Yeezus
Tim Simmons
Posts: 8,079
Anyone listening to this?
Holy shit.
Holy shit.
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Tim Simmons
Posts: 8,079
Comments
Also, I just read that Kanye West doesn't give a f*ck about the leak, which doesn't surprise me. In fact, he already said that he doesn't care about how much Yeezus would sale. I now finished listening to I Am A God. Pretty eerie ending.
This, like, JT's album, is an artist at their creative peak, not caring at all what fans or critics think. No single, no video, no album artwork, no promotion, no album artwork at all other than a CDR and some tape.
Ye flips the script and makes a minimalist album influenced by heavy metal, industrial music, and house music.
Justin Vernon appears on 3 songs.
This is music no one else is making. He flat out says he doesnt give a damn about record sales anymore.
This is music made by an artist. Music made to challenge (Billie Holiday Strange Fruit sample), confuse, digust and repulse, make you tap your toes and nod your head, etc...
This is a guy who can't miss.
As Ive long said, Michael Jordan is arrogant and full of himself. But no one questions it because he's the best ever. Kanye's the same way. He's arrogant as all hell, but if you put out 6 straight albums that are all masterpieces and widely considered to be among the top albums of our generation, I think you can say what you want.
Its more than that, he's everything he says he is. You read the NY TImes interview the other day? He calls himself a legend, an icon, a style guru and icon, and one of the best and most important artists of his generation. Its certainly not polite to talk that way, and even if you do believe it, to not say it in front of millions. But its undeniable, he is all those things and more.
This like JT's 20/20 is capital A art. Its not meant to sell units. Its meant to be thought of along the likes of all the great art in history.
that Hold My Liquor song is gorgeous. That main beat thing that sounds like an airhorn or alarm, WOW! And Justin Vernon crooning on it. So brilliant.
You can certainly have that opinion, but it is sort of naive. plus you miss out on great music. I used to be "only listen to conscious/political music with a message" about a decade ago. What limiting about that is that ignores the importance and value and inherent artistic value of mainstream/pop/music without a message. And lets be clear this album does have a message.
Jay-z makes quality music. To ignore it because its mainstream, about silly things, or because he's fabulously wealthy is just plain silly.
Hell, Are Bob Dylan and Van Morrison really all that nice of people?
Its one thing to judge the artist, which you can do. Call them, egomaniacs, selfish, arrogant, jerks, or worse. But its also possible to recognize art comes out of alot of people. Not all of them are saints, few are. That only makes the resulting art more interesting.
"F*ck dis! My video cost a million dollars! Pam Anderson was in it! I was jumping across canyons and shit! If I don't win, the awards show loses credibility!" - Kanye
Please. :? Yea...haters just to hate....sure.
nowadays hits you when you're young
Im always interested in this perspective. So do you do this with all music you listen to? You dont listen to any artists who are immature, egomaniacs, rude, spoiled? Id find that exhuasting to try and find out about the backstory of every artist and even then, how do you really know if a band are quality human beings or not? I used to do this too, but found I actually was missing out on some amazing music. Do you have to agree with a writer to think they are a great writer? If you go see an art show, does the art's inherent personal value to you suffer because the artist is rude? Were Picasso and Van Gogh and Rothko good people? And if not, does it matter?
I do this with everything. Movies, Music, Art, Television,.....If someone continually goes out of his or her way to be a total dumbass, like Kanye has done for years I try to ignore anything they produce. I can't see it any other way. There was a time when I couldn't stand Pearl Jam because of all the political shit Ed would spew at most shows. It became redundant and turned me off to their music. Thankfully it has eased over these years and I can enjoy them again. I feel this way about alot of artists/musicians/actors/writers and so on......
Thats sad. Especially considering most of us dont truly know of these people, as humans. We know what the media reports. Period. Lots of people are great artists and arent nice people. Van Morrison, one of the all time greats. I guess you dont listen to him. Id find it exhausting to do this. What qualifies someone as good versus bad? Polanski is a brilliant director. Do we say "Rosemary's baby" is crap because he did what he did. I think you can and should view artists as complex and conflicted like all of us normal people too. In fact I think its this dichotomy which makes great art. The tortured, sad, depressed, angry, conflicted, lost artist makes for good creativity. Is a writer bad if he is a drunk and a philanderer? Its all subjective. Plus I think this behavior, the egomanic, the "im doing what I want and to hell with what you think", makes great art. Theres a reason that sort of behavior is associated with legends. I think to become a master at your trade you need to have that attitude. You can't be getting drunk and going to parties and watching endless Twilight Zone marathons if you want to become the next Shakespeare.
Not my style... But it's all about PR...bad, good, ugly. People just suck this shit up
He's a pioneer in what he's doin musically, glad I got to see him at MIA
I don't consciously go around judging the character of the artists I listen to, but if they do good in the world and/or have an enlightening perspective on the world, it definitely heightens my interest in them. That's a big reason why Pearl Jam isn't just another band to me.
If Kanye's lyrics were divergent from his personality, in a good way, I could certainly appreciate the music more. Unfortunately his douchey personality comes out loud and clear in his music, so even though he does try as hard as he can to come off as a flippant narcissist in interviews and public appearances, his music does just as good of a job.
To be fair, I listened to the whole stream of the new album. The beats and melodies are really nice, but his cringeworthy lyrics and the fact it's him make it much less enjoyable than it should be. Here are some of his 'artistic achievements' on the new album:
"I am a god
So hurry up with my damn massage
And a French ass restaurant
Hurry up with my damn croissants"
"4in the morning, and I'm zonin'
They say I'm possessed, it's an omen
I keep it 300, like the Romans" (Romans?!)
"Baby girl tryna get a nut
And her girl tryna give it up
Chopped em both down
Don't judge 'em Joe Brown
One last announcement
No sports bra, lets keep it bouncin"
nowadays hits you when you're young
Kanye's complex. I dont like my art with a bow on it. I like humanness. Misogyny and sexism and all that deserves to be called out when anyone engages in it. But alot is going on in the lyrics of Yeezus. he samples a nina simone cover of Billie Holidays strange fruit, a song about lynching. The songs themselves criticize apartheid, call out people who are offended by interracial couples, discusses the prison industrial complex and how its big buisness, criticizes materialism, denounces america for being horrified at the bloodshed in iraq while ignoring when young black males die in the streets in urban america, and chastizes the audience and himself for participating in consumer and capitalist culture that enslaves us all.
Tupac was the same way. Whats interesting about Kanye is he does all this even within the same verse. Blatant sexism then social critique.
People love to hate. Kanye's achievements and impact are solidified. Anyone questioning them is either unwilling or unable to deal in reality.
Tupac and Biggie's importance to hip hop and exposing the world to the grim realities of being black men in the 90's were also filled with the same thing. Born to Die is a stone cold classic. Paints disturbing portraits of the lives of people deemed by society to be lesser than. Yet within that are lines that delve into sexist and even homphobic terrirory.
The issue here is holding two ideas simotaneously. Criticizing the artist for their sexism, but also praising the work for its ambition, scope, experimentalism and artistry.
2008: MSG 1, Hartford, Mansfield 2, Ed Solo NYC 1
2009: London (O2), Philly 1, 2, 3, & 4
2010: Hartford, Boston, MSG 1 & 2
2011: Ed Solo Hartford
2012: Philly (MIA Fest)
2013: Worcester 2, Brooklyn 1 & 2, Hartford
How can you be a musical genius when all you do is sample other artists work on your songs, lip synch at your shows and need to use a computer because you cant sing. I don't get the love for this hack. :fp:
Yes, he's an artistic genius enlightening us all to the issues of the world. :fp:
nowadays hits you when you're young
How can you call Kanye complex and throw admiration at his supposed worldliness and awareness when he can't even get the difference between Romans and Greeks?! Just because you throw out historical references and mention topical issues in your music doesn't make you relevant or a groundbreaker or a genius. Even worse, when your references are factually inaccurate, it makes you look like a buffoon.
Kanye isn't even in the same league as 2pac or Biggie, don't insult them by making that comparison.
nowadays hits you when you're young
How about this one :fp:
A monster about to come alive again/ Soon as I pull up and park the Benz/ We got this bitch shaking like Parkinson's (On Sight)
Biggie and Pac's importance only heighten my point. Neithers music portrayed women as equals, sexism and objectification was rampant in both. Ready to Die portrays the reality of urban horror better than just about any other album. Yet its littered with references to women as objects. That needs to be discussed and criticized, but im certainly not going to write biggie off as meaningless and an idiot because of it. Tupac could be the ultimate example. Possibly raped a girl, yet wrote one of the best pro-women anthems ever penned by a male hip hop artists with Keep ya head up.
Pac and Biggie are giants and legends but lets not pretend either was squeaky clean choir boys who also didnt have their real demons as well.
The sheer guts to take a sample about lynching and include it on an album thats going to be played loud and danced to by lots of teens who have no idea what lynching even is, only shows his genius more.
Kanye's legend is solid. his work is legendary. His producers work is also legendary. Its fine to not like an artist, its your right, but to deny his influence and the acclaim his work has achieved I think is just being silly.
I dont think he lip syncs. Clearly you havent heard The Avalanches, or Dj Shadow. Or Radiohead or Thom Yorke for that matter. Computers and samples being somehow less musically pure than instruments is preposterous. A Girl Talk live show is about as much fun as you ever will have at a live show.
The roll out of this album is something alot of other bands could do to imitate. No single. No video. No album cover. No liner notes. At most a one month lead up. And projection of Kanye rapping New Slaves was shown on apartment walls, or even on prisons around the US in the days before the album leaked.
And he clearly, and most hip hop artists sample not to make up for their lack of talent, but to enhance the musical experience. Dj Shadow and RJD2 for example revel in finding the most obscure sample, some long forgotten album in the bin for 25 cents, and they somehow come up with this amazing break from it.
DJ Shadow is a musical genius and he does this. And Since I Left You is considered a landmark album, Also what about Moby's legendary Play album?>
Really don't know much of his stuff... where else should I go?