Obama Care and Stupid American Voters ?

Godfather.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/11/11/obamacare-architect-lack-transparency-was-key-because-stupidity-american/

OOOOOO just check it out,it wont hurt you.

Godfather.

mickeyrat

except, this bill wasnt necessarily voted on by "the stupdity of the american voter"

brianlux

and besides, lets not forget how the GOP gutted and trashed the bill in the first place. As for "stupid American voters" goes, we have scads of evidence to that effect. )

CM189191

brianlux said:

scads of evidence to that effect

"Tax cuts will stimulate the economy and pay for themselves."
"We'll be greeted as liberators."
"Oil revenues will pay for the war in Iraq."
"Tax cuts for the wealthy will create jobs."
"The wealth will trickle down."
"Obamacare penalties were always a tax even though it didn't say that in the law and we knew healthy people were going to be subsidizing the sick even though we didn't come right out and say it"

Only one of these things helped average Americans.
Lie to begin a war: Totally justified.
Lie to give healthcare to people: THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!

The ACA was publicly debated and took over 3 years to get passed.
Not like:
9/11 AUMF (3 days)
USA PATRIOT (2 weeks)
Medicare Part D (6 months)
the Iraq War vote (1 month)
Gramm-Leach-Bliley (7 months).
Yet each of these relied on urgency, lack of transparency, and yes - the stupidity of the average American voter to be passed. You can file each of these under "It's only ok when we do it!".

I have to see an ACA alternative presented by the GOP.

Stickman12

CM189191 said:

brianlux said:

scads of evidence to that effect

"Tax cuts will stimulate the economy and pay for themselves."
"We'll be greeted as liberators."
"Oil revenues will pay for the war in Iraq."
"Tax cuts for the wealthy will create jobs."
"The wealth will trickle down."
"Obamacare penalties were always a tax even though it didn't say that in the law and we knew healthy people were going to be subsidizing the sick even though we didn't come right out and say it"

Only one of these things helped average Americans.
Lie to begin a war: Totally justified.
Lie to give healthcare to people: THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!

The ACA was publicly debated and took over 3 years to get passed.
Not like:
9/11 AUMF (3 days)
USA PATRIOT (2 weeks)
Medicare Part D (6 months)
the Iraq War vote (1 month)
Gramm-Leach-Bliley (7 months).
Yet each of these relied on urgency, lack of transparency, and yes - the stupidity of the average American voter to be passed. You can file each of these under "It's only ok when we do it!".

I have to see an ACA alternative presented by the GOP.

Very nice post!!!

gimmesometruth27

ejleonjr said:

CM189191 said:

brianlux said:

scads of evidence to that effect

"Tax cuts will stimulate the economy and pay for themselves."
"We'll be greeted as liberators."
"Oil revenues will pay for the war in Iraq."
"Tax cuts for the wealthy will create jobs."
"The wealth will trickle down."
"Obamacare penalties were always a tax even though it didn't say that in the law and we knew healthy people were going to be subsidizing the sick even though we didn't come right out and say it"

Only one of these things helped average Americans.
Lie to begin a war: Totally justified.
Lie to give healthcare to people: THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!

The ACA was publicly debated and took over 3 years to get passed.
Not like:
9/11 AUMF (3 days)
USA PATRIOT (2 weeks)
Medicare Part D (6 months)
the Iraq War vote (1 month)
Gramm-Leach-Bliley (7 months).
Yet each of these relied on urgency, lack of transparency, and yes - the stupidity of the average American voter to be passed. You can file each of these under "It's only ok when we do it!".

I have to see an ACA alternative presented by the GOP.

Very nice post!!!

i agree. stated much better than i could have.

the gop alternative to obamacare is this:

repeal obamacare, let the uninsured die, and give the money saved back to the 1% in the form of tax cuts.

kce8

I know I have no right to comment this but I am really disturbed about the politics in general.

JC29856

Isn't Obama care expanded version of Mass Romney care? What's the difference?

Godfather.

health care is needed for sure but this obama care is a mess and devided between politions and the general plubic, why don't government officals want obama care for thier own familys ?

Godfather.

CM189191

It's a shame when more people care about universal access to the internet, than universal access to health care...

All Hell Breaks Loose On Ted Cruz’s FB Page As Conservatives Go On The Attack

JimmyV

CM189191 said:

brianlux said:

scads of evidence to that effect

"Tax cuts will stimulate the economy and pay for themselves."
"We'll be greeted as liberators."
"Oil revenues will pay for the war in Iraq."
"Tax cuts for the wealthy will create jobs."
"The wealth will trickle down."
"Obamacare penalties were always a tax even though it didn't say that in the law and we knew healthy people were going to be subsidizing the sick even though we didn't come right out and say it"

Only one of these things helped average Americans.
Lie to begin a war: Totally justified.
Lie to give healthcare to people: THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!!

The ACA was publicly debated and took over 3 years to get passed.
Not like:
9/11 AUMF (3 days)
USA PATRIOT (2 weeks)
Medicare Part D (6 months)
the Iraq War vote (1 month)
Gramm-Leach-Bliley (7 months).
Yet each of these relied on urgency, lack of transparency, and yes - the stupidity of the average American voter to be passed. You can file each of these under "It's only ok when we do it!".

I have to see an ACA alternative presented by the GOP.

Um...er...repeal and replace! Or something.

mikepegg44

wait, someone in politics told a half truth? someone in politics thinks the american people are stupid? color me f'n shocked. What proves the american people are as stupid as this guy thinks they are is that they think that this opinion is only that of one party or another...

CM189191 said:

It's a shame when more people care about universal access to the internet, than universal access to health care...

All Hell Breaks Loose On Ted Cruz’s FB Page As Conservatives Go On The Attack

forgive me if you aren't but it seems to me that you are confusing access to healthcare with the ability to afford health insurance. The health insurance reform bill with the misnomer Affordable Care Act does very little to curb the rise in costs (someone is still paying them), what it does is subsidize those rises for insurance companies (think subsidy for select few 1%) while capping the rise in premiums. Correct me if I am wrong someone, but I believe no emergency room can turn you away, so in fact everyone has access to healthcare.

I have seen the effects of the ACA first hand (my job) and it is not perfect, in fact it is far from perfect. It deserves review and restructure. It does not deserve to be blown up and it does not deserve to be repealed without a plan to replace. Once the cats are out of the bag you can no longer heard them.

Universal health care is the logical next step and the only way that we can truly cut the cost of healthcare in any meaningful way. It pains me to say it but we are too far down the road, when health insurance became a thing this was the way it was always going to have to point.

If I cannot choose the size and scope of the federal government, I would certainly like to choose what they do with all the money they take, and even an ill fated attempt at health care reform seems like a better investment in the future of our country than more homeland security agents, more fbi agents, more police officers, more weapons, more tanks, more bombs etc etc.

The problem as I see it is that government subsidization of products masks the true costs right up until they can no longer keep up. We see it with gas every day, if we were paying the true cost per gallon their would be far more people biking. There will be problems, I just hope that by that point we have a government that cares enough to actually solve them without placing blame so they can create plans for elections 10 years from now. The fuckers don't care, pretty much a mirror of a public they have alienated to the point where most don't care much either.

Take care of your family and your community, the rest will always be a god damn struggle.

oftenreading

mikepegg44 said:

wait, someone in politics told a half truth? someone in politics thinks the american people are stupid? color me f'n shocked. What proves the american people are as stupid as this guy thinks they are is that they think that this opinion is only that of one party or another...

CM189191 said:

It's a shame when more people care about universal access to the internet, than universal access to health care...

All Hell Breaks Loose On Ted Cruz’s FB Page As Conservatives Go On The Attack

forgive me if you aren't but it seems to me that you are confusing access to healthcare with the ability to afford health insurance. The health insurance reform bill with the misnomer Affordable Care Act does very little to curb the rise in costs (someone is still paying them), what it does is subsidize those rises for insurance companies (think subsidy for select few 1%) while capping the rise in premiums. Correct me if I am wrong someone, but I believe no emergency room can turn you away, so in fact everyone has access to healthcare.

I have seen the effects of the ACA first hand (my job) and it is not perfect, in fact it is far from perfect. It deserves review and restructure. It does not deserve to be blown up and it does not deserve to be repealed without a plan to replace. Once the cats are out of the bag you can no longer heard them.

Universal health care is the logical next step and the only way that we can truly cut the cost of healthcare in any meaningful way. It pains me to say it but we are too far down the road, when health insurance became a thing this was the way it was always going to have to point.

If I cannot choose the size and scope of the federal government, I would certainly like to choose what they do with all the money they take, and even an ill fated attempt at health care reform seems like a better investment in the future of our country than more homeland security agents, more fbi agents, more police officers, more weapons, more tanks, more bombs etc etc.

The problem as I see it is that government subsidization of products masks the true costs right up until they can no longer keep up. We see it with gas every day, if we were paying the true cost per gallon their would be far more people biking. There will be problems, I just hope that by that point we have a government that cares enough to actually solve them without placing blame so they can create plans for elections 10 years from now. The fuckers don't care, pretty much a mirror of a public they have alienated to the point where most don't care much either.

Take care of your family and your community, the rest will always be a god damn struggle.

You make some good points, mikepegg44, but emergency room care is not health care. Emergency room care deals with urgent/emergent issues; that is what they are designed to do, and that is what they do well. They do not do well with chronic conditions, or more minor conditions that still impact an individual's health and well being. ERs are great for an MI (heart attack), but not so great to help someone manage the conditions that led to the MI, like uncontrolled diabetes, hypertension, hypercholesterolemia, etc. They are great if a pregnant woman is bleeding, but not so great for routine prenatal care.

As to how the US is going to solve this? Beats me, but I also would not like to see the loss of a program, however insufficient, that is at least an improvement over no health care for millions.

i_lov_it

How can the People let this happen is even more disturbing.

Halifax2TheMax

So, is StummeyCare or North Charleston Care as bad, worse or needs work? Should their city council vote 58 times to overturn it? Just wondering.

Halifax2TheMax

Bets on who the first republican member of congress speaks out against StummeyCare?

Last-12-Exit

Halifax2TheMax said:

So, is StummeyCare or North Charleston Care as bad, worse or needs work? Should their city council vote 58 times to overturn it? Just wondering.

What does this mean?

callen

Godfather. said:

health care is needed for sure but this obama care is a mess and devided between politions and the general plubic, why don't government officals want obama care for thier own familys ?

Godfather.

Have a loved one that signed up and has insurance for first time. Payments reasonable and dr visits went great. And she's actually paying into the system

Another friends life probably saved cause he's getting care for his bladder cancer. He had blood in urine and would of just sucked it up till pain so bad too late and expensive ER visit.

Obama care gives me the option of leaving my employer and still get decent coverage even with preexisting conditions. Very liberating.

Obama care is a success.

Godfather.

callen said:

Godfather. said:

health care is needed for sure but this obama care is a mess and devided between politions and the general plubic, why don't government officals want obama care for thier own familys ?

Godfather.

Have a loved one that signed up and has insurance for first time. Payments reasonable and dr visits went great. And she's actually paying into the system

Another friends life probably saved cause he's getting care for his bladder cancer. He had blood in urine and would of just sucked it up till pain so bad too late and expensive ER visit.

Obama care gives me the option of leaving my employer and still get decent coverage even with preexisting conditions. Very liberating.

Obama care is a success.

awesome news ! I really would like to see it work for those that need it.

Godfather.

hedonist

It seems to have really benefited my sister's family. She was finally able to get much-needed cataract surgery, so for that, I'm grateful.

WhatYouTaughtMe

I lost my work benefits when I made the decision to go back to school and work less. The cost of my work sponsored plan had gone way up after the ACA which is a drawback. However, I have been able to get a more affordable plan through the market place. My brother is a diabetic in college and the ACA has eliminated hundreds of dollars a month in medical costs for him. It seems I've heard a number of good and bad things. Hopefully they can keep fine tuning it until it helps more people than it hurts.

Last-12-Exit

ACA caused us to switch prescription drug carriers and has made it much more difficult to get even the basic of procedures done because of some pharmacist thinking he can make more educated decisions over my doctor. Remember when health care was based on what was best for the patient? I do, it was before this law.

WhatYouTaughtMe

Last-12-Exit said:

ACA caused us to switch prescription drug carriers and has made it much more difficult to get even the basic of procedures done because of some pharmacist thinking he can make more educated decisions over my doctor. Remember when health care was based on what was best for the patient? I do, it was before this law.

I'd disagree that health care was that much better before the ACA. It was still a business with doctors pushing medicine on behalf of the pharmaceutical companies. I'm not saying it's better now, just that it has been broken for a long time. In your specific case that sucks.

rr165892

Godfather. said:

callen said:

Godfather. said:

health care is needed for sure but this obama care is a mess and devided between politions and the general plubic, why don't government officals want obama care for thier own familys ?

Godfather.

Have a loved one that signed up and has insurance for first time. Payments reasonable and dr visits went great. And she's actually paying into the system

Another friends life probably saved cause he's getting care for his bladder cancer. He had blood in urine and would of just sucked it up till pain so bad too late and expensive ER visit.

Obama care gives me the option of leaving my employer and still get decent coverage even with preexisting conditions. Very liberating.

Obama care is a success.

awesome news ! I really would like to see it work for those that need it.

Godfather.

I second that.It has some flaws but hearing some real stories of people who have been really helped makes it seem like most parts could be worked with.

rgambs

Last-12-Exit said:

ACA caused us to switch prescription drug carriers and has made it much more difficult to get even the basic of procedures done because of some pharmacist thinking he can make more educated decisions over my doctor. Remember when health care was based on what was best for the patient? I do, it was before this law.

Was healthcare based on what was best for the patient back when pregnancy, cancer, diabetes, glaucoma, you name it, were considered preexisting conditions and didn't have to be covered at all?

Halifax2TheMax

Last-12-Exit said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

So, is StummeyCare or North Charleston Care as bad, worse or needs work? Should their city council vote 58 times to overturn it? Just wondering.

What does this mean?

I find it ironic or perhaps the height of hypocrisy that the mayor of North Charleston and the city council of a city in a heavily republican state decided to continue the health insurance coverage of their fired police officer, after he shot an unarmed black motorist in the back five times for fleeing because of a tail light being out, because his wife is 8 months pregnant. Where's the republican outrage?

Halifax2TheMax

callen said:

Godfather. said:

health care is needed for sure but this obama care is a mess and devided between politions and the general plubic, why don't government officals want obama care for thier own familys ?

Godfather.

Have a loved one that signed up and has insurance for first time. Payments reasonable and dr visits went great. And she's actually paying into the system

Another friends life probably saved cause he's getting care for his bladder cancer. He had blood in urine and would of just sucked it up till pain so bad too late and expensive ER visit.

Obama care gives me the option of leaving my employer and still get decent coverage even with preexisting conditions. Very liberating.

Obama care is a success.

I had a friend that I knew from when I was six months old. He woke up one morning in May pissing blood. Didn't have health insurance so he didn't go to the doctor as he was going through a divorce at the time and the soon to be ex was really sticking it to him with a restraining order, accusations of violating said restraining order, all the while living in his apartment in a three family house. By the time he saw a doctor in August of that same year, his bladder cancer was too aggressive to be treated. On July 16th of this year, it'll be ten years since he passed. I can only think what might be had the Clinton's health plan act or some version of it had been passed in 1993-1994. I'm sure others may do so as well.

PJfanwillneverleave1

Man
Americans sure do like eating their young when it comes to healthcare.

Up here, sure we pay taxes up our wazoo but when it comes to receiving care of health the collective mindset is to help first and do not ever worry about financial status.
Sure our system has flaws because like anything that involves money status levels occur.
It is a benefit to us all up here to never have to weigh the option of going to the hospital/er/doctor whenever we want or paying bills.

Last-12-Exit

Halifax2TheMax said:

Last-12-Exit said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

So, is StummeyCare or North Charleston Care as bad, worse or needs work? Should their city council vote 58 times to overturn it? Just wondering.

What does this mean?

I find it ironic or perhaps the height of hypocrisy that the mayor of North Charleston and the city council of a city in a heavily republican state decided to continue the health insurance coverage of their fired police officer, after he shot an unarmed black motorist in the back five times for fleeing because of a tail light being out, because his wife is 8 months pregnant. Where's the republican outrage?

I would hope people wouldn't be angry about this. It certainly isn't the wife's fault. I haven't heard any of my republican co-worker complaining about this.

Halifax2TheMax

I'm not angry about it, for the record. Just wondering where the republican outrage is.

callen

WhatYouTaughtMe said:

I lost my work benefits when I made the decision to go back to school and work less. The cost of my work sponsored plan had gone way up after the ACA which is a drawback. However, I have been able to get a more affordable plan through the market place. My brother is a diabetic in college and the ACA has eliminated hundreds of dollars a month in medical costs for him. It seems I've heard a number of good and bad things. Hopefully they can keep fine tuning it until it helps more people than it hurts.

That's it. It needs refinement and happy for all to put in their input.

And RR's frustration of him having to pay for his employees healthcare taking real PJ concert traveling money out if his pocket just reinforces thought that we should break tie between healthcare and employers.