Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Their PT conferences are at 7:30 so nice try. Also my Dad and all my friends parents were able to make it to all the PTC without loosing their jobs. THey all had the same responsibility of putting food on the table. PTconferences don't come up at suprises they are usually scheduled when the school year starts. I am sure giving your employer a month notice would be acceptable and I doubt any employer would not try and work with your schedule, especially if they are doing hourly work they could easily find someone to take their shift for that day. Quit with the excuses.
I'm sorry but you are so clueless. Ever heard of second or third shift?? and 'easily find someone to take their shift'?? What planet are you on?
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Glad you brought that point to light! My thoughts concur.
Didn't you just say that it's rare for a person on welfare to be working full time?
They sound like great parents, you must be so proud of them that they are spending HALF on their kids... Since they are not getting drugged up at work they must be doing it at home infront or when they should be spending time with their kids. And you laugh at me for wanting these kids to be a more stable environment (foster/adoption)
Aside from the fact that your assumption is baseless (that only two places exist in the world: work & at home in front of your kids), you missed my entire point. All I was saying was that we shouldn't take food out of children's mouths, as I've said 100 times before.
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Glad you brought that point to light! My thoughts concur.
Didn't you just say that it's rare for a person on welfare to be working full time?
no, I did not say that at all. But, now that you mention it, where I live, if they WERE working full time, even if they make minimum wage, they would not be eligible to receive welfare for themselves (and probably still not able to afford even a minimal standard of living).
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Their PT conferences are at 7:30 so nice try. Also my Dad and all my friends parents were able to make it to all the PTC without loosing their jobs. THey all had the same responsibility of putting food on the table. PTconferences don't come up at suprises they are usually scheduled when the school year starts. I am sure giving your employer a month notice would be acceptable and I doubt any employer would not try and work with your schedule, especially if they are doing hourly work they could easily find someone to take their shift for that day. Quit with the excuses.
glad you daddy didn't loose his job....
I'm guessing you're in your teens or lived a very sheltered life....perhaps both...
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Their PT conferences are at 7:30 so nice try. Also my Dad and all my friends parents were able to make it to all the PTC without loosing their jobs. THey all had the same responsibility of putting food on the table. PTconferences don't come up at suprises they are usually scheduled when the school year starts. I am sure giving your employer a month notice would be acceptable and I doubt any employer would not try and work with your schedule, especially if they are doing hourly work they could easily find someone to take their shift for that day. Quit with the excuses.
I'm sorry but you are so clueless. Every heard of second or third shift?? and 'easily find someone to take their shift'?? What planet are you on?
Huh??? I worked at a restruant through college and everybody pick up different shifts for people. That is actually extremely common. What planet are you from.
Are you saying everyone on welfare is working 2nd and 3rd shift.
You are made aware months in advance that there will be PT conferences. Letting your employer know a month in advance they will surly find someone to fill your shift for you. Do you even work? How could someone be so oblivious to this.
(1) No, it's not like your employer does. Does your employer tell you exactly what you can & cannot buy with the money s/he gives you? I believe that's what was being discussed. If you believe we should tell welfare recipients what they can & cannot buy, whatever. But please stop with the bad analogies.
(2) Again with equating poor people to children? Really?? Sad. :(
(2) They are both dependants, dependant on someone else to live (provide basic needs of life, food, shelter,)
(1) No my employer does not becuase I am providing my employer with my good/services. I am earning the money. But while I am at work they are rules set in the work place in order for me to earn that money.
What servies are welfare recipients who don't work providing. Nothing... So since we can't put rules on their "work" we should be able to put rules around what they are allowed to use their assistance for. Since you don't see a problem with them using "our" money how every they want. I am sure you are fine with them selling their families food stams for drugs and money right. You support that?
We are all dependents in some way.
We weren't talking about rules while people are at work; we were talking about rules re: what they can & cannot buy. So, again, bad analogy.
The truth is that you have no idea what services welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide. People contribute when they are working & need assistance when they're not. It doesn't mean they never contribute. By your logic, though, I assume you are against providing assistance to children, the disabled, & the elderly?
I think the part I bolded is central to your position. You are just looking for ways to control "these people," to assert your "hard-earned" power over those you think are lesser humans than you are.
Drugs are illegal. Money can be necessary for other things.
Huh??? I worked at a restruant through college and everybody pick up different shifts for people. That is actually extremely common. What planet are you from.
Are you saying everyone on welfare is working 2nd and 3rd shift.
You are made aware months in advance that there will be PT conferences. Letting your employer know a month in advance they will surly find someone to fill your shift for you. Do you even work? How could someone be so oblivious to this.
I'm on earth in a place called reality. You don't always get MONTHS or WEEKS to be informed of a PT conference and if there are only 1 or 2 other people working with you, I'd like to see it 'easy' to get someone to take your shift. Apparently it wasn't the case in the ONE restaurant YOU worked in.
and do I even work?? What the hell kind of question is that??? I've been in the work force for almost 20 years and YES I WORK. IN FACT I HAVE TWO JOBS.
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Their PT conferences are at 7:30 so nice try. Also my Dad and all my friends parents were able to make it to all the PTC without loosing their jobs. THey all had the same responsibility of putting food on the table. PTconferences don't come up at suprises they are usually scheduled when the school year starts. I am sure giving your employer a month notice would be acceptable and I doubt any employer would not try and work with your schedule, especially if they are doing hourly work they could easily find someone to take their shift for that day. Quit with the excuses.
Oh my good God, man! You are living in a COMPLETELY alternate reality with ABSOLUTELY ZERO understanding of the situations of "these people" you keep talking about!! It's absolutely mind-boggling how little you understand & yet how much you judge. I mean, really, I think my head is going to explode after reading such an asinine comment!
You actually believe that everyone has the same work experience as you and your dad, don't you? Where no one works at 7:30 and everyone's bosses let them off work whenever they want and everyone can afford to lose money?!? Sure, SOME people have that experience, but MANY, MANY don't.
It must be nice to have lived a life of such motherfucking privilege. :roll: (But please pull your head out of your ass before you continue to judge.)
(1) No, it's not like your employer does. Does your employer tell you exactly what you can & cannot buy with the money s/he gives you? I believe that's what was being discussed. If you believe we should tell welfare recipients what they can & cannot buy, whatever. But please stop with the bad analogies.
(2) Again with equating poor people to children? Really?? Sad. :(
(2) They are both dependants, dependant on someone else to live (provide basic needs of life, food, shelter,)
(1) No my employer does not becuase I am providing my employer with my good/services. I am earning the money. But while I am at work they are rules set in the work place in order for me to earn that money.
What servies are welfare recipients who don't work providing. Nothing... So since we can't put rules on their "work" we should be able to put rules around what they are allowed to use their assistance for. Since you don't see a problem with them using "our" money how every they want. I am sure you are fine with them selling their families food stams for drugs and money right. You support that?
We are all dependents in some way.
We weren't talking about rules while people are at work; we were talking about rules re: what they can & cannot buy. So, again, bad analogy.
The truth is that you have no idea what services welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide. People contribute when they are working & need assistance when they're not. It doesn't mean they never contribute. By your logic, though, I assume you are against providing assistance to children, the disabled, & the elderly?
I think the part I bolded is central to your position. You are just looking for ways to control "these people," to assert your "hard-earned" power over those you think are lesser humans than you are.
Drugs are illegal. Money can be necessary for other things.
I am being paid for MY work, what I contribute. What are they contributing to the GOV. to recieve this money? Nothing, they are being paid for not providing any services.
Technicaly they are always at "work" since they are being paid by the gov. to do nothing.
And you have no idea what service welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide. They look like they are doing a great job contributing to the areas they live in. My positions which for some reason you can't grasp is bolded and explained by if you restrict what they are spending their money on, that can ONLY be a positive for the children.
So again you approve of people on welfare with families selling thier food stams for something else. Since they should not have restrictions on what they are given.
Huh??? I worked at a restruant through college and everybody pick up different shifts for people. That is actually extremely common. What planet are you from.
Are you saying everyone on welfare is working 2nd and 3rd shift.
You are made aware months in advance that there will be PT conferences. Letting your employer know a month in advance they will surly find someone to fill your shift for you. Do you even work? How could someone be so oblivious to this.
I'm on earth in a place called reality. You don't always get MONTHS or WEEKS to be informed of a PT conference and if there are only 1 or 2 other people working with you, I'd like to see it 'easy' to get someone to take your shift. Apparently it wasn't the case in the ONE restaurant YOU worked in.
and do I even work?? What the hell kind of question is that??? I've been in the work force for almost 20 years and YES I WORK. IN FACT I HAVE TWO JOBS.
The first day of school you are given a school schedule of events and on that are PT conferences... OMG how do you not get that, my daughter is in pre-school and they manage to do that, they do it in my wifes school. They did it in my school. Its a pretty universal concept.
Let's say you are a low-income parent, trying to put food on the table. You would likely have to be at work during parent-teacher conferences. You probably are paid by the hour and don't have any/much leave time. Your options, then, are to miss the conference & work to feed your kids, or miss work to go to the conference, have less ability to provide for your family, & possibly lose your job. You of all people, who talks so much about how people should work their assess off to put food on the table no matter what, should not fault people for making the decision to continue to work in this situation.
Their PT conferences are at 7:30 so nice try. Also my Dad and all my friends parents were able to make it to all the PTC without loosing their jobs. THey all had the same responsibility of putting food on the table. PTconferences don't come up at suprises they are usually scheduled when the school year starts. I am sure giving your employer a month notice would be acceptable and I doubt any employer would not try and work with your schedule, especially if they are doing hourly work they could easily find someone to take their shift for that day. Quit with the excuses.
I just realized this post relates in a way to a post in another thread. Though I know you don't represent most of the "educated" population, I think it's completely out-of-touch attitudes like yours that encourage others to have attitudes like these:
I find it curious that a lot of people in America look down their noses at educated people. There are people who criticize Obama for being an "elitist" simply because he was educated at an Ivy League school and can coherently string a sentence together. Oddly enough, many of the people who criticize Obama for that were whipped into a frenzy by Republican politicians... Republican politicians who went to prestigious universities (what was that comment about keeping the population dumb so they don't try and change the system?). Here in Louisiana there's a lot of anti-higher education sentiment, and a lot of people are glad that the universities are having their budgets slashed because, to them, universities do nothing more than train people to be liberal elites (because, you know, when you're researching potential cures for cancer and AIDS it totally matters who you voted for in the last election). It never ceases to amaze me just how many people out there distrust people with an education. Personally, I don't want the leader of a country to be a "man of the people" - I want the guy in charge to be able to think at a higher level than me. People need more education (and of a better quality), not less - though there are people out there who think education = bad. It's crazy.
Oh my good God, man! You are living in a COMPLETELY alternate reality with ABSOLUTELY ZERO understanding of the situations of "these people" you keep talking about!! It's absolutely mind-boggling how little you understand & yet how much you judge.
It really, really is mind-boggling. Blockhead you scare me. You are completely devoid of logic or rationale or any understanding of the real world in terms of what some people have to do to make it through life (anything other than your life).
The first day of school you are given a school schedule of events and on that are PT conferences... OMG how do you not get that, my daughter is in pre-school and they manage to do that, they do it in my wifes school. They did it in my school. Its a pretty universal concept.
I am being paid for MY work, what I contribute. What are they contributing to the GOV. to recieve this money? Nothing, they are being paid for not providing any services.
Technicaly they are always at "work" since they are being paid by the gov. to do nothing.
And you have no idea what service welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide.
Your narrow-minded idea of contribution aside, most people who receive welfare will work at some point in their lives, right? So then we do know for a fact that they contribute to the system.
They look like they are doing a great job contributing to the areas they live in. My positions which for some reason you can't grasp is bolded and explained by if you restrict what they are spending their money on, that can ONLY be a positive for the children.
So again you approve of people on welfare with families selling thier food stams for something else. Since they should not have restrictions on what they are given.
You are talking about breaking the law. That is not what we are talking about here.
Oh my good God, man! You are living in a COMPLETELY alternate reality with ABSOLUTELY ZERO understanding of the situations of "these people" you keep talking about!! It's absolutely mind-boggling how little you understand & yet how much you judge. I mean, really, I think my head is going to explode after reading such an asinine comment!
You actually believe that everyone has the same work experience as you and your dad, don't you? Where no one works at 7:30 and everyone's bosses let them off work whenever they want and everyone can afford to lose money?!? Sure, SOME people have that experience, but MANY, MANY don't.
It must be nice to have lived a life of such motherfucking privilege. :roll: (But please pull your head out of your ass before you continue to judge.)
Why don't you just excuse them out of all responsibility since thats what you are doing. Should be abolish PT conferecnes in poor areas because none of them can make it at any time???
Please find where I said they all have the same work experience as my dad, Ill be waiting...
But I find it extremely hard to believe if you went up to your boss (at any job) and said hey in a month I have a PT conferene could I leave work early that day or have someone pick up my shift , they would not work with you.
Great job though. You have just excused these people into not having any responsibilty in your eyes.
TO me it sounds like they don't even have time to parent, how unfair, lets just keep giving them more money.
Sorry but I live a life of responsibily and don't make excuses for everthing that dosen't go my way. We are now living in a world that is giving our GIFT CARDS to get parents to go to PT conferences. OHHHHH POOR PARENTS, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE WE CAN GIVE YOU...
The first day of school you are given a school schedule of events and on that are PT conferences... OMG how do you not get that, my daughter is in pre-school and they manage to do that, they do it in my wifes school. They did it in my school. Its a pretty universal concept.
Really?? Seriously?? Is this a joke?
How do you not understand this simple concept.
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
I wanted to see some thoughts before I gave my opinion, but these are my initial basic requirements in no particular order (not an exhaustive list):
1) Restriction on grocery store items that must be purchased before "optional" items are purchased (i.e. if you can get a decent meal on the table every day and still afford ice cream - excellent. But, you can't buy the ice cream first). Mechanisms are already in place for this. Health Flexible Spending Account debit cards already restict what you can buy with them. That can be easily transfered to other things due to the bar coding system.
2) Drug/alcohol testing. This is a tricky one. Some folks have necessary scripts, and I'm not 100% sure we can figure out how to exclude those (e.g. how to test for codeine when it's in certain scripts). So, I don't think it's a question of if we need this, but how? Unfortunately, that's a pretty big question that I have no suggestion for.
3) Aptitude testing. To incentivize less cheating here allow other restrictions to be lighter relative to how you score here. Obviously, more would be expected of you as well. But, that seems like a fair trade off.
4) Random home checks for living situations. eg Are you really living with an unmarried father of one of your children or not? That is not the only example. That's why it needs to be more general than that. But, it should be unannounced. Obviously, very strict guidelines would have to be set in place so folks aren't taken advantage of by unauthorized visits and/or fake visits.
5) School attendance and grades (C average? simply passing?) for all children (job could also be applicable after a certain age as an alternative to school). This is put on the parents. Maybe, we reduce the base payments, and then add a "school bonus."
I also believe all of these should be tempered by length of time on the program. Maybe, the first few months, there's very little restrictions on some items. Then, as we move along increase. This serves a few purposes. First, it makes it less attractive to stay on assistance to those that are "lingering." Second, those that really need to stay on longer probably need a lot more guidance in life than not (this is very general, and obviously does not cover everyone. But, you have to create some criteria). And finally, reduce administrative cost associated with those brief "transient" recipients.
Sorry. The world doesn't work the way you tell it to.
How do you not understand this simple concept.
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
Oh my good God, man! You are living in a COMPLETELY alternate reality with ABSOLUTELY ZERO understanding of the situations of "these people" you keep talking about!! It's absolutely mind-boggling how little you understand & yet how much you judge. I mean, really, I think my head is going to explode after reading such an asinine comment!
You actually believe that everyone has the same work experience as you and your dad, don't you? Where no one works at 7:30 and everyone's bosses let them off work whenever they want and everyone can afford to lose money?!? Sure, SOME people have that experience, but MANY, MANY don't.
It must be nice to have lived a life of such motherfucking privilege. :roll: (But please pull your head out of your ass before you continue to judge.)
Why don't you just excuse them out of all responsibility since thats what you are doing. Should be abolish PT conferecnes in poor areas because none of them can make it at any time???
Please find where I said they all have the same work experience as my dad, Ill be waiting...
But I find it extremely hard to believe if you went up to your boss (at any job) and said hey in a month I have a PT conferene could I leave work early that day or have someone pick up my shift , they would not work with you.
Great job though. You have just excused these people into not having any responsibilty in your eyes.
TO me it sounds like they don't even have time to parent, how unfair, lets just keep giving them more money.
Sorry but I live a life of responsibily and don't make excuses for everthing that dosen't go my way. We are now living in a world that is giving our GIFT CARDS to get parents to go to PT conferences. OHHHHH POOR PARENTS, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE WE CAN GIVE YOU...
No one is making excuses; we are just explaining reality. Have whatever opinions you want, but I just ask that they are based in reality, please.
You implied that everyone has the same work experience by saying that they should be able to make it because your dad was able to make it. No sense in trying to back-peddle now.
You find it extremely hard to believe that not everyone's boss is understanding & not everyone's job is flexible because you are living in an alternate, privileged reality where people have more control over their lives than many other people do. As someone who is very flexible & understanding & has managed businesses that employee people at minimum wage, I can tell you that there are MANY times when I just couldn't let people off work for whatever reason. And, with availability being the primary requirement of the job, people who ask for too much time off lose their jobs. That's just the way it is. And as someone who has worked those jobs, I have had the same experience.
Yes, yes there is something else we can give parents: RESPECT
blockhead, apparently you did not watch bowling for columbine where they profiled the single mom working 2 jobs, 18-19 hour days to try to provide for her sons. there are people in this world who try to support their kids by any means necessary, by taking that second or 3rd shift job at white castle or mopping floors in a factory. not everyone works 9-5 and not everyone can get off work for anything like conferences. i work with a physician, and if that physician is here in the office seeing patients, I am here. there is no way around it. i do not get days off because there is nobody here to cover for me that does my job. i do not get sick days and have only missed 2 days of work in 4.5 years and those were due to a family funeral. if i am out of the office, the doctor is 1/2 as efficient and can see less than 1/2 of the case load he sees when i am here. the only days off i get are when he goes out of town. i am single and have no kids, but i have missed out on a lot of things because of this job. i don't know what kind of cushy job your dad did, or what your engineering job allows you to do as far as ease of getting time off, but some people in this world are job slaves.
to quote an old friend of mine, any similarity between your reality and mine is purely coincidental. just because your job allows you to do x and y and z and allows you to get off work for whatever does not mean that that is the case for everyone. in fact, that is the exception and not the rule.
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
The first day of school you are given a school schedule of events and on that are PT conferences... OMG how do you not get that, my daughter is in pre-school and they manage to do that, they do it in my wifes school. They did it in my school. Its a pretty universal concept.
Really?? Seriously?? Is this a joke?
How do you not understand this simple concept.
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
I have known plenty of patients who couldn't get off work for a fucking abortion. Or for prenatal care. Or for surgery. Not being able to get off work is a HUGE problem in the medical field too, not just in education.
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
WOW...now apparently we are making SEXIST and or MISOGYNISTIC comments as well????
pathetic.
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
I wanted to see some thoughts before I gave my opinion, but these are my initial basic requirements in no particular order (not an exhaustive list):
1) Restriction on grocery store items that must be purchased before "optional" items are purchased (i.e. if you can get a decent meal on the table every day and still afford ice cream - excellent. But, you can't buy the ice cream first). Mechanisms are already in place for this. Health Flexible Spending Account debit cards already restict what you can buy with them. That can be easily transfered to other things due to the bar coding system.
2) Drug/alcohol testing. This is a tricky one. Some folks have necessary scripts, and I'm not 100% sure we can figure out how to exclude those (e.g. how to test for codeine when it's in certain scripts). So, I don't think it's a question of if we need this, but how? Unfortunately, that's a pretty big question that I have no suggestion for.
3) Aptitude testing. To incentivize less cheating here allow other restrictions to be lighter relative to how you score here. Obviously, more would be expected of you as well. But, that seems like a fair trade off.
4) Random home checks for living situations. eg Are you really living with an unmarried father of one of your children or not? That is not the only example. That's why it needs to be more general than that. But, it should be unannounced. Obviously, very strict guidelines would have to be set in place so folks aren't taken advantage of by unauthorized visits and/or fake visits.
5) School attendance and grades (C average? simply passing?) for all children (job could also be applicable after a certain age as an alternative to school). This is put on the parents. Maybe, we reduce the base payments, and then add a "school bonus."
I also believe all of these should be tempered by length of time on the program. Maybe, the first few months, there's very little restrictions on some items. Then, as we move along increase. This serves a few purposes. First, it makes it less attractive to stay on assistance to those that are "lingering." Second, those that really need to stay on longer probably need a lot more guidance in life than not (this is very general, and obviously does not cover everyone. But, you have to create some criteria). And finally, reduce administrative cost associated with those brief "transient" recipients.
Perhaps I misunderstood, but did you just essentially say that children who aren't good in school shouldn't be fed??
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
WOW...now apparently we are making SEXIST and or MISOGYNISTIC comments as well????
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
WOW...now apparently we are making SEXIST and or MISOGYNISTIC comments as well????
pathetic.
omg that was really just unfkngbelievable.
Yes, it was. And yet, still somehow believable given the source. On that note, I'm outta here!
Comments
Aside from the fact that your assumption is baseless (that only two places exist in the world: work & at home in front of your kids), you missed my entire point. All I was saying was that we shouldn't take food out of children's mouths, as I've said 100 times before.
glad you daddy didn't loose his job....
I'm guessing you're in your teens or lived a very sheltered life....perhaps both...
Are you saying everyone on welfare is working 2nd and 3rd shift.
You are made aware months in advance that there will be PT conferences. Letting your employer know a month in advance they will surly find someone to fill your shift for you. Do you even work? How could someone be so oblivious to this.
We are all dependents in some way.
We weren't talking about rules while people are at work; we were talking about rules re: what they can & cannot buy. So, again, bad analogy.
The truth is that you have no idea what services welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide. People contribute when they are working & need assistance when they're not. It doesn't mean they never contribute. By your logic, though, I assume you are against providing assistance to children, the disabled, & the elderly?
I think the part I bolded is central to your position. You are just looking for ways to control "these people," to assert your "hard-earned" power over those you think are lesser humans than you are.
Drugs are illegal. Money can be necessary for other things.
and do I even work?? What the hell kind of question is that??? I've been in the work force for almost 20 years and YES I WORK. IN FACT I HAVE TWO JOBS.
oh, the irony...
Oh my good God, man! You are living in a COMPLETELY alternate reality with ABSOLUTELY ZERO understanding of the situations of "these people" you keep talking about!! It's absolutely mind-boggling how little you understand & yet how much you judge. I mean, really, I think my head is going to explode after reading such an asinine comment!
You actually believe that everyone has the same work experience as you and your dad, don't you? Where no one works at 7:30 and everyone's bosses let them off work whenever they want and everyone can afford to lose money?!? Sure, SOME people have that experience, but MANY, MANY don't.
It must be nice to have lived a life of such motherfucking privilege. :roll: (But please pull your head out of your ass before you continue to judge.)
Technicaly they are always at "work" since they are being paid by the gov. to do nothing.
And you have no idea what service welfare recipients who don't work are providing or have provided or will provide. They look like they are doing a great job contributing to the areas they live in. My positions which for some reason you can't grasp is bolded and explained by if you restrict what they are spending their money on, that can ONLY be a positive for the children.
So again you approve of people on welfare with families selling thier food stams for something else. Since they should not have restrictions on what they are given.
I just realized this post relates in a way to a post in another thread. Though I know you don't represent most of the "educated" population, I think it's completely out-of-touch attitudes like yours that encourage others to have attitudes like these:
http://forums.pearljam.com/viewtopic.ph ... 5#p3632808
Your narrow-minded idea of contribution aside, most people who receive welfare will work at some point in their lives, right? So then we do know for a fact that they contribute to the system.
You are talking about breaking the law. That is not what we are talking about here.
Please find where I said they all have the same work experience as my dad, Ill be waiting...
But I find it extremely hard to believe if you went up to your boss (at any job) and said hey in a month I have a PT conferene could I leave work early that day or have someone pick up my shift , they would not work with you.
Great job though. You have just excused these people into not having any responsibilty in your eyes.
TO me it sounds like they don't even have time to parent, how unfair, lets just keep giving them more money.
Sorry but I live a life of responsibily and don't make excuses for everthing that dosen't go my way. We are now living in a world that is giving our GIFT CARDS to get parents to go to PT conferences. OHHHHH POOR PARENTS, IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE WE CAN GIVE YOU...
Its amazing how AMT views getting off work for a few hours or getting someone to pick up your shift.
Hell all women have to do is tell their boss they are having women "issues" and they get the day off.
1) Restriction on grocery store items that must be purchased before "optional" items are purchased (i.e. if you can get a decent meal on the table every day and still afford ice cream - excellent. But, you can't buy the ice cream first). Mechanisms are already in place for this. Health Flexible Spending Account debit cards already restict what you can buy with them. That can be easily transfered to other things due to the bar coding system.
2) Drug/alcohol testing. This is a tricky one. Some folks have necessary scripts, and I'm not 100% sure we can figure out how to exclude those (e.g. how to test for codeine when it's in certain scripts). So, I don't think it's a question of if we need this, but how? Unfortunately, that's a pretty big question that I have no suggestion for.
3) Aptitude testing. To incentivize less cheating here allow other restrictions to be lighter relative to how you score here. Obviously, more would be expected of you as well. But, that seems like a fair trade off.
4) Random home checks for living situations. eg Are you really living with an unmarried father of one of your children or not? That is not the only example. That's why it needs to be more general than that. But, it should be unannounced. Obviously, very strict guidelines would have to be set in place so folks aren't taken advantage of by unauthorized visits and/or fake visits.
5) School attendance and grades (C average? simply passing?) for all children (job could also be applicable after a certain age as an alternative to school). This is put on the parents. Maybe, we reduce the base payments, and then add a "school bonus."
I also believe all of these should be tempered by length of time on the program. Maybe, the first few months, there's very little restrictions on some items. Then, as we move along increase. This serves a few purposes. First, it makes it less attractive to stay on assistance to those that are "lingering." Second, those that really need to stay on longer probably need a lot more guidance in life than not (this is very general, and obviously does not cover everyone. But, you have to create some criteria). And finally, reduce administrative cost associated with those brief "transient" recipients.
No one is making excuses; we are just explaining reality. Have whatever opinions you want, but I just ask that they are based in reality, please.
You implied that everyone has the same work experience by saying that they should be able to make it because your dad was able to make it. No sense in trying to back-peddle now.
You find it extremely hard to believe that not everyone's boss is understanding & not everyone's job is flexible because you are living in an alternate, privileged reality where people have more control over their lives than many other people do. As someone who is very flexible & understanding & has managed businesses that employee people at minimum wage, I can tell you that there are MANY times when I just couldn't let people off work for whatever reason. And, with availability being the primary requirement of the job, people who ask for too much time off lose their jobs. That's just the way it is. And as someone who has worked those jobs, I have had the same experience.
Yes, yes there is something else we can give parents: RESPECT
to quote an old friend of mine, any similarity between your reality and mine is purely coincidental. just because your job allows you to do x and y and z and allows you to get off work for whatever does not mean that that is the case for everyone. in fact, that is the exception and not the rule.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
I'm not really even sure what you are talking about.
I have known plenty of patients who couldn't get off work for a fucking abortion. Or for prenatal care. Or for surgery. Not being able to get off work is a HUGE problem in the medical field too, not just in education.
pathetic.
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
Perhaps I misunderstood, but did you just essentially say that children who aren't good in school shouldn't be fed??
Yes, it was. And yet, still somehow believable given the source. On that note, I'm outta here!