China's rise worries neighbours

catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
edited October 2010 in A Moving Train
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/fe ... 47305.html



Territorial disputes between China and Japan leave some countries nervous, as Asian leaders meet in Vietnam.


China’s imperious behaviour in recent territorial spats with its edgy neighbours has touched a raw nerve. Anxiety about its intentions and the future outlook loom large as leaders of the 16-nation East Asia Summit gather this weekend in Hanoi, Vietnam's capital, to discuss regional matters.

As tensions up north between Beijing and Tokyo show few signs of abating, many are voicing fears that China’s surpassing of Japan as the world’s second largest economy has put into fast forward its ambitions about fulfilling its dream of unification through reclaiming lost territories.

Some even say that the restoration of an international order where the Middle Kingdom gains supremacy in the region and beyond is on the agenda of the Chinese leadership.

An October article in the online edition of the US-based Foreign Policy magazine claimed that Beijing has abandoned its philosophy of a "peaceful rise". It argues that China is harking back to a Sino-centric view of the world where it sits atop the political hierarchy and other sovereign states are seen as lesser entities in deference to the Middle Kingdom.

Disquiet about the revival of a Sino-centric mentality among the Chinese ruling elite has surfaced even in hardcore nationalistic media outlets like China’s Global Times newspaper.

"China’s success is the result of reform and opening up but success has not brought a more open mind. On the contrary, it has caused the return of a self-centred ideology," said a signed opinion piece on October 11. "The cultures around China have, historically, worried about being engulfed by other powerful civilisations. Now they feel uncomfortable with …China’s over- emphasis on its own civilisation," it said.

Japan disputes

In September, the same paper emphatically stated that China’s claims over the disputed Senkaku/Diaoyu islands are part of a broader claim to the Okinawa prefecture, which it said Japan snatched from the Qing dynasty that ruled China in the early 19th century.

When disputes over the rocky isles claimed by both China and Japan boiled over in September, Beijing cancelled diplomatic meetings with Tokyo, cut off the export of rare earth materials upon which Japan depends, and demanded an apology after Tokyo gave in to its demands and released the detained crew of a Chinese fishing trawler.

Beijing also reacted with fury to comments by the Japanese foreign minister describing its retaliatory action as "hysterical".

Beijing’s anger was palpable too when China’s growing assertiveness over the disputed territories in the South China Sea was countered earlier this year by the United States with arguments about the area being "maritime commons".

At a July security meeting of Association of South-East Asian Nations (ASEAN) countries, US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton stressed the importance that the United States attaches to the freedom of navigation in the South China Sea, calling it a US "national interest". In those busy international shipping lanes, there are islets like the Spratlys and the Paracels that are claimed in part or in full by not less than six countries.

Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi retorted that Beijing considers the South China Sea a "core national interest" and that "China is a big country and other countries are small countries and that is just a fact."

China’s recent territorial rows have occurred mostly on sea, which illustrates the country’s new push to increase its development space and seek new energy and mineral resources.

In August, Beijing announced that it had dispatched a manned submarine beneath the South China Sea to plant the Chinese flag on the seabed and begin a search for valuable undersea mineral deposits. Not coincidentally, the Senkaku/Diaoyu islands in the Yellow Sea are believed to be sitting on underwater deposits of natural gas too.

China’s emphasis on sea rights is not new, having occurred under the rule of late economic reform architect Deng Xiaoping. Unlike Mao Zedong who waged wars with neighbouring countries on land, Deng stressed the importance of China’s sovereignty and sea rights.

Maritime defence

As China’s economy continues to grow at staggering pace, straining the country’s resources and energy supplies, sea exploration and development is acquiring a new urgency.

In recent years, China has taken steps to strengthen its maritime defence, streamline its complicated system of sea management rights and build up a modern China Coast Guard parallel to those of the United States and Japan.

From Beijing’s point of view, the escalation of recent territorial disputes is entirely due to the United States’ high-profile "re-engagement" with the region. In September, US President Obama held a summit with leaders of the 10-member ASEAN and pledged that the United States will play a "leadership role in Asia".

"Already Clinton’s declaration about the South China Sea as maritime commons was meant to announce the return of the United States to Asia," says Liu Ming, Asia researcher with the Shanghai Academy of Social Sciences. "The US (government) wants to internationalise an issue that is meant to be resolved between China and relevant parties on bilateral basis. This is not a multilateral matter. Going the US way would make things in the South China sea only more complicated."

Some are already warning that the re-emergence of the US factor in the region will rob ASEAN of the opportunity to speak with its own voice. The fifth East Asia Summit on October 30 is expected to invite the leaders of Russia and the United States to participate in it starting from 2011. But to Beijing, this welcome extended to "big powers" like the United States and Russia to the region’s decision-making table is a poorly thought out attempt to counterbalance the rise of China.

"The United States is trying to sow mistrust between China and ASEAN," says Ma Ying of the Shanghai Institute for International Studies, cautioning that the region may become entangled in the battle for influence between the two superpowers.

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Comments

  • haffajappahaffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    Jeezy Chrizzy, China is big enough. It's bad enough the bastards won't let go of Tibet, and then lock people up for speaking out against their regime...
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    haffajappa wrote:
    Jeezy Chrizzy, China is big enough. It's bad enough the bastards won't let go of Tibet, and then lock people up for speaking out against their regime...

    all theyre on about is territory they claim is rightfully theirs. whatever that means. theyre not invading and setting up military bases in the name of freedom and democracy. this is about disputed territorial rights. i dont see it as expansionism. then again perhaps im a little naive. who knows.















    ...the shadow knows. 8-)
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Big bad China the evil bogeyman threatening world peace and security!!!


    The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands are uninhabited. Maybe some seagulls or crabs live on them but nothing else. But this now means that China is seeking world domination?

    What a joke.
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Big bad China the evil bogeyman threatening world peace and security!!!


    The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands are uninhabited. Maybe some seagulls or crabs live on them but nothing else. But this now means that China is seeking world domination?

    What a joke.

    oh come on steve. its funny. i think it is anyway. i love watching the US freak out.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • haffajappahaffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Big bad China the evil bogeyman threatening world peace and security!!!


    The Senkaku/Diaoyu islands are uninhabited. Maybe some seagulls or crabs live on them but nothing else. But this now means that China is seeking world domination?

    What a joke.
    For gods sake, will SOMEBODY think of the seagulls?!
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • SmellymanSmellyman Asia Posts: 4,524
    meanwhile......

    the US has over 60,000 troops in Asia....
  • MotoDCMotoDC Posts: 947
    In before someone turns this into an I-hate-the-US thread...oh damn, too late already. Silly me.

    Snide jabs aside, however, this article does sound like much ado about nothing. At least for now.
  • JeanwahJeanwah Posts: 6,363
    haffajappa wrote:
    Jeezy Chrizzy, China is big enough. It's bad enough the bastards won't let go of Tibet, and then lock people up for speaking out against their regime...

    all theyre on about is territory they claim is rightfully theirs. whatever that means. theyre not invading and setting up military bases in the name of freedom and democracy. this is about disputed territorial rights. i dont see it as expansionism. then again perhaps im a little naive. who knows.
    I bet those islands are rich in resources that's causing the fight. It does mention natural gas and mineral deposits... Who knows what else is surrounding those islands... And besides, isn't the claim to valuable natural resources what every powerful country wants own to right now, since natural resources are becoming scarcer and scarcer? It's not just about territory, but valuable territory.
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Jeanwah wrote:
    I bet those islands are rich in resources that's causing the fight. It does mention natural gas and mineral deposits... Who knows what else is surrounding those islands... And besides, isn't the claim to valuable natural resources what every powerful country wants own to right now, since natural resources are becoming scarcer and scarcer? It's not just about territory, but valuable territory.

    And I bet you're just making it up as you go along.

    Next you'll be claiming the goats on the islands have wmd's that could be deployed against America within 45 minutes.

    Why don't you just admit that you have a problem with China and everything to do with China?
  • JeanwahJeanwah Posts: 6,363
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:
    I bet those islands are rich in resources that's causing the fight. It does mention natural gas and mineral deposits... Who knows what else is surrounding those islands... And besides, isn't the claim to valuable natural resources what every powerful country wants own to right now, since natural resources are becoming scarcer and scarcer? It's not just about territory, but valuable territory.

    And I bet you're just making it up as you go along.

    Next you'll be claiming the goats on the islands have wmd's that could be deployed against America within 45 minutes.

    Why don't you just admit that you have a problem with China and everything to do with China?
    What the - :?
    The article did mention the natural gas and mineral deposits... And I was hardly speaking against China, nor for the U.S.

    You just think I have something against China...I don't actually.
  • Byrnzie wrote:

    Why don't you just admit that you have a problem with China and everything to do with China?

    Human Rights Violations. Environmental Disasters. Shitty "Made in China" products. China is what North Korea strives to be. I guess that's why China is one of North Korea's only allies.


    I can't believe we dignified these asshats with the olympics. But, hey, it worked for Hitler.
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Jeanwah wrote:
    The article did mention the natural gas and mineral deposits... And I was hardly speaking against China, nor for the U.S.

    You just think I have something against China...I don't actually.

    My apologies for thinking that the only threads on the M.T you ever contribute to are those that criticize China.
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    arthurdent wrote:
    Human Rights Violations. Environmental Disasters. Shitty "Made in China" products. China is what North Korea strives to be. I guess that's why China is one of North Korea's only allies.


    I can't believe we dignified these asshats with the olympics. But, hey, it worked for Hitler.

    Because America is a shining beacon of justice in the world, right?

    Last I heard you were dropping bombs on Afghan civilians and torturing Iraqi's.
  • JeanwahJeanwah Posts: 6,363
    arthurdent wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:

    Why don't you just admit that you have a problem with China and everything to do with China?

    Human Rights Violations. Environmental Disasters. Shitty "Made in China" products. China is what North Korea strives to be. I guess that's why China is one of North Korea's only allies.


    I can't believe we dignified these asshats with the olympics. But, hey, it worked for Hitler.

    Actually, yeah these are true. And I do have issues w/ Tibet too. But I'm sure that not everything in China is bad, just like not everything is bad about the U.S. I know that in the past I've said plenty about China to Byrnzie but that's because he has plenty to say about the U.S.

    Peace, Byrnzie?
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    China on the rise! Today these rocks, tomorrow the world!!
    Diaoyu-Islands.jpg
  • Byrnzie wrote:

    Last I heard you were dropping bombs on Afghan civilians and torturing Iraqi's.

    At least we don't force women to have abortions.
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • Jeanwah wrote:

    Actually, yeah these are true. And I do have issues w/ Tibet too. But I'm sure that not everything in China is bad, just like not everything is bad about the U.S. I know that in the past I've said plenty about China to Byrnzie but that's because he has plenty to say about the U.S.

    Peace, Byrnzie?

    The vast majority of the population are barely peasants and the communist elite are living high on the hog. It's like North Korea x 1,000. They have somehow managed to cobble together a system that combines the worst qualities of both communism and capitalism.
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    arthurdent wrote:
    The vast majority of the population are barely peasants

    You really don't know what you're talking about.
  • Byrnzie wrote:
    arthurdent wrote:
    The vast majority of the population are barely peasants

    You really don't know what you're talking about.


    Despite China's strong and sustained economic growth, poverty is still persistent, especially in remote rural areas. Income inequalities between eastern and western China have broadened, and the income gap between rural and urban residents has widened considerably since the late 1970s.

    http://www.ruralpovertyportal.org
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • China even steals their space program. Their rockets look suspiciously like U.S. Titan II ICBMs and Delta-class rockets, and their capsules are basically copies of Russian Soyuz.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_March_rocket
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhou_5
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    arthurdent wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    arthurdent wrote:
    The vast majority of the population are barely peasants

    You really don't know what you're talking about.


    Despite China's strong and sustained economic growth, poverty is still persistent, especially in remote rural areas. Income inequalities between eastern and western China have broadened, and the income gap between rural and urban residents has widened considerably since the late 1970s.

    http://www.ruralpovertyportal.org

    What's the latest on income inequalities in the U.S these days? Last I heard 17% of Americans live in poverty.

    You said the vast majority of China's population are peasnts. This is bullshit. But keep going with your fantasies.


    http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 712806.cms
    'China is expected to overtake Japan as the second wealthiest country in the world by 2015 on the back of rapid economic growth and strong domestic consumption, a report said Friday.'

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/09/ ... 2133.shtml
    'Census: 1 in 7 Americans Live in Poverty'


    Not looking too good for you is it?
  • SmellymanSmellyman Asia Posts: 4,524
    China has HUUUGE population obviously and a lot live in very rural areas or come to the cities and factories looking for work. All poor looking for riches.

    China is in a very unique situation, rapidly rising economy in the 21st century which is unprecedented. There will be many bumps in the road because NOBODY knows what will happen or how to deal with it.

    However, China has a very rapidly growing middle class and poverty is trending down, not up.
  • Byrnzie wrote:

    Not looking too good for you is it?

    you do realize that the whole "cultural relativism" argument is complete bullshit, right?
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • chadwickchadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    i've had some amazing mongolian beef before
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."

    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    Things aren't looking up in Canada or the States is because the manufacturing sector has taken a beating over the last 2 decades...both our governments have allowed companies to relocate to Mexico and China and open manufacturing facilities in places that have poor labor and environmental laws. 15 years ago it seemed everything was made in Mexico, now it's made in China, as soon as these corporations find somewhere cheaper they will relocate out of China, just as they did Mexico. Personally whenever possible I buy Made In Canada or Made In USA, because the one thing I believe in passionately is that the Canadian or US made product is far superior than Made In China, no if and or buts.
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • haffajappahaffajappa British Columbia Posts: 5,955
    Jeanwah wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Jeanwah wrote:
    I bet those islands are rich in resources that's causing the fight. It does mention natural gas and mineral deposits... Who knows what else is surrounding those islands... And besides, isn't the claim to valuable natural resources what every powerful country wants own to right now, since natural resources are becoming scarcer and scarcer? It's not just about territory, but valuable territory.

    And I bet you're just making it up as you go along.

    Next you'll be claiming the goats on the islands have wmd's that could be deployed against America within 45 minutes.

    Why don't you just admit that you have a problem with China and everything to do with China?
    What the - :?
    The article did mention the natural gas and mineral deposits... And I was hardly speaking against China, nor for the U.S.

    You just think I have something against China...I don't actually.
    Actually Jeanwah is right, i've read about this before, at least i think she's right, it is sitting on pockets of natural gas.

    Since when did you become the defender of all things Chinese, Bynzie? :?
    live pearl jam is best pearl jam
  • [quote="Smellyman"

    China is in a very unique situation, rapidly rising economy in the 21st century which is unprecedented. There will be many bumps in the road because NOBODY knows what will happen or how to deal with it.
    [/quote]

    China's big problem is that it's growing too big, too fast and alot of people are going to get left behind in the transition from developing nation to superpower status.
    Rock me Jesus, roll me Lord...
    Wash me in the blood of Rock & Roll
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    edited October 2010
    arthurdent wrote:
    you do realize that the whole "cultural relativism" argument is complete bullshit, right?

    No, I don't recognize that. Go ahead and explain to us all how it's bullshit.
    Post edited by Byrnzie on
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    arthurdent wrote:
    China's big problem is that it's growing too big, too fast and alot of people are going to get left behind in the transition from developing nation to superpower status.

    So you mean China will end up like America then?

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/09/ ... 2133.shtml

    '1 in 7 Americans Live in Poverty - 14.3 percent of the population.'
  • ByrnzieByrnzie Posts: 21,037
    haffajappa wrote:
    Actually Jeanwah is right, i've read about this before, at least i think she's right, it is sitting on pockets of natural gas.

    Apparently Afghanistan and Iraq have a lot of natural gas too.
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