Ohio school shooter likely tried as an adult

Godfather.
Godfather. Posts: 12,504
edited March 2013 in A Moving Train
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/01/justice/o ... ?hpt=ju_c1

any thoughts ? he is probably 16 or 17.

Godfather.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,437
    That's old enough to know it's very, very wrong to unload a clip into a bunch of random human beings. He is defective and needs to be recalled.
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    Jason P wrote:
    That's old enough to know it's very, very wrong to unload a clip into a bunch of random human beings. He is defective and needs to be recalled.
    Agreed.

    And I'm sorry (somewhat) for chuckling at your last comment.
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 25,079
    they try 13 year olds as adults.

    in the eyes of the law, this kid is an adult.

    he premeditated shooting up that cafeteria. he is gonna get convicted on 3 murder counts as an adult.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • MedozK
    MedozK Tennessee Posts: 9,212
    edited March 2012
    Jason P wrote:
    That's old enough to know it's very, very wrong to unload a clip into a bunch of random human beings. He is defective and needs to be recalled.
    If that had been my son or daughter that was killed...he wouldnt get the chance to be tried as an adult..I would take care of him.
  • blackredyellow
    blackredyellow Posts: 5,888
    He's 17, I'm all for trying him as an adult.


    From the link above:
    The Plain Dealer newspaper in Cleveland reported that his parents had both been charged with domestic violence against each other. His father also served prison time for assaulting a police officer and was charged with holding a different woman under running water and bashing her head into a wall, the newspaper reported.


    Geez... you gotta wonder if this kid ever had a chance to get through life without being involved in something bad...
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    blackredyellow wrote:
    He's 17, I'm all for trying him as an adult.


    From the link above:
    The Plain Dealer newspaper in Cleveland reported that his parents had both been charged with domestic violence against each other. His father also served prison time for assaulting a police officer and was charged with holding a different woman under running water and bashing her head into a wall, the newspaper reported.


    Geez... you gotta wonder if this kid ever had a chance to get through life without being involved in something bad...

    doomed from the start,what a shame.

    Godfather.
  • gimmesometruth27
    gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 25,079
    Godfather. wrote:
    blackredyellow wrote:
    He's 17, I'm all for trying him as an adult.


    From the link above:
    The Plain Dealer newspaper in Cleveland reported that his parents had both been charged with domestic violence against each other. His father also served prison time for assaulting a police officer and was charged with holding a different woman under running water and bashing her head into a wall, the newspaper reported.


    Geez... you gotta wonder if this kid ever had a chance to get through life without being involved in something bad...

    doomed from the start,what a shame.

    Godfather.
    yep. it is sad. kids like him never stand a chance.

    family of origin can be a motherfucker sometimes.

    this kid was dealt a shitty hand the day he was born.

    most of us do not realize how lucky we are if we come from stable and functional families. we take it for granted sometimes.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    blackredyellow wrote:
    He's 17, I'm all for trying him as an adult.


    From the link above:
    The Plain Dealer newspaper in Cleveland reported that his parents had both been charged with domestic violence against each other. His father also served prison time for assaulting a police officer and was charged with holding a different woman under running water and bashing her head into a wall, the newspaper reported.


    Geez... you gotta wonder if this kid ever had a chance to get through life without being involved in something bad...

    doomed from the start,what a shame.

    Godfather.
    yep. it is sad. kids like him never stand a chance.

    family of origin can be a motherfucker sometimes.

    this kid was dealt a shitty hand the day he was born.

    most of us do not realize how lucky we are if we come from stable and functional families. we take it for granted sometimes.

    so true man.

    Godfather.
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    gimmesometruth27 wrote:
    yep. it is sad. kids like him never stand a chance.

    family of origin can be a motherfucker sometimes.

    this kid was dealt a shitty hand the day he was born.

    most of us do not realize how lucky we are if we come from stable and functional families. we take it for granted sometimes.
    what are they finding out about this kid and his family background?
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,437
    There are reports he will be tried as a juvenile w/ 3 counts of aggregated murder ....

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/01/deadline-looms-for-charges-in-ohio-high-school-shooting/
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • Idris
    Idris Posts: 2,317
    The way we go on when these sad things happen. Like he was destined to pick up a gun and slaughter people. Doomed? Really?

    For me, to my mind...This is a telling sign of society, a failure on many levels, at home, at school. The entire system.

    Godfather, if you took this child into your care when he was in infant, sure perhaps he would still end up doing the same thing? Maybe he's genetically predisposed to do this?

    For all we know, if this kid held off a couple more years, maybe he would've joined the military been sent to Afghanistan and in that setting he would kill, maybe slaughter an entire village? But of course, then we would not call him a killer, we refer to him as a "Hero".

    Yea JasonP 17 is old enough to know that it's bad to kill a bunch of random human beings...Unless it's by some order and you are trained to do the killing.

    This kid had a hard upbringing, like many people, but unlike many people, he acted out, by directly killing people.

    At 15 he was charged with assaulting another student, the assault? He put a kid in a head lock and punched him. I personally wonder why he did that. Was he walking one day, saw some kid and did that to him?

    What age is an adult? 17? 16? 24? What makes someone an adult? Pubes? Patience?
  • blackredyellow
    blackredyellow Posts: 5,888
    Jason P wrote:
    There are reports he will be tried as a juvenile w/ 3 counts of aggregated murder ....

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/01/deadline-looms-for-charges-in-ohio-high-school-shooting/

    I'm guessing that's just the preliminary charges. They had to charge him by this afternoon, there can always be charges added, or efforts to try him as an adult.
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    Idris wrote:
    The way we go on when these sad things happen. Like he was destined to pick up a gun and slaughter people. Doomed? Really?

    For me, to my mind...This is a telling sign of society, a failure on many levels, at home, at school. The entire system.

    Godfather, if you took this child into your care when he was in infant, sure perhaps he would still end up doing the same thing? Maybe he's genetically predisposed to do this?

    For all we know, if this kid held off a couple more years, maybe he would've joined the military been sent to Afghanistan and in that setting he would kill, maybe slaughter an entire village? But of course, then we would not call him a killer, we refer to him as a "Hero".

    Yea JasonP 17 is old enough to know that it's bad to kill a bunch of random human beings...Unless it's by some order and you are trained to do the killing.

    This kid had a hard upbringing, like many people, but unlike many people, he acted out, by directly killing people.

    At 15 he was charged with assaulting another student, the assault? He put a kid in a head lock and punched him. I personally wonder why he did that. Was he walking one day, saw some kid and did that to him?

    What age is an adult? 17? 16? 24? What makes someone an adult? Pubes? Patience?
    I truly understand what you are saying but these are all "if's" and we will never know,nobody will ever know but we know one thing for sure his life up to this point was not a good one.

    Godfather.
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,437
    Idris wrote:

    Yea JasonP 17 is old enough to know that it's bad to kill a bunch of random human beings...Unless it's by some order and you are trained to do the killing.

    This kid had a hard upbringing, like many people, but unlike many people, he acted out, by directly killing people.

    At 15 he was charged with assaulting another student, the assault? He put a kid in a head lock and punched him. I personally wonder why he did that. Was he walking one day, saw some kid and did that to him?

    What age is an adult? 17? 16? 24? What makes someone an adult? Pubes? Patience?
    13 is when you become an adult, according to Jewish law. I don't think that number is too far off. That seems to be when most parents start trusting their kids to be more responsible and in return give them more freedom to act on their own. I'm not saying they have evolved enough to be an average adult, but I don't think most people can claim that at age 18 either. I was probably in my late twenties before starting to figure things out.

    I don't know if a report of a previous fight is a big deal. I imagine most of us were in a scrap or two before getting out of high school.

    And this shooting did not occur in a theater of war. I know that may not satisfy you, but it's one of the oddities of the human society that has evolved over thousands of years.
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • FiveB247x
    FiveB247x Posts: 2,330
    I'm against the death penalty so I think this is inherently wrong but would add a few comments to think bout:

    - It wasn't that long ago in our nation's history that a 16yr old was considered an adult for mostly all matters (except voting). Nowadays, we have a very protectionist view of "children" and in many respects it does more harm than good. Perhaps it has to do with the life expectancy or something but mostly, these type of cultural meme's are made up by some arbitrary law or guideline and just applied to other areas of focus and then legitimized as such for the rest of society.

    - In the US by statistics alone comparing the number of people to guns, almost 1 of every 2 people would have a gun. Considering how large a ratio that is, it's very surprising we don't see more shootings and people going around doing such things.

    - In situations like these, people usually become very polar in their opinions about gun control or similar. I usually view these things as two fold - 1 - It's a sign of parenting or lack their of. 2 - It's a failure of society to not have recognized this person in need of help for health (mental and other) issues. For things to get to this level or step, a lot of overlooking and ignoring of problems had to be going on and sadly this is how we find out. It's usually not common for a person to just wake up one day and do such a thing.
    CONservative governMENt

    Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
  • mikalina
    mikalina Posts: 7,206
    The young man who went on a shooting spree is 17 yrs old. He grew up in a violent home life -
    ( no excuse for shooting ) but clearly has mental issues.

    He father served prison time for trying to kill his mother. I'm sure the list goes on....

    I hope he is tried as an adult.

    3 students were shot and killed.
    ********************************************************************************************* image
  • DriftingByTheStorm
    DriftingByTheStorm Posts: 8,684
    His only company to confide in was the vermin in the street.
    He longed for only one thing, the world to bow at his feet.
    They too should feel his secret fear. The dismal drear.
    His pain had made him sincere.

    He was better than the rest,
    all those ones he detests,
    within their castles, so vain. Selfish and conceited.
    They couldn’t care less about the peasants they mistreated.

    The world is a sandbox for all the wretched sinners.
    They simply create what they want and make themselves the winners.
    But the true winner, he has nothing at all.
    Enduring the pain of waiting for that castle to fall.

    Through his good deeds,
    the rats and the fleas.
    He will have for what he pleads,
    through the eradication of disease.
    So, to the castle he proceeds,
    like an ominous breeze through the trees.

    - TJ Lane, Relentlessly Bullied Teen,
    Facebook post prior to shooting

    Lane was described as a "good kid" with "impressive grades", who was "doubling up" on classes to graduate early. A fellow student who made extra effort to get to know him says that he was obviously greatly pained by his family life, which he would never mention in conversation, and that she says she knows first hand of the constant bullying and verbal abuse which Lane took by classmates who would make fun of his hair cut, the clothes he wore, and the fact that he was a quiet person. She said that he was genuinely likable and kind; she also said that he never responded to the bullying except by "being quiet" when harassed.
    If I was to smile and I held out my hand
    If I opened it now would you not understand?
  • blackredyellow
    blackredyellow Posts: 5,888
    DriftingByTheStorm wrote:
    His only company to confide in was the vermin in the street.
    He longed for only one thing, the world to bow at his feet.
    They too should feel his secret fear. The dismal drear.
    His pain had made him sincere.

    He was better than the rest,
    all those ones he detests,
    within their castles, so vain. Selfish and conceited.
    They couldn’t care less about the peasants they mistreated.

    The world is a sandbox for all the wretched sinners.
    They simply create what they want and make themselves the winners.
    But the true winner, he has nothing at all.
    Enduring the pain of waiting for that castle to fall.

    Through his good deeds,
    the rats and the fleas.
    He will have for what he pleads,
    through the eradication of disease.
    So, to the castle he proceeds,
    like an ominous breeze through the trees.

    - TJ Lane, Relentlessly Bullied Teen,
    Facebook post prior to shooting

    Lane was described as a "good kid" with "impressive grades", who was "doubling up" on classes to graduate early. A fellow student who made extra effort to get to know him says that he was obviously greatly pained by his family life, which he would never mention in conversation, and that she says she knows first hand of the constant bullying and verbal abuse which Lane took by classmates who would make fun of his hair cut, the clothes he wore, and the fact that he was a quiet person. She said that he was genuinely likable and kind; she also said that he never responded to the bullying except by "being quiet" when harassed.

    You left out the second half... it turns very dark and violent...
    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... -lane.html

    "Stay back!" The Guards screamed as they were thrown to their knees.
    "Oh God, have mercy, please!"
    The castle, she gasped and then so imprisoned her breath,
    to the shallow confines of her fragile chest.

    I'm on the lamb but I ain't no sheep.
    I am Death.
    And you have always been the sod.
    So repulsive and so odd.
    You never even deserved the presence of God, and yet, I am here.

    Around your cradle I plod.
    Came on foot, without shod.
    How improper, how rude.
    However, they shall not mind the mud on my feet if there is blood on your sheet.
    Now! Feel death, not just mocking you.
    Not just stalking you but inside of you.

    Wriggle and writhe.
    Feel smaller beneath my might.
    Seizure in the Pestilence that is my scythe.
    Die, all of you.
    My whole life
    was like a picture
    of a sunny day
    “We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
    ― Abraham Lincoln
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/01/mo ... latestnews

    this is what I was getting at as far as youth thinking and frame of mimnd ^^^
    this young gal (18)really thinks she is in love with a man over twice her age, Im not trying to justify the shooting and killing this young kid did I'm just saying that at that age they're thinking isen't really always ...spot on, especially with the childhood this young man had.

    Godfather.
  • pandora
    pandora Posts: 21,855
    A human brain does not fully mature nor understand consequence until mid twenties.
    It is full tilt action without forethought driven by basic emotions and recklessness.

    For me personally, after raising teens, my own and other parent's kids,
    I do not consider them an adult until that age.
    And boy do I see a difference in my young people now!

    I think we need laws for that in between time 13 to say 23
    that would provide punishment, direction and mental and family help.
    Not just say they committed an adult crime so that makes
    them an adult....
    cause it certainly does not.

    This boy is a victim also in my eyes, being bullied, being taught violence solves
    problems, and now if he is tried as an adult, thrown in prison for life, he is
    a victim of the system.

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