obama is a marxist?

bigdvs

RW81233 wrote:

please...W was lining his friends' pockets with his policies....what you are doing with Obama is akin to calling me conservative because I post in the Ron Paul for Prez thing, read and listen his drivel, have a dad who works for Lockheed-Martin, and have choked down some Ayn Rand shitsandwiches that are actually sold as books that people love. Has Obama fundamentally changed our country to fit Marxian views - not even close. He may personally be a marxist, but not as a president.

I can agree with that. So we are calling him a marxist personally.

STAYSEA

I had to do a stupid report on a world Leader a long time ago in a galaxy far way...
So I picked Lennin? Ouch , stupid kid! wrong Lennon. Bored with his bio, I just fluffed the paper with sentences about the book.. But I concluded , Lennin is bad, okay. People ended up poor. I only wrote one paragraph of my own thoughs... I got a huge A. Imagine? Pandora (the radio station) got stuck the other day. How many people covered Imagine? I couldn't " Imagine" but Wow! Marxist Is a socialist with a diffrent hat! Like defining the word "is"? Change?... is What my Homeless Uncles beg for? Quit giving more money than you have? I learned that my freshman year in community College. I maxed out my credit card on school supplies... Lame. Monopoly became super trendy during the Great depression, people could pretend to have money. I'm going to stick with scrabble. The kids' version. because I have the low IQ :?
I'm not like them... I just need some change.. really just a few quarters....

bigdvs

STAYSEA wrote:

I had to do a stupid report on a world Leader a long time ago in a galaxy far way...
So I picked Lennin? Ouch , stupid kid! wrong Lennon. Bored with his bio, I just fluffed the paper with sentences about the book.. But I concluded , Lennin is bad, okay. People ended up poor. I only wrote one paragraph of my own thoughs... I got a huge A. Imagine? Pandora (the radio station) got stuck the other day. How many people covered Imagine? I couldn't " Imagine" but Wow! Marxist Is a socialist with a diffrent hat! Like defining the word "is"? Change?... is What my Homeless Uncles beg for? Quit giving more money than you have? I learned that my freshman year in community College. I maxed out my credit card on school supplies... Lame. Monopoly became super trendy during the Great depression, people could pretend to have money. I'm going to stick with scrabble. The kids' version. because I have the low IQ :?
I'm not like them... I just need some change.. really just a few quarters....

you're not a wolf

This is pretty funny.

RW81233

bigdvs wrote:

RW81233 wrote:

please...W was lining his friends' pockets with his policies....what you are doing with Obama is akin to calling me conservative because I post in the Ron Paul for Prez thing, read and listen his drivel, have a dad who works for Lockheed-Martin, and have choked down some Ayn Rand shitsandwiches that are actually sold as books that people love. Has Obama fundamentally changed our country to fit Marxian views - not even close. He may personally be a marxist, but not as a president.

I can agree with that. So we are calling him a marxist personally.

i said he "may" be a marxist personally, or maybe there are parts of marxism that appeal to him - dude was a pretty smart guy and wrote some pretty insightful things. Of course if you use the name in America people freak, but usually they have some bastardized understanding of what Marx was about. At the same time, I would hope that Obama was a post-Marxist in that he sees some relevance in his writings, but also understands that the game has changed (something Randians or Ron Paul lovers don't get) because we don't really live in an industrial economy anymore. As such much of the battle over power isn't the means of production (it is in other countries), but rather the sale/consumption of cultural goods (aka brands), what they mean, who they benefit, and to what ends.

catefrances

Jason P wrote:

After reading wiki's summary on Marxism, I'm not sure if Karl Marx was a Marxist. :think:

which one was he... the one who was mute???


you know tbh i wasnt too confident that those who called obama a marxist would reply. but i thought id give it a go cause im crazy like that. *shrugs*

MayDay Malone

RW81233 wrote:

please...W was lining his friends' pockets with his policies....what you are doing with Obama is akin to calling me conservative because I post in the Ron Paul for Prez thing, read and listen his drivel, have a dad who works for Lockheed-Martin, and have choked down some Ayn Rand shitsandwiches that are actually sold as books that people love. Has Obama fundamentally changed our country to fit Marxian views - not even close. He may personally be a marxist, but not as a president.

How's that shining-socialist-city-on-a-hill, Scandanavia doing today? Buy any of that $500 butter yet?

MayDay Malone

catefrances wrote:

Jason P wrote:

After reading wiki's summary on Marxism, I'm not sure if Karl Marx was a Marxist. :think:

which one was he... the one who was mute???


you know tbh i wasnt too confident that those who called obama a marxist would reply. but i thought id give it a go cause im crazy like that. *shrugs*

I don't take bait....

again... hobbies people... hobbies.

It's Xmas. Don't you have family to see or something?

catefrances

MayDay Malone wrote:

catefrances wrote:

Jason P wrote:

After reading wiki's summary on Marxism, I'm not sure if Karl Marx was a Marxist. :think:

which one was he... the one who was mute???


you know tbh i wasnt too confident that those who called obama a marxist would reply. but i thought id give it a go cause im crazy like that. *shrugs*

I don't take bait....

again... hobbies people... hobbies.

It's Xmas. Don't you have family to see or something?

wasnt bait mayday... please dont confuse my motives with yours. im very interested when people throw the marxist tag aorund and i tend to want to know why. simple.

gimmesometruth27

bigdvs wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

several reasonable comparisons of things that this president believes and has done that are in line with general marxist philosophy
that definition does not really explain anything to someone who has not studied marxism.

how do we know that obama's worldview is a sociopolitical worldview and method of socioeconomic inquiry that centers upon a materialist interpretation of history?? what has he done policywise or what has he tried to policywise that gives people that idea?

if he has a dialectical view of social change, that is only one component, and one component a marxist does not make...

most economic theories are an analysis and critique of the development of capitalism, are they not?

and i doubt that by this definition "Marxian economic theory, a sociological theory and a revolutionary view of social change that has influenced socialist political movements around the world" obama is influencing socialist political movements. many people believe in that. that does not make him or any one of us marxists.

can anyone provide specific examples of obama being a marxist?

wolf spotted

please refer to associates and promptly excuse all of them at your convience:
Alinsky,( Community Organizing,) Mrs Dunham ( avowed Marxist abandoned Barry to further her political beliefs) Jeremiah Wright ( Black Liberation Theology ) Frank Marshall Davis ( Communist Mentor in Hawaii) Rashaid Kahlidi ( Palestinian Operative for Arafat’s PLO ) Bill Ayers ( 60′s SDS/Weatherunderground Hugo Chavez admirer, Inept 60′s Bomber) Thomas G Ayers ( Father to Bill, Chicago Urban League Man of the Year 19…. Chairman Commonwealth Edison) Valerie Jarrett. ( Obama’s close friend check her linage and politics.)

Thank you for ceding the bolded point at least.

And wait why is the pursuit of socialistic policies not eligible for consideration as evidence of this president's socioeconomic philosophy? Did we not consider all of GWB contacts and all of his actions as some giant neocon conspiracy.

i have associated with people who have marxist or communist beliefs. does that make me one? no.
i have associated with people who are catholic, protestant, jewish, muslim, does that make me one? no

and another thing cincy, even if he was a marxist, what difference does it make? it is not like he is single-handedly going to be able to change us away from a capitalist society, even when he wins a second term...

and yes we associate gwb's policies as a grand neocon conspiracy because look who he associated wtih and look at what they were able to accomplish. they put the pnac and heritage foundation desires into play when we went and started blowing up iraq. they were neocons and they actively pursued and in some cases carried out neocon ideology..

once obama does something to prove that he is a marxist then i will call him a marxist. until then, i am just going to laugh at those who do...

polaris_x

MayDay Malone wrote:

How's that shining-socialist-city-on-a-hill, Scandanavia doing today? Buy any of that $500 butter yet?

uhhh ... by nearly every standard you can imagine - scandinavia does remarkably better than the US ...

http://www.weforum.org/reports/global-c ... -2011-2012

MayDay Malone

polaris_x wrote:

MayDay Malone wrote:

How's that shining-socialist-city-on-a-hill, Scandanavia doing today? Buy any of that $500 butter yet?

uhhh ... by nearly every standard you can imagine - scandinavia does remarkably better than the US ...

http://www.weforum.org/reports/global-c ... -2011-2012

Not by the butter standard.

gimmesometruth27

MayDay Malone wrote:

polaris_x wrote:

MayDay Malone wrote:

How's that shining-socialist-city-on-a-hill, Scandanavia doing today? Buy any of that $500 butter yet?

uhhh ... by nearly every standard you can imagine - scandinavia does remarkably better than the US ...

http://www.weforum.org/reports/global-c ... -2011-2012

Not by the butter standard.

does the "butter standard" matter? what you keep talking about is a temporary issue in the scandinavian countries. it will be taken care of after the holidays when demand has gone down.

Jason P

polaris_x wrote:

uhhh ... by nearly every standard you can imagine - scandinavia does remarkably better than the US ...

http://www.weforum.org/reports/global-c ... -2011-2012

The U.S. has cities with bigger populations then countries in Scandinavia.

Scandinavia also has a distinct culture which I'm sure helps a lot. From what I've read, the population has very strong work ethics. Good for them and I'm glad their system works. Living in frozen isolation does have its advantages ... plus the Swedes do a good job in keeping Detroit in the Stanley Cup hunt each season. :thumbup:

I think the U.S. would be better off first adapting their work ethic before their policies.

MayDay Malone

When demand goes down?



for butter.....






Socialism sux.

polaris_x

MayDay Malone wrote:

Not by the butter standard.

polaris_x

Jason P wrote:

The U.S. has cities with bigger populations then countries in Scandinavia.

Scandinavia also has a distinct culture which I'm sure helps a lot. From what I've read, the population has very strong work ethics. Good for them and I'm glad their system works. Living in frozen isolation does have its advantages ... plus the Swedes do a good job in keeping Detroit in the Stanley Cup hunt each season. :thumbup:

I think the U.S. would be better off first adapting their work ethic before their policies.

the primary difference is they are a "we" culture whereas america is a "me" culture ... it is why we are discussing prosperity gaps in other threads ... it's great to be in the US if you only care about yourself and want to achieve as much as possible but you are never going to win the team game ...

Jason P

polaris_x wrote:

Jason P wrote:

The U.S. has cities with bigger populations then countries in Scandinavia.

Scandinavia also has a distinct culture which I'm sure helps a lot. From what I've read, the population has very strong work ethics. Good for them and I'm glad their system works. Living in frozen isolation does have its advantages ... plus the Swedes do a good job in keeping Detroit in the Stanley Cup hunt each season. :thumbup:

I think the U.S. would be better off first adapting their work ethic before their policies.

the primary difference is they are a "we" culture whereas america is a "me" culture ... it is why we are discussing prosperity gaps in other threads ... it's great to be in the US if you only care about yourself and want to achieve as much as possible but you are never going to win the team game ...

That's an across-the-board issue that the country has.

You take any one of the OWS protesters ... if they hit the lotto and win $1 million dollars ... how many are going to equally disperse it to their fellow protesters? I have a really good feeling less then 1% would do such a thing.

polaris_x

Jason P wrote:

That's an across-the-board issue that the country has.

You take any one of the OWS protesters ... if they hit the lotto and win $1 million dollars ... how many are going to equally disperse it to their fellow protesters? I have a really good feeling less then 1% would do such a thing.

i think you are missing the point ... i don't think anyone in sweden is going to win $1 million and give it all away ...

it's philosophical ... if I can use a hockey analogy ... it means that someone like pavel daytsuk understands that his personal achievement and glory come second to the success of the team ... it means he plays 2-ways and doesn't take extra long shifts in order to pad his stats ...

socialism doesn't mean that everyone is supposed to be the same ... it just means that working collectively, we can do much better ...

gimmesometruth27

MayDay Malone wrote:

When demand goes down?



for butter.....






Socialism sux.

do you even know why there is a shortage of butter over there and why people are angry about it?

the same thing could just as easily happen here if it were something important to american holiday customs.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/de ... -christmas

Jason P

polaris_x wrote:

Jason P wrote:

That's an across-the-board issue that the country has.

You take any one of the OWS protesters ... if they hit the lotto and win $1 million dollars ... how many are going to equally disperse it to their fellow protesters? I have a really good feeling less then 1% would do such a thing.

i think you are missing the point ... i don't think anyone in sweden is going to win $1 million and give it all away ...

it's philosophical ... if I can use a hockey analogy ... it means that someone like pavel daytsuk understands that his personal achievement and glory come second to the success of the team ... it means he plays 2-ways and doesn't take extra long shifts in order to pad his stats ...

socialism doesn't mean that everyone is supposed to be the same ... it just means that working collectively, we can do much better ...

In theory, it sounds great. But no one in the U.S., be it a C.E.O. or a labor union, is willing (or could) adapt such a philosophy. Most large countries that have tried to force the philosophy have failed or are running behind the guise the the philosophy so they can control the masses with an iron fist (all while maintaining a capitalistic economy).

By the way, I'm not sure where I'm heading with these thoughts. :geek: