No, I'm not seriously suggesting the President or poor little Malia have to suffer through life unarmed and unable to defend themselves or have someone provide it for them. I'd just ask for the same Right, that I already have, not to be taken away from me. Anything else is hypocrisy.
sounds like you are having a "poor me" couple of weeks ever since a psycho decided to shoot up a school and we have been talking about gun control.
and please indulge me and explain how curbing combat worthy machine guns, high capacity clips/magazines, instituting more stringent background checks is taking away any right of yours.
or is it the whole ron paul mentality that the government is not allowed to change the bill of rights or else it is an affront to freedom and an affront to jesus or something?
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
Gimme,
Well I do feel that taking things away from the law abiding is more of a knee-jerk reaction and is nothing more than doing something just to do something.
And really, it has been said hundreds if not thousands of times, guns don't shoot themselves. My guns have never injured anything. And also really, limit me to 10 rounds at a time? Another knee-jerk reaction. The excuse you lefties like to use is that the crazed coward would not have been able to kill x amount of people had they had to stop to reload. But when anyone attempts to claim that concealed permit holders could have stopped some of these crimes you guys scream that more guns is not the answer. FYI there have been many instances where the offender was stopped by a concealed weapons holder.
So let's stop and use your logic for a second.
Let's say that your high-cap magazine (very few guns use clips) ban goes into effect. Previously mentioned crazed killer that somehow is not breaking enough laws to begin with is actually following the one that you guys love to go on and on about and only has a ten round magazine loaded up. Let's also assume that you guys have your way and he is in a gun-free zone, I like to call them criminal enabling zones but I digress, and that there are no law-abiding people practicing concealed carry. This would-be killer gets off 10 easy shots without regard for actually needing to defend himself. 10 shots, no defense.
Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots.
And the Ron Paul mentality is making an amendment to the Constitution in order to change it. You'll be very hard pressed to find any quote from me claiming anything about religion, but FYI the Founding Father's claimed that the Bill Of Rights are God-given and that they are there so that the general government remains Constitutionally limited and the people remain free from tyranny.
Sacha and Malia are worth no more than any of your children.
to me they are worth less than my own, tho given sophies choice on the matter id asked to be killed if it kept them(and all children) alive. . however... your country is full of crazy nutters whod think nothing of targetting children.... whether they be the children of the president or kindergartners in newtown.
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
I've also never said I had a problem with background checks and I can't recall seeing anyone here say that there should be none.
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
Sacha and Malia are worth no more than any of your children.
to me they are worth less than my own, tho given sophies choice on the matter id asked to be killed if it kept them(and all children) alive. . however... your country is full of crazy nutters whod think nothing of targetting children.... whether they be the children of the president or kindergartners in newtown.
Oh geez, where are you when the school kids are caught in the crossfire in Chicago? Or is it only white first graders that tug at the ol heartstrings? Because a great deal more black youths are killed by illegal guns in Chicago than white first-graders are killed by legal guns that are stolen.
When will you people realize that criminals do not follow laws?
Sacha and Malia are worth no more than any of your children.
to me they are worth less than my own, tho given sophies choice on the matter id asked to be killed if it kept them(and all children) alive. . however... your country is full of crazy nutters whod think nothing of targetting children.... whether they be the children of the president or kindergartners in newtown.
Oh geez, where are you when the school kids are caught in the crossfire in Chicago? Or is it only white first graders that tug at the ol heartstrings? Because a great deal more black youths are killed by illegal guns in Chicago than white first-graders are killed by legal guns that are stolen.
When will you people realize that criminals do not follow laws?
calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
I'm quite calm, thanks. My point was that everyone, here/media/nation/world has bleeding hearts for these rich white kids in CT but do not seem to care much about the EVERYDAY gang violence in some of the large cities.
But please tell me again how banning high-cap magazines will stop that crime. In fact, tell me how ANY new gun control law will stop that crime.
calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
I'm quite calm, thanks. My point was that everyone, here/media/nation/world has bleeding hearts for these rich white kids in CT but do not seem to care much about the EVERYDAY gang violence in some of the large cities.
But please tell me again how banning high-cap magazines will stop that crime. In fact, tell me how ANY new gun control law will stop that crime.
I absolutely care about gang violence everyday. I think the sheer presence of 2 guns for every 3 people in the entire country makes that type of violence all too easy as well. So...yeah. Reduce the number of guns in the hands of people disposed to commit crime. Close loopholes that allow guns to be bought and sold without oversight. Reinvest in communities and education (yeah, I said it) to help curb gang activity. Propose comprehensive regulations so that there are more "responsible" owners and less guns in the hands of irresponsible, um, "handlers."
Gun violence in Newtown or Oakland is a problem. If we know that mental illness and the sheer availability of guns contribute, why not attack both ends? Why is that such a difficult compromise for people?
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calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
I'm quite calm, thanks. My point was that everyone, here/media/nation/world has bleeding hearts for these rich white kids in CT but do not seem to care much about the EVERYDAY gang violence in some of the large cities.
But please tell me again how banning high-cap magazines will stop that crime. In fact, tell me how ANY new gun control law will stop that crime.
i imagine its a class thing. the privileged often see nothing til theyre hit in the face with it, then they freak out, wring their hands and cry wont somebody think of the children. but what they mean is wont somebody think of our children. personally i care no less for the child killed in crossfire than i do for the child killed within the (supposed) safety of their classroom. but yeah youre right about the medias take on issues such as this... remembering of course who the media is representative of. i saw a similar thing with hurricane sandy vis a vis NJ/NY and the caribbean nations affected.
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calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
I'm quite calm, thanks. My point was that everyone, here/media/nation/world has bleeding hearts for these rich white kids in CT but do not seem to care much about the EVERYDAY gang violence in some of the large cities.
But please tell me again how banning high-cap magazines will stop that crime. In fact, tell me how ANY new gun control law will stop that crime.
i imagine its a class thing. the privileged often see nothing til theyre hit in the face with it, then they freak out, wring their hands and cry wont somebody think of the children. but what they mean is wont somebody think of our children. personally i care no less for the child killed in crossfire than i do for the child killed within the (supposed) safety of their classroom. but yeah youre right about the medias take on issues such as this... remembering of course who the media is representative of. i saw a similar thing with hurricane sandy vis a vis NJ/NY and the caribbean nations affected.
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So the police/government will use no more than 10 rounds too?
I am not suggesting that they are the enemy.
Of course your government also uses unmanned drones, automatic weaponry and surface to surface missiles amongst other things. Perhaps you should have some of those as well.
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unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
Well I do feel that taking things away from the law abiding is more of a knee-jerk reaction and is nothing more than doing something just to do something.
And really, it has been said hundreds if not thousands of times, guns don't shoot themselves. My guns have never injured anything. And also really, limit me to 10 rounds at a time? Another knee-jerk reaction. The excuse you lefties like to use is that the crazed coward would not have been able to kill x amount of people had they had to stop to reload. But when anyone attempts to claim that concealed permit holders could have stopped some of these crimes you guys scream that more guns is not the answer. FYI there have been many instances where the offender was stopped by a concealed weapons holder.
So let's stop and use your logic for a second.
Let's say that your high-cap magazine (very few guns use clips) ban goes into effect. Previously mentioned crazed killer that somehow is not breaking enough laws to begin with is actually following the one that you guys love to go on and on about and only has a ten round magazine loaded up. Let's also assume that you guys have your way and he is in a gun-free zone, I like to call them criminal enabling zones but I digress, and that there are no law-abiding people practicing concealed carry. This would-be killer gets off 10 easy shots without regard for actually needing to defend himself. 10 shots, no defense.
Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots.
And the Ron Paul mentality is making an amendment to the Constitution in order to change it. You'll be very hard pressed to find any quote from me claiming anything about religion, but FYI the Founding Father's claimed that the Bill Of Rights are God-given and that they are there so that the general government remains Constitutionally limited and the people remain free from tyranny.
...Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
or 4. 'crazed' gunman is more skilled than CW carrier, shoots him/her and continues on his rampage shooting everyone he comes across in case they too are carrying a concealed weapon.
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well people have proven that they are not capable of responsibly controlling themselves with the awesome power or semi and automatic rifles. unsung, why do you need a weapon like that? just because you can?? and proposed legislation would not take away guns from people. it would make it harder for them to get. that is a big difference. you people on the right make it seem like you are being punished or that something is being taken away from you. something that you do not need is being taken away from you. i see it as making it more difficult for people to get. how can limiting access to something equate to "taking away" something that a person does not yet possess???
and while i am at it, you made a smartass post earlier saying something to the effect of "oh so now we are going to limit the police to 10 rounds"...that is not what i or anyone advocating for tighter gun laws is advocating. why is it that those on the right immediately swing to some other extreme of hyperbole like that? you all make assumptions that people on my side are saying something that none of us have ever even suggested. it is very immature and it actually bothers me that someone who is as intelligent as yourself would go to such depths for the sake of trying to prove a point that none of us are even making..
you keep saying guns don't shoot themselves. they don't. but the gun is the tool that people use to kill. you can't kill someone by making a gun out of 2 fingers and yelling "Bang.....Bang..., "pew pew pew"... or " rat a tat a tat atat" etc. the gun is what makes the outcome of that intent of violence a possiblilty.
and please give it a rest with the "a person with a concealed weapon could have stopped it" schtick. that is hypothetical at best. there was an armed guard at columbine who exchanged fire with klebold and harris and he MISSED, allowing killing to continue. that scenario should be part 4 in "your logic" example aht you gave. you did not mention the armed guard missing. and that is the flaw with your logic. you did not put out there the variable that the armed ccw hero might possibly miss. if he misses, the killer may shoot him, and then there is nobody to stop the killer.
so that squashes the "In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots." point you are making
we can debate hypotheticals all night but it gets us nowhere closer to a resolution.
do you find it funny how biden's committee has not even communicated with the nra or asked them to be a part in finding a solution? because their ideas are old, tired, dated, and do not work.
Well I do feel that taking things away from the law abiding is more of a knee-jerk reaction and is nothing more than doing something just to do something.
And really, it has been said hundreds if not thousands of times, guns don't shoot themselves. My guns have never injured anything. And also really, limit me to 10 rounds at a time? Another knee-jerk reaction. The excuse you lefties like to use is that the crazed coward would not have been able to kill x amount of people had they had to stop to reload. But when anyone attempts to claim that concealed permit holders could have stopped some of these crimes you guys scream that more guns is not the answer. FYI there have been many instances where the offender was stopped by a concealed weapons holder.
So let's stop and use your logic for a second.
Let's say that your high-cap magazine (very few guns use clips) ban goes into effect. Previously mentioned crazed killer that somehow is not breaking enough laws to begin with is actually following the one that you guys love to go on and on about and only has a ten round magazine loaded up. Let's also assume that you guys have your way and he is in a gun-free zone, I like to call them criminal enabling zones but I digress, and that there are no law-abiding people practicing concealed carry. This would-be killer gets off 10 easy shots without regard for actually needing to defend himself. 10 shots, no defense.
Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots.
And the Ron Paul mentality is making an amendment to the Constitution in order to change it. You'll be very hard pressed to find any quote from me claiming anything about religion, but FYI the Founding Father's claimed that the Bill Of Rights are God-given and that they are there so that the general government remains Constitutionally limited and the people remain free from tyranny.
Their words, not mine.
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
Well I do feel that taking things away from the law abiding is more of a knee-jerk reaction and is nothing more than doing something just to do something.
And really, it has been said hundreds if not thousands of times, guns don't shoot themselves. My guns have never injured anything. And also really, limit me to 10 rounds at a time? Another knee-jerk reaction. The excuse you lefties like to use is that the crazed coward would not have been able to kill x amount of people had they had to stop to reload. But when anyone attempts to claim that concealed permit holders could have stopped some of these crimes you guys scream that more guns is not the answer. FYI there have been many instances where the offender was stopped by a concealed weapons holder.
So let's stop and use your logic for a second.
Let's say that your high-cap magazine (very few guns use clips) ban goes into effect. Previously mentioned crazed killer that somehow is not breaking enough laws to begin with is actually following the one that you guys love to go on and on about and only has a ten round magazine loaded up. Let's also assume that you guys have your way and he is in a gun-free zone, I like to call them criminal enabling zones but I digress, and that there are no law-abiding people practicing concealed carry. This would-be killer gets off 10 easy shots without regard for actually needing to defend himself. 10 shots, no defense.
Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots.
And the Ron Paul mentality is making an amendment to the Constitution in order to change it. You'll be very hard pressed to find any quote from me claiming anything about religion, but FYI the Founding Father's claimed that the Bill Of Rights are God-given and that they are there so that the general government remains Constitutionally limited and the people remain free from tyranny.
Their words, not mine.
Anyone care to comment?
Not really. If these are your beliefs you are entitled to them. But the "Ron Paul mentality" statement is pretty ridiculous. Ron Paul may have had strong beliefs, but in the end he was in it to make money for his family and to build a political machine for his legacy son. Not much better than any other political hack, unfortunately.
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and please indulge me and explain how curbing combat worthy machine guns, high capacity clips/magazines, instituting more stringent background checks is taking away any right of yours.
or is it the whole ron paul mentality that the government is not allowed to change the bill of rights or else it is an affront to freedom and an affront to jesus or something?
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Well I do feel that taking things away from the law abiding is more of a knee-jerk reaction and is nothing more than doing something just to do something.
And really, it has been said hundreds if not thousands of times, guns don't shoot themselves. My guns have never injured anything. And also really, limit me to 10 rounds at a time? Another knee-jerk reaction. The excuse you lefties like to use is that the crazed coward would not have been able to kill x amount of people had they had to stop to reload. But when anyone attempts to claim that concealed permit holders could have stopped some of these crimes you guys scream that more guns is not the answer. FYI there have been many instances where the offender was stopped by a concealed weapons holder.
So let's stop and use your logic for a second.
Let's say that your high-cap magazine (very few guns use clips) ban goes into effect. Previously mentioned crazed killer that somehow is not breaking enough laws to begin with is actually following the one that you guys love to go on and on about and only has a ten round magazine loaded up. Let's also assume that you guys have your way and he is in a gun-free zone, I like to call them criminal enabling zones but I digress, and that there are no law-abiding people practicing concealed carry. This would-be killer gets off 10 easy shots without regard for actually needing to defend himself. 10 shots, no defense.
Now let's use my logic. Crazed killer is walking into a mall or a school to perform bad deeds and mayhem. The first person that sees him just happens to be a concealed or open carry person and is able to draw down on the offender without delay. Three things happen; one, a possible firefight, two, a killer that decides getting shot isn't that appealing and gives up, or three, the offender is quickly taken out by the CCW holder.
In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots.
And the Ron Paul mentality is making an amendment to the Constitution in order to change it. You'll be very hard pressed to find any quote from me claiming anything about religion, but FYI the Founding Father's claimed that the Bill Of Rights are God-given and that they are there so that the general government remains Constitutionally limited and the people remain free from tyranny.
Their words, not mine.
to me they are worth less than my own, tho given sophies choice on the matter id asked to be killed if it kept them(and all children) alive. . however... your country is full of crazy nutters whod think nothing of targetting children.... whether they be the children of the president or kindergartners in newtown.
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Oh geez, where are you when the school kids are caught in the crossfire in Chicago? Or is it only white first graders that tug at the ol heartstrings? Because a great deal more black youths are killed by illegal guns in Chicago than white first-graders are killed by legal guns that are stolen.
When will you people realize that criminals do not follow laws?
sure if you all feel the need to be armed hows about you limit the capacity of the weapons available so that everyones playing on a level field?
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I am not suggesting that they are the enemy.
calm down unsung, it was just an example. we were talking about hypoethical direct targetting of the children of the president when you mentioned sascha and malia were we not? hence my newtown comparison, where again, but not hypothetically, children were deliberately targetted. thats all i was going for.
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I'm quite calm, thanks. My point was that everyone, here/media/nation/world has bleeding hearts for these rich white kids in CT but do not seem to care much about the EVERYDAY gang violence in some of the large cities.
But please tell me again how banning high-cap magazines will stop that crime. In fact, tell me how ANY new gun control law will stop that crime.
I absolutely care about gang violence everyday. I think the sheer presence of 2 guns for every 3 people in the entire country makes that type of violence all too easy as well. So...yeah. Reduce the number of guns in the hands of people disposed to commit crime. Close loopholes that allow guns to be bought and sold without oversight. Reinvest in communities and education (yeah, I said it) to help curb gang activity. Propose comprehensive regulations so that there are more "responsible" owners and less guns in the hands of irresponsible, um, "handlers."
Gun violence in Newtown or Oakland is a problem. If we know that mental illness and the sheer availability of guns contribute, why not attack both ends? Why is that such a difficult compromise for people?
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i imagine its a class thing. the privileged often see nothing til theyre hit in the face with it, then they freak out, wring their hands and cry wont somebody think of the children. but what they mean is wont somebody think of our children. personally i care no less for the child killed in crossfire than i do for the child killed within the (supposed) safety of their classroom. but yeah youre right about the medias take on issues such as this... remembering of course who the media is representative of. i saw a similar thing with hurricane sandy vis a vis NJ/NY and the caribbean nations affected.
take a good look
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hold my hand
lie beside me
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"...I changed by not changing at all..."
Of course your government also uses unmanned drones, automatic weaponry and surface to surface missiles amongst other things. Perhaps you should have some of those as well.
Anyone care to comment?
or 4. 'crazed' gunman is more skilled than CW carrier, shoots him/her and continues on his rampage shooting everyone he comes across in case they too are carrying a concealed weapon.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
and while i am at it, you made a smartass post earlier saying something to the effect of "oh so now we are going to limit the police to 10 rounds"...that is not what i or anyone advocating for tighter gun laws is advocating. why is it that those on the right immediately swing to some other extreme of hyperbole like that? you all make assumptions that people on my side are saying something that none of us have ever even suggested. it is very immature and it actually bothers me that someone who is as intelligent as yourself would go to such depths for the sake of trying to prove a point that none of us are even making..
you keep saying guns don't shoot themselves. they don't. but the gun is the tool that people use to kill. you can't kill someone by making a gun out of 2 fingers and yelling "Bang.....Bang..., "pew pew pew"... or " rat a tat a tat atat" etc. the gun is what makes the outcome of that intent of violence a possiblilty.
and please give it a rest with the "a person with a concealed weapon could have stopped it" schtick. that is hypothetical at best. there was an armed guard at columbine who exchanged fire with klebold and harris and he MISSED, allowing killing to continue. that scenario should be part 4 in "your logic" example aht you gave. you did not mention the armed guard missing. and that is the flaw with your logic. you did not put out there the variable that the armed ccw hero might possibly miss. if he misses, the killer may shoot him, and then there is nobody to stop the killer.
so that squashes the "In any case my logic a possible zero shots vs. your logic at least 10 shots." point you are making
we can debate hypotheticals all night but it gets us nowhere closer to a resolution.
do you find it funny how biden's committee has not even communicated with the nra or asked them to be a part in finding a solution? because their ideas are old, tired, dated, and do not work.
lastly, how are the people under tytanny now?
we aren't.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Not really. If these are your beliefs you are entitled to them. But the "Ron Paul mentality" statement is pretty ridiculous. Ron Paul may have had strong beliefs, but in the end he was in it to make money for his family and to build a political machine for his legacy son. Not much better than any other political hack, unfortunately.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/03/22/r ... 1-million/
"...I changed by not changing at all..."