Male suicide - Interesting article...

Thoughts_Arrive

http://intentious.com/2011/12/16/dying-in-silence/

Boys apparently don't cry?

gimmesometruth27

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

http://intentious.com/2011/12/16/dying-in-silence/

Boys apparently don't cry?

i would say that men suffer in silence. just as the article stated.

having recently survived a crippling, very near life-threatening depression myself i can attest that as a man i suffered in silence. i was conditioned to not show emotion and never let people know that something was bothering me because it is a display of weakness. i was dying inside and to the outside world i had to act like nothing was wrong. i was fucking up at work and i became seriously apathetic and unable to have empathy for others because i was too wrapped up in the hellhole that my life had become. i had nobody to go to. i could not go to my male friends because they would think i was a pussy. they did not know how to help. their solution was to get me loaded on liquor and that just made things worse because i turned inward and dwelled on my problems instead of attacking them with a clear head. i could not go to my family because they could not help me. they had always avoided serious issues and acted like everything was normal and put on a front to everyone else like things were grand. i had lost my girlfriend, who at the time i thought was my best friend so i could not go to her. i was completely alone and self medicating with drugs and alcohol. i began to write letters to people that kind of put things in perspective and were my way of saying goodbye to some people. it scared me that i could write those goodbye letters with absolutely no emotion. no sadness, no anger, nothing. to me, i was done....i was actually thinking of ways to end things. i stopped caring about things. i started taking stupid risks and pushing the envelope in a lot of ways. i started giving things away that i felt that i did not need. and if i had had a gun at that time i don't see how i would be here today. i finally hit rock bottom and sought counseling, as that was my last option. i can freely admit that that counseling and a few close friendships on here, my band and my music, and my dog saved my life.

i was looking at the table on that link about how men and women show signs of depression.



what i find strange is that my depression manifested itself and i showed more signs that were more common in women than in men.

the more female symptoms i had were:
i blamed myself
i had sadness, apathy, and worthlessness, with some anger.
i had serious anxiety issues
i overslept
i had difficulty maintaining boundaries
i had mainly guilt, with some shame
i had problems with success
i assumed low status
i withdrew from those closest to me

while the more male characteristics that i had were:
i created conflict
i was restless and agitated
i had compulsiveness
i self medicated with drugs and alcohol
and i did the overuse of internet/tv/email

the other thing that i found interesting is that i know more males who have committed suicide than i do women. i think more women that i knew casually attempted, but more men were successful.

this was a hard post for me to type and to admit so publicly, but i think that in the end it will be helpful for me to admit it.

i am completely recovered now and i know that i will never, ever, allow myself to end up in a similar situation again. so in an odd way i am thankful that i went through all of that because it has made me a stronger person today. i learned so much about myself during that time. things that i never knew before. things that i might have suspected but i always trampled those feelings in an effort to bury them. the thing about counseling is it forces you to be honest with yourself. it forces you to find the demons inside of you and makes you exorcise them.. once you are able to be honest with yourself, then you can start to see the things that were the problem and you can recognize why they were the problem. and then you can put those things to bed and move on with your life.

if anyone out there is depressed or feeling suicidal, for god's sake talk to someone.

Thoughts_Arrive

Thank you for being honest and sharing your experiences.
Wishing you all the best.

pandora

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if anyone out there is depressed or feeling suicidal, for god's sake talk to someone.

I'm glad you are here.
The best advice comes from sharing so people know they are not alone.
Thank you

gimmesometruth27

thanks to both of you too...

i share stuff so that if only one person is helped by it it is worth any temporary embarrassment on my part...

stargirl69

You show great strength by sharing your story here gimmesometruth27 ... I have had my own personal experiences battling this and my most wonderful yet tragic relationship was darkly marked with my only loves history of suicide attempts.

It takes great strength and courage to recognise and hear the words "I need help",come from our own mouths.

I wish you well and I am glad to hear you are doing better with each new day.

xxooxx

catefrances

pandora wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if anyone out there is depressed or feeling suicidal, for god's sake talk to someone.

I'm glad you are here.
The best advice comes from sharing so people know they are not alone.
Thank you

im glad hes here too pandora.... oh wow look its the season for miracles... we agree on something.

gimmesometruth27

catefrances wrote:

pandora wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

if anyone out there is depressed or feeling suicidal, for god's sake talk to someone.

I'm glad you are here.
The best advice comes from sharing so people know they are not alone.
Thank you

im glad hes here too pandora.... oh wow look its the season for miracles... we agree on something.

awwwww glad you two can agree, and i have something to do with it haha....

gimmesometruth27

stargirl69 wrote:

You show great strength by sharing your story here gimmesometruth27 ... I have had my own personal experiences battling this and my most wonderful yet tragic relationship was darkly marked with my only loves history of suicide attempts.

It takes great strength and courage to recognise and hear the words "I need help",come from our own mouths.

I wish you well and I am glad to hear you are doing better with each new day.

xxooxx

thank you. like i said, i am back to normal now. the way i figure it, i am normal and average enough that i am sure there are others out there that are going through a rough patch and if my words can help anyone in any way i am not afraid to share. if i had read something like that in the depths of my depression it would have helped me for sure.

and yeah, the "i need help" thing was a difficult conclusion to come to. i mean people knew i was in trouble but it took me to admit it that i needed help and that i was willing to listen to that help for things to actually start to turn around.

i am sorry that you had to go through what you had to experience. it is never easy when you or someone you love is going through this stuff.

take care stargirl69.

Loulou

Yeah have to admit, the 4 people I have known were all males between 19-25. My best mate from high school always felt very lonley, he would tell me all the time that I was a great friend but that I didn't understand. Found out after he died that he was gay, I wish he had been able to talk about it with me. Very sad.

gimmesometruth27

Loulou wrote:

Yeah have to admit, the 4 people I have known were all males between 19-25. My best mate from high school always felt very lonley, he would tell me all the time that I was a great friend but that I didn't understand. Found out after he died that he was gay, I wish he had been able to talk about it with me. Very sad.

i am so sorry.

i don't want to speak for your friend, but i know that when i was at my worst people were reaching out to me and i did not want to talk. i didn't want to talk because i didn't want to share any more than i had to, and because i did not think that my friends would understand my situation. there were a few of them that i did not think i could trust, and since my trust had just been severely betrayed i did not want to let anyone else in. also rather than answering a million questions about it from many different people, i said nothing.

again i am so sorry for your loss... :(

Loulou

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Loulou wrote:

Yeah have to admit, the 4 people I have known were all males between 19-25. My best mate from high school always felt very lonley, he would tell me all the time that I was a great friend but that I didn't understand. Found out after he died that he was gay, I wish he had been able to talk about it with me. Very sad.

i am so sorry.

i don't want to speak for your friend, but i know that when i was at my worst people were reaching out to me and i did not want to talk. i didn't want to talk because i didn't want to share any more than i had to, and because i did not think that my friends would understand my situation. there were a few of them that i did not think i could trust, and since my trust had just been severely betrayed i did not want to let anyone else in. also rather than answering a million questions about it from many different people, i said nothing.

again i am so sorry for your loss... :(

Thanks mate, yeah it's like he would start to talk about it but it hurt him too much and he'd stop. He was always the person to make everyone laugh, if you weren't that close to him you would have never thought he would have gone through with it. He tried it a couple of times before succeeding, then broke up with someone and I guess that was the last straw. I'm sorry that you went through this too, thanks for giving us some insight into this, much appreciated.

catefrances

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

awwwww glad you two can agree, and i have something to do with it haha....

dont get cocky kid.... :P

_

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thanks to both of you too...

i share stuff so that if only one person is helped by it it is worth any temporary embarrassment on my part...

You're a good man. :thumbup:

catefrances

_ wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thanks to both of you too...

i share stuff so that if only one person is helped by it it is worth any temporary embarrassment on my part...

You're a good man. :thumbup:

QFT... perhaps a little unapproachable but hey! no ones perfect. :P

usamamasan1

I grew up in a family circle of honesty and trust. We could always speak to each other if we had a problem/issue to solve/discuss.
My parents are married and I am getting old. Traditions, like marriage and family are strong bonds.
Suicide is the ultimate sin.

catefrances

usamamasan1 wrote:

..I grew up in a family circle of honesty and trust. We could always speak to each other if we had a problem/issue to solve/discuss.
My parents are married and I am getting old. Traditions, like marriage and family are strong bonds.
Suicide is the ultimate sin.

why... cause doctrine says it is the only sin one cant seek repentance for?? excuse me but what a crock of shit that is.

its great that you grew up in a environment such as you did, but not every one is as fortunate as you(and even if they are sometimes its just not enough) and not everybody has the strength within themselves. suicide is a desparate act and labelling it as 'the ultimate sin' doesnt help. perhaps youd like to take that strength you have and turn it into compassion.

gimmesometruth27

usamamasan1 wrote:

Suicide is the ultimate sin.

is that a fact??

try telling that to the family of jessie kasper, a teenage australian pearl jam fan who used to post here. she committed suicide in 2003. maybe if there was a thread like this back then, just maybe she might be here today.

i wasn't going to say anything, but this reply has pissed me off big time...your level of callousness and your apathy towards those who are in a bad situation speaks volumes about you as a person. not just in this thread, but any thread where people who are not "winning" is discussed.

please read this page and come back and tell me how much of a sinner she is...

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id= ... 94?sk=info

gimmesometruth27

Loulou wrote:

Thanks mate, yeah it's like he would start to talk about it but it hurt him too much and he'd stop. He was always the person to make everyone laugh, if you weren't that close to him you would have never thought he would have gone through with it. He tried it a couple of times before succeeding, then broke up with someone and I guess that was the last straw. I'm sorry that you went through this too, thanks for giving us some insight into this, much appreciated.

we should never ever forget that people who are in such an emotional state are capable of anything. that is why it is a bad sign when people withdraw or when they refuse to open up and discuss anything. i know in my experience, keeping up appearances that i was fine was the main motivation to get through my days. i went to work like i was fine. i actually excelled at work at that time because it was the only thing forcing me to take my mind off of my problem. and to maintain appearances i was not saying anything to anyone who i thought might do something crazy like calling my parents or the cops or anyone who could help. the thing i learned the most, which was distressing at the time, it that i am a survivor. i overcame the thing that threatened to do me in. i found the strength within me to keep going. and now i am thriving again. i wish that everyone can have the outcome that i had.

gimmesometruth27

catefrances wrote:

_ wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thanks to both of you too...

i share stuff so that if only one person is helped by it it is worth any temporary embarrassment on my part...

You're a good man. :thumbup:

QFT... perhaps a little unapproachable but hey! no ones perfect. :P

sometimes i have my doubts , _

and me unapproachable? i have to disagree :P ...

Byrnzie

_ wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

thanks to both of you too...

i share stuff so that if only one person is helped by it it is worth any temporary embarrassment on my part...

You're a good man. :thumbup:

+1

Byrnzie

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

we should never ever forget that people who are in such an emotional state are capable of anything. that is why it is a bad sign when people withdraw or when they refuse to open up and discuss anything. i know in my experience, keeping up appearances that i was fine was the main motivation to get through my days. i went to work like i was fine. i actually excelled at work at that time because it was the only thing forcing me to take my mind off of my problem. and to maintain appearances i was not saying anything to anyone who i thought might do something crazy like calling my parents or the cops or anyone who could help. the thing i learned the most, which was distressing at the time, it that i am a survivor. i overcame the thing that threatened to do me in. i found the strength within me to keep going. and now i am thriving again. i wish that everyone can have the outcome that i had.

I vaguely remember you confiding in me at the time. Something to do with a break-up. I probably didn't take it too seriously though in all honesty (or as seriously as I should/could have), as you've always struck me as a pretty tough egg.

Anyway, kudos for you typing all of this in this thread. It's stuff like this that makes this forum a great place. And I hope you don't ever slide down into that hole again a second time. If you do, then make sure you let me know about it.

CarolineSays

Sorry Thoughts, this is gimme's thread now...

Thanks for sharing, gimme. I was misdiagnosed because I had predominantly "male" symptoms. Thanks to my very stubborn husband I found the appropriate help.

You're "wrong" on one point, though. You'll never be "normal" again. You'll always be on your guard, more aware of yourself, of your needs and mental state. Which makes you a stronger person and more likely more in tune with other people's feelings and needs.

edit : ignore the ignorant troll posts...

Thoughts_Arrive

usamamasan1 wrote:

Suicide is the ultimate sin.

It is people like you with your views that have turned me off church.
I haven't been to Christmas mass in a few years now, it causes conflict in the household with my mum who labels me as 'not a real Catholic'. Disgusting, the church is a shit system.
God and Jesus would never call someone that took their own life a sinner, that is a bunch of old pedophiles preaching their shit to the world.

pandora

Suicide can not be an option
whatever one must do in their own heads, this be the goal, the final outcome.

If that is to go back to one's religious teachings and then know,
for them, it is a sin
whatever it takes to make it not an option... then live for God

If that is to meditate on the outcome for all those you will leave behind.
Feel the pain feel the change for them, live the ache, the loss.
If one decides to live for others to save their loved ones the most horrible pain
and guilt imaginable
whatever it takes to make suicide not an option ... then live for others

If it is going to your lowest and crawling back up with or without help
to live for yourself whatever it takes ... choose life then live for yourself.

Suicide can not be an option. Save a life.

gimmesometruth27

Byrnzie wrote:

I vaguely remember you confiding in me at the time. Something to do with a break-up. I probably didn't take it too seriously though in all honesty (or as seriously as I should/could have), as you've always struck me as a pretty tough egg.

Anyway, kudos for you typing all of this in this thread. It's stuff like this that makes this forum a great place. And I hope you don't ever slide down into that hole again a second time. If you do, then make sure you let me know about it.

yeah i think when i mentioned it to you it was at the very beginning of things starting to get bad. i did not go into details because i was maintaining appearances...that break up had just occurred and i was learning things about that person that really hurt to hear. it had been a mentally abusive and traumatizing relationship and there was some distance involved, which gave her free reign to do whatever she wanted with whomever she wanted to do it with, and that included having affairs...i did not know how bad it was going to get when i had mentioned it to you just over a year ago, but i think when we talked i was at the top of the slide preparing to take the downward plunge.. i disappeared from here for a few months shortly after that and did not come back until late february or early march. i had to get away from everything that reminded me of her and that included doing away with all things pearl jam for awhile. i could not get totally away though because i have a big stickfigure tattooed on my arm, so that kind of sucked...while i was away i did a lot of soulsearching and went to the counselor at that time and did a lot of reading and writing and working out. i lost nearly 40 lbs and have managed to keep 36 of them off, which is a good thing.. and lol at hard egg...i guess i do have a hard exterior, but the deeper one digs they will notice that the interior is much more fragile...

i was hoping that my sharing of my story would make more people come forward and share theirs so we could have a really good discussion about suicide and depression. we are all here to bounce ideas off of each other and learn from one another. and don't worry byrnzie, i am not going to slide down that hole again. i will not make those same mistakes again. i have learned my lesson. and i have learned that life is good now, and it sure as hell beats the alternative..i can't believe that i ever got to that point. i guess it is like that old saying, "it's not how hard you fall, it is how high you BOUNCE!"

cincybearcat

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Interesting, thanks for sharing. And I'm glad you are doing better.

gimmesometruth27

CarolineSays wrote:

Sorry Thoughts, this is gimme's thread now...

Thanks for sharing, gimme. I was misdiagnosed because I had predominantly "male" symptoms. Thanks to my very stubborn husband I found the appropriate help.

You're "wrong" on one point, though. You'll never be "normal" again. You'll always be on your guard, more aware of yourself, of your needs and mental state. Which makes you a stronger person and more likely more in tune with other people's feelings and needs.

edit : ignore the ignorant troll posts...

sorry, i didn't mean to hijack the thread :oops:

i was just pointing out that my symptoms were different from what the article posted. it sounds like yours were too. i am glad that your husband knew you well enough to know that you were misdiagnosed. mine was an easy diagnosis because i had all the classic signs, just the genders were reversed.

and you are right, i stand corrected. i am back to normal in that i can do everything i wanted to do before, but as you said, i am on guard and i don't let my guard down easily anymore. i guess it is some sort of defense mechanism or something. and that guard being up has hurt my subsequent relationships somewhat because i do not open up as easily as i used to. and you are right in that i am much more aware of what i need. i had never been that way before. i was always more selfless than selfish. and that set me up for problems. now i have no problem with looking out for my interests as well. it is all about self worth. if you do not value yourself enough you can become anything people want you to be and people will take advantage of your selflessness. you will give away everything you have emotionally to people who are not worthy of it, or don't deserve it.

i am glad that you go through your rough patch as well

JonnyPistachio

Gimme, that must've been tough to share, but I'm sure it might help people if there are in a similar situation.
And you're right, its all about how you bounce back, and realizing that life is often long, and there is plenty of time to figure things out. Glad you are doing well now!

On an aside, I agree with Thoughts Arrive here:

Thoughts_Arrive wrote:

usamamasan1 wrote:

Suicide is the ultimate sin.

It is people like you with your views that have turned me off church.
I haven't been to Christmas mass in a few years now, it causes conflict in the household with my mum who labels me as 'not a real Catholic'. Disgusting, the church is a shit system.
God and Jesus would never call someone that took their own life a sinner, that is a bunch of old pedophiles preaching their shit to the world.

Some people just know exactly how to take a shit in all the wrong places.

gimmesometruth27

cincybearcat wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Interesting, thanks for sharing. And I'm glad you are doing better.

thanks dude. you guys aren't getting rid of me that easily haha...

yes it is interesting that the predominant gender characteristics were reversed in a couple of cases in this thread.

this chart was in the article that was linked in the OP. i just put it in there so people could easier see what i was referrring to in my post. there are other informational charts on that site as well.

cincybearcat

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

Interesting, thanks for sharing. And I'm glad you are doing better.

thanks dude. you guys aren't getting rid of me that easily haha...

yes it is interesting that the predominant gender characteristics were reversed in a couple of cases in this thread.

this chart was in the article that was linked in the OP. i just put it in there so people could easier see what i was referrring to in my post. there are other informational charts on that site as well.

After reading the chart, I'm really concerned about Byrnzie.

Seriously though, when you get in a slump and things start to become too much it's easy to see how it snowballs and can really effect people. It's also easy to see it being written off by many as someone just being a jerk. You really need good people around you to help you notice the changes in yourself. Can wake you up and help you get past it. Without others there to help, it'd be pretty difficult to do on your own.