Why buy if not to enjoy?! Is it not scalping?!
Just want to get a few people's opinions on this train of thought. And, saying that, it is a train of thought only, so no attacking (hahaha).
I buy vinyl ad want a few vinyl to acctually listen to. Not to buy them when they come out, keep them sealed, then sell them to someone in a few years for a ridiculous amount of money, which drives up the price for people like myself who want to enjoy the record and have no plans on hiding it away to again make money off it. Similarity to scalping, yes?!
I have a few "holy grail" items like the Epic release of "Live In Atlanta" (given to me by a sweet friend), Epic release of "Rarefied And Live" (won from Triple J radio), "Live On Two Legs"vinyl and the first pressings of "Vs" and "Vitalogy" on vinyl. All get played, a lot!
Now I want to try get a few of the albums i don't have, look on eBay, all priced well over $100, and what is annoying is they are all sealed and as new... meaning someone bought them to make money off them. Or if someone just happened to not getting around to playing it, they shoudl sell it for a price that represents inflation... $20 in 1996 should mean about $30 now, if not the same!
Same goes with poster collectors for the sake of storing and re-selling. Scalpers of a different kind. I have a few prints (every show I have been to), all framed and hanging on display. I bought the only one I didn't get personally at a show (Sydney 1998) from a dude who had it in a tube since then, for $400. It was my "holy grail" and completed my collection, so I paid it. But seriously... is this not scalping, and keeping things from fans who want to enjoy, look at, listen to a product from their favourite band?
I have seen on another thread, people buying multiple copies of "Amongst The Waves". If anyone can justify that to me besides wanting to make money by making it harder for people who want one to get one, go ahead. Even a completist collector only needs 1 copy of everything.
Thanks for listening!
I buy vinyl ad want a few vinyl to acctually listen to. Not to buy them when they come out, keep them sealed, then sell them to someone in a few years for a ridiculous amount of money, which drives up the price for people like myself who want to enjoy the record and have no plans on hiding it away to again make money off it. Similarity to scalping, yes?!
I have a few "holy grail" items like the Epic release of "Live In Atlanta" (given to me by a sweet friend), Epic release of "Rarefied And Live" (won from Triple J radio), "Live On Two Legs"vinyl and the first pressings of "Vs" and "Vitalogy" on vinyl. All get played, a lot!
Now I want to try get a few of the albums i don't have, look on eBay, all priced well over $100, and what is annoying is they are all sealed and as new... meaning someone bought them to make money off them. Or if someone just happened to not getting around to playing it, they shoudl sell it for a price that represents inflation... $20 in 1996 should mean about $30 now, if not the same!
Same goes with poster collectors for the sake of storing and re-selling. Scalpers of a different kind. I have a few prints (every show I have been to), all framed and hanging on display. I bought the only one I didn't get personally at a show (Sydney 1998) from a dude who had it in a tube since then, for $400. It was my "holy grail" and completed my collection, so I paid it. But seriously... is this not scalping, and keeping things from fans who want to enjoy, look at, listen to a product from their favourite band?
I have seen on another thread, people buying multiple copies of "Amongst The Waves". If anyone can justify that to me besides wanting to make money by making it harder for people who want one to get one, go ahead. Even a completist collector only needs 1 copy of everything.
Thanks for listening!

PJ - Sydney 1998; Sydney 2003; Sydney, Melbourne, Newcastle 2006; Melbourne, Sydney 2009; Gold Coast, Melbourne, Sydney 2014.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
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So I woke up and purchased the vinyl at midnight PCT, then went back to bed. Woke up the next morning and came on the board and there was a bunch of hoopla about the vinyl being sold out and angry ten clubbers not even getting a shot at purchasing the album....all the now normal stuff that occurs when something limited goes on sale.
Next thing, the album shows up on my door and I find it selling on Ebay for large amounts of money. Originally, I had all intentions of playing it, but when it became a collector's item in that short time-span, I rationalized to keep it sealed and hold onto it.
Having attended the show, I know what it was like to have actually been there and no vinyl is going to better recreate that moment. So, I'm fine with holding onto it sealed and waiting for a time to get rid of it when something else I want comes my way.
If the market price of the album drops back down to $45, then I'll crack it open and give it a spin. Till then, I have the CD along with memories of being there to tide me over.
Not everyone out there is a flipper. Some people are just at the right place at the right time and have different priorities in life.
It's almost like watching kidsplay with toys... I'm not playing with it anymore, but it's my toy so you can't play with it. Know what I mean?
I'm not having a go at you at all, just kinda trying to undertsand and create a bit of discussion amongst fans and collectors. Prices are getting ridiculous, and as fans, who want people to access Pearl Jam and not be frustrated by trying to find a record, we owe it to ourselves to discuss it.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
I had exactly the same thoughts about it reading "Amongst The Waves numbers" thread. That's true I can't find the other reason in having 5-15 copies of the same 45 than making money.
I'm glad you said that.
I'm not going to twist anyone's arm to sell the album, it's just going to be sold at market value. So are the prices crazy? or are the people paying for these prices crazy?
The kid's toy analogy doesn't work for me because of ownership versus borrowing something. I don't know about you but when my friends/siblings wanted by toys I would share the toy with them and let them play it, but I wouldn't let them take home the toy and be the new owner of it. And when I shared the toy I would expect it back in the same condition that it started in or else I would be pissed.
That being said, if anyone wants to come over and look at my sealed vinyl, you're welcome to, since that would be sharing like kids do.
all in all, if you feel the price is above market price, then don't purchase it and create and efficiency within the market.
Well it obviously is about taking advantage of an arbitrage opportunity, but that is still allowed. They were able to find something selling below the market value and they were able to purchase them.
Whether or not they should do it, is a different story. but again, it's all relative. If they're not a huge Pearl Jam fan, if they don't give a damn about the the music or the Pearl Jam community or their ten club membership then it's their right to flip. Just as it is your right and free will to not purchase from that seller. Buyer beware.
Is it more selfish for someone to look out for themselves and make a quick buck or for someone to say you can't own that because you're not using it how I want you to use it?
And I'm not saying that we couldn't do the same thing, but when you see someone have 10 copies of Amongst The Waves, you really wanna ask them why. The spirit of this community has always been supportive and encouraging and strong. But I doubt many people outside the TenClub/forums would actually chase down a copy of Benny or Amongst The Waves or whatever, so you are being ripped of by a fellow community member, which is my gripe.
Have I watched an Ames print I listed on eBay shoot higher and higher? Yes. Did I list it for more than it cost me? No. Have I bought items that I no longer have the passion for and believe I should sell them? Yes. Have I bought items solely to flip them? No. Do I see a point in having a vinyl in the shrink-wrap? No. A vinyl collector plays records, a lot.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
In someone elses view it isn't. C'est la vie.
More people tend have the first view point which has been proven time and time again. And in my view it's worth being a part of which is why I won't be flipping items on Ebay. But I don't think its my job to police others who do.
But it DOES piss me off that I see the same seller on eBay with multiple copies of something. I don't buy shit to sell it. I buy it to have it and enjoy it. I don't understand the whole "vinyl sealed" thing either. I couldn't care less if a PJ vinyl I bought was sealed. I'm going to open it to play it anyway, so as long as it's in good condition, that's all that matters.
I own nothing that I haven't used. I respect someone's right to collect something and keep it in pristine/sealed condition, I just don't personally understand the point of it.
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
Can you say you respect something in one half of a sentence and then say you don't understand the point of it in the next half? It seems to contradict itself.
Or maybe the better question is why hold something in high regard if you see no point to it?
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
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St. Paul 2014
Now, let's all be friends again.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
Bottom line, is, Ty, no offense, but this is nothing more than people who don't have an endless supply of cash (us) complaining that we can't afford something we didn't buy when we could have afforded it. We missed the proverbial boat. It sucks, but it's the way it is. I paid $100 for a poster for the Fargo 2003 show that I didn't buy at the show itself. I'm going to "ruin" it by block mounting it. I COULD keep it stored in a cold room for 20 years and then try to sell it, but I want to see it hanging on my wall. Some people don't care about that, and that's fine. I do, and that's what's important. If you want Benny Hall so bad, start saving $10 a week. In no time flat you'll find yourself bidding on one. Or buying one on here the next time someone needs money for the next PJ tour!
Fargo 2003
Winnipeg 2005
Winnipeg 2011
St. Paul 2014
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
I agree with Billy Pumpkin on this one. Ture market value is realized when a final sale is made, not during the bidding process.
http://inthepresenttense.blogspot.com/
I ordered from hmv and then got an e-mail saying they had cancelled my order as they were no longer getting stock. I then ordered from 2 other places in case either of them would also end up without stock ... to then be e-mailed by hmv to say they now were getting stock and would fulfil my order. So by trying to get hold of one I ended up with 3.
I will hold onto the 2 extras in case I ever miss out on something and it may be possible to use them in a trade. Not everyone with more than one of something is setting out to make money.
I too have bought a lot of vinyl at after market prices and wished I could have bought it when it went on sale.
Houses are. Buy a house when the market is stagnant (therefore low prices), sell it when the market is buoyant. As the population is mobile, loads and loads of people do that. I bought my house, obviously to live in, but also as an investment (eg looking at the neighbourhood - is it 'up and coming' or getting worse, etc.). It's now worth 4.5x what I paid for it 10 years ago, even in the current market.
Anything can be a commodity to potentially make money, as long as someone wants what you have.
I guess with regards to PJ stuff on this board, it's an emotional thing. No one would bat an eyelid if one would say 'I bought a house last week with no intention of living in it and sold it today at twice the buying price', would they? This person would probably get a pat on the back for being so ingenious!
im the flipper you all hate then .as i got 13 atw on 7".Firstly, same as chime i didnt intend to get this many but have ended up with them.I have already given a few away for free.
secondly i posted on this forum 3 weeks before the release of this 7" that is was going on sale and to pre order it.(maybe this is why its now 1800 and not 1200 as first intended).So if people have missed out they are too blame no one else.time was on your side here.
But this is the first pearl jam item i have ever bought more then one of.Why you ask.i simply cant afford to get all the bits i want without trading or selling on now.If you collect you cant stop.giveway selling for $375 last night .so my $8 profit (not that ive sold any)on a 7" is not going to pay or that..Do you buy stocks have a pension its all making money.(well should be).
i didnt get into pearl jam to make a few $£$£$ on records.i spend a hell of a lot more then i should.
im sorry if you dont agree but im not the only one with a few doubles.
Lastly im on of the few people in here that regularly give stuff away free.lowest bid contest and the world cup sweep..No questions ask i just do it.last prize was a 2003 boot which i could of sold for $40..
chhers all
kevin..now ill duck
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As I've said before, simply having a limited product is not necessary to being a fan. If I bought all 1800 copies of ATW, I'm not stopping you from listening to ATW or The End on your CD or Backspacer vinyl. To me, scalping tickets is another issue altogether. That's putting a price on an experience. A performance. Something that you can't hold, or frame or relive. It's a one off. So I do think it's wrong to flog a ticket for excessive amounts of money because I believe that experience is essential to being a fan of a band.
It won't be the memorabilia you look back on, it'll be the memories of seeing the band.
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jmgphotos/4731512142/" title="PJ Banner2 by Mister J Photography, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1135/4731512142_258f2d6ab4_b.jpg" width="630" height="112" alt="PJ Banner2" /></a>
Now sell me a sealed copy of Soldier Field for a reasonable price.
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Flipping includes selling for cash or trading for something worth what you sell the item for in cash. Trading an item you bought for $20 for an item that is worth $100 on the going market is the same thing as selling your item for $100 and buying the new item for $100.
I don't care what you do, but just saying the "trade" excuse does not work.
so who do you blame us or the band....why make picture discs then...itw pic costing $700 is not for playing ..
why put out a whitebackspacer
a orange fixer
a blue fixer ..
come on dont you collect anything .
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but this is all just my opinion, when it comes down to it I can't force people to do what I want them to do. so really its all just a moot point. its just sad that i would really like to hear Benny Hall on wax and i dont think i'll get the chance because its so expensive and the only person i know that has it has a sealed copy. so once again, this is my opinion, in the end you can only do what you want with your moeny and you possessions
But if you see it as a collectible commodity, your main purpose is not to listen to it but to 'collect' and keep it as pristine as possible. Just like paintings. Some people buy paintings to hang on walls (with the consequence of the artwork degrading), some 'collect' them and these are stored in ideal conditions, out of the light, therefore out of sight. You wish you had a Benny Hall vinyl to listen to (knowing damn well someone has a sealed copy somewhere), I wish I had an original from one of the masters (knowing it's in a vault in someone's private collection, never to be seen).
Gotta disagree with this one. Flipping is scalping. Scalping is flipping. Buying something at a value, then advertising it to someone who obviously wants it, when you had no intention of using it in the first place.
the serialthrilla, I know you give stuff away and are a generous contributor, no questions. 13 just seemed a lot. As the creator of this thread, I even understand maybe having 2 copies, to use as trade or something like that. But imagine this... if the 2,000 copies of Benny wet to the 2,000 most frequent users of this forum, I very much doubt they would be going for $1,000+ at the moment, because those most passionate about them and their limited release, would have one.
EV - Canberra, Newcastle, Sydney 2011; Sydney 2014.
What would you do if someone had an item for sale that originally cost $100, but was now only worth $50; would you insist on paying them their original cost of $100 so that they wouldn't be losing any money?