Black autographed lyric sheet for trade.

Fyfe

Looking to trade a Black lyric sheet that was signed by 3 of the guys. This piece is framed and comes with a certificate of authenticity.

I am really looking for the S/N McFarlane/Maxx242 Copenhagen print or the Munk One and Maxx242 PJ20 billboard print - I would consider a non S/N PJ20 billboard print

I am also open to other trade offers

Grandmas Jam

Someone Help this guy out!

Indi4ence

nice piece, good luck

FYI, there is no such thing as a non-S/N PJ20 Billboard Print

100 Pacer

:corn:

Fyfe

Indi4ence wrote:

nice piece, good luck

FYI, there is no such thing as a non-S/N PJ20 Billboard Print

Thanks dude... Found that out after I posted this.

Really am looking for the Copenhagen print.. And I know I can trade that billboard print for it

Suziemay

Sounds like you're looking to trade for it, but if you're willing to buy, Chad has the Spawn for sale
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=194110

Stypo420

PM sent

Fyfe

Suziemay wrote:

Sounds like you're looking to trade for it, but if you're willing to buy, Chad has the Spawn for sale
http://forums.pearljam.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=194110

I am willing to buy, but cash is lacking at the moment.

Also would sell this to cover the cost of the Copenhagen print

dimitrispearljam

so cool item...

good luck

Boxes&Books

I could be wrong here, but these sigs look a little off.... :oops: just my opinion - not trying to burn anyone.... :oops:

Fyfe

Not trying to... But that's exactly what you are doing

100 Pacer

Fyfe wrote:

Not trying to... But that's exactly what you are doing

Can you shed some more light about these signatures? How were they obtained? When were they obtained? Where were they obtained?

Stypo420

tonifig8 wrote:

I could be wrong here, but these sigs look a little off.... :oops: just my opinion - not trying to burn anyone.... :oops:

way to vomit your opinion. What exactly are you trying to accomplish with your post? The seller is a respected member of the Pearl Jam community, he may not be big on the board but never the less he is a well known completely respected member of the community on FB.

Why are you using the "oops" smiley? There is no oops your intentionally stirring shit friend....unless I'm missing something. I just don't understand your need to add your unsolicited opinion.

Fyfe

100 Pacer wrote:

Fyfe wrote:

Not trying to... But that's exactly what you are doing

Can you shed some more light about these signatures? How were they obtained? When were they obtained? Where were they obtained?

The signatures were obtained in Dublin in August of 2006 at The Point according to the COA that I have. I got this along with another signed photo from a collector in NYC.

I traded a ball signed by 4 NY Yankees from the 96 World Series team for these items; I obtained the ball through my father who has been on the NYY groundscrew since '82

100 Pacer

Fyfe wrote:

100 Pacer wrote:

Fyfe wrote:

Not trying to... But that's exactly what you are doing

Can you shed some more light about these signatures? How were they obtained? When were they obtained? Where were they obtained?

The signatures were obtained in Dublin in August of 2006 at The Point according to the COA that I have. I got this along with another signed photo from a collector in NYC.

I traded a ball signed by 4 NY Yankees from the 96 World Series team for these items; I obtained the ball through my father who has been on the NYY groundscrew since '82

Having read Stypo420's post it appears an open dialogue isn't welcome here so I will just say based on the information you provided, specifically that you were told these signatures were obtained in 2006, tonifig8 was well within his right to speak up.

Stypo420

100 Pacer wrote:

Having read Stypo420's post it appears an open dialogue isn't welcome here so I will just say based on the information you provided, specifically that you were told these signatures were obtained in 2006, tonifig8 was well within his right to speak up.

I didn't mean to come off that way...apologies...perhaps I read to much into the oops faces, there is nothing wrong with an open dialogue.

Fyfe

Having read Stypo420's post it appears an open dialogue isn't welcome here so I will just say based on the information you provided, specifically that you were told these signatures were obtained in 2006, tonifig8 was well within his right to speak up.

I understand and agree with the point you made about Stypo420's post - but I am not sure why the signatures being obtained in 2006 has anything to do with the validity of this item?

Boxes&Books

Stypo420 wrote:

PM sent

I'm not questioning the sellers integrity- I'm questioning the authenticity of these signatures- This wouldn't be the first time someone came on the board believing they owned an authentic piece and later came to discover the sigs were fake. The reason I added the oops faces were because I was a little embarrassed to chime in on the thread, but by the looks of it it seems you already made up your mind and made the seller an offer- Don't know why you would be so bothered by my comments. I did not take the sellers history into consideration, my opinion was simply based off of what I was viewing. I've been dealing with PJ autos for well over a decade, so I think I've learned a thing or two during that time. I'm not saying I'm an expert, but I've seen hundreds of examples and have a pretty good understanding.

I didn't want to come off as rude or a jerk, but these sigs in my opinion are clearly fake- Certificates of authenticity can sometimes mean squat. Just my two cents. Good luck to the seller and all involved in this. I could be 100% wrong...

My apologies if this came off rude or if broke a rule here amongst the elitist.

:arrow:

Fyfe

tonifig8 wrote:

Stypo420 wrote:

PM sent

I'm not questioning the sellers integrity- I'm questioning the authenticity of these signatures- This wouldn't be the first time someone came on the board believing they owned an authentic piece and later came to discover the sigs were fake. The reason I added the oops faces were because I was a little embarrassed to chime in on the thread, but by the looks of it it seems you already made up your mind and made the seller an offer- Don't know why you would be so bothered by my comments. I did not take the sellers history into consideration, my opinion was simply based off of what I was viewing. I've been dealing with PJ autos for well over a decade, so I think I've learned a thing or two during that time. I'm not saying I'm an expert, but I've seen hundreds of examples and have a pretty good understanding.

I didn't want to come off as rude or a jerk, but these sigs in my opinion are clearly fake- Certificates of authenticity can sometimes mean squat. Just my two cents. Good luck to the seller and all involved in this. I could be 100% wrong...

My apologies if this came off rude or if broke a rule here amongst the elitist.

:arrow:

What leads you to believe that they are clearly fake?

And how can you in one breath say clearly fake, and in the next breath say you could be 100% wrong... If you are saying you could be 100% wrong, then you can't be sure they are clearly fake

100 Pacer

Fyfe wrote:

Having read Stypo420's post it appears an open dialogue isn't welcome here so I will just say based on the information you provided, specifically that you were told these signatures were obtained in 2006, tonifig8 was well within his right to speak up.

I understand and agree with the point you made about Stypo420's post - but I am not sure why the signatures being obtained in 2006 has anything to do with the validity of this item?

The "E" in Eddie and "V" in Vedder on your lyric sheet have very subtle but specific differences when compared against legitimate examples of Ed's signature which were obtained in person during that time period. In addition, Stone's signature on your lyric sheet just doesn't compare to legitimate examples from that era. His typical signature hasn't really changed in many years (although he sometimes signs more enthusiastically than others and adds a bit of "character" in his penmanship) the letters in his name more pronounced as opposed to scribbled, with the "S" in Stone appearing here not quite like others obtained in person during that time period.

Just my observation.

Boxes&Books

Fyfe wrote:

What leads you to believe that they are clearly fake?

And how can you in one breath say clearly fake, and in the next breath say you could be 100% wrong... If you are saying you could be 100% wrong, then you can't be sure they are clearly fake

The first thing I noticed was the Mike signature(i'm guessing that's supposed to be Mike's sig) - I've never seen a mike sig with both "M" directly over one another - usually the lower "M" is more over to the right. Never have I seen the lower "m" to be smaller than the above "M" - not only that, but they are way to tight- the two ending loops run almost the same. The strokes are all sharp and have no real sloppiness. - Everything on the Mike signature points to fake (in my opinion) - nothing looks legit about it...

The Stone sig: The "s" looks tight, with no breakage at the top (some examples don't separate, but those are usually much more sloppy sigs- unlike this one), with the rest of the signature flowing and then making sharp strokes at the ends ... After seeing the Mike sig I would have my doubts about the Stone - Ed sigs


For the Ed - All you have to do is look at it from the bottom up... look at all the "d's" they are all the same. look at how smooth it flows on the bottom- almost like if your drawing a straight line with little grooves/bumps along the way.... The V is way off for that era or any era and the "e" following the "V" really did it for me. To many negatives ...

I'm sure if you posted some good up close images we could really pick these signatures apart.

- look around and compare- it's not that difficult. Look for images online and you'll start to notice some of those characteristics.... Why don't you just email santos little helper and see what he can tell you.... Maybe I'm wrong, but in my opinion to many things point to fake -- Ask some of the big collectors on the board to see how they feel. A lot of people on here have tons of experience and I'm sure they wouldn't mind giving you some friendly advise.

I'm done... this took up way to much time.

P.S
if this turns out to be fake - I'm sorry for your loss. It sucks, but that's how things sometimes go. Win some you lose some.... life goes on.

good luck

pdalowsky

Been watching this thread closely - always hate to be the guy who pours scorn on authenticity - but the thread is open enough to add a little input

To me these are fake. I too have been around and watchful of these autos over a great many years and these look very off.

It's crap to say so but as people may look to trade valuable items for this it seems important to add a bit of extra 'opinion'

I would add as a footnote - auto'd black lyrics have been a regular on eBay these last 4 years or so... Always looking like these and never really costing much. Always additional warning signs

By all means - this is just opinion but a well researched one

Stypo420

I would like to apologize again for having a negative initial reaction. The open dialogue is important and your opinions all seem thoughtful if nothing else.

Is there a definitive authority on signatures? I know someone said to email santos but are the certificates of authenticity (CA) that can be trusted without thought? or should all CA be scrutinized?

Indi4ence

I believe now a days a COA is almost meaningless unless it is signed directly from the artist or a dealer who deals with the artist directly.

I am not a professional on this matter or pretend to be one, this is just my 2 cents

JMo

I'm not an expert, but I trust tonifig8, 100 pacer and pdalowsky, because they are and have been in the collecting 'game' for years. Autographs and COA's are funny things. I see so many items that claim to come with a COA, when really it's just some dude that typed up a piece a paper and printed it out. That said, I do have some sports autographs, from childhood, that have been authenticated by PSA/DNA. I knew first hand they were real though. But sports autos are more popular and seen often, compared to music autos.

Anyway, I don't feel tonifig8 was trying to stir anything. Open dialogue is important in these forums. There was no malice involved, I'm sure.

Fyfe

I appreciate everyone's help and advice here. Going to look into figuring this out..

If anyone has a definitive place I should look to get this looked at please send me a PM.

Luckily I did not purchase this and what I traded away was a walk in the park to get.

dugangsxr

Unfortunately for me I bought that thing of the bay, paid roughly $80 bucks. Sent it to PSA to get authentication, paid about $80.00. They gave me about five reasons why it was fake. Sucks for me, I bought two items of the guy. my lyrics sheet is the same, just autos in different places. Sucks!! by time i got it back from PSA i couldn't do anything. this John L dude got me for a few hundred dollars.

Boxes&Books

In my opinion you should never ever buy an autograph simply based on a COA. The key for me is the provenance and knowing the person your buying it from. Those two things are key for me. A COA is great, but never make a decision simply based on that. Signatures aren't always going to look the same, due to the circumstances of where/how the item was signed or the era when it was signed.

One board member might not always have the right answer, but if you ask around I'm sure you'll get some solid advise and make a solid informed decision, while at the same time educating yourself. I've had conversations with other long time collectors where we have disagreed on the authenticity of an item, so it's always best to get good solid support from a team of collectors, especially for the high end items.
There are ton's of signed items on the bay that come with COA and they're clearly fake, regardless of which company authenticated the piece. But There are also tons of good items on the bay with or with out the COA. Just educate yourself a little and then pull the trigger. Signatures are awesome, even if it wasn't you who got the signature... Just my opinion of course.

Good luck to everyone ...

Fyfe

dugangsxr wrote:

Unfortunately for me I bought that thing of the bay, paid roughly $80 bucks. Sent it to PSA to get authentication, paid about $80.00. They gave me about five reasons why it was fake. Sucks for me, I bought two items of the guy. my lyrics sheet is the same, just autos in different places. Sucks!! by time i got it back from PSA i couldn't do anything. this John L dude got me for a few hundred dollars.

John Lyonne is the name on my COA as well

John Lyonne
5 Swords Business PK
Swords
Co. Dublin 9
Ireland

dugangsxr

Yep, I purchased the items about four or five years ago. It sucks there's nothing you can do. I lost about three hundred dollars, at least you didnt get burnt that bad. Still sucks though.

Wilds

Fyfe wrote:

I appreciate everyone's help and advice here. Going to look into figuring this out..

If anyone has a definitive place I should look to get this looked at please send me a PM.

Luckily I did not purchase this and what I traded away was a walk in the park to get.

In my opinion there is a definitive place to look, and you have already found it. It is my opinion that between 100 pacer, tonifig8, pdalowsky, and wilds, there is no better place to look for Pearl Jam autograph opinions.

The other two choices are PSA/DNA or JSA authentications houses, or sending it to the Ten Club.

I trust the people on this board way more than those two costly authentication houses, and if truth be told, more than the ten club, although I've yet to see them get one wrong.

As to the item at hand. It has been denounced by all knowledgeable people on this board, AND the exact same item from the exact same seller, with the exact same worthless COA was found to be fake by PSA/DNA the leading authentication house in the country.

And now by me. It is an unfortunate thing to own, but the autographs in question are terrible fakes.

Not even good ones in my opinion.

The forger has put down an early 00's signature on an item he claims was signed in 2006. This is very obvious with the "Eddie Vedder" signature.

The Mike McCready is the most interesting. To me it looks like the forger copied Mikes autograph while looking into a mirror. The M's as usually constructed appear to be on the right of both his first and last name.

And the Stone is poorly formed.

None of these match up.

Sorry for taking so long to ring in, and hopefully I'm not coming across too harsh. Just wanted to make sure you don't spend any money trying to get this authenticated.

Wilds