Jewish Settler Attacks = Terrorism

Byrnzie

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

(1) What are the steps that need to be taken by the international community to thwart the cleansing tactics of Israel? And (2)... who leads such a change effort?

At what point does the world demand Israel reform? And short of simply recognizing the problem for what it is... what steps can people take from their corner of the world to help?

Does the world care enough for the Palestinian people to come to their defence?

The whole World recognizes the occupation as illegal, and the whole World supports a U.N Resolution - U.N 242 - that calls for an immediate withdrawal of Israeli's from the territory it occupied during, and after, the 1967 war.
Every year at the Security Council the whole World votes to implement this resolution, and every year the U.S stands alone in the World in opposing it, and uses it's power of automatic veto to block it. This has been the case for the past 45 years. The whole World on one side, and the U.S and Israel on the other.

What can you do? Write to your local representative and tell him that you're disgusted that your tax dollars are funding the ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians. Tell him you're disgusted that $4Billion of U.S tax dollars are being used to pay for weapons that are being used to murder children - 3 Palestinian children every day, on average, for the past 13 years.

I wrote to my local representative in England a couple of times regarding this issue. His name came up in the news as he'd castigated somebody publicly for stating that the present borders of Israel could not be permanent, or words to that effect. This MP then accused her of trying to 'delegitimize Israel', e.t.c. - he basically just trotted out all of the usual platitudes that he'd been fed over the years by the British media.
Anyway, I wrote him a long letter, and he appeared to respond well to it.

yosi

Constructive. As ever.

Byrnzie

yosi said:

Constructive. As ever.

Yosi said you should put pressure on your local representatives. I said you should write to your local representatives. Yosi then makes a snide remark about my advice being 'constructive'.

Funny that.

Byrnzie

So, it looks like the 15 year old American boy, beaten by Israeli police, is the cousin of Mohammed Abu Khdair, the 16 year old Palestinian who was abducted and burnt to death during the rampage of Israeli's through Palestinian areas, largely inspired and instigated by Netanyahu.

Byrnzie

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.603232
Our wretched Jewish state

Now we know: In the Jewish state, there is pity and humane feelings only for Jews, rights only for the Chosen People. The Jewish state is only for Jews.

By Gideon Levy - 06.07.14

The youths of the Jewish state are attacking Palestinians in the streets of Jerusalem, just like gentile youths used to attack Jews in the streets of Europe. The Israelis of the Jewish state are rampaging on social networks, displaying hatred and a lust for revenge, unprecedented in its diabolic scope. Some unknown people from the Jewish state, purely based on his ethnicity. These are the children of the nationalistic and racist generation – Netanyahu’s offspring.

For five years now, they have been hearing nothing but incitement, scaremongering and supremacy over Arabs from this generation’s true instructor, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Not one humane word, no commiseration or equal treatment.

They grew up with the provocative demand for recognition of Israel as a “Jewish state,” and they drew the inevitable conclusions. Even before any delineation of what a “Jewish state” means – will it be a state that dons tefillin (phylacteries), kisses mezuzot (doorpost fixtures with prayer scrolls), sanctifies charms, closes down on the Sabbath and keeps strict kashrut laws? – the penny has dropped for the masses.

The mob was the first to internalize its true significance: a Jewish state is one in which there is room only for Jews. The fate of Africans is to be sent to the Holot detention center in the Negev, while that of Palestinians is to suffer from pogroms. That’s how it works in a Jewish state: only this way can it be Jewish.

In the Jewish state-in-the-making, there is no room even for an Arab who strives his utmost to be a good Arab, such as the writer Sayed Kashua. In a Jewish state, the chairman of the Knesset plenary session, MK Ruth Calderon (from Yesh Atid – the “center” of the political map, needless to say), cuts off Arab MK Ahmed Tibi (United Arab List-Ta’al), who has just returned all shaken up from a visit to the family of the murdered Arab boy from Shoafat, impudently preaching to him that he must also refer to the three murdered Jewish teens (even after he did just that).

In a Jewish state, the High Court of Justice approves the demolition of a murder suspect’s family home even before his conviction. A Jewish state legislates racist and nationalist laws.

The media in the Jewish state wallows in the murder of three yeshiva students, while almost entirely ignoring the fates of several Palestinian youths of the same age who have been killed by army fire over the last few months, usually for no reason.

No one was punished for these acts – in the Jewish state there is one law for Jews and another for Arabs, whose lives are cheap. There is no hint of abiding by international laws and conventions. In the Jewish state, there is pity and humane feelings only for Jews, rights only for the Chosen People. The Jewish state is only for Jews.

The new generation growing in its shadow is a dangerous one, both to itself and its surroundings. Netanyahu is its education minister; the militaristic and nationalist media serves as its pedagogic epic poem; the education system that takes it to Auschwitz and Hebron serves as its guide.

The new sabra (native-born Israeli) is a novel species, prickly both on the outside and the inside. He has never met his Palestinian counterpart, but knows everything about him – the sabra knows he is a wild animal, intent only on killing him; that he is a monster, a terrorist.

He knows that Israel has no partner for peace, since this is what he’s heard countless times from Netanyahu, Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman and Economy Minister Naftali Bennett. From Yair Lapid he’s heard that they are “Zoabis” – referring dismissively to MK Haneen Zoabi (Balad).

Being left wing or a seeker of justice in the Jewish state is deemed a crime, civil society is considered treacherous, true democracy an evil. In a Jewish state – dreamed of not only by the right wing but also by the supposed center-left, including Tzipi Livni and Lapid – democracy is blurred.

It’s not the skinheads that are the Jewish state’s main problem, it’s the sanctimonious eye-rollers, the thugs, the extreme right wing and the settlers. It’s not the margins but the mainstream, which is partly very nationalistic and partly indifferent.

In the Jewish state, there is no remnant of the biblical injunction to treat the minority or the stranger with justice. There are no more Jews left who marched with Martin Luther King or who sat in jail with Nelson Mandela. The Jewish state, which Israel insists the Palestinians recognize, must first recognize itself. At the end of the day, at the end of a terrible week, it seems that a Jewish state means a racist, nationalistic state, meant for Jews only.

Byrnzie

The occupation would have been brought to an end a long time ago if hadn't been routinely given a green light by Washington at the U.N. As Gideon Levy points out, the Israeli leadership have never offered any concessions at the negotiating table, they've simply argued for what they want, ignoring completely what they're entitled to under international law. This is why the occupation continues, and why people continue being killed as we speak.


http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/demands-of-a-thief-1.233907

Demands of a thief

The question of whether ending the occupation would threaten or strengthen Israel's security is irrelevant. There are not, and cannot be, any preconditions for restoring justice.

By Gideon Levy - Nov. 25, 2007

...Israel is not being asked "to give" anything to the Palestinians; it is only being asked to return - to return their stolen land and restore their trampled self-respect, along with their fundamental human rights and humanity.

...Just as a thief cannot present demands - neither preconditions nor any other terms - to the owner of the property he has robbed, Israel cannot present demands to the other side as long as the situation remains as it is.

Security? We must defend ourselves by defensive means. Those who do not believe that the only security we will enjoy will come from ending the occupation and from peace can entrench themselves in the army, and behind walls and fences. But we have no right to do what we are doing: Just as no one would conceive of killing the residents of an entire neighborhood, to harass and incarcerate it because of a few criminals living there, there is no justification for abusing an entire people in the name of our security. The question of whether ending the occupation would threaten or strengthen Israel's security is irrelevant. There are not, and cannot be, any preconditions for restoring justice.

Byrnzie

....

yosi

I was responding to your tone. For a second I thought we might actually be able to have a civil conversation on this forum.

Byrnzie

Yosi, is Gideon levy an anti-Semite?

yosi

I wouldn't say so.

Byrnzie

yosi said:

I was responding to your tone. For a second I thought we might actually be able to have a civil conversation on this forum.

In other words, you were hoping to have a conversation devoid of any inconvenient truths.

Byrnzie

yosi said:

I wouldn't say so.

Why not? According to your wide-reaching net of everything that constitutes anti-Semitism, surely he's implicated?

yosi

I also wouldn't say that you and Gideon Levy are saying the same things.

Byrnzie

But it's o.k, I think I understand:

yosi said:

It is simply because I believe it to be true

Byrnzie

yosi said:

I also wouldn't say that you and Gideon Levy are saying the same things.

No? How so?

Byrnzie

He says the Jewish state means a racist state. A state run by, and for, Jews, and to the detriment of non-Jews. Just what I said.
He also says that Israel has no desire for peace, and simply wants to keep expanding the settlements in accordance with it's Zionist ideology. Just what I said.

But I'm an anti-Semite, and he isn't? Is this because...?

yosi said:

It is simply because I believe it to be true

yosi

Byrnzie said:

He says the Jewish state means a racist state. A state run by, and for, Jews, and to the detriment of non-Jews. Just what I said.
He also says that Israel has no desire for peace, and simply wants to keep expanding the settlements in accordance with it's Zionist ideology. Just what I said.

But I'm an anti-Semite, and he isn't? Is this because...?

yosi said:

It is simply because I believe it to be true

I read his piece to be a condemnation of and a lament for what the extreme right wing, and in his view an increasing segment of the mainstream, have come to understand as the meaning of a Jewish state. I didn't read it as an indictment of the concept as such. The last paragraph in particular, I think, makes clear that in his view a Jewish state could embody liberal values. As I read it, he's condemning people who take the idea of a Jewish state and imbue it with racism. He's not saying that the concept of a Jewish state is racist as such.

That's very different than what you have said, which is that the very notion of Jewish self-determination is racist.

yosi

Also, and I know you find context to be anathema, but there's a big difference between an Israeli criticizing the racism of other Israelis out of a concern for the social fabric of his own country, and you, who thinks that the entire polity as such should cease to exist.

yosi

Byrnzie said:

Thirty Bills Unpaid said:

(1) What are the steps that need to be taken by the international community to thwart the cleansing tactics of Israel? And (2)... who leads such a change effort?

At what point does the world demand Israel reform? And short of simply recognizing the problem for what it is... what steps can people take from their corner of the world to help?

Does the world care enough for the Palestinian people to come to their defence?

The whole World recognizes the occupation as illegal, and the whole World supports a U.N Resolution - U.N 242 - that calls for an immediate withdrawal of Israeli's from the territory it occupied during, and after, the 1967 war.
Every year at the Security Council the whole World votes to implement this resolution, and every year the U.S stands alone in the World in opposing it, and uses it's power of automatic veto to block it. This has been the case for the past 45 years. The whole World on one side, and the U.S and Israel on the other.

A thorough, straightforward, and very well-sourced legal analysis of Resolution 242, written by a professor of international law.
http://jcpa.org/text/resolution242-lapidoth.pdf
Suffice it to say that the Resolution does not actually say what you claim that it says.

And here's the wikipedia bio for the author, just so we can dispense with the notion that she doesn't know what she's talking about.

Professor Ruth Lapidoth is a Senior Researcher at the Jerusalem Institute for Israel Studies and Professor Emeritus of International Law at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem. She is a recipient of the 2006 Israel Prize in Legal Studies and of the 2000 Prominent Woman in International Law Award from the WILIG group of the American Society of International Law.

Lapidoth formerly served as a Legal Advisor to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, has been a guest lecturer and researcher in several leading academic institutions, including Oxford University, Georgetown University and the American Institute for Peace, and is the author of nine books and more than ninety articles dealing with international law, human rights, the Arab-Israeli conflict, and Jerusalem.

Byrnzie

yosi said:

Also, and I know you find context to be anathema, but there's a big difference between an Israeli criticizing the racism of other Israelis out of a concern for the social fabric of his own country, and you, who thinks that the entire polity as such should cease to exist.

'Out of a concern for the social fabric of his own country'? Really? Is that why you think Gideon Levy critical of the occupation and Israel's oppression of the Palestinians? Out of a concern for the social fabric of his country? And you even have the audacity to regard that one-eyed, self-serving analysis as 'context'.