Pulled deltoid muscle

backseatLover12
backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
edited September 2013 in All Encompassing Trip
I go to the gym regularly and have never really pulled a muscle or had muscle injuries (have had plenty bone injuries though). I have some sort of deltoid (anterior shoulder muscle) injury or may have just pulled it a few weeks ago. The pain isn't getting better. Anyone have any ideas of how to treat it without finding a sports rehab person?

Thanks! :)
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • hervert
    hervert Posts: 77
    treat it pretty conservative for 3-7 days with ice and avoiding ANY activities that aggrivate it. then as it seems to turn the corner in terms of pain and soreness you could try heating it before any activity and still ice after any activity. mix in a little range of motion, moving the shoulder in all the directions that it moves up to the point of pain and then back 20 times each direction, 2-3x per day. then if performing a weightlifting routine start back slowly (lower weights, less frequency etc...) to shoulder exercises or any overhead lifts especially.
    if you are not improving over the course of the next couple of weeks then maybe you have a more serious problem like torn cartilage or ligament (separated shoulder a.k.a. ac joint sprain) and that would require further medical treatment and physical therapy as those will not heal on their own very well. good luck

    H
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  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    hervert wrote:
    treat it pretty conservative for 3-7 days with ice and avoiding ANY activities that aggrivate it. then as it seems to turn the corner in terms of pain and soreness you could try heating it before any activity and still ice after any activity. mix in a little range of motion, moving the shoulder in all the directions that it moves up to the point of pain and then back 20 times each direction, 2-3x per day. then if performing a weightlifting routine start back slowly (lower weights, less frequency etc...) to shoulder exercises or any overhead lifts especially.
    if you are not improving over the course of the next couple of weeks then maybe you have a more serious problem like torn cartilage or ligament (separated shoulder a.k.a. ac joint sprain) and that would require further medical treatment and physical therapy as those will not heal on their own very well. good luck

    H

    It's been a couple weeks, is it too late to ice it? I have been aggrevating it, not realizing the damage done, and thought I could massage the knot out (it's not a knot, I found out). Thanks for your help!
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    are you sure it is the deltoid?

    i work in an orthopedic/sports medicine office and i can not remember a single time in the last 6 years when we have made that diagnosis.

    most likely it is a rotator cuff syndrome/subacromial bursitis or impingement syndrome. those refer pain to anterior and lateral upper arm. if it is truely anterior, it could also be the biceps tendon. these issues can be stubborn, so i would see a sports medicine physician. you could have an underlying biomechanical issue that could have contributed to your current issue.

    if you plan to hold off you can treat conservatively with rest, ice, and anti inflammatory meds. we always recommend aleve, 2 tabs twice a day for 7-10 days then as needed after that. if you can tolerate nsaids, that is.

    seriously though, if it were me, i would see a doctor. they can give you all of your treatment options, plus they have the benefit of imaging.

    good luck :)
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    edited September 2013
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    are you sure it is the deltoid?

    i work in an orthopedic/sports medicine office and i can not remember a single time in the last 6 years when we have made that diagnosis.

    most likely it is a rotator cuff syndrome/subacromial bursitis or impingement syndrome. those refer pain to anterior and lateral upper arm. if it is truely anterior, it could also be the biceps tendon. these issues can be stubborn, so i would see a sports medicine physician. you could have an underlying biomechanical issue that could have contributed to your current issue.

    if you plan to hold off you can treat conservatively with rest, ice, and anti inflammatory meds. we always recommend aleve, 2 tabs twice a day for 7-10 days then as needed after that. if you can tolerate nsaids, that is.

    seriously though, if it were me, i would see a doctor. they can give you all of your treatment options, plus they have the benefit of imaging.

    good luck :)

    It must be my rotator cuff then, I did it in the gym lifting weights, and it feels like the muscle, not anterior but lateral, so I assumed it was the deltoid. And I assume that it's a strain and with rest and ice/heat after aggravating it to the point of more pain would be sufficient. At least I hope. Thanks Gimme. I see the doc for other reasons tomorrow, so I'll bring it up.
    Post edited by backseatLover12 on
  • Vitalogensia
    Vitalogensia Posts: 2,209
    I am actually having the exact same symptoms. I haven't been to a doctor in about twelve years, so I'm not inclined to go that route. Thanks for the advice!
  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    SK359828 wrote:
    I am actually having the exact same symptoms. I haven't been to a doctor in about twelve years, so I'm not inclined to go that route. Thanks for the advice!

    Did you get it from lifting weights?
  • Vitalogensia
    Vitalogensia Posts: 2,209
    No, playing softball. I caught the ball twice where it pulled my left arm back over my head, then I did it again the next week. Maybe it's not the same thing as you, but whenever I rotate my arm to the left or lift it above my head, it hurts. It has gotten better over the weeks, but still sore, sometimes when I push with that arm, too.
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    backseatLover12 wrote:
    It must be my rotator cuff then, I did it in the gym lifting weights, and it feels like the muscle, not anterior but lateral, so I assumed it was the deltoid. And I assume that it's a strain and with rest and ice/heat after aggravating it to the point of more pain would be sufficient. At least I hope. Thanks Gimme. I see the doc for other reasons tomorrow, so I'll bring it up.
    are you male or female?

    men can get odd conditions like distal clavicular exostosis, or AC joint arthritis. these are much more difficult to treat because they involve a joint, but they refer to the lateral upper arm and deltoid region as well..

    if you can feel a palpable mass, it is most likely musculotendinous in nature, which would lead me to believe rotator cuff involvement or bicipital tendon involvement.

    i would not see a general practitioner for an orthopedic problem. most of them do not know how to work it up. they go straight to an mri when most times an x ray series with the appropriate views is much more helpful. worse yet, if they do the wrong workup they end up treating it incorrectly like going for a cortisone injection right off the bat. those people are great with internal med stuff, but leave the orthopedics to the orthopedic or sports medicine specialists.

    if you see your md and it is determined to be a muscle strain or tendinopathy, i would HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend physical therapy that utilizes either the ASTYM technique or the Graston technique. these are very, very effective modalities used in the treatment of soft tissue injuries. we have had a LOT of success with both methods. we order PT with Astym or Graston probably 80% of the time. our doctors swear by both of them.

    more info on ASTYM- http://www.astym.com/Main

    more info on Graston- http://www.grastontechnique.com/
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    SK359828 wrote:
    No, playing softball. I caught the ball twice where it pulled my left arm back over my head, then I did it again the next week. Maybe it's not the same thing as you, but whenever I rotate my arm to the left or lift it above my head, it hurts. It has gotten better over the weeks, but still sore, sometimes when I push with that arm, too.
    sounds like rotator cuff to me. in the left shoulder, the supraspinatus and infraspinatus rotate the arm to the left, and the teres minor and the subscapularis rotate it back to the right. it is opposite for the right shoulder. these are the 4 rotator cuff muscles. the supraspinatus and infraspinatus also decelerate the shoulder when following through after throwing a football or baseball. these muscles tend to break down. strain, or weaken, and that is why so many throwers have rotator cuff issues.

    the deltoid is the prime mover of the shoulder when raising it forward, backward, laterally, etc. the secondary muscles like the bicep and the rotator cuff assist the deltoid with raising the arm. most times if you have pain raising the arm higher than shoulder level, it will pinch the rotator cuff and create pain. it is called impingement.

    you need to see someone to evaluate it, and if appropriate, start you on a home rehab program.

    there are always other factors involved like shoulder instability or something, but physical examination is the only way to determine that. shoulder instability makes the rotator cuff muscles work overtime to keep the ball and socket together so over time those muscles strain or weaken.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Vitalogensia
    Vitalogensia Posts: 2,209
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    SK359828 wrote:
    No, playing softball. I caught the ball twice where it pulled my left arm back over my head, then I did it again the next week. Maybe it's not the same thing as you, but whenever I rotate my arm to the left or lift it above my head, it hurts. It has gotten better over the weeks, but still sore, sometimes when I push with that arm, too.
    sounds like rotator cuff to me. in the left shoulder, the supraspinatus and infraspinatus rotate the arm to the left, and the teres minor and the subscapularis rotate it back to the right. it is opposite for the right shoulder. these are the 4 rotator cuff muscles. the supraspinatus and infraspinatus also decelerate the shoulder when following through after throwing a football or baseball. these muscles tend to break down. strain, or weaken, and that is why so many throwers have rotator cuff issues.

    the deltoid is the prime mover of the shoulder when raising it forward, backward, laterally, etc. the secondary muscles like the bicep and the rotator cuff assist the deltoid with raising the arm. most times if you have pain raising the arm higher than shoulder level, it will pinch the rotator cuff and create pain. it is called impingement.

    you need to see someone to evaluate it, and if appropriate, start you on a home rehab program.

    there are always other factors involved like shoulder instability or something, but physical examination is the only way to determine that. shoulder instability makes the rotator cuff muscles work overtime to keep the ball and socket together so over time those muscles strain or weaken.

    Wow, thanks man! I really appreciate your insight and the time you put into the description.
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    SK359828 wrote:
    Wow, thanks man! I really appreciate your insight and the time you put into the description.
    no problem.

    i try to help out when i can, and anatomy, kinesiology, biomechanics, and orthopedics are my passion. i talk about this stuff all day every day, so it is no problem to try to offer advice when i can.

    good luck, and hope i was able to shed some light on some things.. :)
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • backseatLover12
    backseatLover12 Posts: 2,312
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    backseatLover12 wrote:
    It must be my rotator cuff then, I did it in the gym lifting weights, and it feels like the muscle, not anterior but lateral, so I assumed it was the deltoid. And I assume that it's a strain and with rest and ice/heat after aggravating it to the point of more pain would be sufficient. At least I hope. Thanks Gimme. I see the doc for other reasons tomorrow, so I'll bring it up.
    are you male or female?

    men can get odd conditions like distal clavicular exostosis, or AC joint arthritis. these are much more difficult to treat because they involve a joint, but they refer to the lateral upper arm and deltoid region as well..

    if you can feel a palpable mass, it is most likely musculotendinous in nature, which would lead me to believe rotator cuff involvement or bicipital tendon involvement.

    i would not see a general practitioner for an orthopedic problem. most of them do not know how to work it up. they go straight to an mri when most times an x ray series with the appropriate views is much more helpful. worse yet, if they do the wrong workup they end up treating it incorrectly like going for a cortisone injection right off the bat. those people are great with internal med stuff, but leave the orthopedics to the orthopedic or sports medicine specialists.

    if you see your md and it is determined to be a muscle strain or tendinopathy, i would HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend physical therapy that utilizes either the ASTYM technique or the Graston technique. these are very, very effective modalities used in the treatment of soft tissue injuries. we have had a LOT of success with both methods. we order PT with Astym or Graston probably 80% of the time. our doctors swear by both of them.

    more info on ASTYM- http://www.astym.com/Main

    more info on Graston- http://www.grastontechnique.com/

    That's a lot of info, thanks! And you're right, it is my rotator cuff. Going to lay low for a few days to see if it improves. Going to see if heat will help.
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    backseatLover12 wrote:
    That's a lot of info, thanks! And you're right, it is my rotator cuff. Going to lay low for a few days to see if it improves. Going to see if heat will help.
    no problem.

    if it does not improve, look into PT with ASTYM or Graston.

    Good Luck!
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    did it snap or pop loudly when this happened?

    i was standing next to my dad when we were erecting a clubhouse for a family friend's kids. snap/pop went the ol' man's rotator cuff. it was one heck of a noise & not at all nice. from what i understand they require surgery, maybe not all but.....
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    chadwick wrote:
    did it snap or pop loudly when this happened?

    i was standing next to my dad when we were erecting a clubhouse for a family friend's kids. snap/pop went the ol' man's rotator cuff. it was one heck of a noise & not at all nice. from what i understand they require surgery, maybe not all but.....
    most complete rotator cuff tears require surgery if you want to have full function of your arm. especially if you are a young, active person.

    partial tears usually do not require surgery, but they are much easier fixes surgically than the full thickness tears. these can normally be successfully rehabbed with physical therapy and antiinflammatory meds.

    a full thickness tear will cause retraction if it is not repaired. retraction is where the half of the muscle furthest from the humeral head actually shortens and withers away and becomes irreparable. some elderly, less active people can function just fine with a complete rotator cuff tear because they do not use their arm as much. if you are a young and active person, you want to fix it so you do not end up with a post-traumatic frozen shoulder or something. those are really bad.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    wow, well done, gst

    so what about actually hearing the rotater cuff explode or whatever it does? that was some sound & dad was not to pleased as his arm went dead like but above his head...
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    chadwick wrote:
    wow, well done, gst

    so what about actually hearing the rotater cuff explode or whatever it does? that was some sound & dad was not to pleased as his arm went dead like but above his head...
    it is not uncommon to hear things rupture. it is like pulling a rubber band until it breaks. there is a snap there.

    everything pops when it tears, some people just feel it, sometimes people hear it too.

    i was standing on a sideline at a college football game in 1996 or so when a guy fractured his femur right in front of me. now that is a sound i will never, ever forget. both the snap, and the screams that followed it...
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • ldent42
    ldent42 NYC Posts: 7,859
    whoa gst ftw! Never thought of using the PJ board for help with my orthopedic problems. Awesome.
    Unfortunately I don't possess the OP's knowledge of anatomy to ask treatment advice, but maybe you have some insight into my injury? I fucked up my ankle a couple years ago and saw an awesome orthopedist who said there was a tear in the tendon. He squeezed some part of my food under the ankle bone towards the heel and I SCREAMED in pain. It was fun. Anyway I was supposed to get surgery to sow that shit back up but then the week before surgery my insurance went bye-bye & I was just SOL. So no surgery, but me still walking around in pain all the time. During the next year I had issues with pain and swelling but I was unable to get insurance to do anything about it. I tried to go with clinics and sliding scale hospital stuff but they make it as hard as possible for you to get in to see a doctor and I couldn't get in to see anyone. So around 6 months ago the pain that had been entirely in my ankle all of a sudden was shooting up my entire leg, via the back of the leg. There's some kind of muscle or something in the top part of my butt that hurts 24/7, but is at it's worst when I stand up after sitting or sit up after laying down. I can't sit back, at all. Like if I'm in a char I have to lean forward, or else the pain in my leg is just too intense. If I'm sitting on the train and it lurches to the side or if I'm in a cab that hits a pothole I get a shooting pain in the spot on the top of my butt. It's the kind of pain that causes a noise to escape my throat so people look at me like I'm nuts. That's always fun.
    My question is, does it seem like I hurt myself separately on the same leg or could it be that since that torn tendon didn't get sewn up when it was supposed to and I kept walking on it something snapped or something and it fucked up the rest of my leg?

    Sorry about the super layman language, I don't really have a clue about this stuff :-(
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  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 24,408
    duska3419 wrote:
    whoa gst ftw! Never thought of using the PJ board for help with my orthopedic problems. Awesome.
    Unfortunately I don't possess the OP's knowledge of anatomy to ask treatment advice, but maybe you have some insight into my injury? I fucked up my ankle a couple years ago and saw an awesome orthopedist who said there was a tear in the tendon. He squeezed some part of my food under the ankle bone towards the heel and I SCREAMED in pain. It was fun. Anyway I was supposed to get surgery to sow that shit back up but then the week before surgery my insurance went bye-bye & I was just SOL. So no surgery, but me still walking around in pain all the time. During the next year I had issues with pain and swelling but I was unable to get insurance to do anything about it. I tried to go with clinics and sliding scale hospital stuff but they make it as hard as possible for you to get in to see a doctor and I couldn't get in to see anyone. So around 6 months ago the pain that had been entirely in my ankle all of a sudden was shooting up my entire leg, via the back of the leg. There's some kind of muscle or something in the top part of my butt that hurts 24/7, but is at it's worst when I stand up after sitting or sit up after laying down. I can't sit back, at all. Like if I'm in a char I have to lean forward, or else the pain in my leg is just too intense. If I'm sitting on the train and it lurches to the side or if I'm in a cab that hits a pothole I get a shooting pain in the spot on the top of my butt. It's the kind of pain that causes a noise to escape my throat so people look at me like I'm nuts. That's always fun.
    My question is, does it seem like I hurt myself separately on the same leg or could it be that since that torn tendon didn't get sewn up when it was supposed to and I kept walking on it something snapped or something and it fucked up the rest of my leg?

    Sorry about the super layman language, I don't really have a clue about this stuff :-(
    ok, before i get into this, is it on the big toe side of the foot or the baby toe side of the foot? on the big toe side there is a very important muscle called the posterior tibialis that if it is torn can have some significant long term chronic issues with walking. that muscle helps to maintain the integrity of the arch and it helps with shock absoprtion of the low leg. most times, a complere tear is a surgical issue. not fixing it can cause all kinds of problems later on. on the baby toe side is the peroneus muscles. these are on the outside of the low leg and help with pushing off with walking. most times these are surgical only if they sublux or pop out of place behind the outside ankle bone. until i know which muscle group i am talking about i can't really answer the question.

    if you are getting radiating pain in your butt and leg, you need to see someone. it can be something as simple as a piriformis syndrome, or something complicated like sciatica or a low back disc issue/lumbar stenosis. piriformis syndrome is caused mostly from prolonged sitting on hard surfaces which irritates the sciatic nerve, which runs through the piriformis muscle. if the piriformis is damaged or tight, it can put pressure on the sciatic nerve and give you all kinds of pain and tingling into your foot.

    i am thinking that your issues are two separate issues and are unrelated. but if the posterior tibialis muscle is involved it could be a contributing factor because the biomechanics of the entire leg and hip are thrown off.

    sorry that is so unclear, but if you can let me know the answers of my questions i can help a little more.

    and don't worry about layman's terms. i hear it every day in clinic :mrgreen:
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • ldent42
    ldent42 NYC Posts: 7,859
    :cry: It's the big toe side. Sometimes the bottom of that foots gets randomly a wee bit numb and/or tingly. It might sound completely daft, but sometimes I think that leg feels longer than the other one.

    I'm not gonna be able to see a doctor until Feb, because insurance.

    I'm gonna end up in a wheelchair ain't I?

    DO NOT GOOGLE IMAGE SEARCH 'posterior tibialis' :sick: (I'm scarred for life now)
    NYC 06/24/08-Auckland 11/27/09-Chch 11/29/09-Newark 05/18/10-Atlanta 09/22/12-Chicago 07/19/13-Brooklyn 10/18/13 & 10/19/13-Hartford 10/25/13-Baltimore 10/27/13-Auckland 1/17/14-GC 1/19/14-Melbourne 1/24/14-Sydney 1/26/14-Amsterdam 6/16/14 & 6/17/14-Milan 6/20/14-Berlin 6/26/14-Leeds 7/8/14-Milton Keynes 7/11/14-St. Louis 10/3/14-NYC 9/26/15
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