Fad feeding

whispering hands

rgambs said:

Another one annoys me to hell and back is the raw diet. It boldly flies in the face of basic science, nutrition, and history with the arrogant, flippant air of a creationist or climate change denier.

Lmao! Yes, it really does! Like I said before.. There's a reason those people didn't live very long..

hedonist

rgambs said:

Food is fuel, food is medicine, and food is pleasure. Life is too short to cut out sugar, grains, or meat 100%!

I can't speak to the other things since I'm not familiar with their workings, but I'm wholeheartedly with you on this (especially as to the pleasure side).

Idris

hedonist said:

Idris said:

hedonist said:

Idris said:

'milk really isn't necessary for adults'...How many things do adults do that are not necessary?

A whole lot

I love milk, mainly have it with cereal a few times a week, and have noticed a huge difference in buying organic milk, which I've done for the last three months. The regular stuff periodically made me sick and seemed to sour quickly.

I've been drinking Organic milk (here in the states) for about a decade, now while I was living in South Africa, we had a milk man drop fresh milk off right to our front door, in glass milk jars! It tasted soooo good.

I really want to get unpasteurized milk here. :>

There's nothing like ice-cold milk from a glass jar (especially drinking straight from it)! Sounds like the milk carts from the 30s & 40s here. Our old house had a little cutout next to the driveway where you could set various arrows to the quantities of milk, butter, eggs needed, and the dude would show up and leave the order on the side-door steps.

Talk about fresh (and nostalgic).

I watched a news story a few years ago about a local group that sold unpasteurized milk (along with produce from area farmers) that was being shut down, despite the community wanting and supporting it. I hadn't realized there was such controversy around it.

npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2011/10/13/141249172/a-legal-loophole-for-raw-milk-lovers-call-it-pet-food

whispering hands

Idris said:

hedonist said:

Idris said:

hedonist said:

Idris said:

'milk really isn't necessary for adults'...How many things do adults do that are not necessary?

A whole lot

I love milk, mainly have it with cereal a few times a week, and have noticed a huge difference in buying organic milk, which I've done for the last three months. The regular stuff periodically made me sick and seemed to sour quickly.

I've been drinking Organic milk (here in the states) for about a decade, now while I was living in South Africa, we had a milk man drop fresh milk off right to our front door, in glass milk jars! It tasted soooo good.

I really want to get unpasteurized milk here. :>

There's nothing like ice-cold milk from a glass jar (especially drinking straight from it)! Sounds like the milk carts from the 30s & 40s here. Our old house had a little cutout next to the driveway where you could set various arrows to the quantities of milk, butter, eggs needed, and the dude would show up and leave the order on the side-door steps.

Talk about fresh (and nostalgic).

I watched a news story a few years ago about a local group that sold unpasteurized milk (along with produce from area farmers) that was being shut down, despite the community wanting and supporting it. I hadn't realized there was such controversy around it.

npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2011/10/13/141249172/a-legal-loophole-for-raw-milk-lovers-call-it-pet-food

Smart!!

oftenreading

rgambs said:

I 100% agree with the idea behind this post. One thing that really bothers me about diets, particularly fad diets, is they focus only on what and how much you eat and ignore the other half of the equation: how active you are. At the highest levels of activity you can eat all the nasty food you desire and your body will burn it right up.
Does it make sense to limit your intake of sugars, meats, and grains? OF COURSE IT DOES! Does it make sense to cut one out entirely? HELL NO! Nearly all foods have aspects that are harmful or negative for the body, which is exactly why you should eat a smart variety. This no grains ever business is just nuts. It isn't sustainable, it sounds like torture and it flat out ignores the health risks of increased meat consumption.
Food is fuel, food is medicine, and food is pleasure. Life is too short to cut out sugar, grains, or meat 100%!

Your body may indeed burn a lot of nasty stuff up in terms of calories, but that doesn't mean it isn't having an effect on your body. Caloric intake isn't the only important factor for nutrition.

The rest of your post I agree with.

rgambs

oftenreading said:

rgambs said:

I 100% agree with the idea behind this post. One thing that really bothers me about diets, particularly fad diets, is they focus only on what and how much you eat and ignore the other half of the equation: how active you are. At the highest levels of activity you can eat all the nasty food you desire and your body will burn it right up.
Does it make sense to limit your intake of sugars, meats, and grains? OF COURSE IT DOES! Does it make sense to cut one out entirely? HELL NO! Nearly all foods have aspects that are harmful or negative for the body, which is exactly why you should eat a smart variety. This no grains ever business is just nuts. It isn't sustainable, it sounds like torture and it flat out ignores the health risks of increased meat consumption.
Food is fuel, food is medicine, and food is pleasure. Life is too short to cut out sugar, grains, or meat 100%!

Your body may indeed burn a lot of nasty stuff up in terms of calories, but that doesn't mean it isn't having an effect on your body. Caloric intake isn't the only important factor for nutrition.

The rest of your post I agree with.

True, there are other factors, but it is my opinion they are all secondary to how much you burn. Our food industry stripped our foods of nutrition, and then added vitamins and minerals to regain what was lost. Pretty stupid, but nutritionally viable. Thru-hikers eat upwards of 4,000 calories a day, typically drinking a ton of soda, eating whole pizzas, multiple burgers, bags of chips, and insane amounts of Hostess products and ice cream. A quart of ice cream in a sitting is not unheard of, and they accrue all the nutrition they need for extreme exertion, without adding plaque to their arteries, suffering poor cholesterol, or blood pressure issues. Indeed, it is those who try to eat "healthy" by going organic and avoiding processed foods that often suffer nutritional deficiencies, as they simple have a difficult time consuming enough calories.

whispering hands

The way to avoid that deficiency, is to mix up your diet to allow for " treats". As for processed foods, there are so so many nasty chemical preservatives that are not needed, but yes, make your own Ice Cream.. Far better natural salt and fat in there than store bought. Though ore convenient than home made, is actually not as delicious or beneficial. I personally can't eat that sort of thing, at least not much,because I'm Diabetic. But I do try to add natural sugars, fats and complex carbs over simple carbs because of the sugar factor. But yes, you're right about back stocking calories to burn when you know you need extra steam. But you can make up for the deficiencies without adding the crap that is processed. I very very rarely eat out, or ore cooked foods, but I also research what I eat as I make menus for the week. In doing that, I am
Able to balance my ratios of vitamins, fats, carbs, sugars, proteins, fibers, and by the end of that menu set, I can know I have a balanced diet in that week. Then again, I don't eat foods from the store. I shop at Farmer's Markets, make my own breads, and hunt for my meats. I also stay as active as I can, and I still have some excess weight, go figure!ol

rgambs

I was speaking specifically of thru-hikers, who burn 3 to 4 thousand calories a day for months on end. They can almost literally eat whatever they want without detriment.

whispering hands

rgambs said:

I was speaking specifically of thru-hikers, who burn 3 to 4 thousand calories a day for months on end. They can almost literally eat whatever they want without detriment.

Definitely!! I misunderstood. :-)

riotgrl

You absolutely have to know your own body and what works best for you. Any diet that restricts ANY macronutrients is probably not best for us. I do best with few grains and more protein and healthy fats. It's a matter of experimenting to find what works best. Most people are unable to understand the signals that their body sends out in response to food intake. Enjoy the foods that feed your soul!

brianlux

rgambs said:

Another one annoys me to hell and back is the raw diet. It boldly flies in the face of basic science, nutrition, and history with the arrogant, flippant air of a creationist or climate change denier.

Man, that shit really bugs you, rgambs! Flying in the face of etc. I get but the metaphor leaves me scratching my head. Raw foodists as creationists or climate change deniers? Huh?

As a fad diet, I agree, it's pretty much that- a fad diet. But used as a temporary detoxification or cleansing diet, it has great health improving potential. It saved my ass at least once, I will definitely tell you that right now- seriously. Also, more people eating local raw fruits, nuts, seeds and vegetables at least some of the time, is better for your landbase... and that is some basic science for you right there.

I'd pretty much think both self-promotion/putting on airs about ones diet AND disparaging or criticizing what other people chose to eat is kind of pointless. Trading ideas and doing what works for yourself makes more sense to me.

Sorry man, don't mean to bum your rant. I have plenty of those myself.

rgambs

brianlux said:

rgambs said:

Another one annoys me to hell and back is the raw diet. It boldly flies in the face of basic science, nutrition, and history with the arrogant, flippant air of a creationist or climate change denier.

Man, that shit really bugs you, rgambs! Flying in the face of etc. I get but the metaphor leaves me scratching my head. Raw foodists as creationists or climate change deniers? Huh?

As a fad diet, I agree, it's pretty much that- a fad diet. But used as a temporary detoxification or cleansing diet, it has great health improving potential. It saved my ass at least once, I will definitely tell you that right now- seriously. Also, more people eating local raw fruits, nuts, seeds and vegetables at least some of the time, is better for your landbase... and that is some basic science for you right there.

I'd pretty much think both self-promotion/putting on airs about ones diet AND disparaging or criticizing what other people chose to eat is kind of pointless. Trading ideas and doing what works for yourself makes more sense to me.

Sorry man, don't mean to bum your rant. I have plenty of those myself.

As part of a larger diet strategy it makes total sense. I'm sour on it in terms of using it like paleo, and devoting your entire diet to it. The premise is that when you cook foods you lose the nutrients, and while there are some cases where nutrients are lost, in the majority of cases heat breaks food down into more digestible matter, from which more nutrients are extracted. Ungulates and primates like gorillas have to consume massive amounts of vegetation, getting much less bang for the buck. Not all foods need cooked, not all foods even make sense to be cooked, but going raw as a lifestyle just isn't based on sound science.

whispering hands

I love that there is some good solid debate going here. I have always been Leary of fad functions.. Because humans are just so similar to sheep.. One strays away, next thing you know, the entire flock is gone.. It is sooo true too.. In both species, all it takes is one motivator.. So when I was diagnosed with Diabetes, and had to start seeing a nutritionist.. I learned a lot about how food is used to fuel the body. And just like with all things in life, it is a forever changing and open science. ( meaning we are always discovering or learning something new in that field). We discussed that Paleo diet as her prime example of rational being taken to the extreme of pure idiocy. ( her words not mine). She explained that to a degree, or margined in your diet, the the principles if the diet were very well founded, but then there are these idiots trying to LIVE on those bases. She explained that it is an excellent feeler experiment for gluten intolerances as well as for lactose intolerances, and as a body reset tool in general, but that our bodies were never designed to sustain life on that diet alone. She also explained that proportioning and abstract value play HUGE roles in how our bodies work with foods.. I'm still learning all this, but I find it interesting, disgusting, and sad all at the same time, that humans are willing to destroy themselves and call it healthy, because it provided a quick and easy result. A simple quick solution is not always the answer. Maintaining health is a daily struggle, it requires discipline, action, restraint, and common sense.. It also requires intelligence.. You HAVE to be able to look into things with an honest and open approach, and weigh factors. It is regimen, exercise, proportioning, balance, and integrity to plan. Not always easy to stick with, but ( and I love this hence borrowing it), if you just eat right, and get out and do one vigorous activity for 30 minutes every day, you don't need to diet. I LOVE that! Anyhow. I love reading everyone's insights here. Carry on..

Thirty Bills Unpaid

People almost look at 'diets' as the cure for what ails them.

What ails most of them is- as RG pointed out- laziness and lack of discipline. Get off the couch and commit to daily exercise instead of looking for a pill from the health store, fad diet, or in some cases... surgery to trim yourself up. Get blood flowing through those arteries and force those muscles to adapt (grow) to more rigorous demands than clicking the remote control or iPod.

Put a bag of chips in front of me and they are in trouble. Red wine at night is nice. To counter my 'poisons'... I work out every day (with the exception of the odd day where I don't). Do I love working out? No. Do I have to work out? Yes. It's necessary. Period.

We weren't designed to do nothing. We were designed to walk long distances (aerobic systems) and kill woolly mammoths (anaerobic systems). Our instincts drive us to want to eat everything and a lot of it because when we were cave people... food wasn't sitting in the fridge waiting for us (so when we came across it... we chowed down on it).

The 'fix' is coming to terms with these truths- not metabolism booster supplements and well-marketed diets.

riotgrl

I will say that I believe science has marginalized the effect of pesticides, and a whole host of other chemicals, upon humans. The bio-accumulation of pesticides has contributed to the rise of diseases and disorders over the course of the past 100 years. And it seems that science hasn't fully explored the relationship between human health and pesticides or GMO's. I think that is why so many people try a variety of diets (fad or whatever you want to call it) trying to isolate the underlying food that is creating or contributing to a wide verity of conditions. I am not totally grain free but I know that I feel much better when I restrict the amount of grains I consume which goes against current USDA nutritional guidelines.

whispering hands

riotgrl said:

I will say that I believe science has marginalized the effect of pesticides, and a whole host of other chemicals, upon humans. The bio-accumulation of pesticides has contributed to the rise of diseases and disorders over the course of the past 100 years. And it seems that science hasn't fully explored the relationship between human health and pesticides or GMO's. I think that is why so many people try a variety of diets (fad or whatever you want to call it) trying to isolate the underlying food that is creating or contributing to a wide verity of conditions. I am not totally grain free but I know that I feel much better when I restrict the amount of grains I consume which goes against current USDA nutritional guidelines.

That is a very good point! Don't even get me started on GMOs or meat cloning! Lol but yeah no one takes that there are chemicals abounding in foods now, that we created with purpose, but never took into account the end game they played. Very good point indeed.

whispering hands

I love your analogy there TBU! That's very true.. It's kind of like having a wolf as a pet, feeding it dog food, and walking it around the block and calling it good. Then you sit and scratch hour head as to why it shreds your carpets, snaps at you, and shuts on your feet. ( and yes they do do that when they are distressed). It's not a dog! It was never designed or bred or created to live in closed quarters! In a box! They were designed to hunt, did you know a wolf can cover 22 miles if territory a day, on a hunt?? We are very much the same, in that we were designed to be active.. Moving, working.. Personally if I could, and I'm working on this, I'd go live off grid. Society has gotten ultra ridiculous, and I almost can't stand to be in the midst. It is mind boggling! But back on point.. TBU has an excellent point. We seem to always neglect the second most important factor; exercise.

rgambs

It is my opinion that exercise is the first most important factor, food a close second.

brianlux

rgambs said:

It is my opinion that exercise is the first most important factor, food a close second.

Like they say, rgambs, "movement is life". So true!

oftenreading

And now available, one of the very faddest things around - Soylent. I had not heard of this until this morning, having apparently missed extensive media hype this summer. This is marketed not as a food supplement, but as a nutritionally complete meal replacement - forever, not just for the short term. Two litres of liquid a day, with the goal of removing all that inefficient time you spend shopping, preparing and, yes, eating your food. I've attached a link to an article by someone who spent a month eating only Soylent (mostly), but a quick google search will take you to their website. It will blow your mind that they think is is a good thing. Unless they are secretly joking, and marveling that people will actually pay for this stuff.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/7/17/5893221/soylent-survivor-one-month-living-on-lab-made-liquid-nourishment