Your honest light-hearted analysis here!

josevolution

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

aerial wrote:

I can understand your anger! but the racist remarks really piss me off!

No. You do not get to "there there, dear" me and say you understand why I'm "angry."

You should be angry, too. I'm not hispanic but I WAS horrified by the "papers please" laws that would make harassing Latino American citizens in Arizona legal. We all know that the point of that law was to make people with brown skin afraid to go out in public so the old white people in Phoenix didn't have to see them.

AND....

No. You don't get to cry racism.

Racism is hatred of a race. And when I single out "old, white, crotchety men," that pretty much points out that it isn't the entire white "race" that I'm pointing to. I'm white myself and I'm just fine with sharing the country with people who aren't. In fact.. I like it. If everybody looked the same, we'd get tired of looking at each other.

I'm pointing out an unavoidable fact.

Back in the 1950s, white men ruled the country. They were in virtually every leadership position from politics, commerce, culture and entertainment. There were no black senators, no Asian news anchors, no Latino men hosting TV variety shows and don't even get me started on how all gay characters in movies were either murders murder victims or limp-wristed caricatures meant only for comedy relief.

There were no "white community leaders" murdered in the 60s but there WERE countless men like Malcolm X, Dr. Matin Luther King, Nedgar Evars and even "get out the vote" volunteers who were killed.

And back then, men worked, women stayed home and cooked and cleaned and voted how their husbands told them. That is the "Traditional America" that people like Bill O'Reilly, Mike Huckabee and James Dobson want to return to and that's the "Traditional America" that Mitt Romney clearly revealed he thinks still rules. His comments about how working women sometimes need to leave early to go home and "cook dinner" showed that he still finds the career woman quaint.

You can try to ignore my very valid argument and pat me on the head saying "I understand why you would be angry" and then call me a racist. But I'm not going to let you get away with it.

Pointing out that America is now a diverse population with many different races and kinds of families isn't "racist." It's just pointing out the truth. Pointing to how the former holders of power are calling our very existence an "attack on traditional America"isn't "racist."

As I've said MANY times here and in other places... Sorry if my bringing up my sexual orientation annoys you. Give me full rights under the law and I promise I'll never mention it again. If that to you is "racist," you're just going to have to adapt to a new world where minorities vote against parties that single them out and attack them with laws and rhetoric like that of Bill O'Reilly.

Prince you nailed it perfectly

Zoso

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

aerial wrote:

I can understand your anger! but the racist remarks really piss me off!

No. You do not get to "there there, dear" me and say you understand why I'm "angry."

You should be angry, too. I'm not hispanic but I WAS horrified by the "papers please" laws that would make harassing Latino American citizens in Arizona legal. We all know that the point of that law was to make people with brown skin afraid to go out in public so the old white people in Phoenix didn't have to see them.

AND....

No. You don't get to cry racism.

Racism is hatred of a race. And when I single out "old, white, crotchety men," that pretty much points out that it isn't the entire white "race" that I'm pointing to. I'm white myself and I'm just fine with sharing the country with people who aren't. In fact.. I like it. If everybody looked the same, we'd get tired of looking at each other.

I'm pointing out an unavoidable fact.

Back in the 1950s, white men ruled the country. They were in virtually every leadership position from politics, commerce, culture and entertainment. There were no black senators, no Asian news anchors, no Latino men hosting TV variety shows and don't even get me started on how all gay characters in movies were either murders murder victims or limp-wristed caricatures meant only for comedy relief.

There were no "white community leaders" murdered in the 60s but there WERE countless men like Malcolm X, Dr. Matin Luther King, Nedgar Evars and even "get out the vote" volunteers who were killed.

And back then, men worked, women stayed home and cooked and cleaned and voted how their husbands told them. That is the "Traditional America" that people like Bill O'Reilly, Mike Huckabee and James Dobson want to return to and that's the "Traditional America" that Mitt Romney clearly revealed he thinks still rules. His comments about how working women sometimes need to leave early to go home and "cook dinner" showed that he still finds the career woman quaint.

You can try to ignore my very valid argument and pat me on the head saying "I understand why you would be angry" and then call me a racist. But I'm not going to let you get away with it.

Pointing out that America is now a diverse population with many different races and kinds of families isn't "racist." It's just pointing out the truth. Pointing to how the former holders of power are calling our very existence an "attack on traditional America"isn't "racist."

As I've said MANY times here and in other places... Sorry if my bringing up my sexual orientation annoys you. Give me full rights under the law and I promise I'll never mention it again. If that to you is "racist," you're just going to have to adapt to a new world where minorities vote against parties that single them out and attack them with laws and rhetoric like that of Bill O'Reilly.

how many times do people on here have to clairfy.. being the majoirty and very lucky to be the majoirty by definition can't cry racism... old white men coontrol the world.. no one opporesses old white men or white men generally.

Cosmo

Zoso wrote:

how many times do people on here have to clairfy.. being the majoirty and very lucky to be the majoirty by definition can't cry racism... old white men coontrol the world.. no one opporesses old white men or white men generally.

...
Seriously... people in power in America need to quit complaining about not having a White History Month or a White Entertainment Channel.
If they DID have these things... it would mean that they were in the minority and History classes would dominated from a perspective other than their own and Television would have 100 channels of Tyler Perry Shows and they would have one channel of their own.
...
Be careful what you wish for... it may just come true.

pandora

Zoso wrote:

how many times do people on here have to clairfy.. being the majoirty and very lucky to be the majoirty by definition can't cry racism... old white men coontrol the world.. no one opporesses old white men or white men generally.

That's all I hear is prejudice against old white men and the rich folk.

They are not popular

MotoDC

PoD wrote:

We all know that the point of that law was to make people with brown skin afraid to go out in public so the old white people in Phoenix didn't have to see them.

No, we don't, and honestly I have to believe even you don't literally think that. At any rate, what's unreasonable about asking suspected illegal aliens for their paperwork? The trouble is in identifying the suspected. And although that is enough for me personally not to support the law, that's far from the accusation you lay out.

PoD wrote:

No. You don't get to cry racism.

I can't speak for aerial, but I'm not crying racism. That plays much too nicely into your antagonistic "wounded butterfly" (or whatever you said) nonsense from another thread. However, my personal lack of victimhood or oppression doesn't change the inherent racism in your multiple posts like this since the election. Take any of them (you've got plenty to choose from) and replace any those "old white man" concepts and replace white with "black". See how it sounds to you.

Racism is hatred of a race

If that were true, we wouldn't have any of the EEOC laws. For example, I don't have to "hate" a race to prefer working with people who look, sound, act like me over people who don't. I could have black or latino friends, not consider it a social stigma to be with them, but still not hire them. Employment discrimination doesn't require "hate" but is certainly a form of racism. A better technical definition (and certainly the one more common in today's parlance) would be any action or decision or judgement based on race/skin color rather than a person's actions or words.

All that said, there's no small irony in how you've defined racism in the midst of an attempt to justify your inimical vitriol against old white men, "crotchety" or otherwise.

Back in the 1950s, white men ruled the country. They were in virtually every leadership position from politics, commerce, culture and entertainment. There were no black senators, no Asian news anchors, no Latino men hosting TV variety shows and don't even get me started on how all gay characters in movies were either murders murder victims or limp-wristed caricatures meant only for comedy relief.

No argument there. I'd say we've come a long way. The problem with the way you express this is that it's only in your extreme, liberal head that conservatives actually want the world to be that way. Some may -- there are crazies all over -- but I can almost guarantee you no one on this board does, even those you disagree with regularly and most vehemently. When most conservatives talk about "taking the country back", we aren't picturing black men in chains for fuck's sake (and the fact that you might even believe something along those lines is worthy of some thought); we're talking about personal accountability, earning your keep, all that good stuff.

Now then, you believe liberal policies are the path (back, in my opinion) to those things, conservatives would disagree. That's the critical point of contention which I'm not even going to discuss. I'm not posting here to get you to agree with the conservative path, rather to be honest in your assertions about the end goals.

Pointing out that America is now a diverse population with many different races and kinds of families isn't "racist."

Don't kid yourself; that's barely the tip of the iceberg of what you were saying. And in any case is not what aerial (I bet) is reacting to.

"I'm concerned about what the prevalence of black men in prison says about our judicial system."
versus
"Why are there so many negroes in prison!"

Same topic, but not even close to the same meaning. How you say shit matters.

But the end of the story is that "Traditional America" is gone because what he MEANS is "back in the 50s when the blacks and the latinos and the gays didn't vote and the wives voted how their husbands told them to."

Sigh. That's all I can muster for this nonsense. Wait, who is "he" here? I've lost track. Eh, It doesn't matter, in your head, it's any old white man. Which is why your point of view is racist. And probably ageist (?). But yeah mostly the former.

Cosmo

fear4freedom wrote:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/oreilly-lambastes-obama-secular-progressives-who-are-bent-on-destroying-traditional-america/

Your true honest analysis here without getting angry please
Keep it pithy, honest and empathetic!

...
Okay... I read the transcript and this is basically what he says...
Traditional America is gone because:
A. There are too many poor people... specifically single mothers with kids born out of wedlock.
B. Pot.
...
Well to address the former cause of Traditional America going away... how about investing in EDUCATION that shows people how poverty increases with the number of uneducated young mothers out there on their own.
Traditional America would have forced/shotgun marriages where the Man of the House could beat the crap out of the wife for having those stupid kids and ruining his life. Divorce is not a part of Traditional America... is it? So, doesn't that mean both are trapped in a marriage that was basically a mistake? Is that the sanctity of Marriage I'm always hearing about? Because if it is, it sounds like it has some real deep inherent flaws.
Also, Traditional America had abortions being done with bent wire coat hangars in back alleys. Don't think you want to bring that back... kind of nasty.
As for pot... how does it differ from alcohol and Prohibition? People aren't going to be forced to smoke pot... just as people today are not forced to drink booze. It's just that, we won't have a bunch of people in jail for buying, smoking or selling pot. Let Phillip-Morris sell pot and create a whole industry around pot/hemp.

fear4freedom

Thank you all for your analysis! Your responses say alot about who you are! Pandora, Aerial and some others have an open mind for being middle of the road! Bill O is middle of the road and for some of you who spew hate and shape a debate with race, class, creed or gender really need to lighten up alittle, Geez! There was no reason to get mad, angry or divisive here! Just a conversation about traditional America and BILL O!

As far as traditional America....i think its gone forever.....not that its a bad thing....but its gone!

I believe that America is good and provides hope to many around the world. I believe we lift up others who need it! I believe we need to preserve our economy and wealth generating machine for the good of all of humanity! We actually create wealth from nothing. We create it, meaning that if someone gets rich, someone else doesnt get poor from it! In a society that we envision....everyone has more! We wish for everyone to have more! We need to remember to thank the successful, the innovative and the risk takers! For some reason I think we forget to do that!

So today let us thank those who create jobs, wealth and hope! We sometimes forget that everything we see, utilize and consume....comes from the wealth that is created from our innovators, risk-takers, hard workers, and our successful! Thanks!

Cosmo

fear4freedom wrote:

Thank you all for your analysis! Your responses say alot about who you are! Pandora, Aerial and some others have an open mind for being middle of the road! Bill O is middle of the road and for some of you who spew hate and shape a debate with race, class, creed or gender really need to lighten up alittle, Geez! There was no reason to get mad, angry or divisive here! Just a conversation about traditional America and BILL O!

As far as traditional America....i think its gone forever.....not that its a bad thing....but its gone!

I believe that America is good and provides hope to many around the world. I believe we lift up others who need it! I believe we need to preserve our economy and wealth generating machine for the good of all of humanity! We actually create wealth from nothing. We create it, meaning that if someone gets rich, someone else doesnt get poor from it! In a society that we envision....everyone has more! We wish for everyone to have more! We need to remember to thank the successful, the innovative and the risk takers! For some reason I think we forget to do that!

So today let us thank those who create jobs, wealth and hope! We sometimes forget that everything we see, utilize and consume....comes from the wealth that is created from our innovators, risk-takers, hard workers, and our successful! Thanks!

...
Question: How is anything that you said... gone? And if something is gone... please, tell me what is gone.
...
Also, this middle of the road your are speaking of... it's the middle of the right lane only you are talking about, right? Otherwise, you have no clue what Left and Right is... Bill O'Rielly... middle of the road? Really? You have never read any of his books, watched any of his shows or listened to any of his radio broadcasts, have you?

Prince Of Dorkness

MotoDC wrote:

my personal lack of victimhood or oppression doesn't change the inherent racism in your multiple posts like this since the election. Take any of them (you've got plenty to choose from) and replace any those "old white man" concepts and replace white with "black". See how it sounds to you.

Well when you can point to a huge number of well-funded black men with a TV network that employs a very disproportionate number of old black men, sitting around and bemoaning how the election was lost because "all those lazy minorities want to sit around and get stuff given to them," I'll happily take a look at it.

Ignoring the historical point of my post is the only way you can even answer anything... it's often the way white people defend the racism that's ingrained in our history and culture. They ask you to picture everything backwards and then ask if you'd give the black people a pass had they said the same thing.

I don't have to "hate" a race to prefer working with people who look, sound, act like me over people who don't. I could have black or latino friends, not consider it a social stigma to be with them, but still not hire them. Employment discrimination doesn't require "hate" but is certainly a form of racism. A better technical definition (and certainly the one more common in today's parlance) would be any action or decision or judgement based on race/skin color rather than a person's actions or words.

All that said, there's no small irony in how you've defined racism in the midst of an attempt to justify your inimical vitriol against old white men, "crotchety" or otherwise.

Um... you realize that "crotchety white men" isn't a race unto itself, right?

The problem with the way you express this is that it's only in your extreme, liberal head that conservatives actually want the world to be that way.

Then tell us... what did he mean by "Traditional America?"

When most conservatives talk about "taking the country back", we aren't picturing black men in chains for fuck's sake (and the fact that you might even believe something along those lines is worthy of some thought);

WOW... ok... that's pretty rich. I said that the old white men wanted to go back to the 1950s. And you somehow interpret that as slavery. You know that the Emancipation Proclamation was in 1863, right?

"I'm concerned about what the prevalence of black men in prison says about our judicial system."
versus
"Why are there so many negroes in prison!"

Yes it is. Now picture Maya Angelou and Bill O'Reilly each saying one of those things. Tell me which one Maya sais and which one came from Bill.

That's all I can muster for this nonsense. Wait, who is "he" here? I've lost track. Eh, It doesn't matter, in your head, it's any old white man. Which is why your point of view is racist. And probably ageist (?). But yeah mostly the former.

It's so cute that you think anyone buys your big bag of bullshit. I was quite careful to point out that not all white people think like that... And my father is an old white man... so is the Vice President and so is Bill Clinton and I'm quite sure none of those guys think that.

But it was fun watching you trying to confuse issues and take things to the absurd levels you did just to try to derail what I said.

Nice try, though, I'll give you that.

dignin

Cosmo wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

Thank you all for your analysis! Your responses say alot about who you are! Pandora, Aerial and some others have an open mind for being middle of the road! Bill O is middle of the road and for some of you who spew hate and shape a debate with race, class, creed or gender really need to lighten up alittle, Geez! There was no reason to get mad, angry or divisive here! Just a conversation about traditional America and BILL O!

As far as traditional America....i think its gone forever.....not that its a bad thing....but its gone!

I believe that America is good and provides hope to many around the world. I believe we lift up others who need it! I believe we need to preserve our economy and wealth generating machine for the good of all of humanity! We actually create wealth from nothing. We create it, meaning that if someone gets rich, someone else doesnt get poor from it! In a society that we envision....everyone has more! We wish for everyone to have more! We need to remember to thank the successful, the innovative and the risk takers! For some reason I think we forget to do that!

So today let us thank those who create jobs, wealth and hope! We sometimes forget that everything we see, utilize and consume....comes from the wealth that is created from our innovators, risk-takers, hard workers, and our successful! Thanks!

...
Question: How is anything that you said... gone? And if something is gone... please, tell me what is gone.
...
Also, this middle of the road your are speaking of... it's the middle of the right lane only you are talking about, right? Otherwise, you have no clue what Left and Right is... Bill O'Rielly... middle of the road? Really? You have never read any of his books, watched any of his shows or listened to any of his radio broadcasts, have you?

Are you seriously expecting a common sense answer? If so I think you have come to the wrong place. Bill O'Rielly has no place in any kind of rational conversation, who cares what he has to say anymore. We need to let this thread die a quick death.

Prince Of Dorkness

For the record... today one of the new stars of a movie we're casting told me I was "really hot for an old guy."

So apparently I'm an old white man, too. And probably crotchety. But you'll never hear me whine about how the makeup of our country's population is changing. Because that's just the reality of the 21st century.

dignin

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

For the record... today one of the new stars of a movie we're casting told me I was "really hot for an old guy."

So apparently I'm an old white man, too. And probably crotchety. But you'll never hear me whine about how the makeup of our country's population is changing. Because that's just the reality of the 21st century.

Old balls

Prince Of Dorkness

fear4freedom wrote:

for some of you who spew hate and shape a debate with race, class, creed or gender really need to lighten up alittle, Geez! There was no reason to get mad, angry or divisive here! Just a conversation about traditional America and BILL O!

I love how you intentionally post the most vile, racist, homophobic asshole you can find than then say anyone who supports his BS is "middle of the road."

This isn't "just a conversation about traditional America" at all. And you know it.

And you've got some nerve blubbering about people who "spew hate and shape the debate with race, class, creed or gender" when Bill O'Reilly said that Republicans lost the election and it was the fault of "the blacks and the latinos." Guess he forgot to add "Americans" at the end.

Cosmo

dignin wrote:

Are you seriously expecting a common sense answer? If so I think you have come to the wrong place. Bill O'Rielly has no place in any kind of rational conversation, who cares what he has to say anymore. We need to let this thread die a quick death.

...
Where's my gun?

norm

Cosmo wrote:

dignin wrote:

Are you seriously expecting a common sense answer? If so I think you have come to the wrong place. Bill O'Rielly has no place in any kind of rational conversation, who cares what he has to say anymore. We need to let this thread die a quick death.

...
Where's my gun?

obama took it from you...don't you remember? right after he got re-elected...i think it was friday

Cosmo

norm wrote:

Cosmo wrote:

dignin wrote:

Are you seriously expecting a common sense answer? If so I think you have come to the wrong place. Bill O'Rielly has no place in any kind of rational conversation, who cares what he has to say anymore. We need to let this thread die a quick death.

...
Where's my gun?

obama took it from you...don't you remember? right after he got re-elected...i think it was friday

...
Damn you, Obamaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhh!!!

fear4freedom

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

fear4freedom wrote:

for some of you who spew hate and shape a debate with race, class, creed or gender really need to lighten up alittle, Geez! There was no reason to get mad, angry or divisive here! Just a conversation about traditional America and BILL O!

I love how you intentionally post the most vile, racist, homophobic asshole you can find than then say anyone who supports his BS is "middle of the road."

This isn't "just a conversation about traditional America" at all. And you know it.

And you've got some nerve blubbering about people who "spew hate and shape the debate with race, class, creed or gender" when Bill O'Reilly said that Republicans lost the election and it was the fault of "the blacks and the latinos." Guess he forgot to add "Americans" at the end.

LOL Your responses say ALOT about you and liberalism in general! You could post a video of the most evil man saying the most evil thing in the world and I would not have gotten bitter one bit! See....I believe all zones are free speech zones and you have the freedom to post whatever, whoever and whereever you wish, as long as its within the guidelines! You are one of those liberals that would love to shut things down if you dont agree huh? You would shut people up if you could huh? You would use beurocracy and the FCC to shut people that you dont agree with , down! HuH? I know your types! LOL Very revealing here to see it!

Prince Of Dorkness

fear4freedom wrote:

You could post a video of the most evil man saying the most evil thing in the world and I would not have gotten bitter one bit!

I know. You'd agree with him.

Prince Of Dorkness

fear4freedom wrote:

You are one of those liberals that would love to shut things down if you dont agree huh? You would shut people up if you could huh? You would use beurocracy and the FCC to shut people that you dont agree with , down! HuH? I know your types! LOL Very revealing here to see it!

Oh dear.

Are you hearing voices again?

Prince Of Dorkness

fear4freedom wrote:

OL Your responses say ALOT about you and liberalism in general!

Yes. That we're sick and tired of conservatives pretending to "just want to have a discussion" when it's clear they want to create a big shit storm and then marvel at it.

And hey.. if someone posts something negative... cry about the FCC (like what?) and then say they don't believe in "free speech."

Honestly... this is such textbook troll bait.