So it’s hard to play QB when your offensive line is banged up and you end up taking sacks and throwing balls up for grabs. Who knew?
Comparing Prince Harry to Pat Mahommes?
fyi check out David Murphy's article today. Says the same things I have been saying. I know a lot of people in this thread love David Murphy. Love to hear people's thoughts on this article.
Text below:
David Murphy Posted: February 9, 2021 - 8:35 PM
The Eagles are about to do the most dangerous thing they’ve ever done, and nobody seems to care. It’s a fascinating thing, this bidding war that a vocal majority of the fan base is currently celebrating. Those fans spent all season telling anyone who would listen that Carson Wentz was cooked, that signing him had been a mistake from the beginning, that the organization sealed its fate when it walked away from Nick Foles. Two weeks ago, in the wake of Lions quarterback Matthew Stafford’s trade to the Rams for Jared Goff and a glut of picks, they were openly wondering how many first-rounders the Eagles would need to include to get rid of Wentz’s contract.
Now, suddenly, Philadelphia is Paris in August 1914, its citizens watching the Colts and the Bears with feverish anticipation as Howie Roseman wags the dog. Each new report adds another order of magnitude to expectations of the haul that a trade of Wentz should fetch. A first-round pick! Two firsts! No less than Stafford fetched! Nick Foles! Tarik Cohen! Allen Robinson’s emoji! The one possibility that nobody seems to consider? Maybe the market for Wentz isn’t the only thing they got wrong.
To a certain extent, I understand why popular opinion is what it is. A year ago, I would not have believed in a world in which the Eagles were on the verge of trading Wentz and I was not standing on a street corner insisting to passing pedestrians that the End Days would soon arrive. That’s how bad Wentz played this season. By practically any measure, quantitative or qualitative, he was among the worst five or six quarterbacks in the league. More concerning is the lack of public support we’ve heard for Wentz from any level of the Eagles organization: coaches, players, past, present. The public record does not paint a flattering picture of Wentz right now, and nobody seems in much of a hurry to correct it.
Frankly, that last observation alone is enough to believe that Wentz’s career with the Eagles is over. The problem isn’t that Wentz wants to be wanted. It’s that he has no choice but to conclude that he isn’t. Anybody who faults him for exercising any leverage that he has to engineer his way out of Philly has never considered how uncomfortable it would be for him to return, given all that he has seen, read, and heard. I feel bad for the guy. I really do. The last 13 months of his professional life have been a complete and irrevocable disaster.
Therein lies the crux of the matter. Even if everything works out entirely in the Eagles’ favor, it will still work out to nothing less than a travesty. Jeffrey Lurie could spend the rest of his life doing the Scrooge McDuck backstroke through a vault of first-round picks and he will still go down as the man who oversaw the most mismanaged and embarrassing chapter in the history of his organization. Wentz could retire from football with a zero quarterback rating and his legacy would still regard him first as the unwitting whistleblower who exposed the depths of the Eagles’ dysfunction.
That, right there, is where the danger lies. Few will admit it because it’s more comfortable to ignore the things we do not know. But there’s a realistic scenario in which history looks back on the Eagles’ decision to trade Wentz as one of professional sports’ greatest management blunders. What the Eagles are about to do simply does not happen, regardless of the circumstances. NFL history is full of quarterbacks who had seasons that were every bit as bad as Wentz’s and did not lose their job. Derek Carr, Andy Dalton, Alex Smith, Ryan Tannehill – and those are only the guys who were better than Wentz this season. Stafford and Ben Roethlisberger both bounced back from abysmal years at similar junctures in their careers. Philip Rivers was a laughingstock at 31 and went on to play eight more seasons.
Right now, people are too preoccupied with assigning blame to see the reality of the Eagles’ situation. Clearly, Wentz has played a role in arriving at this juncture. On the field and in the locker room, the quarterback is the commanding officer. He is both culpable and creditable for everything that happens on his watch. With great power comes great responsibility, and Wentz bears plenty of the latter for failing to make the best of the situation.
At the same time, the situation matters. Isn’t that what we saw on Sunday night, when the game’s best quarterback in the sport’s biggest game turned in one of the worst statistical performances in its history? The Chiefs were a team with the NFL’s best play-caller, its best deep threat, its best tight end, and its best quarterback, and they still ended up scoring a total of nine points while getting blown off the NFL’s biggest stage.
Carson Wentz is not Patrick Mahomes. But he is 28 years old and has the same raw materials that he had when he was one of the NFL’s best. In three of the last four seasons, he has been a top-15 QB by practically any measure. If the NFL’s best offense can look like its worst without an offensive line, isn’t there a chance that Wentz is actually a lot better than he looked while playing 12 games without one? Isn’t there a chance that he’d look a lot better with a different coach and different supporting cast? Isn’t there a chance that the Eagles’ inability to succeed with him will prove to be an indictment of the Eagles?
If all Wentz needed was the right situation, history will laugh at the Eagles’ failure to provide it. It will laugh like it laughed at the Blazers and Jordan, and the Sixers and Barkley, and the Chargers and Brees.
If so, look out. And look in the mirror. And remember that you celebrated.
"Carson Wentz is not Patrick Mahomes." I don't know how you quote F Me's statement above and then include an article literally saying the same thing.
Murphy is a douchebag. He knows what he's talking about when it comes to baseball, that was his beat for a long time. But being a contrarian for the matter of nothing more than to add, "...well, on the contrary" is garbage. That's what this is, he completely speaks out of both sides of his mouth. Just because you have confirmation bias doesn't validate you objectively, 'Takes. This all misses the point that Wentz wants out, there's no going back in time. If the point is to highlight the ineptitude and dysfunction of Lurie and Howie, no one denies this.
I do not feel bad for Wentz. McNabb dealt with 1000x times worse and got no where near the sympathy that Neck Acne does. Murphy makes it sound like Eagles fans wanted Wentz gone all year, which is no where near the case. No one's celebrating Wentz's demise nor his departure.
"Carson Wentz is not Patrick Mahomes." I don't know how you quote F Me's statement above and then include an article literally saying the same thing.
Murphy is a douchebag. He knows what he's talking about when it comes to baseball, that was his beat for a long time. But being a contrarian for the matter of nothing more than to add, "...well, on the contrary" is garbage. That's what this is, he completely speaks out of both sides of his mouth. Just because you have confirmation bias doesn't validate you objectively, 'Takes. This all misses the point that Wentz wants out, there's no going back in time. If the point is to highlight the ineptitude and dysfunction of Lurie and Howie, no one denies this.
I do not feel bad for Wentz. McNabb dealt with 1000x times worse and got no where near the sympathy that Neck Acne does. Murphy makes it sound like Eagles fans wanted Wentz gone all year, which is no where near the case. No one's celebrating Wentz's demise nor his departure.
Well because I wasn’t directly
comparing Wentz to Mahomes, neither was Murphy.
"So, let’s say Jeffrey Lurie calls you later today and offers you a one-question job interview to replace Roseman. He presents these three hypothetical options:
Surrender the No. 6 pick, your 2021 second-round pick and a 2022 third-round pick to draft Fields at No. 3.
Stay at No. 6 and draft Chase.
Trade No. 6 to the Patriots for No. 15, a 2022 first-round pick and a 2021 fourth-round pick. Select Georgia pass rusher Azeez Ojulari at No. 15.
Which do you choose?"
I think I'm going with #3 no question. This team stinks, is crippled by the cap, and is devoid of a breadth of talent.
"So, let’s say Jeffrey Lurie calls you later today and offers you a one-question job interview to replace Roseman. He presents these three hypothetical options:
Surrender the No. 6 pick, your 2021 second-round pick and a 2022 third-round pick to draft Fields at No. 3.
Stay at No. 6 and draft Chase.
Trade No. 6 to the Patriots for No. 15, a 2022 first-round pick and a 2021 fourth-round pick. Select Georgia pass rusher Azeez Ojulari at No. 15.
Which do you choose?"
I think I'm going with #3 no question. This team stinks, is crippled by the cap, and is devoid of a breadth of talent.
As has been printed, if they are going with Hurts this season it makes all the sense in the world to try and get another 1st for next year
If Hurts isn't the answer having two firsts will be prime to use for a QB pick. If he is, having two is great.
"So, let’s say Jeffrey Lurie calls you later today and offers you a one-question job interview to replace Roseman. He presents these three hypothetical options:
Surrender the No. 6 pick, your 2021 second-round pick and a 2022 third-round pick to draft Fields at No. 3.
Stay at No. 6 and draft Chase.
Trade No. 6 to the Patriots for No. 15, a 2022 first-round pick and a 2021 fourth-round pick. Select Georgia pass rusher Azeez Ojulari at No. 15.
Which do you choose?"
I think I'm going with #3 no question. This team stinks, is crippled by the cap, and is devoid of a breadth of talent.
3 by process of elimination. I don’t want to take Fields or use the 6th pick on a wide receiver.
Take what you can get with a sunk cost. I think they'll parlay whatever they get, along with trading back in the draft to accumulate more picks. At least I think that's what they should do.
Also, anybody see the corners coach they just hired - and announced - this past week already took another job with Alabama? That doesn't indicate any issues with this org whatsoever. Nope nope nope not at all.
Take what you can get with a sunk cost. I think they'll parlay whatever they get, along with trading back in the draft to accumulate more picks. At least I think that's what they should do.
Also, anybody see the corners coach they just hired - and announced - this past week already took another job with Alabama? That doesn't indicate any issues with this org whatsoever. Nope nope nope not at all.
Don't know for sure but Alabama is probably paying that guy more than the Eagles. Bama pays their assistants crazy high. Plus he will probably coach better corners there than the Eagles corners.
8/28/98- Camden, NJ
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Tres Mts.- 3/23/11- Philly. PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
That trade is more then just a L? Plus, still the big Cap hit? OUCH ! (for both)
No question is the biggest issue now is Howie, but evidently there's no changing that at this time. If there's "good news" in this it's that at least his cap hit is only for this year for a team that has made every move, and comment, to express Rebuild.
That trade is more then just a L? Plus, still the big Cap hit? OUCH ! (for both)
No question is the biggest issue now is Howie, but evidently there's no changing that at this time. If there's "good news" in this it's that at least his cap hit is only for this year for a team that has made every move, and comment, to express Rebuild.
Yeah, the Cap hit for one year is about the only good thing with this Eagles/Wentz fiasco.
Well having two first round picks (potentially) next year would be exciting if Hurts proves capable. Two first can be used a number of different ways to make improvements. If Hurts sucks well I guess they can use those two to get aggressive about a new QB.
The fact that this is the return shows his value around the league. Sad situation anyway you look at it. But since they're rebuilding, it's better to rip the band aid off now, get what they can, and move on.
HAVING SAID THAT...it's a relatively decent haul considering there was only one team in the league who had any real interest in him. I just wish this year's pick was a 2nd. Next year will likely be a first though.
I agree with FME. See what Hurts can do in a prolonged period of time. If he's good--great! If he's bad, well you've got the assets needed to obtain another qb. Who knows, they could also package some picks and move up to take a qb in this year's draft too.
and conditional 2nd round pick in 2022 that could turn into a 1st round. still a dumb fucking trade in my opinion.
It is a DUMB trade.
it was DUMB to give wentz $128M.
If I had known then what I know now...
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
You really think he'll take 75% of the snaps next year? I suppose the Colts' OL will protect him well, but he'll still likely find a way to get hurt, benched or both.
Comments
Text below:
David Murphy
Posted: February 9, 2021 - 8:35 PM
The Eagles are about to do the most dangerous thing they’ve ever done, and nobody seems to care. It’s a fascinating thing, this bidding war that a vocal majority of the fan base is currently celebrating. Those fans spent all season telling anyone who would listen that Carson Wentz was cooked, that signing him had been a mistake from the beginning, that the organization sealed its fate when it walked away from Nick Foles. Two weeks ago, in the wake of Lions quarterback Matthew Stafford’s trade to the Rams for Jared Goff and a glut of picks, they were openly wondering how many first-rounders the Eagles would need to include to get rid of Wentz’s contract.
Now, suddenly, Philadelphia is Paris in August 1914, its citizens watching the Colts and the Bears with feverish anticipation as Howie Roseman wags the dog. Each new report adds another order of magnitude to expectations of the haul that a trade of Wentz should fetch. A first-round pick! Two firsts! No less than Stafford fetched! Nick Foles! Tarik Cohen! Allen Robinson’s emoji! The one possibility that nobody seems to consider? Maybe the market for Wentz isn’t the only thing they got wrong.
To a certain extent, I understand why popular opinion is what it is. A year ago, I would not have believed in a world in which the Eagles were on the verge of trading Wentz and I was not standing on a street corner insisting to passing pedestrians that the End Days would soon arrive. That’s how bad Wentz played this season. By practically any measure, quantitative or qualitative, he was among the worst five or six quarterbacks in the league. More concerning is the lack of public support we’ve heard for Wentz from any level of the Eagles organization: coaches, players, past, present. The public record does not paint a flattering picture of Wentz right now, and nobody seems in much of a hurry to correct it.
Frankly, that last observation alone is enough to believe that Wentz’s career with the Eagles is over. The problem isn’t that Wentz wants to be wanted. It’s that he has no choice but to conclude that he isn’t. Anybody who faults him for exercising any leverage that he has to engineer his way out of Philly has never considered how uncomfortable it would be for him to return, given all that he has seen, read, and heard. I feel bad for the guy. I really do. The last 13 months of his professional life have been a complete and irrevocable disaster.
Therein lies the crux of the matter. Even if everything works out entirely in the Eagles’ favor, it will still work out to nothing less than a travesty. Jeffrey Lurie could spend the rest of his life doing the Scrooge McDuck backstroke through a vault of first-round picks and he will still go down as the man who oversaw the most mismanaged and embarrassing chapter in the history of his organization. Wentz could retire from football with a zero quarterback rating and his legacy would still regard him first as the unwitting whistleblower who exposed the depths of the Eagles’ dysfunction.
That, right there, is where the danger lies. Few will admit it because it’s more comfortable to ignore the things we do not know. But there’s a realistic scenario in which history looks back on the Eagles’ decision to trade Wentz as one of professional sports’ greatest management blunders. What the Eagles are about to do simply does not happen, regardless of the circumstances. NFL history is full of quarterbacks who had seasons that were every bit as bad as Wentz’s and did not lose their job. Derek Carr, Andy Dalton, Alex Smith, Ryan Tannehill – and those are only the guys who were better than Wentz this season. Stafford and Ben Roethlisberger both bounced back from abysmal years at similar junctures in their careers. Philip Rivers was a laughingstock at 31 and went on to play eight more seasons.
Right now, people are too preoccupied with assigning blame to see the reality of the Eagles’ situation. Clearly, Wentz has played a role in arriving at this juncture. On the field and in the locker room, the quarterback is the commanding officer. He is both culpable and creditable for everything that happens on his watch. With great power comes great responsibility, and Wentz bears plenty of the latter for failing to make the best of the situation.
At the same time, the situation matters. Isn’t that what we saw on Sunday night, when the game’s best quarterback in the sport’s biggest game turned in one of the worst statistical performances in its history? The Chiefs were a team with the NFL’s best play-caller, its best deep threat, its best tight end, and its best quarterback, and they still ended up scoring a total of nine points while getting blown off the NFL’s biggest stage.
Carson Wentz is not Patrick Mahomes. But he is 28 years old and has the same raw materials that he had when he was one of the NFL’s best. In three of the last four seasons, he has been a top-15 QB by practically any measure. If the NFL’s best offense can look like its worst without an offensive line, isn’t there a chance that Wentz is actually a lot better than he looked while playing 12 games without one? Isn’t there a chance that he’d look a lot better with a different coach and different supporting cast? Isn’t there a chance that the Eagles’ inability to succeed with him will prove to be an indictment of the Eagles?
If all Wentz needed was the right situation, history will laugh at the Eagles’ failure to provide it. It will laugh like it laughed at the Blazers and Jordan, and the Sixers and Barkley, and the Chargers and Brees.
If so, look out. And look in the mirror. And remember that you celebrated.
Murphy is a douchebag. He knows what he's talking about when it comes to baseball, that was his beat for a long time. But being a contrarian for the matter of nothing more than to add, "...well, on the contrary" is garbage. That's what this is, he completely speaks out of both sides of his mouth. Just because you have confirmation bias doesn't validate you objectively, 'Takes. This all misses the point that Wentz wants out, there's no going back in time. If the point is to highlight the ineptitude and dysfunction of Lurie and Howie, no one denies this.
I do not feel bad for Wentz. McNabb dealt with 1000x times worse and got no where near the sympathy that Neck Acne does. Murphy makes it sound like Eagles fans wanted Wentz gone all year, which is no where near the case. No one's celebrating Wentz's demise nor his departure.
Well because I wasn’t directly comparing Wentz to Mahomes, neither was Murphy.
"So, let’s say Jeffrey Lurie calls you later today and offers you a one-question job interview to replace Roseman. He presents these three hypothetical options:
Which do you choose?"
I think I'm going with #3 no question. This team stinks, is crippled by the cap, and is devoid of a breadth of talent.
Also, anybody see the corners coach they just hired - and announced - this past week already took another job with Alabama? That doesn't indicate any issues with this org whatsoever. Nope nope nope not at all.
Yes
10/31/09- Philly
5/21/10- NYC
9/2/12- Philly, PA
7/19/13- Wrigley
10/19/13- Brooklyn, NY
10/21/13- Philly, PA
10/22/13- Philly, PA
10/27/13- Baltimore, MD
4/28/16- Philly, PA
4/29/16- Philly, PA
5/1/16- NYC
5/2/16- NYC
9/2/18- Boston, MA
9/4/18- Boston, MA
9/14/22- Camden, NJ
9/7/24- Philly, PA
9/9/24- Philly, PA
Eddie Vedder- 6/25/11- Philly, PA
RNDM- 3/9/16- Philly, PA
Colts are pissing their pants right now as they used a mask and gun and stole Wentz from the Eagles. Well, maybe not , since Howie SUCKS !!
I would've kept him.
If Hurts sucks well I guess they can use those two to get aggressive about a new QB.
HAVING SAID THAT...it's a relatively decent haul considering there was only one team in the league who had any real interest in him. I just wish this year's pick was a 2nd. Next year will likely be a first though.
I agree with FME. See what Hurts can do in a prolonged period of time. If he's good--great! If he's bad, well you've got the assets needed to obtain another qb. Who knows, they could also package some picks and move up to take a qb in this year's draft too.
it was DUMB to give wentz $128M.
Vegas 93, Vegas 98, Vegas 00 (10 year show), Vegas 03, Vegas 06
VIC 07
EV LA1 08
Seattle1 09, Seattle2 09, Salt Lake 09, LA4 09
Columbus 10
EV LA 11
Vancouver 11
Missoula 12
Portland 13, Spokane 13
St. Paul 14, Denver 14
I suppose the Colts' OL will protect him well, but he'll still likely find a way to get hurt, benched or both.