Senate GOP to oppose Obama tax plan

cincybearcat

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

cincybearcat wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

the wealthiest individuals are defined as any individual making over $250,000 or any couple making over $400,000. these are the top 2% of all wage earners.

Where did you see this?

I heard on the news..it wasn't Fox News...that they were only going to keep the tax break for individuals earning less than $200,000 and families earning less than $250,000. That's a big difference from what you are stating. I gotta find out which is right.

wrong. it is individuals making less than $250,000 and couples making less than $400,000. there are soundbites stating this all over the news...i will try to find a link i guess...

Right from Obama's own website...http://www.barackobama.com/taxes/

Under the Obama Plan:

* Middle class families will see their taxes cut – and no family making less than $250,000 will see their taxes increase. The typical middle class family will receive well over $1,000 in tax relief under the Obama plan, and will pay tax rates that are 20% lower than they faced under President Reagan. According to the Tax Policy Center, the Obama plan provides three times as much tax relief for middle class families as the McCain plan.
* Families making more than $250,000 will pay either the same or lower tax rates than they paid in the 1990s. Obama will ask the wealthiest 2% of families to give back a portion of the tax cuts they have received over the past eight years to ensure we are restoring fairness and returning to fiscal responsibility. But no family will pay higher tax rates than they would have paid in the 1990s. In fact, dividend rates would be 39 percent lower than what President Bush proposed in his 2001 tax cut.

know1

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

from 2006....

http://www.faireconomy.org/press_room/2 ... b_creation

No Correlation Between Bush Tax Cuts and
Job Creation, Report Shows

2005.

United for a Fair Economy (http://www.faireconomy.org) is a national non-profit that spotlights the growing economic divide in the U.S.

I immediately distrust any organization who emphasizes anything having to do with "fair". Fair doesn't exist and since I do not believe they are ignorant enough to not realize that, I assume they have their own agenda...i.e. their version of fair that probably isn't fair for some other segment.

know1

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

gimmesometruth27

know1 wrote:

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

how do yoou figure it is increasing power and influence over our lives? are we not in a society where we fund the government? is it not the law to pay your taxes no matter what the rates are?

know1

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

know1 wrote:

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

how do yoou figure it is increasing power and influence over our lives? are we not in a society where we fund the government? is it not the law to pay your taxes no matter what the rates are?

Your reply isn't really directly in opposition to what I said. Sure - we should have to pay some taxes, but what I said was the ACT of INCREASING taxes gives the government more resources to increase it's power and influence over our lives. Conversely, that same act decreases the resources of the citizens and therefore they have less freedom.

gimmesometruth27

know1 wrote:

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

know1 wrote:

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

how do yoou figure it is increasing power and influence over our lives? are we not in a society where we fund the government? is it not the law to pay your taxes no matter what the rates are?

Your reply isn't really directly in opposition to what I said. Sure - we should have to pay some taxes, but what I said was the ACT of INCREASING taxes gives the government more resources to increase it's power and influence over our lives. Conversely, that same act decreases the resources of the citizens and therefore they have less freedom.

well either way, if these assholes refuse to compromise, everybody's taxes are going up and the government will thus take away more of our freedom...

VINNY GOOMBA

Rich people DO employ people and do create jobs. It doesn't just stop with the rich, either. The private sector in general is the only place where jobs are actually created. Is the effect an overnight phenomenon? Certainly not in an environment of complete uncertainty and instability, which is what the whole world is experiencing right now. Tax cuts will be effective if more is done to restore confidence in the market, which would require much less government intervention and regulation of most businesses, as well as drastic cuts in spending on the overseas empire and elsewhere. It will take time to see the positive effects of doing this, but it will work if given the chance. Unfortunately, I don't see this happening any time soon, although it really needs to happen to prevent absolute chaos from breaking out.

Allowing tax cuts to expire or raising taxes pisses almost everyone off, and it should. However, the anger is mis-directed, since the biggest culprit ailing confidence in the economy and most vicious form of taxation is inflation. Everyone notices when their paycheck is less thanks to taxes, or when the bridge toll doubles one day. Only a few notice the value of their money being diluted more as time progresses. There are outcries over the spending, but still only a few are wary of how the spending process actually works (or doesn't work and screws over everyone BUT the absolute elite). This country has to take a serious look at reigning in the Fed or completely abolishing it, because it is the vehicle that allows for out of control spending, and protection of fraudulent and poor business practice. Take this step, and people can argue all day about whether direct taxation is too high or too low and the argument itself will actually have merit. For now, it's almost a moot point to argue about tax raises or cuts seeing as how any action is only going to marginally effect the debt problem. However, giving businesses more incentive to do business couldn't hurt at all. Cut taxes across the board, even for the rich. What needs to stop is bailing them out when they make bad decisions.

mikepegg44

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

refuse to compromise, everybody's taxes are going up and the government will thus take away more of our freedom...

why are they assholes for not wanting taxes to go up? Talk about fairness? I say good for them for standing up for their constituents. Republicans are supposed to be about smaller government...most aren't anymore, so when they actually stand up for it I say good.

And right on Vinny...the fed is extremely dangerous

cincybearcat

Interesting read on it...

http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/24/news/ec ... n&hpt=Sbin

breath123

know1 wrote:

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

Ugh, again with this crap.

The rich bought the government, so the thing that you despise so much is run by the people whose ass you are constantly licking.

sucks to be you.

puppet.

Jason P

breath123 wrote:

know1 wrote:

When the government raises taxes - even on the so-called rich - it is just trying to increase its power and influence over our lives...and thereby reduce our so-called freedoms even more.

When it lowers taxes, the opposite is true.

Ugh, again with this crap.

The rich bought the government, so the thing that you despise so much is run by the people whose ass you are constantly licking.

sucks to be you.

puppet.

And a happy Friday to you, sir! :wave:

MellowCat

Death taxes, capital gains taxes and taxes on dividends will affect every American that owns stock or dies. I am very concerned about those being raised. If Congress would have done something about the expiring Bush Tax Cuts before the pussies high-tailed it outta there, maybe businesses would at least know whether they could afford to hire people or not.

I don't own a business, but not knowing what the tax rate is going to be has stopped me from doing a lot of spending that I would have otherwise done, including hiring people for construction projects around my house.

When those assholes cut out the wasteful spending, then they can talk to me about raising my taxes.

Commy

Jason P wrote:

I think the tax cut issue is a brilliant strategy by the democrats. It's a good strategy because Obama can claim to be the defender of the middle class heading into November while still raising taxes. The GOP is awkwardly forced to oppose the plan because it will cost their voters $700B, which the democrats can then appropriate the money to their voters . . . or pay for the military for one year :shock: . Genius.

its was a plan put in place by the GOP tho, setting the tax cuts to expire under the next president, who they all probably agreed was going to be a democrat, given how terrible a job bush did. it makes it look like obama is raising taxes on the rich, when in reality he's simply putting things back the way they were before bush screwed them.

and i hate to defend obama, because i don't really support anything he does, but he is saving 98% of people from a tax hike, or is going to prevent them from expiring.

and i guess since everyone is so concerned about that top 2% really shows how influencial fox news can be.


The top 2% wage earners in america can afford a tax hike, they probably own half of the county
anyway.

pjfan021

i agree with people being concerned with small businesses getting hit on this. If they're hit then obviously things will not work out well because it is SMALL businesses that create jobs. Secondly, I think that the clinton era taxes saw extremely good production. Lastly, extending these tax cuts will cost us 700billion we don't have, so in essence that's wasteful spending.

mikepegg44

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

MotoDC wrote:

unsung wrote:

The answer is to stop spending, NOT raise taxes.

This is generally my position as well, though I have to admit I'm not as familiar with the specifics of the Obama plan as I should be. My biggest concern would be how the plan defines the "wealthiest" Americans and whether that includes small business owners that don't file as a corporation. Whether gimmesometruth wants to believe it or not, that is where the majority of job creation comes from. Perhaps not top-paying employment, but let's face it, we can't all be rock stars.

the wealthiest individuals are defined as any individual making over $250,000 or any couple making over $400,000. these are the top 2% of all wage earners.

WHERE ARE THE JOBS THAT WERE REPORTEDLY CREATED BY THESE TAX CUTS? what happened when we were hemoraging over 700,000 jobs a month under bush's last few months?? same tax cuts were in place there, yet no jobs were created. that is a bullshit talking point that the rich are the only ones create the jobs. if they were creating jobs it would be pulling us out of this recession because more people would be working. when unemployment is nearly 10%, where are the jobs that these people are allegedly creating?

you are right, poor people are creating jobs all over the place. Who do you think creates jobs? exlain to me how taking more money from individuals will create jobs?
who the hell are you to say someone isn't paying enough in taxes? They earned it, they worked hard to get it, but yet they shouldn't get to? fuck that. we should all pay 12%. and not a fucking dollar more. The federal government is way too involved in things that states should be in charge of.

mikepegg44

pjfan021 wrote:

Lastly, extending these tax cuts will cost us 700billion we don't have, so in essence that's wasteful spending.

it isn't the governments money. it doesn't cost them anything. It doesn't cost them anything. it doesn't cost them anything. They never had it.

Commy

mikepegg44 wrote:

pjfan021 wrote:

Lastly, extending these tax cuts will cost us 700billion we don't have, so in essence that's wasteful spending.

it isn't the governments money. it doesn't cost them anything. It doesn't cost them anything. it doesn't cost them anything. They never had it.

given wealth has been concentrating to the top for 40 years, say they don't extend the tax cuts and raise minimum wage?



to get back to 1979 levels, back when a guy with a job could raise a family.


good idea giving the working class income yeah?

Electric_Delta

MellowCat wrote:

Death taxes, capital gains taxes and taxes on dividends will affect every American that owns stock or dies. I am very concerned about those being raised. If Congress would have done something about the expiring Bush Tax Cuts before the pussies high-tailed it outta there, maybe businesses would at least know whether they could afford to hire people or not.

I don't own a business, but not knowing what the tax rate is going to be has stopped me from doing a lot of spending that I would have otherwise done, including hiring people for construction projects around my house.

When those assholes cut out the wasteful spending, then they can talk to me about raising my taxes.

Electric_Delta

Beware the lame duck session.

Pelosi, Reid, and the rest of the Demoncrats will take it out on the average person for their heavy election losses.

I'm sure it will be made to look like it's the Republicans fault for whatever reason, but hey, consider the source.

Jeanwah

There won't be any new jobs in this country while there's a tax break for offshoring jobs. We can thank Republicans for that, when our own representatives favor jobs in other countries rather than job creation in our own country!!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/10/1 ... 65501.html