Canadian Politics Redux

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

I’m with Saskatchewan.  Standard time - all the time. I like my sunshine in the morning. 

Technically Saskatchewan is in the Mountain Time Zone (same as Alberta).  In effect they're technically on Mountain DST, but Mountain DST would be the same as Central Standard.  Not sure why they went with calling it Central Standard, but technically they're Mountain DST

Here in BC I'm hoping the DST all year round kicks in sooner rather than later.   Where my wife is from in Northeastern BC, they stay on DST all year round already.

1ThoughtKnown

I’m not “with” Saskatchewan in their time zone. I’m “with” them in having no daylight savings time for reasons previously stated. Your logic actually works both ways. If Saskatchewan is in “MDT”, then Alberta would also be in “CST”. Basically, Saskatchewan is the only province who makes sense. Good on them

HughFreakingDillon

1ThoughtKnown said:

The problem with time change is that historically it has resulted in a significant increase in workplace accidents. Particularly folks in safety sensitive positions or shift workers. 

Also it results in more car accidents on our streets. It’s a complete waste of time and should be abolished. 

also death by heart attack i believe. 

Meltdown99

I.ve read polls that show most are in favor of not adjusting the clocks.  Seems like they should.  It Will not cost the politicians anything and their citizens are happy...

erebus

It will probably happen at the same time as electoral reform and an elected senate.... never 

although marijuana was legalized, so maybe a little better chance than never 

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

I’m not “with” Saskatchewan in their time zone. I’m “with” them in having no daylight savings time for reasons previously stated. Your logic actually works both ways. If Saskatchewan is in “MDT”, then Alberta would also be in “CST”. Basically, Saskatchewan is the only province who makes sense. Good on them

I sort of get that.  When people say their against the DST, they're not actually against DST, they're against the clocks changing twice a year.  It seems to me that if we're seeing a shift to not changing the clocks anymore, it's shifting to DST all the time.

I still stick by what I said about Sask.  They call themselves in the Central Time Zone, but geographically their in the mountain time zone.   If this "trend" of going to DST all the time continues.  Sask. will be in sync with Alberta, not Manitoba. 

1ThoughtKnown

Zod said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

I’m not “with” Saskatchewan in their time zone. I’m “with” them in having no daylight savings time for reasons previously stated. Your logic actually works both ways. If Saskatchewan is in “MDT”, then Alberta would also be in “CST”. Basically, Saskatchewan is the only province who makes sense. Good on them

I sort of get that.  When people say their against the DST, they're not actually against DST, they're against the clocks changing twice a year.  It seems to me that if we're seeing a shift to not changing the clocks anymore, it's shifting to DST all the time.

I still stick by what I said about Sask.  They call themselves in the Central Time Zone, but geographically their in the mountain time zone.   If this "trend" of going to DST all the time continues.  Sask. will be in sync with Alberta, not Manitoba. 

I am against the time change AND permanent DST.   I want Standard time all the time. That is why I’m with Saskatchewan, they are CST all the time.  I want Alberta to be MST all the time. 

Now whether they are Mountain or Central based on the rest of the world, well that’s irrelevant. Should Newfoundland be a half hour later than the rest of the Maritimes... well absolutely not. But they are and so be it. Had something to do with joining confederation in 1949 if memory serves me correctly. 

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

Zod said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

I’m not “with” Saskatchewan in their time zone. I’m “with” them in having no daylight savings time for reasons previously stated. Your logic actually works both ways. If Saskatchewan is in “MDT”, then Alberta would also be in “CST”. Basically, Saskatchewan is the only province who makes sense. Good on them

I sort of get that.  When people say their against the DST, they're not actually against DST, they're against the clocks changing twice a year.  It seems to me that if we're seeing a shift to not changing the clocks anymore, it's shifting to DST all the time.

I still stick by what I said about Sask.  They call themselves in the Central Time Zone, but geographically their in the mountain time zone.   If this "trend" of going to DST all the time continues.  Sask. will be in sync with Alberta, not Manitoba. 

I am against the time change AND permanent DST.   I want Standard time all the time. That is why I’m with Saskatchewan, they are CST all the time.  I want Alberta to be MST all the time. 

Now whether they are Mountain or Central based on the rest of the world, well that’s irrelevant. Should Newfoundland be a half hour later than the rest of the Maritimes... well absolutely not. But they are and so be it. Had something to do with joining confederation in 1949 if memory serves me correctly. 

Wait so all we have to do to make you happy is do what Sask. did?  Adopt DST but name it Standard Time for the time zone to the East?  I'm in!

This is how we would replicate what Saskatchewan did and apply it to the rest of country:

1)  BC goes to Mountain Standard

2)  Alberta goes to Central Standard

3)  Sask. Stays where it is

4)  Manitoba goes to Eastern Standard

5)  Ontario goes to Atlantic Standard

6) We Invent new names for Atlantic and NFLD.   Maritimes Standard and New Newfie Standard

edit:  I'm actually serious here.   Sask. is geographically in Mountain Time Zone.   Sunrise in Regina is just before 9am in the winter.   Standard Timer's hate the concept of a 9am sunrise in the winter.  The clock is orientated for less light in the am and more light later the day.     People keep using it as an argument for Standard Time, not realizing in practice it's DST with a different name.  Maybe this is how they got to population to go with it when they implemented it.   The politicians thought it would be an easier sell if they called it standard time... lol.

1ThoughtKnown

My belief is that for optimal human health (particularly circadian rhythms) we should not be screwing with time in any way. Your points are valid, but I am not with DST in any form. 

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

My belief is that for optimal human health (particularly circadian rhythms) we should not be screwing with time in any way. Your points are valid, but I am not with DST in any form. 

You had me at first, but the second half of that sentence makes me think you're still not getting it.  

How would permanently moving to DST interrupt people's rhythm's?  The clock changes would stop; there would be no more time changes to mess up those rhythm's.

I feel there's 3 arguments:

1) DST permanently - no clock changes - more light in the evening, less light in the morning

2) Standard Time permanently - no clock changes - less light in the evening, more light in the morning

3) Standard Time/DST - we change the clocks twice a year.

Every time I'm arguing in favour of DST, and someone argues against DST, I feel like they're arguing against #3, not against #1.    The only time I feel like someone knows what they're talking about is they say:   I'm a morning person, I prefer more sunlight in the morning or I've got kids I hate dropping the kids off to school in the dark in December.

That's all it is between #1 and #2.  Personal Preference.  Neither one's going to mess with rhythm's.

I can't tell in your argument's if your only against changing the clocks, or if you actually have a preference between standard/dst when we come to choosing which one to stay on year round.

1ThoughtKnown

Zod said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

My belief is that for optimal human health (particularly circadian rhythms) we should not be screwing with time in any way. Your points are valid, but I am not with DST in any form. 

You had me at first, but the second half of that sentence makes me think you're still not getting it.  

How would permanently moving to DST interrupt people's rhythm's?  The clock changes would stop; there would be no more time changes to mess up those rhythm's.

I feel there's 3 arguments:

1) DST permanently - no clock changes - more light in the evening, less light in the morning

2) Standard Time permanently - no clock changes - less light in the evening, more light in the morning

3) Standard Time/DST - we change the clocks twice a year.

Every time I'm arguing in favour of DST, and someone argues against DST, I feel like they're arguing against #3, not against #1.    The only time I feel like someone knows what they're talking about is they say:   I'm a morning person, I prefer more sunlight in the morning or I've got kids I hate dropping the kids off to school in the dark in December.

That's all it is between #1 and #2.  Personal Preference.  Neither one's going to mess with rhythm's.

I can't tell in your argument's if your only against changing the clocks, or if you actually have a preference between standard/dst when we come to choosing which one to stay on year round.

Read. Educate yourself 
https://medium.com/@herf/why-standard-time-is-better-e586b500923

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

Zod said:

1ThoughtKnown said:

My belief is that for optimal human health (particularly circadian rhythms) we should not be screwing with time in any way. Your points are valid, but I am not with DST in any form. 

You had me at first, but the second half of that sentence makes me think you're still not getting it.  

How would permanently moving to DST interrupt people's rhythm's?  The clock changes would stop; there would be no more time changes to mess up those rhythm's.

I feel there's 3 arguments:

1) DST permanently - no clock changes - more light in the evening, less light in the morning

2) Standard Time permanently - no clock changes - less light in the evening, more light in the morning

3) Standard Time/DST - we change the clocks twice a year.

Every time I'm arguing in favour of DST, and someone argues against DST, I feel like they're arguing against #3, not against #1.    The only time I feel like someone knows what they're talking about is they say:   I'm a morning person, I prefer more sunlight in the morning or I've got kids I hate dropping the kids off to school in the dark in December.

That's all it is between #1 and #2.  Personal Preference.  Neither one's going to mess with rhythm's.

I can't tell in your argument's if your only against changing the clocks, or if you actually have a preference between standard/dst when we come to choosing which one to stay on year round.

Read. Educate yourself 
https://medium.com/@herf/why-standard-time-is-better-e586b500923

I guess we'll agree to disagree.   That article is rough and very bias.  It spends a bunch of time supporting in favor of the light/dark sleep cycle.  How people wake up to bright light, and people will feel more rested in the winter if the light wakes them up.   Then it completely omits the summer half the argument, of what happens when it gets light out an hour earlier.   Given their own argument, people are going to way up an hour earlier which is damn early in the summer.

If anything this article kind of has me leaning in the direction of Standard time is good for winter, and DST is good for summer.    Switching clocks creates a temporary bad.   Maybe the temporary bad is better then running DST in the winter, or ST in the summer.

1ThoughtKnown

Ok. Argue with the MANY scientists and studies  who are quoted in the article. Take the stance that the article is “biased”. 😂
My gawd, does everyone just have to argue for the sake of arguing. Yeesh. 

Peace. I’m out. 

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

Ok. Argue with the MANY scientists and studies  who are quoted in the article. Take the stance that the article is “biased”. 😂
My gawd, does everyone just have to argue for the sake of arguing. Yeesh. 

Peace. I’m out. 

This is what were supposed to do the in the world.  Take an argument, explore it, and argue both sides of it to try an understand the others point of view.   I'm not sure why you're getting agitated, when you were also counter arguing the argument.  It takes two to tango.

Peace out.

1ThoughtKnown

You said the article was “biased” which is a very Fox News stance. You want to argue with the scientists have atter pal. 

I’m an industrial health & safety professional who has worked with organizations who have shift workers (and I am a former shift worker myself).  
You don’t believe screwing with the clocks (in any way) leads to cancer, obesity et al, then that is your stance. I wasn’t agitated (why I had the laughing emoji there). 

I gave you access to the data. You are still holding steadfast. That is the way the world is today. So I laugh and carry on. Once again - Peace, I’m out 😎

Zod

1ThoughtKnown said:

You said the article was “biased” which is a very Fox News stance. You want to argue with the scientists have atter pal. 

I’m an industrial health & safety professional who has worked with organizations who have shift workers (and I am a former shift worker myself).  
You don’t believe screwing with the clocks (in any way) leads to cancer, obesity et al, then that is your stance. I wasn’t agitated (why I had the laughing emoji there). 

I gave you access to the data. You are still holding steadfast. That is the way the world is today. So I laugh and carry on. Once again - Peace, I’m out 😎

lol.  I thought you already peaced out.

The thing about scientists is they don't always come to the same conclusion.  You often have different scientists arguing different things.  Scientific studies can often conflict, and sometimes new scientific studies come along that invalidate old ones.  Science is extremely important, but banking on the interpretation of one group of scientists, and not leaving things open for more discovery, or argument isn't really scientific.

I found your article interesting, and the part about DST disrupting rhythms in the winter was insightful.   I didn't feel like the article was well rounded because it omitted the other half of the issue.   What's the impact of earlier sun in the summer on people's sleep cycles.  I felt that would of been more rounded.  I don't need to be convince why Standard Time might be between in the winter, I need to be convinced why it's better the summer.

Similar to your argument's, I felt like arguing with you was arguing with a brick wall.   I was trying to understand your half of the arguments, and express where mine came from.   Similar to the world of today you dismissed anything I had to say, and did the ole "my way is the only way and the right way".

I also don't believe you peaced out because you like to argue just as much as I do.  Waiting for your response in .. 4... 3... 2.... 1.....

Meltdown99

How Toronto police found the suspect in Christine Jessop’s murder through DNA

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/how-toronto-police-found-the-suspect-in-christine-jessop-e2-80-99s-murder-through-dna/ar-BB1a5Vw4

Now the Jessop family and the Morin family can have closure...

It's just too bad the corrupt cops did not DO their job right the 1st time...

The cops did not solve this, DNA did, just like DNA proved Morin was innocent...

oftenreading

Minassian enters a NCRMD plea at the opening of his trial. I'm really interested to see what mental disorder is claimed, and what the evidence of the defense and Crown experts is. Characterizing incel beliefs as psychosis rather than just odious ideas seems a stretch to me at this stage.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/alek-minassian-van-attack-trial-1.5796750

oftenreading

Meltdown99 said:

How Toronto police found the suspect in Christine Jessop’s murder through DNA

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/how-toronto-police-found-the-suspect-in-christine-jessop-e2-80-99s-murder-through-dna/ar-BB1a5Vw4

Now the Jessop family and the Morin family can have closure...

It's just too bad the corrupt cops did not DO their job right the 1st time...

The cops did not solve this, DNA did, just like DNA proved Morin was innocent...

"The cops" solved the case, with the use of DNA techniques. 

Your argument is akin to "doctors don't treat diseases, medications treat diseases", or maybe "surgeons don't remove tumours, scalpels remove tumours". 

Meltdown99

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

How Toronto police found the suspect in Christine Jessop’s murder through DNA

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/how-toronto-police-found-the-suspect-in-christine-jessop-e2-80-99s-murder-through-dna/ar-BB1a5Vw4

Now the Jessop family and the Morin family can have closure...

It's just too bad the corrupt cops did not DO their job right the 1st time...

The cops did not solve this, DNA did, just like DNA proved Morin was innocent...

"The cops" solved the case, with the use of DNA techniques. 

Your argument is akin to "doctors don't treat diseases, medications treat diseases", or maybe "surgeons don't remove tumours, scalpels remove tumours". 

The cops charged an innocent man and continued the farce until DNA cleared him...however, the evidence without DNA cleared him as well that the cops refused to acknowledge.  They found a suspect and built a faulty case around guy Paul Morin.  The 1 million he got largely covered legal expenses and I believe he is entitled to much more and should be taken from the police budget of investigating police force...I followed the case well.  He was railroaded and Paul Morin knows he was railroaded.