The Forthrightness Thread

brianlux

Just for grins, shits and giggles along that winding road that leads most philosophical threads towards oblivion...
Forthrightness (a subset of truthfulness, a subset of truth).
In general, are people who and what they say they are?
Are you who and what you say you are?

Vitalogensia

i think this is a difficult question to answer. I would say at work, I am not who I say I am, and I doubt that others co-workers are who they say they are. Yet, "work Scott" is still me, whether I want to say it or not.

Thus, I'd say it depends what you are saying, who you are saying it to, and where you are saying it. I guess I could have just said "no."

Jason P

What if I claimed I was a liar, but in fact was lying about it?

:think:

Hugh Freaking Dillon

some people build themselves up. I actually tend to knock myself down. just so there's no disappointment if I'm put under further investigation.

brianlux

Jason P wrote:

What if I claimed I was a liar, but in fact was lying about it?

:think:

I would say most likely you are lying (unless your telling the truth). :eh:

Hugh Freaking Dillon

this is an interesting question, actually, because of my depression and anxiety, it tends to switch my personality traits on a whim (outgoing and fun switches to loner and downer; shopper turns to seller, etc). so sometimes I feel like a fraud because I act differently than people expect, or even act differently than I expect of myself, or I do something I say I wouldn't normally do.

redrock

I believe I am who I say I am - though I am not just one person (no.... I don't have DID). Well.. maybe one but 'layered'/'multifaceted'. Me is me but not all get to see the whole of me, I guess. My core personality is the same but maybe sometimes tempered down for work, quieter if I'm with my old neighbour, more superficial with acquaintances,etc. My real friends get to see the lot! But we all have some chameleon in us - that's how society works - we adapt to our environment.

We share differently with the various people in different situations so I guess they see (and judge) us differently?

Whilst I do have the little 'adaptation' to the environment, I have never hidden behind the anonymity of the internet to create a whole different persona or try to project an image of someone that is not really me (but that I may wish to be? Or think I am but 'real life' people won't accept?). Nor have I done that in real life either - waaaaaaaaaaaaay to difficult to keep it up, I would have thought!

So... forthright or not? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm..... Sort of!

Told you it might mess with my mind!

hedonist

redrock wrote:

We share differently with the various people in different situations so I guess they see (and judge) us differently?

This speaks volumes.

Plus, I think we may perceive (and maybe therefore portray?) ourselves differently than we actually are...kinda like what was said in a psych class I took years ago - there's how you see yourself, how others see yourself, how you WANT others to see you, and how you actually are.

(My mind's being a-messed with now too! )

I've had some people who don't know me very well make startlingly accurate assessments of me...then again, the complete opposite as well.

Perception...

As far as being candid, I typically am, though will withhold information if I feel it's no one's business.

And I'll say this too - the fact that someone speaks their mind doesn't mean I'm going to embrace said mind or the thoughts that come from it.

Cosmo

hedonist wrote:

There is how you see yourself,
how others see yourself,
how you WANT others to see you, and
how you actually are.

...
That is it... in a nutshell.
I think this one is the one that is most pervasive: 'How you WANT others to see you'
and this is the one least seen: 'How you actually are'
...
That is how we get things like Facebook. Where we put the things we want people to see about us... except for our secretive addiction to porn.
...
Hmmm... wait... I just admitted to being addicted to porn. Is that a personal secret or did I want you to know that?

brianlux

hedonist wrote:

redrock wrote:

We share differently with the various people in different situations so I guess they see (and judge) us differently?

This speaks volumes.

Plus, I think we may perceive (and maybe therefore portray?) ourselves differently than we actually are...kinda like what was said in a psych class I took years ago - there's how you see yourself, how others see yourself, how you WANT others to see you, and how you actually are.

(My mind's being a-messed with now too! )

I've had some people who don't know me very well make startlingly accurate assessments of me...then again, the complete opposite as well.

Perception...

As far as being candid, I typically am, though will withhold information if I feel it's no one's business.

And I'll say this too - the fact that someone speaks their mind doesn't mean I'm going to embrace said mind or the thoughts that come from it.

Yeah, as soon as the thought crossed my mind it started messing around in my head a bit. I'm pretty much a "what you see is what you get" kind of person and I mostly try to say clearly what it is I believe and what I'm thinking and keep working on having an open mind and seeing others perceptions. The toughest one for me is the difficulty that comes up when I disagree with someone I like, admire or care for and don't want to say something to jeopardize that relationship. I want to remain true to what I believe but at the same time don't want to lose a friend. That's partly due having grown up with very little self-confidence having to work hard to build that from the floor up but it's also come from a few rejections. (One potential friend stopped talking to me when he asked me to guess his name and I guess too high-- which was pretty weird. I've never answered that question again.) In the long run, I've learned it's best open to other peoples' ideas but at the same time stand firm by what you most strongly believe. I have to remember that if I speak my mind openly and someone disagrees, I'll be forgiven or accepted by those who are true friends and/or open minded associates.

Cosmo

brianlux wrote:

Yeah, as soon as the thought crossed my mind it started messing around in my head a bit. I'm pretty much a "what you see is what you get" kind of person and I mostly try to say clearly what it is I believe and what I'm thinking and keep working on having an open mind and seeing others perceptions. The toughest one for me is the difficulty that comes up when I disagree with someone I like, admire or care for and don't want to say something to jeopardize that relationship. I want to remain true to what I believe but at the same time don't want to lose a friend. That's partly due having grown up with very little self-confidence having to work hard to build that from the floor up but it's also come from a few rejections. (One potential friend stopped talking to me when he asked me to guess his name and I guess too high-- which was pretty weird. I've never answered that question again.) In the long run, I've learned it's best open to other peoples' ideas but at the same time stand firm by what you most strongly believe. I have to remember that if I speak my mind openly and someone disagrees, I'll be forgiven or accepted by those who are true friends and/or open minded associates.

...
All that means is you are normal. When someone matters to you, you can still disagree with them and leave that on that level. and that at times, it is best to leave certain things unsaid... because you know he perspon well enough to know how they will react (or over-react).
Also... some things that are on your mind... need to stay on your mind. Like, it is better to keep that dream about you banging your friend's wife, doggy-style, on a beach where the waves were made of chocolate pudding while The Beatles were playing on the shelves in a hardware store... away from your friend's ears.

gimmesometruth27

Jason P wrote:

What if I claimed I was a liar, but in fact was lying about it?

:think:

MIND=BLOWN

:shock:

brianlux

Cosmo wrote:

Like, it is better to keep that dream about you banging your friend's wife, doggy-style, on a beach where the waves were made of chocolate pudding while The Beatles were playing on the shelves in a hardware store... away from your friend's ears.

Unexpected turn in thread! :shock:



But yes, I get what you're saying. Cosmo.

riotgrl

Aren't we always evolving? I'm not exactly the same person I was in my 20s, I've grown into my personality and become more comfortable with who I am. Alot of my key characteristics are the same - I'm essentially an introvert who prefers low key and quiet but I'm a teacher and I've had to overcome some of those tendencies. I'd like to think I'm always forthright but as redrock mentioned sometimes I amplify some characteristics and mute others as the situation calls for. Certainly at home and with my friends I am at full volume

Cosmo

riotgrl wrote:

Aren't we always evolving? I'm not exactly the same person I was in my 20s, I've grown into my personality and become more comfortable with who I am. Alot of my key characteristics are the same - I'm essentially an introvert who prefers low key and quiet but I'm a teacher and I've had to overcome some of those tendencies. I'd like to think I'm always forthright but as redrock mentioned sometimes I amplify some characteristics and mute others as the situation calls for. Certainly at home and with my friends I am at full volume

...
Still... aren't there things in all of us that will never reach the light of day? Things we are just too embarassed or ashamed to admit that we think, have done... or do?

mickeyrat

brianlux wrote:

Just for grins, shits and giggles along that winding road that leads most philosophical threads towards oblivion...
Forthrightness (a subset of truthfulness, a subset of truth).
In general, are people who and what they say they are?
Are you who and what you say you are?

I've thought for a long time now, that it isnt for me to say who or what I am. Thats something for everyone else to judge or determine. Which is to say they will see me as I am to them.

If it WERE mine to say, to others anyway, I dont believe anyone should believe me then. That would be based out of my ego for the most part.

riotgrl

Cosmo wrote:

riotgrl wrote:

Aren't we always evolving? I'm not exactly the same person I was in my 20s, I've grown into my personality and become more comfortable with who I am. Alot of my key characteristics are the same - I'm essentially an introvert who prefers low key and quiet but I'm a teacher and I've had to overcome some of those tendencies. I'd like to think I'm always forthright but as redrock mentioned sometimes I amplify some characteristics and mute others as the situation calls for. Certainly at home and with my friends I am at full volume

...
Still... aren't there things in all of us that will never reach the light of day? Things we are just too embarassed or ashamed to admit that we think, have done... or do?

Certainly, that is true. For me, I think I'm at that point in my life that I care less what others think of me and just want to be ME. Sometimes, that means others don't like me or respect me or think well of me because we don't see eye to eye but being myself and being true to myself has become just as important.

Jeanwah

brianlux wrote:

In general, are people who and what they say they are?
Are you who and what you say you are?

Are you talking about the ego or the true person? Because they're two different things.

It's quite difficult to be your true self when out in public because the ego takes over the minute we're around people.

I've been attempting to stop the ego more and more and just BE around people. It's hard! There's our social selves and our true selves. Both different.

Edit: But at the same time, it's easier to proclaim who you are on a message board than in person. No one here knows each other in person, so it's easier to speak who we really are rather than worry about social tendencies and any awkwardness that may show itself in person.

Cosmo

Jeanwah wrote:

Are you talking about the ego or the true person? Because they're two different things.

It's quite difficult to be your true self when out in public because the ego takes over the minute we're around people.

I've been attempting to stop the ego more and more and just BE around people. It's hard! There's our social selves and our true selves. Both different.

Edit: But at the same time, it's easier to proclaim who you are on a message board than in person. No one here knows each other in person, so it's easier to speak who we really are rather than worry about social tendencies and any awkwardness that may show itself in person.

...
That is true... who we are in public is not necessarily who we are when we are alone. And online is completely different. I am Cosmo, the cat that smokes cigarettes out here because of my abnormal paranoia of the internet. But, I'm pretty much spew the same words here (concerning my views and opinions and generally scruffy social skills)... as in the real world. Ask Hedonist... we've met in the Real World. And I can attest, that she is pretty much the 'What you read is what you get' kind of gal.
And i will freely admit... I am a completely different dancer when I'm in the real world... then when it's only me and the cats in the house. It is a pretty frightening sight.

fear4freedom

I do beieve that I live my principles and values in such a way that is felt by others. Over the past 10 years I have strived to be sober, hardworking, faithful, loyal and patriotic! I am sober because for most of my life I was not! Now its time to appreciate my temple that GOD has given me. I am hardworking in a sense that if I do a job for a customer and I underbid it, then they get more services for their money, and thats a gift from me, with joy! The quality of my work has improved greatly and is as good as it can be, due to all the experience and wisdom that comes with 30 years of hands-on. I am faithful to my fellow people, my GOD, my country, and my customers. I have faith in people...even though most dont. I have faith in God. I have faith in the things I cannot see and I do have faith that there are good things happening, even when we cannot see it or fathom it. I dont just claim im a Christian.....I live it! I dont just wear the shirt, or post it on my facebook, I live it, I do it, I act it out....as actions speak louder than words. I do everything I can to lift people up whenever I can. I am loyal to my customers, my family members, my girlfriend and my friends. I am a man of my word, and when i make a promise, you better believe Im not going to forget about you. I always think of how I can help others at all costs. As far as patriotism...sure I am patriotic because I believe in the "idea" of the American Dream and American Exceptionalism. I believe that we are in a unique place in time and in history to help the weak, fight evil and promote freedom, liberty and peace for the entire world!
I believe that we have done many things well, and we have failed at many others. But mostly, I believe that we are special because we at least tried them. I believe we are exceptional because.....we are!

I dont just wear the label....I LIVE IT, ACT IT, EXPRESS IT, LOVE IT! Life is a breath of fresh air and while we are renting our bodies and passing through this life here on earth.....I will do my best to be Christ-like!

I will do my best to be honest and therefore....will probably die financially poor, but very rich in....YES...very rich in life!

Cosmo

Jason P wrote:

What if I claimed I was a liar, but in fact was lying about it?

:think:

...
A double negative. Saying you are a liar... and lying about being a liar... means... it is true, you are a liar.
...
Not a bad thing... just means you are a human being that has empathy for other human beings. You will not tell someone the truth that their kid looks like Gollum... or you won't tell her that her ass looks big in those pants because her ass is big... or you will lie to her and tell her that everything is going to be okay, when you know, for a fact, it isn't.
You are just being human... and not being an asshole.

comebackgirl

I agree with redrock in that we show different parts of ourselves when with different people. I also agree with riotgirl in that we are always evolving. I can be wildly full of contradictions depending on my mood, the situation and how much rest I've gotten (or haven't gotten)...sometimes extremely patient...sometimes impulsive and wildly impatient...sometimes silly and giddy...sometimes overly serious...sometimes shy and totally introverted...sometimes gregarious and outgoing. These are all parts of me and I am getting to know myself better every day. When I figure out exactly out who that is I will let you know

Cosmo

comebackgirl wrote:

I agree with redrock in that we show different parts of ourselves when with different people. I also agree with riotgirl in that we are always evolving. I can be wildly full of contradictions depending on my mood, the situation and how much rest I've gotten (or haven't gotten)...sometimes extremely patient...sometimes impulsive and wildly impatient...sometimes silly and giddy...sometimes overly serious...sometimes shy and totally introverted...sometimes gregarious and outgoing. These are all parts of me and I am getting to know myself better every day. When I figure out exactly out who that is I will let you know

...
But, deep down... you know who you are, right? You know what your fears are, you know what your beliefs are. You know secrets that only you know. Secrets, dreams. fantasies, fears.. all of that that never goes out in public. There are certain rocks in the garden we tend that are better off left unturned.
There is nothing wrong with that. It is just part of the experience of being human.

comebackgirl

Cosmo wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

I agree with redrock in that we show different parts of ourselves when with different people. I also agree with riotgirl in that we are always evolving. I can be wildly full of contradictions depending on my mood, the situation and how much rest I've gotten (or haven't gotten)...sometimes extremely patient...sometimes impulsive and wildly impatient...sometimes silly and giddy...sometimes overly serious...sometimes shy and totally introverted...sometimes gregarious and outgoing. These are all parts of me and I am getting to know myself better every day. When I figure out exactly out who that is I will let you know

...
But, deep down... you know who you are, right? You know what your fears are, you know what your beliefs are. You know secrets that only you know. Secrets, dreams. fantasies, fears.. all of that that never goes out in public. There are certain rocks in the garden we tend that are better off left unturned.
There is nothing wrong with that. It is just part of the experience of being human.

Yes...I know who I am at my core. Many of those things are unchanging. I enjoy learning about myself as much as I enjoy learning about other people though; exploring why my feelings about certain things or people have changed or why I might have a strong reaction to someone (good or bad).

brianlux

fear4freedom wrote:

I do beieve that I live my principles and values in such a way that is felt by others. Over the past 10 years I have strived to be sober, hardworking, faithful, loyal and patriotic! I am sober because for most of my life I was not! Now its time to appreciate my temple that GOD has given me. I am hardworking in a sense that if I do a job for a customer and I underbid it, then they get more services for their money, and thats a gift from me, with joy! The quality of my work has improved greatly and is as good as it can be, due to all the experience and wisdom that comes with 30 years of hands-on. I am faithful to my fellow people, my GOD, my country, and my customers. I have faith in people...even though most dont. I have faith in God. I have faith in the things I cannot see and I do have faith that there are good things happening, even when we cannot see it or fathom it. I dont just claim im a Christian.....I live it! I dont just wear the shirt, or post it on my facebook, I live it, I do it, I act it out....as actions speak louder than words. I do everything I can to lift people up whenever I can. I am loyal to my customers, my family members, my girlfriend and my friends. I am a man of my word, and when i make a promise, you better believe Im not going to forget about you. I always think of how I can help others at all costs. As far as patriotism...sure I am patriotic because I believe in the "idea" of the American Dream and American Exceptionalism. I believe that we are in a unique place in time and in history to help the weak, fight evil and promote freedom, liberty and peace for the entire world!
I believe that we have done many things well, and we have failed at many others. But mostly, I believe that we are special because we at least tried them. I believe we are exceptional because.....we are!

I dont just wear the label....I LIVE IT, ACT IT, EXPRESS IT, LOVE IT! Life is a breath of fresh air and while we are renting our bodies and passing through this life here on earth.....I will do my best to be Christ-like!

I will do my best to be honest and therefore....will probably die financially poor, but very rich in....YES...very rich in life!

I will admit you are very true to your beliefs and are sincere in expressing those beliefs- I've always said that.

By "we" do you mean Christians? Americans? This is an international forum. I'm not sure how all this refers to being forthright. Within the topic of forthrightness, I'm just not sure how you got from there to how great "we" are at doing all these wonderful things you talk about or why we are "special" and "exceptional" --compared to whom?

Cosmo

comebackgirl wrote:

Yes...I know who I am at my core. Many of those things are unchanging. I enjoy learning about myself as much as I enjoy learning about other people though; exploring why my feelings about certain things or people have changed or why I might have a strong reaction to someone (good or bad).

...
And really... in the big scheme of things... isn't that what really matters?
I mean, you don't need the adulation of others as long as you and your core beliefs... driven by the humanity at your core... are true. People will move towards those whom are honest and forthright in their words, backed up by their actions. Anyone can tell you what a wonderful person they are and how they love everyone and are caring and giving... then, say or do things to the contrary. Like the example I use about some of my co-workers that organize our Christmas Adopt a Family and are all about the spiirit of Christmas and giving... but come March/April... the same single mother is a leech and a whore. That says it all.
Anyway... you seem very nice and honest... but, truthfully... i really can't say for sure. The same works the other way... you can only base your judgement on who I am.... by what I type... and if what I type is true. For all you know... I may be Charles Manson, right?

comebackgirl

Cosmo wrote:

comebackgirl wrote:

Yes...I know who I am at my core. Many of those things are unchanging. I enjoy learning about myself as much as I enjoy learning about other people though; exploring why my feelings about certain things or people have changed or why I might have a strong reaction to someone (good or bad).

...
And really... in the big scheme of things... isn't that what really matters?
I mean, you don't need the adulation of others as long as you and your core beliefs... driven by the humanity at your core... are true. People will move towards those whom are honest and forthright in their words, backed up by their actions. Anyone can tell you what a wonderful person they are and how they love everyone and are caring and giving... then, say or do things to the contrary. Like the example I use about some of my co-workers that organize our Christmas Adopt a Family and are all about the spiirit of Christmas and giving... but come March/April... the same single mother is a leech and a whore. That says it all.
Anyway... you seem very nice and honest... but, truthfully... i really can't say for sure. The same works the other way... you can only base your judgement on who I am.... by what I type... and if what I type is true. For all you know... I may be Charles Manson, right?

I agree that's what matters most. We have to live with ourselves and hopefully be at peace with ourselves. I think it's important to try and be open to seeing our faults and our inconsistencies...even though that can be painful, that is how we can grow. Even if I don't agree with someone's feedback or assessment of me, I try to sit with it for a moment and see what they're seeing and see if maybe there is a bit of truth in it, and if so, if it's something I want to work on. Sometimes it's really a projection of themselves and needs to be seen as such, and sometimes there is some truth to it...and sometimes I'm ok with that. I have to be at peace with me, regardless of what anyone else thinks of me. I think people do a better job of showing you who they are then telling you who they are. When in doubt, I always look to their behavior.
Thank you Cosmo...maybe we will meet at a show and you will be able tell a little bit more if that's true. If anything you will know that I am, in fact, very short and I like my heels for a reason Regardless...I'm pretty sure you're a fabulous dancer when it's just you and the cats

fear4freedom

brianlux wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

I do beieve that I live my principles and values in such a way that is felt by others. Over the past 10 years I have strived to be sober, hardworking, faithful, loyal and patriotic! I am sober because for most of my life I was not! Now its time to appreciate my temple that GOD has given me. I am hardworking in a sense that if I do a job for a customer and I underbid it, then they get more services for their money, and thats a gift from me, with joy! The quality of my work has improved greatly and is as good as it can be, due to all the experience and wisdom that comes with 30 years of hands-on. I am faithful to my fellow people, my GOD, my country, and my customers. I have faith in people...even though most dont. I have faith in God. I have faith in the things I cannot see and I do have faith that there are good things happening, even when we cannot see it or fathom it. I dont just claim im a Christian.....I live it! I dont just wear the shirt, or post it on my facebook, I live it, I do it, I act it out....as actions speak louder than words. I do everything I can to lift people up whenever I can. I am loyal to my customers, my family members, my girlfriend and my friends. I am a man of my word, and when i make a promise, you better believe Im not going to forget about you. I always think of how I can help others at all costs. As far as patriotism...sure I am patriotic because I believe in the "idea" of the American Dream and American Exceptionalism. I believe that we are in a unique place in time and in history to help the weak, fight evil and promote freedom, liberty and peace for the entire world!
I believe that we have done many things well, and we have failed at many others. But mostly, I believe that we are special because we at least tried them. I believe we are exceptional because.....we are!

I dont just wear the label....I LIVE IT, ACT IT, EXPRESS IT, LOVE IT! Life is a breath of fresh air and while we are renting our bodies and passing through this life here on earth.....I will do my best to be Christ-like!

I will do my best to be honest and therefore....will probably die financially poor, but very rich in....YES...very rich in life!

I will admit you are very true to your beliefs and are sincere in expressing those beliefs- I've always said that.

By "we" do you mean Christians? Americans? This is an international forum. I'm not sure how all this refers to being forthright. Within the topic of forthrightness, I'm just not sure how you got from there to how great "we" are at doing all these wonderful things you talk about or why we are "special" and "exceptional" --compared to whom?

I simply described how I was patriotic as a personal trait that I act on and carry out! That led to my description of why!

hedonist

Cosmo wrote:

...
That is true... who we are in public is not necessarily who we are when we are alone. And online is completely different. I am Cosmo, the cat that smokes cigarettes out here because of my abnormal paranoia of the internet. But, I'm pretty much spew the same words here (concerning my views and opinions and generally scruffy social skills)... as in the real world. Ask Hedonist... we've met in the Real World. And I can attest, that she is pretty much the 'What you read is what you get' kind of gal.
And i will freely admit... I am a completely different dancer when I'm in the real world... then when it's only me and the cats in the house. It is a pretty frightening sight.

Thanks, Cos...I'd say the same - that you're as decent and odd (in a good way!) and funny and honest in person as you are here.

(I'd also say the same about the cats thing, after having just played with them. I think only the man I live with sees - and thank god, embraces - that particular side of me :P )

As to being forthright, earlier this evening I lit the menorah in my Dad's honor. It doesn't hold religious significance for me, but it did for him. He always encouraged me to be open with him, even if he wouldn't be comfortable with what I'd share - and so I was. In fact, he moreso encouraged that honesty within myself, no matter the end-result - and so I've been, or try to be. It's like a duty, almost - though a good one, in the end.

The candles are still going here, burning down. Behind the menorah is a photo of my dad in his army uniform; he was maybe 20 years old. Smiling. Small photo of him and me in the corner of the frame, his arm around me. Next to that frame, a picture of his parents, when life was good for them.

I find comfort in it, in that candle-lit scene.

Sorry for the semi-offtopicness...he was my pillar of honesty, and this thread, along with the ritual earlier, just felt connected in a sweet way.

Anyway, I really dig threads like this - the perspectives, the insights, even the mind-bends

fear4freedom

fear4freedom wrote:

brianlux wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

I do beieve that I live my principles and values in such a way that is felt by others. Over the past 10 years I have strived to be sober, hardworking, faithful, loyal and patriotic! I am sober because for most of my life I was not! Now its time to appreciate my temple that GOD has given me. I am hardworking in a sense that if I do a job for a customer and I underbid it, then they get more services for their money, and thats a gift from me, with joy! The quality of my work has improved greatly and is as good as it can be, due to all the experience and wisdom that comes with 30 years of hands-on. I am faithful to my fellow people, my GOD, my country, and my customers. I have faith in people...even though most dont. I have faith in God. I have faith in the things I cannot see and I do have faith that there are good things happening, even when we cannot see it or fathom it. I dont just claim im a Christian.....I live it! I dont just wear the shirt, or post it on my facebook, I live it, I do it, I act it out....as actions speak louder than words. I do everything I can to lift people up whenever I can. I am loyal to my customers, my family members, my girlfriend and my friends. I am a man of my word, and when i make a promise, you better believe Im not going to forget about you. I always think of how I can help others at all costs. As far as patriotism...sure I am patriotic because I believe in the "idea" of the American Dream and American Exceptionalism. I believe that we are in a unique place in time and in history to help the weak, fight evil and promote freedom, liberty and peace for the entire world!
I believe that we have done many things well, and we have failed at many others. But mostly, I believe that we are special because we at least tried them. I believe we are exceptional because.....we are!

I dont just wear the label....I LIVE IT, ACT IT, EXPRESS IT, LOVE IT! Life is a breath of fresh air and while we are renting our bodies and passing through this life here on earth.....I will do my best to be Christ-like!

I will do my best to be honest and therefore....will probably die financially poor, but very rich in....YES...very rich in life!

I will admit you are very true to your beliefs and are sincere in expressing those beliefs- I've always said that.

By "we" do you mean Christians? Americans? This is an international forum. I'm not sure how all this refers to being forthright. Within the topic of forthrightness, I'm just not sure how you got from there to how great "we" are at doing all these wonderful things you talk about or why we are "special" and "exceptional" --compared to whom?

I simply described how I was patriotic as a personal trait that I act on and carry out! That led to my description of why!

I meant Americans when i said "we", however "christians that act" are also special!

CAVSTARR313

I am VGL