you or biased against Sanders?

ldent42

Free said:

ldent42 said:

I read about the violence by Bernie supporters though I did not see any videos.

I don't doubt that some supporters may have gotten violent. And if they did I don't know why that would suddenly speak for the whole campaign. Bernie's had thousands of people attending his rallies and shit and this is what? the second report of some of his supporters doing something less than okay, the first report of violence? If there needs to be a reaction to it, I'd expect a reaction more along the lines of "that's not bad, considering." Even if we're talking about a dozen people in NV compared to tens or hundreds of thousands over the US - come on.

I posted a first hand account in the form of video of what happened. Thanks for being realistic.

When will the public wake up and shut off the media when there's Proof that they're not only lying but doing it to solely enforce Sanders to quit the race? What more lies will they come up with? Photos don't lie. Sanders rallies bring out thousands of people. The media can only do so much to make it sound like he's doing poorly. When he's not, considering his support.

This race is still neck to neck, and there will be a contested convention.

I know you did. I should've said I didn't "watch" any videos. Don't feel like putting the sound on (it's a process rn cuz my speakers aint working)

ldent42

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

PJ_Soul said:

Jason P said:

Yeah.^^^ And where did this happen?

People looking for trouble found trouble. I don't want to defend the clown, but the left have got to get there shit together. 4 or 5 Midwest states may decide this election, and antics of violence that the left has instigated will swing critical votes to Trump.

So when peaceful protesters get attacked it is the fault of the peaceful protesters??? Okay.

It is common sense that should be applied to multiple situations. If you go confront a large group in a disrespectful manner, be it Trump supporters, Eagles fans, Hells Angels, Pirates, etc, you are taking on a risk of getting pepper sprayed or your butt kicked.

Peaceful protest is one of the most fundamental rights of Americans (or is supposed to be). This is FAR from the first time that I have seen people say the kind of thing you are saying, and every time I am just a bit more dismayed by how Americans seem to have turned their backs on this crucial right that plays a huge role in ensuring the rights and freedoms that Americans claim to cherish. But I'm starting to think that is more just a catch phrase than something they actually value.

I'm not saying they don't have the right. I'm saying they are taking a known risk.

If someone parked a car outside of a Sanders rally with Trump stickers on it, there is a known risk that the odds that the car could be keyed or have a window smashed out are dramatically higher then if parked outside a 7/11.

No, I realize that you know they have the right to do it, but I'm talking about the attitude towards it (not you in particular). I.e. if a peaceful protestor gets attacked it's their fault for being there rather than the fault of the attacker, or at the very least they are not deserving of defense (akin to blaming rape victims when they wear short skirts, frankly). If peaceful protestors interrupt traffic or cause any inconvenience to anyone at any time they are the "enemy". This seems to be a very common attitude among Americans lately, and it is a dangerous trend IMO.

100%

If you're going to protest then you should expect to get abused.
if you are in a large group of supporters then you have the right to abuse protestors because they have it coming since they showed up.

ldent42

mrussel1 said:

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

To be fair though, He did condone is and state unequivocally that is is counter to his campaign's mission. Like right there. In the first sentence. I don't see what's wrong with him pointing out that violence was done to his campaign staff during the campaign though. Like why is not okay for him to point that out? It seems to me to be speaking to a culture of violence in politics in NV.

rgambs

mrussel1 said:

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

I don't see it as a red herring, I see it as a reminder of what violence ACTUALLY looks like, not what anti-Sanders sources want you to think it looks like.

Free

Check the Young Turks out, especially around 3:00 mark. https://www.facebook.com/TheYoungTurks/videos/10153641106459205/

mrussel1

ldent42 said:

mrussel1 said:

^^Sanders has a moral obligation to condemn any violence or harassment done on his campaign's behalf. I don't mean to imply they sanctioned it, but he needs to condone it and state unequivocally that it is counter to his principles. In his statement released on the subject, he condoned it but pivoted immediately to some incident that happened months ago, and in which there is no evidence that it was related to his campaign, him personally or that DNC was behind it. It's a total red herring. What do those incidents have to do with what happened to the Nevada official?

Our campaign of course believes in non-violent change and it goes without saying that I condemn any and all forms of violence, including the personal harassment of individuals. But, when we speak of violence, I should add here that months ago, during the Nevada campaign, shots were fired into my campaign office in Nevada and apartment housing complex my campaign staff lived in was broken into and ransacked.

To be fair though, He did condone is and state unequivocally that is is counter to his campaign's mission. Like right there. In the first sentence. I don't see what's wrong with him pointing out that violence was done to his campaign staff during the campaign though. Like why is not okay for him to point that out? It seems to me to be speaking to a culture of violence in politics in NV.

No, there should not be a sentence that says ... "BUT..." after the condemnation. There is no 'but'. There's no justification yet Sanders seems to try to justify the actions of the individuals. What if I said, "yes my brother robbed a bank and that was wrong..BUT remember that he was mugged three months ago". Does that fly? Does he think Lange shot up his campaign hq? Does he think she broke into some apartments of his staff? How does whatever happened to his campaign three months ago remotely justify the actions towards Lange?

It's a terrible condemnation. Oh and btw, the Politifact was there. For those that are interested in what happened, feel free to read their write-up. http://www.politifact.com/nevada/statements/2016/may/18/jeff-weaver/allegations-fraud-and-misconduct-nevada-democratic/