decriminalising it for posession means that whilst it isn't legal having posession 9yes and using) for personal use is in itself not a crime, legalising it means it is legal to sell, distribute in whatever amount you like. Until decriminalisation for personal use (say 14 days worth) is acheived and users as opposed to people making a profit from it are still being prosecuted or charged you cannot take the next step to legalisation.
In relation to worrying about kids etc, pot is readily available to kids if they want it who here can say they have ever had any trouble getting ahold of it if they want it. decriminalisation protects kids from ending up with records for something as meaningless as having a joint.
I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
Legalize it here in America....
Let the government tax it and control it just like tobacco.....
Let the government charge $800 an ounce.....
And if you get caught buying it from your friend down the street???
$10,000 fine, 6 months probation....
2nd offense???
1 Year prison......
You want the government to legalize pot???
Im all for it....
So then the war on drugs would just become the war on tax cheats and there wouldn't be any cash savings. Since it is not like the guy with a few lights and a little grop op in his basement would stop producing. I don't have a problem with legalization, but the idea that there would be this magical tax revenue stream is kind of crazy. I mean people who grow pot now aren't afraid of going to jail for producing drugs so why would they be scared of going to jail for tax evasion? Plus these guys already have their systems set up, and probably paid for, so unless the tax rates are really low, how could a taxed product compete on price with an untaxed product. In Ontario, illegal cigarettes are a huge problem, because the amount of tax paid on a legally bought pack of smokes is very high.
Legalize it here in America....
Let the government tax it and control it just like tobacco.....
Let the government charge $800 an ounce.....
And if you get caught buying it from your friend down the street???
$10,000 fine, 6 months probation....
2nd offense???
1 Year prison......
You want the government to legalize pot???
Im all for it....
So then the war on drugs would just become the war on tax cheats and there wouldn't be any cash savings. Since it is not like the guy with a few lights and a little grop op in his basement would stop producing. I don't have a problem with legalization, but the idea that there would be this magical tax revenue stream is kind of crazy. I mean people who grow pot now aren't afraid of going to jail for producing drugs so why would they be scared of going to jail for tax evasion? Plus these guys already have their systems set up, and probably paid for, so unless the tax rates are really low, how could a taxed product compete on price with an untaxed product. In Ontario, illegal cigarettes are a huge problem, because the amount of tax paid on a legally bought pack of smokes is very high.
my ONLY reason for agreeing for legalization is to help stop the cartels and smuggling that is leaving a trail of dead bodies on both sides of the border and the money spent on this drug war.
I am for this, but let's not start with the "tax it" argument until we talk about other places the government will cut taxes to offset the income from a pot tax.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
Agreed, but neither is alcohol...
Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
Agreed, but neither is alcohol...
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
again if people are chronic users they are going to be using regardless of the legalality
I don't mean to offend anyone, a lot of what I say should be taken with a grain of salt... that said for most of you I'm a stranger on a computer on the other side of the world, don't give me that sort of power!
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
How can you be sure that pot caused his condition?
SOME studies say that it can aggravate, or even trigger ALREADY EXISTING, UNDERLYING mental issues. Other studies debunk that. Its been studied to death, and the fact of the matter is that regardless of these side effects, it is still MUCH less harmful than many, many other legal drugs....and more versatile/beneficial than most.
It may well be underlying but I've seen it way too many times for it to be a coincedence. In a couple of instances, your right, it has been underlying because it has run in the family but smoking too much pot has helped bring on the psychosis. Trust me, after many many convos with this person's doctors over the years whether it was solely smoking pot or underlying mental problem, the dope didn't help. As for it being much less harmless, doesn't really make it okay for everybody to take. There may be much less risk in jumping off a cliff than lying under a train, doesn't mean I'm going to do either of them. I loved the odd doobie when I was younger, don't get me wrong, I know there are alot of users it doesn't effect but I know alot it has effected. Everyone is intitled to their own opinions of whether or not to legalise it and I just don't think people should think it's harmless that's all. On another note, this bloody 'ice' or whatever it's called is getting to be a massive problem now, a certain mother I know has deserted her kids because of it, does anyone know what it's actually made of???
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
How can you be sure that pot caused his condition?
SOME studies say that it can aggravate, or even trigger ALREADY EXISTING, UNDERLYING mental issues. Other studies debunk that. Its been studied to death, and the fact of the matter is that regardless of these side effects, it is still MUCH less harmful than many, many other legal drugs....and more versatile/beneficial than most.
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
It may well be underlying but I've seen it way too many times for it to be a coincedence. In a couple of instances, your right, it has been underlying because it has run in the family but smoking too much pot has helped bring on the psychosis. Trust me, after many many convos with this person's doctors over the years whether it was solely smoking pot or underlying mental problem, the dope didn't help. As for it being much less harmless, doesn't really make it okay for everybody to take. There may be much less risk in jumping off a cliff than lying under a train, doesn't mean I'm going to do either of them. I loved the odd doobie when I was younger, don't get me wrong, I know there are alot of users it doesn't effect but I know alot it has effected. Everyone is intitled to their own opinions of whether or not to legalise it and I just don't think people should think it's harmless that's all. On another note, this bloody 'ice' or whatever it's called is getting to be a massive problem now, a certain mother I know has deserted her kids because of it, does anyone know what it's actually made of???
Sorry folks but I just don't see how decriminalising it is going to help chronic users of it. Unless you have seen the effects on some people and had to live with someone losing their grip on reality from it, I'm sure you would think it's harmless. I had to visit this person in the pysch ward every week and taste his food and water first before he would touch it. I had to scan his room for cameras before he'd sit in it. Trust me, it's not harmless for everyone!!!
How can you be sure that pot caused his condition?
SOME studies say that it can aggravate, or even trigger ALREADY EXISTING, UNDERLYING mental issues. Other studies debunk that. Its been studied to death, and the fact of the matter is that regardless of these side effects, it is still MUCH less harmful than many, many other legal drugs....and more versatile/beneficial than most.
I understand that you've had very negative experiences with it, and i am sorry to hear about it, issues like that aren't very common at all. Some people become paranoid after smoking for a while and have to stop (and i know at least 6 people that had to do this and they stopped because they didn't enjoy it anymore, there was no addictive issue) but that's just how some people are with it. Yes, chronic use of it can lead to some negative issues with emotions and memory but like said, anti-deppressants, vicotin, aderol, and a dozen other medications cause many more problems and harmful side effects than weed. Even tho you've had negative issues with it, there are a lot of people out there who have benefited greatly from it. I know a few cancer patients that swear by it and it also helps with arthritis and sleep issues. It's not as bad as it's made out to be but again, it's not for everyone.
First post here in a moving train. I usually steer clear of political and/or religous conversations but AET & other music were a little slow today. I've read through this entire thread and see a lot of valid points. I am of the opinion that marijuana is far and away less dangerous than most any other drug out there including prescription pills and alcohol for that matter. There is the argument of marijuana being a 'gateway' drug, but I feel that if it is legalized and regulated, than it would dramatically decrease the number of younger users (whom are most often the victim of said 'gateway' drug). It was always easier for me to score drugs when I was underage than it was alcohol and I think that if it were legalized and only sold to those 21+ than it would make it harder for the youth to get a hold of, as 'black-market' dealers would pretty much go away. I'll also agree that the tax revenues and savings from law enforecement agencies, corrections facilities, and courts would be almost immeasurable. I think that the drug should be treated a lot like alcohol. You must be of a certain age to purchsae it, you must consume it in a designated place, you must have a special permit/license to produce it, you must have an altogether different license/permit to sell it, it must be taxed, and it must be regulated. Private growers would be subjected to frequent quality control testing (seeing to it that no one is lacing the stuff with more anything that could be harful and addicting). I know there's a lot more to it, but I really think that the legalization would all-in-all be a great benefit to our society and our economy. And to be honest, I think it's only a short matter of time before we are seriously voting on a National reform. Off topic, for those who havent seen it, I recommend checking out a documentary called "The Union - The Business Behind Getting High". Interesting to say the least. http://www.amazon.com/Union-Business-Be ... B0025XUTKQ
peace
You make some good points, if they could keep a close watch on it's use and age of use. And I obviously agree that it's less riskier than taking other drugs but really, do we HAVE to choice a drug to take? How about none at all? Same with alcohol, I mean I love the odd drink but would my world crumble without it? No. I loved the odd spliff but do I miss it now? No. I know that the thought of legalising dope to dope users sounds like a beautiful dream but when you have little ones to protect it's a scary thought. If my baby comes home one day and says to me "look Mum I smoke dope,,,,but it's not as dangerous as other drugs, I'm not going to be like "phewww, at least it's dope!!!!!!" I'll be hell disappointed and worried for he little mind.
You say it's not common Pjfan01 for it to effect you yet you go onto say you have seen 6 people who it's mentally effected????
First post here in a moving train. I usually steer clear of political and/or religous conversations but AET & other music were a little slow today. I've read through this entire thread and see a lot of valid points. I am of the opinion that marijuana is far and away less dangerous than most any other drug out there including prescription pills and alcohol for that matter. There is the argument of marijuana being a 'gateway' drug, but I feel that if it is legalized and regulated, than it would dramatically decrease the number of younger users (whom are most often the victim of said 'gateway' drug). It was always easier for me to score drugs when I was underage than it was alcohol and I think that if it were legalized and only sold to those 21+ than it would make it harder for the youth to get a hold of, as 'black-market' dealers would pretty much go away. I'll also agree that the tax revenues and savings from law enforecement agencies, corrections facilities, and courts would be almost immeasurable. I think that the drug should be treated a lot like alcohol. You must be of a certain age to purchsae it, you must consume it in a designated place, you must have a special permit/license to produce it, you must have an altogether different license/permit to sell it, it must be taxed, and it must be regulated. Private growers would be subjected to frequent quality control testing (seeing to it that no one is lacing the stuff with more anything that could be harful and addicting). I know there's a lot more to it, but I really think that the legalization would all-in-all be a great benefit to our society and our economy. And to be honest, I think it's only a short matter of time before we are seriously voting on a National reform. Off topic, for those who havent seen it, I recommend checking out a documentary called "The Union - The Business Behind Getting High". Interesting to say the least. http://www.amazon.com/Union-Business-Be ... B0025XUTKQ
peace
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
marijuana has no withdraw effects since your body slowly weans itself from it (17 hour half life) so i'm all for legalization. moderation is the key as with anything, and there will be several who are just stoners and waste their life away as with any drug. the potential for abuse is no worse than a perscription medication. medical conditions are a risk when taking any substance, hence moderation and paying attention to your body. i'm cool with restrictions too (no driving or reporting to work if your employer cares for example).
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
marijuana has no withdraw effects since your body slowly weans itself from it (17 hour half life) so i'm all for legalization. moderation is the key as with anything, and there will be several who are just stoners and waste their life away as with any drug. the potential for abuse is no worse than a perscription medication. medical conditions are a risk when taking any substance, hence moderation and paying attention to your body. i'm cool with restrictions too (no driving or reporting to work if your employer cares for example).
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
there are some withdrawl effects for heavy users, trust me i know
recently I am no longer susceptible to random drug screenings, so I smoke a bit here and there. It replaced my alcohol usage and I haven't had a drink in almost a month.
I feel ABSOLUTELY GREAT, my skin looks better, my gym performance is much better, and mentally I feel great. Alcohol is such a fucking poison and that doesn't become apparent until you stop using it completely.
Everything not forbidden is compulsory and eveything not compulsory is forbidden. You are free... free to do what the government says you can do.
marijuana has no withdraw effects since your body slowly weans itself from it (17 hour half life) so i'm all for legalization. moderation is the key as with anything, and there will be several who are just stoners and waste their life away as with any drug. the potential for abuse is no worse than a perscription medication. medical conditions are a risk when taking any substance, hence moderation and paying attention to your body. i'm cool with restrictions too (no driving or reporting to work if your employer cares for example).
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
there are some withdrawl effects for heavy users, trust me i know
When pot was made illegal by the Feds in 1937, the American Medical Association opposed the law as they were supporting doctors who were treating patients with it. The main support for the law was from companies who made synthetic fibers like nylon and wanted to eliminate the hemp industry. This is not a conspiracy theory - it's history. But just like with the prohibition of alcohol, a huge and unconquerable black market opened, and without that black market, what fucking music would we have to listen to???? :shock:
When pot was made illegal by the Feds in 1937, the American Medical Association opposed the law as they were supporting doctors who were treating patients with it. The main support for the law was from companies who made synthetic fibers like nylon and wanted to eliminate the hemp industry. This is not a conspiracy theory - it's history. But just like with the prohibition of alcohol, a huge and unconquerable black market opened, and without that black market, what fucking music would we have to listen to???? :shock:
No pot, no Pearl Jam. I rest my case.
The guys smoke 'dem tweeds (name the movie)? Say it ain't so!
marijuana has no withdraw effects since your body slowly weans itself from it (17 hour half life) so i'm all for legalization. moderation is the key as with anything, and there will be several who are just stoners and waste their life away as with any drug. the potential for abuse is no worse than a perscription medication. medical conditions are a risk when taking any substance, hence moderation and paying attention to your body. i'm cool with restrictions too (no driving or reporting to work if your employer cares for example).
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
there are some withdrawl effects for heavy users, trust me i know
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
marijuana has no withdraw effects since your body slowly weans itself from it (17 hour half life) so i'm all for legalization. moderation is the key as with anything, and there will be several who are just stoners and waste their life away as with any drug. the potential for abuse is no worse than a perscription medication. medical conditions are a risk when taking any substance, hence moderation and paying attention to your body. i'm cool with restrictions too (no driving or reporting to work if your employer cares for example).
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
there are some withdrawl effects for heavy users, trust me i know
I think until you see the effects of it on someone you love, you still think it's harmless. I've said how I feel about this subject and it's not based on taxes, black market or beneficial pain relief, it's purely based on what I have experienced first hand with this drug and what doctors have told me. There's really no point in me going through a big discussion about it with people who either obviously are smoking it and/or haven't seen what I have seen. Although, the pain relief for cancer patients and the like, I can understand. It's a free world and everyone is intitled to an opinion but the thought of my daughter smoking it day in day out and suffering the way I have seen friends and family suffer, scares the crap out of me. There has been too many chronic smokers that have gone haywire in the head for it to be a coincidence.
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
You can say that pot causes mental health issues, but you're wrong. Trust me, I have experience with it. I'm not going to discuss it any further. See how easy that is?
Your biased opinions and limited personal experiences do not a scientific study make. Besides, I could find you scientific data to support ANY stance on MJ prohibition; it's been studied to fucking death. And it's all moot. This is about fair treatment, equality, personal liberty and responsibility (yes, it can have harmful side effects in a small number of users...but this is the personal responsibility part).
It's easy to say 'do we have to choose a drug to take, how about none at all?'....well, how about it then? If your personal moral judgement of inebriation is going to be our guideline here....do you support criminalizing alcohol and all other intoxicants? Do you support mandatory minimums/three strikes/forfeiture laws for prescription drug abusers? Because despite your desire to protect people from themselves, the status quo FORCES a law abiding citizen to choose alcohol, the most dangerous drug of them all. I have to wonder if your opinion would change if you'd been busted one of those times you 'enjoyed a spliff' when you were younger, and legalization would mean your lifelong criminal record, education funding denials, travel limitations, etc were repealed...? All of your arguments are based on health risks....so why do you insist on turning a health issue into a legal one? Wouldn't your friends be better off with more healthcare funding, considering the fact that drug war funding did sweet fuck all to prevent the problems they've had???
On a side note, I'd like to point out that you seem to infer a righteous stance by saying that 'once you have kids' to protect, (legalization) is a scary thought'. Are you scared that you will not be able to keep your kid from smoking pot if it's legal? Do you think legalization gives you ANY less control over that than you have now? I don't mean to take an aggressive tone, but I resent this inference...I have kids myself and I don't think destroying other peoples lives based on a false presumption of added security for my kids is a reasonable approach to this.
And to answer your previous question: ice is crystal methamphetamine. It's made of a ton of nasty chemicals, and is probably the most poisonous/damaging of all popular recreational drugs.
Like I said above, everyone is entitled to their own opinion without an aggressive response. I understand that in your opinion, it has no effect on mental health, I've been told and seen otherwise. Ultimately I guess just as you think that I am completely wrong and being naive, I think you are just as naive for believing it does absolutely nothing to your mental health. I can only speak for myself when it comes to my own child, I won't apologize for worrying about her health and yes, if it's legal of course it will be more readily available!!!!
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
I think guys have me all wrong. I have agreed with many of your points, in particular Hewhoforgets made some great points. I'm just saying that certain rules need to be put in place and that people shouldn't be naive to the fact that it does effect you mentally. At least I can admit if someone makes some true points, some of you seem more bloody dictorial and unwavering than I do!!!! At the end of the day, there's no need to be arragant and rude, you can make your point but it helps to see the grey area too! I thought this was a discussion not a fucking slanging match. I think I've made my point, pot does make people moody bastards!!
“ "Thank you Palestrina. It’s a wonderful evening, it’s great to be here and I wanna dedicate you a super sexy song." " (last words of Mark Sandman of Morphine)
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
It's not the drug, it's the irresponsible, idiotic morons who would abuse it and let it destroy their lives. We have seen it with alcohol, and it will happen with weed. Trust me, I am 100% for legalization, but our society has shown that we are too irresponsible and too stupid to handle the gift of legalized marijuana.
Once again, it is the few ruining it for the many.
P.S. I do find it funny though, that we live in a society where we are told to stay away from a plant - one that grows freely from "God's" green earth - but we, once we turn 21, can freely kill ourselves with alcohol. Strange.
Like I said above, everyone is entitled to their own opinion without an aggressive response. I understand that in your opinion, it has no effect on mental health, I've been told and seen otherwise. Ultimately I guess just as you think that I am completely wrong and being naive, I think you are just as naive for believing it does absolutely nothing to your mental health. I can only speak for myself when it comes to my own child, I won't apologize for worrying about her health and yes, if it's legal of course it will be more readily available!!!!
Ya, we definitely have a few disconnects happenin here.
I didn't call you naive, and no one is asking you to apologize for worrying about your daughter's health. geez.
I did say that I 'resent' that you seem to see your parenting outlook on the topic as superior to mine, but that inference was bein a bit sensitive...and maybe I should have said 'regret'? whatevs...
Also, my opinion is definitely NOT that it has no effect on mental health...it most likely does...in fact, I recognized side effects in my last post, and in my first on the topic, possible mental health effects. So I'm not being dictatorial or unwavering, either...
I’m not sure what to say about the second link, but I’ll be less aggressive and ignore it altogether
The model proposed by the 2007 report cited in your first link, and published in the Lancet, was effectively debunked in 2009 by this study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19560900
If you read this research: http://www.schizophreniaforum.org/new/d ... sp?id=1522
You’ll find that there are compounds in marijuana that can actually be used to treat schizophrenia/psychosis.
None of this work is definitive. The Zammit report acknowledges its own limitations, and the article you linked gives a pretty fair contrary account of the studies' inherent and conclusive flaws. It’s not exactly hard science; it was a meta-analysis of a bunch of other studies conducted, and funded, during the war on drugs…
But that’s what I’m saying, this merry-go-round never ends!
Our governments will be happy to keep spending our money on these studies (or cherry picking them from our institutions for political gain) in order to detract from any meaningful debate on policy revision, and to find a way to keep the drug-war/prison-industrial machine chugging along. This is not in the public's best interest! Profit!!!!
I’ll ask again, minus the profanity :
why turn a health issue into a legal one? Wouldn't your friends be better off with more healthcare funding, considering the fact that drug war funding did nothing to prevent the problems they've had???
Comments
Ohhhh yeahhhhhhhh
Godfather.
In relation to worrying about kids etc, pot is readily available to kids if they want it who here can say they have ever had any trouble getting ahold of it if they want it. decriminalisation protects kids from ending up with records for something as meaningless as having a joint.
So then the war on drugs would just become the war on tax cheats and there wouldn't be any cash savings. Since it is not like the guy with a few lights and a little grop op in his basement would stop producing. I don't have a problem with legalization, but the idea that there would be this magical tax revenue stream is kind of crazy. I mean people who grow pot now aren't afraid of going to jail for producing drugs so why would they be scared of going to jail for tax evasion? Plus these guys already have their systems set up, and probably paid for, so unless the tax rates are really low, how could a taxed product compete on price with an untaxed product. In Ontario, illegal cigarettes are a huge problem, because the amount of tax paid on a legally bought pack of smokes is very high.
my ONLY reason for agreeing for legalization is to help stop the cartels and smuggling that is leaving a trail of dead bodies on both sides of the border and the money spent on this drug war.
Godfather.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
SOME studies say that it can aggravate, or even trigger ALREADY EXISTING, UNDERLYING mental issues. Other studies debunk that. Its been studied to death, and the fact of the matter is that regardless of these side effects, it is still MUCH less harmful than many, many other legal drugs....and more versatile/beneficial than most.
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
I understand that you've had very negative experiences with it, and i am sorry to hear about it, issues like that aren't very common at all. Some people become paranoid after smoking for a while and have to stop (and i know at least 6 people that had to do this and they stopped because they didn't enjoy it anymore, there was no addictive issue) but that's just how some people are with it. Yes, chronic use of it can lead to some negative issues with emotions and memory but like said, anti-deppressants, vicotin, aderol, and a dozen other medications cause many more problems and harmful side effects than weed. Even tho you've had negative issues with it, there are a lot of people out there who have benefited greatly from it. I know a few cancer patients that swear by it and it also helps with arthritis and sleep issues. It's not as bad as it's made out to be but again, it's not for everyone.
peace
You say it's not common Pjfan01 for it to effect you yet you go onto say you have seen 6 people who it's mentally effected????
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
as long as the government doesn't put a ridiculous tax on it then i'm cool. it would take a while for it to become outrageous, they'd have to eliminate the black market first.
there are some withdrawl effects for heavy users, trust me i know
I feel ABSOLUTELY GREAT, my skin looks better, my gym performance is much better, and mentally I feel great. Alcohol is such a fucking poison and that doesn't become apparent until you stop using it completely.
No pot, no Pearl Jam. I rest my case.
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
i bet no one knows how i feel about this subject
"what a long, strange trip it's been"
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
Your biased opinions and limited personal experiences do not a scientific study make. Besides, I could find you scientific data to support ANY stance on MJ prohibition; it's been studied to fucking death. And it's all moot. This is about fair treatment, equality, personal liberty and responsibility (yes, it can have harmful side effects in a small number of users...but this is the personal responsibility part).
It's easy to say 'do we have to choose a drug to take, how about none at all?'....well, how about it then? If your personal moral judgement of inebriation is going to be our guideline here....do you support criminalizing alcohol and all other intoxicants? Do you support mandatory minimums/three strikes/forfeiture laws for prescription drug abusers? Because despite your desire to protect people from themselves, the status quo FORCES a law abiding citizen to choose alcohol, the most dangerous drug of them all. I have to wonder if your opinion would change if you'd been busted one of those times you 'enjoyed a spliff' when you were younger, and legalization would mean your lifelong criminal record, education funding denials, travel limitations, etc were repealed...? All of your arguments are based on health risks....so why do you insist on turning a health issue into a legal one? Wouldn't your friends be better off with more healthcare funding, considering the fact that drug war funding did sweet fuck all to prevent the problems they've had???
On a side note, I'd like to point out that you seem to infer a righteous stance by saying that 'once you have kids' to protect, (legalization) is a scary thought'. Are you scared that you will not be able to keep your kid from smoking pot if it's legal? Do you think legalization gives you ANY less control over that than you have now? I don't mean to take an aggressive tone, but I resent this inference...I have kids myself and I don't think destroying other peoples lives based on a false presumption of added security for my kids is a reasonable approach to this.
And to answer your previous question: ice is crystal methamphetamine. It's made of a ton of nasty chemicals, and is probably the most poisonous/damaging of all popular recreational drugs.
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/news ... otic-later
http://www.whatstherush.org.au/index.ph ... mitstart=2
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
Please, also do an illegal search and seizure of the contents of my bladder.
....................................... if Kafka or Orwell were alive to see this they would be in disbelief.
Adelaide 1998
Adelaide 2003
Adelaide 2006 night 1
Adelaide 2006 night 2
Adelaide 2009
Melbourne 2009
Christchurch NZ 2009
Eddie Vedder, Adelaide 2011
PJ20 USA 2011 night 1
PJ20 USA 2011 night 2
Adelaide BIG DAY OUT 2014
Once again, it is the few ruining it for the many.
P.S. I do find it funny though, that we live in a society where we are told to stay away from a plant - one that grows freely from "God's" green earth - but we, once we turn 21, can freely kill ourselves with alcohol. Strange.
I didn't call you naive, and no one is asking you to apologize for worrying about your daughter's health. geez.
I did say that I 'resent' that you seem to see your parenting outlook on the topic as superior to mine, but that inference was bein a bit sensitive...and maybe I should have said 'regret'?
Also, my opinion is definitely NOT that it has no effect on mental health...it most likely does...in fact, I recognized side effects in my last post, and in my first on the topic, possible mental health effects. So I'm not being dictatorial or unwavering, either...
I’m not sure what to say about the second link, but I’ll be less aggressive and ignore it altogether
The model proposed by the 2007 report cited in your first link, and published in the Lancet, was effectively debunked in 2009 by this study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19560900
If you read this research:
http://www.schizophreniaforum.org/new/d ... sp?id=1522
You’ll find that there are compounds in marijuana that can actually be used to treat schizophrenia/psychosis.
None of this work is definitive. The Zammit report acknowledges its own limitations, and the article you linked gives a pretty fair contrary account of the studies' inherent and conclusive flaws. It’s not exactly hard science; it was a meta-analysis of a bunch of other studies conducted, and funded, during the war on drugs…
But that’s what I’m saying, this merry-go-round never ends!
Our governments will be happy to keep spending our money on these studies (or cherry picking them from our institutions for political gain) in order to detract from any meaningful debate on policy revision, and to find a way to keep the drug-war/prison-industrial machine chugging along. This is not in the public's best interest! Profit!!!!
I’ll ask again, minus the profanity
why turn a health issue into a legal one? Wouldn't your friends be better off with more healthcare funding, considering the fact that drug war funding did nothing to prevent the problems they've had???