It is actually true that "honour killings" are a Muslim thing... We really can't deny that. Just remember GF: A LOT of Muslims are 100% opposed to it. Please please remember that. That said, despite some passages in the Quran that suggest it's wrong (and others that basically contradict that... it's a fucking holy text, and I think it's pointless to use that as a measure of anything, frankly. It's just a bunch of bullshit that contradicts itself, just like the Bible does, and adherence to it by Muslims is as subjective and inconsistent as it is for Christians of the Bible), it's not nearly as frowned upon in the Muslim world as ALL of us would like it to be. Here is an article from 2013 that includes an estimation of how Muslims feel on certain issues, including honour killing... rather disturbing actually (so are the results re Sharia Law). I don't think it serves anyone to pretend it's not a real problem just in order to be PC about it, because acknowledging a problem is the first step towards fixing the problem, which should be everyone's goal (start with women's rights in Muslim nations... everything after that will basically fall into place). BUT REMEMBER: these results are focused on Muslim nations (most of which are in some kind of turmoil). Not on Muslims in North America. They didn't even include North or South America in the results at all. That is an important point for folks like GF to keep in mind. Also notice that most disapprove of suicide bombers in particular (phew). https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/02/what-the-muslim-world-believes-on-everything-from-alcohol-to-honor-killings-in-8-maps-and-4-charts/
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,334
So your comparing a bunch of crazy Christians in their beliefs who only make an ass of THEMSELVES with their silly protest to a religion or culture that produces crazies who kill in the name of their religion...big difference! Just wondering has the west borough baptist church ever been convicted of a serious criminal offence, or do they just typically make an ass of themselves in public. And if all they've done is make an ass out of themselves in public then I guess they are entitled to.
Big difference between honour killings and making an ass of yourselves...
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
Yeah, because Americans don't do any fucked up shit to their kids ever, just Muslim folks.
You are a nut.
did I say something that is not true ? if I said "honor killing" what would be the first thing to come to your mind ? and calling me names ain't nice ol' boy, I am truly offended ! guess I better find my "safe place" HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHA !
Godfather.
You didn't say anything that wasn't true...
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
So your comparing a bunch of crazy Christians in their beliefs who only make an ass of THEMSELVES with their silly protest to a religion or culture that produces crazies who kill in the name of their religion...big difference! Just wondering has the west borough baptist church ever been convicted of a serious criminal offence, or do they just typically make an ass of themselves in public. And if all they've done is make an ass out of themselves in public then I guess they are entitled to.
Big difference between honour killings and making an ass of yourselves...
Yes.
People stumble over themselves to apologize for Islam whenever these mortifying events get presented by making vague references to Christianity- not allowing criticism of Islam stand alone.
Christianity is full of faults, but Christians are nothing compared to the Islamic zealots in Muslim countries where these types of events are commonplace.
Annoying versus deadly and intolerant. Not even close.
Yeah, because Americans don't do any fucked up shit to their kids ever, just Muslim folks.
You are a nut.
did I say something that is not true ? if I said "honor killing" what would be the first thing to come to your mind ? and calling me names ain't nice ol' boy, I am truly offended ! guess I better find my "safe place" HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHA !
Yeah, because Americans don't do any fucked up shit to their kids ever, just Muslim folks.
You are a nut.
did I say something that is not true ? if I said "honor killing" what would be the first thing to come to your mind ? and calling me names ain't nice ol' boy, I am truly offended ! guess I better find my "safe place" HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHA !
Godfather.
Translation:
well.....good morning ! liberal's don't use facts, they seem to have no idea what a "fact" is.
Yeah, because Americans don't do any fucked up shit to their kids ever, just Muslim folks.
You are a nut.
did I say something that is not true ? if I said "honor killing" what would be the first thing to come to your mind ? and calling me names ain't nice ol' boy, I am truly offended ! guess I better find my "safe place" HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHA !
Godfather.
Translation:
well.....good morning ! liberal's don't use facts, they seem to have no idea what a "fact" is.
Godfather.
Come on GF. Their opinions are facts and your the crazy one to have a different opinion!! You gun nut conservative freedom lover
Yeah, because Americans don't do any fucked up shit to their kids ever, just Muslim folks.
You are a nut.
did I say something that is not true ? if I said "honor killing" what would be the first thing to come to your mind ? and calling me names ain't nice ol' boy, I am truly offended ! guess I better find my "safe place" HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHA !
Godfather.
Translation:
well.....good morning ! liberal's don't use facts, they seem to have no idea what a "fact" is.
Godfather.
Come on GF. Their opinions are facts and your the crazy one to have a different opinion!! You gun nut conservative freedom lover
crazy me ME !!!!!!! HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAH !
Godfather.
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,334
Yes and no. Some of the world is actually quite amazing, stunning, lovely, spectacular, inspiring and awesome in the truest sense of the word.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
So your comparing a bunch of crazy Christians in their beliefs who only make an ass of THEMSELVES with their silly protest to a religion or culture that produces crazies who kill in the name of their religion...big difference! Just wondering has the west borough baptist church ever been convicted of a serious criminal offence, or do they just typically make an ass of themselves in public. And if all they've done is make an ass out of themselves in public then I guess they are entitled to.
Big difference between honour killings and making an ass of yourselves...
Yes.
People stumble over themselves to apologize for Islam whenever these mortifying events get presented by making vague references to Christianity- not allowing criticism of Islam stand alone.
Christianity is full of faults, but Christians are nothing compared to the Islamic zealots in Muslim countries where these types of events are commonplace.
Annoying versus deadly and intolerant. Not even close.
Agreed, lots Islam apologist ... lead by many politicians. As far as Christianity, I'm no fan of their message ... I'm not not going to get into a debate over religions ... because you know, as well as I do as soon as that debate is started people around here will trip over themselves defending Islam and will will search google posting examples of Christian religions gone bad ... lol.
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,334
It is actually true that "honour killings" are a Muslim thing... We really can't deny that. Just remember GF: A LOT of Muslims are 100% opposed to it. Please please remember that. That said, despite some passages in the Quran that suggest it's wrong (and others that basically contradict that... it's a fucking holy text, and I think it's pointless to use that as a measure of anything, frankly. It's just a bunch of bullshit that contradicts itself, just like the Bible does, and adherence to it by Muslims is as subjective and inconsistent as it is for Christians of the Bible), it's not nearly as frowned upon in the Muslim world as ALL of us would like it to be. Here is an article from 2013 that includes an estimation of how Muslims feel on certain issues, including honour killing... rather disturbing actually (so are the results re Sharia Law). I don't think it serves anyone to pretend it's not a real problem just in order to be PC about it, because acknowledging a problem is the first step towards fixing the problem, which should be everyone's goal (start with women's rights in Muslim nations... everything after that will basically fall into place). BUT REMEMBER: these results are focused on Muslim nations (most of which are in some kind of turmoil). Not on Muslims in North America. They didn't even include North or South America in the results at all. That is an important point for folks like GF to keep in mind. Also notice that most disapprove of suicide bombers in particular (phew). https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/02/what-the-muslim-world-believes-on-everything-from-alcohol-to-honor-killings-in-8-maps-and-4-charts/
Not that anyone is obligated, but I'm just wondering why no one is responding to the info in this link, lol. It seems really relevant!
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
It is actually true that "honour killings" are a Muslim thing... We really can't deny that. Just remember GF: A LOT of Muslims are 100% opposed to it. Please please remember that. That said, despite some passages in the Quran that suggest it's wrong (and others that basically contradict that... it's a fucking holy text, and I think it's pointless to use that as a measure of anything, frankly. It's just a bunch of bullshit that contradicts itself, just like the Bible does, and adherence to it by Muslims is as subjective and inconsistent as it is for Christians of the Bible), it's not nearly as frowned upon in the Muslim world as ALL of us would like it to be. Here is an article from 2013 that includes an estimation of how Muslims feel on certain issues, including honour killing... rather disturbing actually (so are the results re Sharia Law). I don't think it serves anyone to pretend it's not a real problem just in order to be PC about it, because acknowledging a problem is the first step towards fixing the problem, which should be everyone's goal (start with women's rights in Muslim nations... everything after that will basically fall into place). BUT REMEMBER: these results are focused on Muslim nations (most of which are in some kind of turmoil). Not on Muslims in North America. They didn't even include North or South America in the results at all. That is an important point for folks like GF to keep in mind. Also notice that most disapprove of suicide bombers in particular (phew). https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/02/what-the-muslim-world-believes-on-everything-from-alcohol-to-honor-killings-in-8-maps-and-4-charts/
Not that anyone is obligated, but I'm just wondering why no one is responding to the info in this link, lol. It seems really relevant!
Also, Pew unfortunately did not survey the world's third-largest Muslim population, which is that of India, and does not include Muslims from Iran, China or Saudi Arabia, much less those who now live in the Western world. But it does offer a wide, comprehensive view of many of the world's largest Muslim communities and their opinions.
the article is good but very incomplete, so once again we move to the media, when ever a muslim incident is on the new it's ...shall we say negative so myself and most of the population know only of the negative side of islam.
and the survey ? I've never heard of PEW (not that it means anything) who are they ?
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
Just curious, do these pollsters and polls have a way of weeding out the the the people who dishonestly answer these polls? Other than the poll is accurate within...
Asking about honour killings and suicide bombs?
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
Just curious, do these pollsters and polls have a way of weeding out the the the people who dishonestly answer these polls? Other than the poll is accurate within...
Asking about honour killings and suicide bombs?
You're asking me? I can't tell you if you want to believe in polling or not. That's up to you. I think it depends on how the particular poll is conducted and what it's about and what the motives behind it were in the first place (which is why election polling is the most untrustworthy). It's never a bad idea to do a little research about a poll if you doubt its results (I'm not doing it for you).
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
Just curious, do these pollsters and polls have a way of weeding out the the the people who dishonestly answer these polls? Other than the poll is accurate within...
Asking about honour killings and suicide bombs?
You're asking me? I can't tell you if you want to believe in polling or not. That's up to you. I think it depends on how the particular poll is conducted and what it's about and what the motives behind it were in the first place (which is why election polling is the most untrustworthy). It's never a bad idea to do a little research about a poll if you doubt its results (I'm not doing it for you).
It was a serious question? I don't believe I asked you to do any research for me...hahaha.
Post edited by lukin2006 on
I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
PEW is this: http://www.pewresearch.org/ A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
Just curious, do these pollsters and polls have a way of weeding out the the the people who dishonestly answer these polls? Other than the poll is accurate within...
Asking about honour killings and suicide bombs?
You're asking me? I can't tell you if you want to believe in polling or not. That's up to you. I think it depends on how the particular poll is conducted and what it's about and what the motives behind it were in the first place (which is why election polling is the most untrustworthy). It's never a bad idea to do a little research about a poll if you doubt its results (I'm not doing it for you).
It was a serious question? I don't believe I asked you to do any research for me...hahaha.
Was what a serious question? I know you didn't ask me to do any research for you. I was just saying that I'm not going to try and dig deeper to answer the question you did ask.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
It is actually true that "honour killings" are a Muslim thing... We really can't deny that. Just remember GF: A LOT of Muslims are 100% opposed to it. Please please remember that. That said, despite some passages in the Quran that suggest it's wrong (and others that basically contradict that... it's a fucking holy text, and I think it's pointless to use that as a measure of anything, frankly. It's just a bunch of bullshit that contradicts itself, just like the Bible does, and adherence to it by Muslims is as subjective and inconsistent as it is for Christians of the Bible), it's not nearly as frowned upon in the Muslim world as ALL of us would like it to be. Here is an article from 2013 that includes an estimation of how Muslims feel on certain issues, including honour killing... rather disturbing actually (so are the results re Sharia Law). I don't think it serves anyone to pretend it's not a real problem just in order to be PC about it, because acknowledging a problem is the first step towards fixing the problem, which should be everyone's goal (start with women's rights in Muslim nations... everything after that will basically fall into place). BUT REMEMBER: these results are focused on Muslim nations (most of which are in some kind of turmoil). Not on Muslims in North America. They didn't even include North or South America in the results at all. That is an important point for folks like GF to keep in mind. Also notice that most disapprove of suicide bombers in particular (phew). https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/02/what-the-muslim-world-believes-on-everything-from-alcohol-to-honor-killings-in-8-maps-and-4-charts/
Not that anyone is obligated, but I'm just wondering why no one is responding to the info in this link, lol. It seems really relevant!
Of all the things that jumped out at me... these items were significant:
1. A majority of Muslims in several countries say that any Muslim who leaves the faith should be executed, with the share who support this nearing two-thirds in Egypt and Pakistan. In Afghanistan, 78 percent say apostates should be killed.
2. Pew asked asked survey respondents "whether honor killings are ever justified as punishment for pre- or extra-marital sex." In the practice, a person is killed -- often by his or her own family -- for having sex out of wedlock. The victim is typically a woman.
Honor killings still happen, and the data reflect why: Majorities of Muslims surveyed rejected the practice in only 14 out of 23 countries. Support for honor killings appears to be highest in Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt and Jordan.
3. Pew points out that "sharia law" is not exactly clear, and people who say they support it often disagree on what it means. There is a wide divergence of opinion among people who support sharia, for example, on whether or not corporal punishment for thievery is acceptable, or on social issues such as divorce. In other words, Muslim communities seem to favor the idea of sharia law far more than any specific laws.
"My brain's a good brain!"
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,334
♪♪ THE HILLS ARE ALIVE WITH THE SOUN... ♪
Oh, sorry. It's just such a depressing thread title. Carry on.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Comments
That said, despite some passages in the Quran that suggest it's wrong (and others that basically contradict that... it's a fucking holy text, and I think it's pointless to use that as a measure of anything, frankly. It's just a bunch of bullshit that contradicts itself, just like the Bible does, and adherence to it by Muslims is as subjective and inconsistent as it is for Christians of the Bible), it's not nearly as frowned upon in the Muslim world as ALL of us would like it to be. Here is an article from 2013 that includes an estimation of how Muslims feel on certain issues, including honour killing... rather disturbing actually (so are the results re Sharia Law). I don't think it serves anyone to pretend it's not a real problem just in order to be PC about it, because acknowledging a problem is the first step towards fixing the problem, which should be everyone's goal (start with women's rights in Muslim nations... everything after that will basically fall into place). BUT REMEMBER: these results are focused on Muslim nations (most of which are in some kind of turmoil). Not on Muslims in North America. They didn't even include North or South America in the results at all. That is an important point for folks like GF to keep in mind. Also notice that most disapprove of suicide bombers in particular (phew).
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/02/what-the-muslim-world-believes-on-everything-from-alcohol-to-honor-killings-in-8-maps-and-4-charts/
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Big difference between honour killings and making an ass of yourselves...
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
People stumble over themselves to apologize for Islam whenever these mortifying events get presented by making vague references to Christianity- not allowing criticism of Islam stand alone.
Christianity is full of faults, but Christians are nothing compared to the Islamic zealots in Muslim countries where these types of events are commonplace.
Annoying versus deadly and intolerant. Not even close.
Godfather.
Trieste 14, Vienna 14, Gdynia 14, Leeds 14, Milton Keynes 14, Denver 14
Central Park 15
Fort Lauderdale 16, Miami 16, Tampa 16, Jacksonville 16, Greenville 16, Hampton 16, Columbia 16, Lexington 16, Philly1 16, Philly2 16, NYC1 16, NYC2 16, Quebec City 16, Ottawa 16, Toronto1 16, Toronto2 16, Fenway1 16, Fenway2 16, Wrigley1 16, Wrigley2 16
Godfather.
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Also, Pew unfortunately did not survey the world's third-largest Muslim population, which is that of India, and does not include Muslims from Iran, China or Saudi Arabia, much less those who now live in the Western world. But it does offer a wide, comprehensive view of many of the world's largest Muslim communities and their opinions.
the article is good but very incomplete, so once again we move to the media, when ever a muslim incident is on the new it's ...shall we say negative so myself and most of the population know only of the negative side of islam.
and the survey ? I've never heard of PEW (not that it means anything) who are they ?
Godfather.
A non-partisan, non-advocacy public opinion pollster. They "conduct public opinion polling, demographic research, content analysis and other data-driven social science research. (They) do not take policy positions."
Godfather.
Asking about honour killings and suicide bombs?
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
I know you didn't ask me to do any research for you. I was just saying that I'm not going to try and dig deeper to answer the question you did ask.
1. A majority of Muslims in several countries say that any Muslim who leaves the faith should be executed, with the share who support this nearing two-thirds in Egypt and Pakistan. In Afghanistan, 78 percent say apostates should be killed.
2. Pew asked asked survey respondents "whether honor killings are ever justified as punishment for pre- or extra-marital sex." In the practice, a person is killed -- often by his or her own family -- for having sex out of wedlock. The victim is typically a woman.
Honor killings still happen, and the data reflect why: Majorities of Muslims surveyed rejected the practice in only 14 out of 23 countries. Support for honor killings appears to be highest in Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt and Jordan.
3. Pew points out that "sharia law" is not exactly clear, and people who say they support it often disagree on what it means. There is a wide divergence of opinion among people who support sharia, for example, on whether or not corporal punishment for thievery is acceptable, or on social issues such as divorce. In other words, Muslim communities seem to favor the idea of sharia law far more than any specific laws.
Oh, sorry. It's just such a depressing thread title. Carry on.
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"