I have seen many non believers believe as they are passing from this world
a sudden revelation, a path complete who's to say
Really?! That's fascinating. How many? What did they say?
Say :?
in the months days hours up to leaving this world they knew God some
believed Christ was their savior
they found a faith they had not known in their lives until that point,
my point of course
perhaps they had been fence sitters
Oh, I see.
I didnt know you meant months, days, hours...I thought it was more of something they did/said AS they were dying, or taking their final breaths.
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
We wouldn't want to hurt our brains by actually thinking, Brian!
The ol' "I'm too smart to need God."
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
Sometimes I see a great heart in you, a passion, an understanding, one would think you would
understand passion in others.
That rationalism, critical thinking, skepticism has it's place but is made complete
with feeling passion and the grandeur of faith.
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
Sometimes I see a great heart in you, a passion, an understanding, one would think you would
understand passion in others.
That rationalism, critical thinking, skepticism has it's place but is made complete
with feeling passion and the grandeur of faith.
Kind of like the whole sha-bang!
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism made complete by.....faith?
Alrighty then.
Bright eyed kid: "Wow Typo Man, you're the best!"
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
Why is it that if you don't believe, or even if you just don't believe that religion has a place in politics that you feel like you have to cut down believers and people of faith by saying they don't think? Such bullshit.
I've met a lot of smart religious people and plenty of dumbass non-believers.
Oh, I see.
I didnt know you meant months, days, hours...I thought it was more of something they did/said AS they were dying, or taking their final breaths.
I've known a few like that too.
I was with my big sister as she passed from cancer those final days
she a spiritual person but not so much a believer of God,
more in the power that is us as part of a universe.
God was there with her in the end though, this she could feel.
After as we planned her funeral in a tiny room
in the basement of the funeral parlor ...
the light bulb over the table ... over our heads ... exploded
shattering glass everywhere tripping off the electricity.
As we sat in the blackness stunned we all knew that was Blythe, feeling her presence.
She let us know the power that was her in this life lives on, her spirit lives on.
I feel her often with me, she is an inspiration to me.
Feeling an important part of our abilities often muted by rationalism
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
Sometimes I see a great heart in you, a passion, an understanding, one would think you would
understand passion in others.
That rationalism, critical thinking, skepticism has it's place but is made complete
with feeling passion and the grandeur of faith.
Kind of like the whole sha-bang!
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism made complete by.....faith?
Alrighty then.
yes completed by faith by knowing by feeling
we use so little of our brains ... we can tap into more
Why is it that if you don't believe, or even if you just don't believe that religion has a place in politics that you feel like you have to cut down believers and people of faith by saying they don't think? Such bullshit.
I've met a lot of smart religious people and plenty of dumbass non-believers.
yeah, I feel like a released a torrent of hateful rhetoric by both sides, that wasn't my intention by starting this thread.
My intention was to express that rationality and logic belong in politics and in debate, and religion does not. Religion or spirituality is a personal thing and proselytization makes me sick, especially when it is part of the policy debate which directly affects my life.
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
Oh, I see.
I didnt know you meant months, days, hours...I thought it was more of something they did/said AS they were dying, or taking their final breaths.
I've known a few like that too.
I was with my big sister as she passed from cancer those final days
she a spiritual person but not so much a believer of God,
more in the power that is us as part of a universe.
God was there with her in the end though, this she could feel.
After as we planned her funeral in a tiny room
in the basement of the funeral parlor ...
the light bulb over the table ... over our heads ... exploded
shattering glass everywhere tripping off the electricity.
As we sat in the blackness stunned we all knew that was Blythe, feeling her presence.
She let us know the power that was her in this life lives on, her spirit lives on.
I feel her often with me, she is an inspiration to me.
Feeling an important part of our abilities often muted by rationalism
Interesting. Thanks for sharing. Sorry for the loss of your Sister.
I find stories like this so interesting. Hard to understand -- where people are coming from or where they're going in their final minutes -- but in these instances, maybe we shouldnt think too hard about it.
Why is it that if you don't believe, or even if you just don't believe that religion has a place in politics that you feel like you have to cut down believers and people of faith by saying they don't think? Such bullshit.
I've met a lot of smart religious people and plenty of dumbass non-believers.
great post, i think the reason is that it easy to insult other people views than to accept others.
this happens on both sides. religion is a tool that people use. for some it makes them happy and thats ok. we all use tools to make us happy.
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
We wouldn't want to hurt our brains by actually thinking, Brian!
The ol' "I'm too smart to need God."
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
Yes, civilizations have been trying for 200,000 years to explain that which cannot be explained. So, they make up stories/myths/fantasies.
I will never put any faith into something that relies on which part of the planet Earth I was born on, or the family I was born into.
Why is it that if you don't believe, or even if you just don't believe that religion has a place in politics that you feel like you have to cut down believers and people of faith by saying they don't think? Such bullshit.
I've met a lot of smart religious people and plenty of dumbass non-believers.
Because religion - on a national, global scale - is a hindrance to progress.
Though I'm also considering voting for Mitt in an effort to move the republican party, if ever so slightly, away from where they are. I really wish Jon Hunstman had a chance in hell.
No one I agree with even close to 100% so I'm really just not sure.
Though I'm also considering voting for Mitt in an effort to move the republican party, if ever so slightly, away from where they are. I really wish Jon Hunstman had a chance in hell.
No one I agree with even close to 100% so I'm really just not sure.
You are probably closer to Obama than you realise
Yes he is. Obama is basically a middle of the road republican.
Though I'm also considering voting for Mitt in an effort to move the republican party, if ever so slightly, away from where they are. I really wish Jon Hunstman had a chance in hell.
No one I agree with even close to 100% so I'm really just not sure.
You are probably closer to Obama than you realise
Or Obama is closer to being a Republican then you realize.
Though I'm also considering voting for Mitt in an effort to move the republican party, if ever so slightly, away from where they are. I really wish Jon Hunstman had a chance in hell.
No one I agree with even close to 100% so I'm really just not sure.
Though I'm also considering voting for Mitt in an effort to move the republican party, if ever so slightly, away from where they are. I really wish Jon Hunstman had a chance in hell.
No one I agree with even close to 100% so I'm really just not sure.
You are probably closer to Obama than you realise
Or Obama is closer to being a Republican then you realize.
My natural home would be a middle of the road republican, like huntsman, but Obama is as good
Faith and dogma may be a valid part of the human experience for many or most of us, but it should never be mistaken for, or compete with, logic, reasoning, deduction, etc. It hurts my brain that this is even a discussion. I respect the fact that people feel powerful things in their heart of hearts, but in no way, shape, or form is that acceptable evidence of anything external to those feelings.
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win ."
Faith and dogma may be a valid part of the human experience for many or most of us, but it should never be mistaken for, or compete with, logic, reasoning, deduction, etc. It hurts my brain that this is even a discussion. I respect the fact that people feel powerful things in their heart of hearts, but in no way, shape, or form is that acceptable evidence of anything external to those feelings.
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
We wouldn't want to hurt our brains by actually thinking, Brian!
The ol' "I'm too smart to need God."
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
To rely only on belief; to behold your entire existence and fate of your entire life to your faith... it's just not an intelligent way to live. (it's actually quite lazy) Balance is crucial to living a full life and that means balancing faith with reasoning, personal responsibility and critical thinking.
Faith and dogma may be a valid part of the human experience for many or most of us, but it should never be mistaken for, or compete with, logic, reasoning, deduction, etc. It hurts my brain that this is even a discussion. I respect the fact that people feel powerful things in their heart of hearts, but in no way, shape, or form is that acceptable evidence of anything external to those feelings.
I'm glad you have it all figured out
Godfather.
That's not what he said.
Bright eyed kid: "Wow Typo Man, you're the best!"
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,430
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism seem to be viewed as too much trouble, too much "wear and tear on brain tissues" as Edward Abbey once mused. It's so much easier to rely on myth or to not think at all. This is a troubling characteristic of our time.
We wouldn't want to hurt our brains by actually thinking, Brian!
The ol' "I'm too smart to need God."
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
Start struggling? Scared? Friend, everyday is a struggle for me and "malignant" is just a protracted word for the end result of life of which I have come extremely close to on more than one occasion. (And, no, I won't bore you with the details- that's irrelevant.) I'm sure near death experience, addiction, psychological struggles and terminal illness are all valid reasons for seeking something that gives one solace and I don't pass judgement on those who go that route- it's just not my thing. But what I'm referring to is the fact that more people rely on religion (which is a form of myth) more so than rational thinking. And I think making a joke about that is just as good a reaction as throwing one's hand's up in the air and I do that as well depending on my mood... or how badly my shoulder hurts. Today I'd rather make jokes.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
i will embrace the end of my life with open arms. in fact i will welcome it and rejoice that finally this life that i never asked for, but am eternally grateful for is coming to its close. i shall not be scared... why should i be. i shall not turn to the heavens and ask why.. nor shall i seek comfort and solace there. i shall look at my life and see things i couldve done better but did to my best at the time. i shall look at those that are close to me and know i am where i ought to be. we will support each other on this final journey and i will die taking my last breath as a smile with all the love given to me and that i have given calming my soul.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I would not want your baggage when the truth in death comes to us, that's a risky gamble my friend.
Godfather.
and this says it all. you don't believe in god because he speaks to you or of some "pandorish truth" you know, it is out of nothing more than FEAR that you have either acquired or have been taught at some point in your life.
all you are doing with your beliefs is rolling the dice. "if I believe and god exists, I'm good. if I believe, and he doesn't exist, oh well, no harm done. just covering all my bases".
Gimli 1993
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
i will embrace the end of my life with open arms. in fact i will welcome it and rejoice that finally this life that i never asked for, but am eternally grateful for is coming to its close. i shall not be scared... why should i be. i shall not turn to the heavens and ask why.. nor shall i seek comfort and solace there. i shall look at my life and see things i couldve done better but did to my best at the time. i shall look at those that are close to me and know i am where i ought to be. we will support each other on this final journey and i will die taking my last breath as a smile with all the love given to me and that i have given calming my soul.
Catefrancis, I think this is one of the finest benedictions to life I have ever read.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
I would not want your baggage when the truth in death comes to us, that's a risky gamble my friend.
Godfather.
and this says it all. you don't believe in god because he speaks to you or of some "pandorish truth" you know, it is out of nothing more than FEAR that you have either acquired or have been taught at some point in your life.
all you are doing with your beliefs is rolling the dice. "if I believe and god exists, I'm good. if I believe, and he doesn't exist, oh well, no harm done. just covering all my bases".
you forgot the "a"
you should have wrote panborish Would better describe just how you feel about the subject
why can others not have their own truth? why must you fight that?
dead people making lightbulbs explode. sweet fancy moses.
you know nothing to speak on the subject but that does not surprise me
are you heartless too?
I sat in the dark with her two stunned children ... both in their early thirties
both losing their mother decades before they should
both grieving a horrible loss broken by my sisters struggle to live
and the finality of seeing her in her coffin just moments before.
and my nieces tiny voice whispered ..." that's my Mom" ...
we all knew it was but for someone like you, a closed mind that can not open,
you refuse to consider and you must be hurtful on top of it and make fun of others...
that is low.
It seems to me if an ancestor appeared to you with a loving,
necessary, healing message just for you
you would disregard dismiss and learn absolutely nothing from the encounter
that is sad
keep your options open for spiritual growth in this lifetime
you have no idea what is ahead for you on your path
I would not want your baggage when the truth in death comes to us, that's a risky gamble my friend.
Godfather.
and this says it all. you don't believe in god because he speaks to you or of some "pandorish truth" you know, it is out of nothing more than FEAR that you have either acquired or have been taught at some point in your life.
all you are doing with your beliefs is rolling the dice. "if I believe and god exists, I'm good. if I believe, and he doesn't exist, oh well, no harm done. just covering all my bases".
:shock: you just don't get it do you ? I'm not trying to sell you or anybody else on the forum anything I'm just standing up for my beliefs and God because a lot of you just can't wait to tell us all how much you do not belive and why.. you don't believe in God and thats fine with me but I'm really tired of the crap you guys sling every time Gods name is mentioned, with all you guys self sidcribed knoledge you say you have I am supreized that you don't understand kindness for others beliefs and views..
Comments
in the months days hours up to leaving this world they knew God some
believed Christ was their savior
they found a faith they had not known in their lives until that point,
my point of course
perhaps they had been fence sitters
Oh, I see.
I didnt know you meant months, days, hours...I thought it was more of something they did/said AS they were dying, or taking their final breaths.
I've known a few like that too.
The ol' "I'm too smart to need God."
Seen a lot of these people start strugglin when the test results come back malignant...
I feel so bad for them. None of them make jokes like Jeanwah's. None of them are cool anymore...
They're just scared.... and they die so scared....
Think its funny that B-lux calls faith in religion "a troubling characteristic of our times".
Only been going on for about 200,000 years in one form or another.
understand passion in others.
That rationalism, critical thinking, skepticism has it's place but is made complete
with feeling passion and the grandeur of faith.
Kind of like the whole sha-bang!
Rationalism, critical thinking and skepticism made complete by.....faith?
Alrighty then.
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
I've met a lot of smart religious people and plenty of dumbass non-believers.
I was with my big sister as she passed from cancer those final days
she a spiritual person but not so much a believer of God,
more in the power that is us as part of a universe.
God was there with her in the end though, this she could feel.
After as we planned her funeral in a tiny room
in the basement of the funeral parlor ...
the light bulb over the table ... over our heads ... exploded
shattering glass everywhere tripping off the electricity.
As we sat in the blackness stunned we all knew that was Blythe, feeling her presence.
She let us know the power that was her in this life lives on, her spirit lives on.
I feel her often with me, she is an inspiration to me.
Feeling an important part of our abilities often muted by rationalism
we use so little of our brains ... we can tap into more
yeah, I feel like a released a torrent of hateful rhetoric by both sides, that wasn't my intention by starting this thread.
My intention was to express that rationality and logic belong in politics and in debate, and religion does not. Religion or spirituality is a personal thing and proselytization makes me sick, especially when it is part of the policy debate which directly affects my life.
Interesting. Thanks for sharing. Sorry for the loss of your Sister.
I find stories like this so interesting. Hard to understand -- where people are coming from or where they're going in their final minutes -- but in these instances, maybe we shouldnt think too hard about it.
great post, i think the reason is that it easy to insult other people views than to accept others.
this happens on both sides. religion is a tool that people use. for some it makes them happy and thats ok. we all use tools to make us happy.
Yes, civilizations have been trying for 200,000 years to explain that which cannot be explained. So, they make up stories/myths/fantasies.
I will never put any faith into something that relies on which part of the planet Earth I was born on, or the family I was born into.
Because religion - on a national, global scale - is a hindrance to progress.
You are probably closer to Obama than you realise
Yes he is. Obama is basically a middle of the road republican.
I voted for him last time. I'm not impressed.
My natural home would be a middle of the road republican, like huntsman, but Obama is as good
"With our thoughts we make the world"
Godfather.
To rely only on belief; to behold your entire existence and fate of your entire life to your faith... it's just not an intelligent way to live. (it's actually quite lazy) Balance is crucial to living a full life and that means balancing faith with reasoning, personal responsibility and critical thinking.
That's not what he said.
Typo Man: "Thanks kidz, but remembir, stay in skool!"
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
i will embrace the end of my life with open arms. in fact i will welcome it and rejoice that finally this life that i never asked for, but am eternally grateful for is coming to its close. i shall not be scared... why should i be. i shall not turn to the heavens and ask why.. nor shall i seek comfort and solace there. i shall look at my life and see things i couldve done better but did to my best at the time. i shall look at those that are close to me and know i am where i ought to be. we will support each other on this final journey and i will die taking my last breath as a smile with all the love given to me and that i have given calming my soul.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
and this says it all. you don't believe in god because he speaks to you or of some "pandorish truth" you know, it is out of nothing more than FEAR that you have either acquired or have been taught at some point in your life.
all you are doing with your beliefs is rolling the dice. "if I believe and god exists, I'm good. if I believe, and he doesn't exist, oh well, no harm done. just covering all my bases".
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Catefrancis, I think this is one of the finest benedictions to life I have ever read.
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
you should have wrote panborish
why can others not have their own truth? why must you fight that?
I think that shows fear in my opinion
are you heartless too?
I sat in the dark with her two stunned children ... both in their early thirties
both losing their mother decades before they should
both grieving a horrible loss broken by my sisters struggle to live
and the finality of seeing her in her coffin just moments before.
and my nieces tiny voice whispered ..." that's my Mom" ...
we all knew it was but for someone like you, a closed mind that can not open,
you refuse to consider and you must be hurtful on top of it and make fun of others...
that is low.
It seems to me if an ancestor appeared to you with a loving,
necessary, healing message just for you
you would disregard dismiss and learn absolutely nothing from the encounter
that is sad
keep your options open for spiritual growth in this lifetime
you have no idea what is ahead for you on your path
:shock: you just don't get it do you ? I'm not trying to sell you or anybody else on the forum anything I'm just standing up for my beliefs and God because a lot of you just can't wait to tell us all how much you do not belive and why.. you don't believe in God and thats fine with me but I'm really tired of the crap you guys sling every time Gods name is mentioned, with all you guys self sidcribed knoledge you say you have I am supreized that you don't understand kindness for others beliefs and views..
Godfather.