"There is no place in our society for a person to make these comments,"
Really? So what now? Execute this teacher? No place in our society? Jesus, that's in an official statement from the scool district? Sounds like they probably have a lot bigger problems than a teacher using questionable scenarios while actually trying to teach.
My point was that those in Alabama wouldn't have said that if a republican had said it. They would have lynched someone for saying it. The reason they are ok with it is because Obama's views fall outside what they're tolerant of.
I live in Vt and if someone here had made that comment about Sarah Palin and the tangent of the bullet, the people here would recognize that that kind of dialogue doesn't belong in public school.
you have no idea what this teacher is tolerant of
having grown up there, I do have an idea of the culture there, and I believe this teacher's comment is reflective of the larger culture of Alabama which is one of intolerance for views that are not consistent with conservative religious dogma. My point is that this is an example of the larger culture that exists there, not that I can read the mind of this one teacher or student.
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
you have no idea what this teacher is tolerant of[/quote]
having grown up there, I do have an idea of the culture there, and I believe this teacher's comment is reflective of the larger culture of Alabama which is one of intolerance for views that are not consistent with conservative religious dogma. My point is that this is an example of the larger culture that exists there, not that I can read the mind of this one teacher or student.[/quote]
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.[/quote]
hey mike
ever think there might have been a african-american in that classroom.
or are they invisible to you?
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
I work in HR for a government agency. Teachers are government employees. In all personnel issues, it doesn't matter what someone's intention was, it is how their actions or words are perceived by others that matters. This teacher should have fucking known better than to use that as an example. Now, while I suspect he's a racist at heart, I can't prove that, but I do know he's fucking stupid.
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I am sure the comment drew a few chuckles from both the teacher and the students. They probably weren't taking themselves seriously. However, it is emblematic of how many of those in the deep south think. It's right up there with "black jokes." God knows, I heard many of them growing up there.
ob·sti·nate
/ˈɒbstənɪt/ Show Spelled[ob-stuh-nit] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
firmly or stubbornly adhering to one's purpose, opinion, etc.; not yielding to argument, persuasion, or entreaty.
2.
characterized by inflexible persistence or an unyielding attitude; inflexibly persisted in or carried out: obstinate advocacy of high tariffs.
3.
not easily controlled or overcome: the obstinate growth of weeds.
4.
not yielding readily to treatment, as a disease.
That is a conversation that doesn't belong in public schools. It is against the law for anyone to even joke about killing any president. That being said, I broke that law a million times during the Bush reign of terror, but I still wouldn't have been making those jokes in a public school.
It was the kid that brought it up. The teacher just responded to the kids example. This teachers job is to teach physics, or maths (fucked if I know!) and a teacher will latch onto any example given by a student in order to better clarify a point. He shouldn't have to worry about whether what he's saying could be deemed politically incorrect.
This teacher should have fucking known better than to use that as an example. Now, while I suspect he's a racist at heart, I can't prove that, but I do know he's fucking stupid.
That is a conversation that doesn't belong in public schools. It is against the law for anyone to even joke about killing any president. That being said, I broke that law a million times during the Bush reign of terror, but I still wouldn't have been making those jokes in a public school.
It was the kid that brought it up. The teacher just responded to the kids example. This teachers job is to teach physics, or maths (fucked if I know!) and a teacher will latch onto any example given by a student in order to better clarify a point. He shouldn't have to worry about whether what he's saying could be deemed politically incorrect.
It was a hypothetical question, was it not? But wouldn't that show that the student who asked the question initially was trying to understand the topic in a context that they could comprehend? It's not like he said "I'm going to shoot Obama and if I do it like this will I be successful?". Seriously, I don't get why things so innocently said could be blown so far out of proportion. Now if the kid had asked the same question in relation to the kid sitting next him, would people be getting so upset?
oh my.. i think mr harrison should have steered the conversation away from using the president(or any other person) as an example in this case. he should have told the student such as example was inappropriate and how about we see what angles we could use to shoot a deer.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
oh my.. i think mr harrison should have steered the conversation away from using the president(or any other person) as an example in this case. he should have told the student such as example was inappropriate and how about we see what angles we could use to shoot a deer.
But then the animal rights groups would have gotten involved and declared that Mr Harrison was encouraging his students to breach some state law regarding the killing of a protected species.
Maybe he could have steered the conversation away from the President and used the example of clay pigeon shooting instead? Though maybe there are some clay enthusiasts who would protest?
oh my.. i think mr harrison should have steered the conversation away from using the president(or any other person) as an example in this case. he should have told the student such as example was inappropriate and how about we see what angles we could use to shoot a deer.
But then the animal rights groups would have gotten involved and declared that Mr Harrison was encouraging his students to breach some state law regarding the killing of a protected species.
Maybe he could have steered the conversation away from the President and used the example of clay pigeon shooting instead? Though maybe there are some clay enthusiasts who would protest?
if i was going to shoot my mother.....
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
He shouldn't have to worry about whether what he's saying could be deemed politically incorrect.
I like you Byrnzie, and usually, we fall on the same side of fence, but I totally disagree with you here. As a government employee in a public school teaching children from a variety of ethnic and racial backgrounds, yes you do need to have a sense of political correctness. Teachers need to understand what is an appropriate example to expound upon and what isn't. He should have steered that conversation in a different direction. He is an educator and should be smart enough to realize that. And something else people don't think about - not everyone who is offended has the nerve to speak out, especially when they are minorities who think they might be bringing unwanted attention upon themselves. I can provide numerous examples from the nursing staff(from a variety of backgrounds) working in my vet home (almost all old white men). Public schools have to create an environment where everyone feels safe and treated with equal respect.
Anyone who has ever read my posts knows that I am not a politically correct individual, far from it, however, I play one at work and understand when it is appropriate for a given situation.
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my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
hey mike
ever think there might have been a african-american in that classroom.
or are they invisible to you?
yep invisible to me...do you know if I am white black asian or latino? or do you just assume things
edit:
how on earth did you come to that conclusion by the way... at first i was a little pissed but as I read your reply to what I wrote again I just have to ask... how the fuck did you come up with that? what about what I wrote led you to believe that I think african americans are invisible? I am seriously interested. no bs, I really want to know. Did I mention that I want to know how you came up with that?
Post edited by mikepegg44 on
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
I work in HR for a government agency. Teachers are government employees. In all personnel issues, it doesn't matter what someone's intention was, it is how their actions or words are perceived by others that matters. This teacher should have fucking known better than to use that as an example. Now, while I suspect he's a racist at heart, I can't prove that, but I do know he's fucking stupid.
a student brought it up, he didn't bring it up as an example
and while he may be stupid, did he really do something worthy of all of the press it has gotten. I believe the way they handled it first, by taking him into an office and yelling at him was the proper way to do it. Not suspend him because the media picked up on it.
I work for the government as well, and I can tell you, no one here would be suspended for this. The union wouldn't allow it . . . I don't know how strong the teacher's union in alabama is, but I am pretty sure this suspension is with pay.
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
edit:
how on earth did you come to that conclusion by the way... at first i was a little pissed but as I read your reply to what I wrote again I just have to ask... how the fuck did you come up with that? what about what I wrote led you to believe that I think african americans are invisible? I am seriously interested. no bs, I really want to know. Did I mention that I want to know how you came up with that?[/quote]
first you asked "how on earth did this make it to the national media".
like it was a classroom full of white obama hater's, laughing at the kid's AND the teacher's joke.
that is why i said there might have been an african-american in that class.
who did not keep his or her mouth shut, like you probably expect them to.
i don't know who said "everyone there accecpted this type of thing"
but with all you wrote, you never mentioned someone in that class who was offended by white people talking about shooting a black man like it was nothing.
and even though you bitch about the media coverage, like they are to blame, i've read in other posts how you love foxnews.
that tells me alot about you.
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
Your logic doesn't make any sense. You are accusing mike and Byrnzie of being racist and ignorant and whatever else, but its all based on a strong emotional reaction and no real evidence. Personally, I don't care for your rants about "white people" and "black people", but I will try to refrain from judging you as a person because of this. Quite frankly, a white person (or a black person) should be able to use whatever fucking example they want to use, without the PC police having to crash down to make them feel horrible. Yes, racism exists, but not in every single corner of every single dark place. Someone could have used the exact same example with a president besides Obama, and you probably wouldn't bat an eye.
Your logic doesn't make any sense. You are accusing mike and Byrnzie of being racist and ignorant and whatever else, but its all based on a strong emotional reaction and no real evidence. Personally, I don't care for your rants about "white people" and "black people", but I will try to refrain from judging you as a person because of this. Quite frankly, a white person (or a black person) should be able to use whatever fucking example they want to use, without the PC police having to crash down to make them feel horrible. Yes, racism exists, but not in every single corner of every single dark place. Someone could have used the exact same example with a president besides Obama, and you probably wouldn't bat an eye.
first of all, please show me where i accuse mike or byrnzie of being racist.
and i do agree with you when you say a white or a black should be able to use whatever example they want to.
except in school.
reborn, let's assume that you are not racist.
and you have a child.
tell me you're good with sending your child to school to be exposed to this hate.
and if it was a white teacher talking about shooting any other president, then it wouldn't be racism now, would it?
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
first of all, please show me where i accuse mike or byrnzie of being racist.
and i do agree with you when you say a white or a black should be able to use whatever example they want to.
except in school.
reborn, let's assume that you are not racist.
and you have a child.
tell me you're good with sending your child to school to be exposed to this hate.
and if it was a white teacher talking about shooting any other president, then it wouldn't be racism now, would it?
But that's where we differ ... A white teacher using Obama as an example is NOT inherently racist. Such a behavior might be indicative of racism, but it might not be. Sorry, but intent and the person's attitude have to factor into this kind of decision. Let's say there's a movie or TV show, and a white person shoots a black person as part of the plot ... Does this somehow make the writer or director racist? Again, I don't follow your logic. I don't believe in a definition of racism to the effect of "anytime a white person comments on harm befalling a black person, its racist". That seems to be what you're saying. Unless you were there, or know this teacher personally, nothing more can be read into the example with any degree of certaintly.
To answer your other question, no, I would not want my kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example. The race of the people involved is unimportant to me. For some reason, that's your sore spot. Mine has more to do with the idea of the shooting of any president being used as an example in school. And keep in mind that I am just sharing my personal view here ... I still agree with Byrnzie's original point. Its being blown up into something major, and it doesn't have to be. It was a stupid, insensitive example, but its not clear to me that the teacher deserves to go to Gitmo because of it.
I like you Byrnzie, and usually, we fall on the same side of fence, but I totally disagree with you here. As a government employee in a public school teaching children from a variety of ethnic and racial backgrounds, yes you do need to have a sense of political correctness. Teachers need to understand what is an appropriate example to expound upon and what isn't. He should have steered that conversation in a different direction. He is an educator and should be smart enough to realize that. And something else people don't think about - not everyone who is offended has the nerve to speak out, especially when they are minorities who think they might be bringing unwanted attention upon themselves. I can provide numerous examples from the nursing staff(from a variety of backgrounds) working in my vet home (almost all old white men). Public schools have to create an environment where everyone feels safe and treated with equal respect.
Anyone who has ever read my posts knows that I am not a politically correct individual, far from it, however, I play one at work and understand when it is appropriate for a given situation.
This is not an unreasonable argument, and I can see the wisdom in a teacher acting in a more sensitive fashion on a case by case basis. I might still question whether this needs to be national news.
first of all, please show me where i accuse mike or byrnzie of being racist.
and i do agree with you when you say a white or a black should be able to use whatever example they want to.
except in school.
reborn, let's assume that you are not racist.
and you have a child.
tell me you're good with sending your child to school to be exposed to this hate.
and if it was a white teacher talking about shooting any other president, then it wouldn't be racism now, would it?
But that's where we differ ... A white teacher using Obama as an example is NOT inherently racist. Such a behavior might be indicative of racism, but it might not be. Sorry, but intent and the person's attitude have to factor into this kind of decision. Let's say there's a movie or TV show, and a white person shoots a black person as part of the plot ... Does this somehow make the writer or director racist? Again, I don't follow your logic. I don't believe in a definition of racism to the effect of "anytime a white person comments on harm befalling a black person, its racist". That seems to be what you're saying. Unless you were there, or know this teacher personally, nothing more can be read into the example with any degree of certaintly.
To answer your other question, no, I would not want my kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example. The race of the people involved is unimportant to me. For some reason, that's your sore spot. Mine has more to do with the idea of the shooting of any president being used as an example in school. And keep in mind that I am just sharing my personal view here ... I still agree with Byrnzie's original point. Its being blown up into something major, and it doesn't have to be. It was a stupid, insensitive example, but its not clear to me that the teacher deserves to go to Gitmo because of it.
Good points - but do you also see that some people are a little more sensitive to the race issue when America finally gets an African American president, and the death threats go up 400% and enrollment in hate groups increases? You may not have a racist bone in your body, and the teacher may not have had a racist bone in his body, but there are plenty of people walking around on eggshells because of the race issue. Even if race had nothing at all to do with this particular example, the fact that the number of death threats Obama receives daily is 4x what Bush received is not just because he's a Democrat - it's because, to some people out there, race is THE issue.
Personally, I think the teacher was just dumb - like you said, any discussion of killing the president is wrong, and the teacher should have cut the student off before he could finish his sentence, instead of continuing the example.
On the bright side though, it's forcing people to have discussions they may not have had otherwise, and a few things are being brought to the surface. Until the problem is brought out into the open it will never be solved.
And I listen for the voice inside my head... nothing. I'll do this one myself.
But that's where we differ ... A white teacher using Obama as an example is NOT inherently racist. Such a behavior might be indicative of racism, but it might not be. Sorry, but intent and the person's attitude have to factor into this kind of decision. Let's say there's a movie or TV show, and a white person shoots a black person as part of the plot ... Does this somehow make the writer or director racist? Again, I don't follow your logic. I don't believe in a definition of racism to the effect of "anytime a white person comments on harm befalling a black person, its racist". That seems to be what you're saying. Unless you were there, or know this teacher personally, nothing more can be read into the example with any degree of certaintly.
To answer your other question, no, I would not want my kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example. The race of the people involved is unimportant to me. For some reason, that's your sore spot. Mine has more to do with the idea of the shooting of any president being used as an example in school. And keep in mind that I am just sharing my personal view here ... I still agree with Byrnzie's original point. Its being blown up into something major, and it doesn't have to be. It was a stupid, insensitive example, but its not clear to me that the teacher deserves to go to Gitmo because of it.[/quote]
help me out here.
you don't want your kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example.
but if it's a white teacher talking about a black man, it would only be stupid and insensitive, and be blown up into something major.
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
help me out here.
you don't want your kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example.
but if it's a white teacher talking about a black man, it would only be stupid and insensitive, and be blown up into something major.
No, my argument is that it COULD perhaps be "only stupid and insensitive". It could also be racially motivated, depending on the individual case in question. You are using a blanket, across the board logic in which white people simply cannot use certain examples or they must be racist (or do I misunderstand?) ... I am saying that such judgments need to be made on a case-by-case basis.
cajunkiwi raises some reasonable points, and I can concede that discussing these issues is critical. My view is that telling everyone that they MUST be racist if they do x, y, and z is a perfect way to foreclose reasonable discussion rather than encourage it. I think we can all agree on obvious cases (like the KKK). This isn't so obvious to me.
Fellow Americans......welcome to the beginning of Dictatorship.
Yes the media has made this bigger then it is, along with the school, and along with certain people on here.
wow
i thought people from maine were only A LITTLE crazy
The whole world will be different soon... - EV
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
He shouldn't have to worry about whether what he's saying could be deemed politically incorrect.
I like you Byrnzie, and usually, we fall on the same side of fence, but I totally disagree with you here. As a government employee in a public school teaching children from a variety of ethnic and racial backgrounds, yes you do need to have a sense of political correctness. Teachers need to understand what is an appropriate example to expound upon and what isn't. He should have steered that conversation in a different direction. He is an educator and should be smart enough to realize that. And something else people don't think about - not everyone who is offended has the nerve to speak out, especially when they are minorities who think they might be bringing unwanted attention upon themselves. I can provide numerous examples from the nursing staff(from a variety of backgrounds) working in my vet home (almost all old white men). Public schools have to create an environment where everyone feels safe and treated with equal respect.
Anyone who has ever read my posts knows that I am not a politically correct individual, far from it, however, I play one at work and understand when it is appropriate for a given situation.
Fair enough. If I was that teacher I'd have gone along with the kids example and used it to better explain/clarify the point I was trying to make re:physics, though I'd also have lightened the tone a bit by then asking the student if he himself was planning to bump off the President, and waited for his response. If it turned out he wasn't being at all serious then that would have been made apparent. If, on the other hand, the student actually did harbour some sort of dislike of Obama to the point where he actually had some unhealthy interest in the subject of his assassination, then I'd have taken him to account over it.
Anyway, from the way the teacher replied my guess is that he already knew that the students comment wasn't made with any sort of seriousness. The whole thing just reeks of over-sensitivity, political correctness, and media hyped bullshit.
If this happened in the UK replacing obama with David Cameron no one would give a shit or at least the teacher would still have his job. Rather OTT if you ask me.
Comments
"There is no place in our society for a person to make these comments,"
Really? So what now? Execute this teacher? No place in our society? Jesus, that's in an official statement from the scool district? Sounds like they probably have a lot bigger problems than a teacher using questionable scenarios while actually trying to teach.
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
having grown up there, I do have an idea of the culture there, and I believe this teacher's comment is reflective of the larger culture of Alabama which is one of intolerance for views that are not consistent with conservative religious dogma. My point is that this is an example of the larger culture that exists there, not that I can read the mind of this one teacher or student.[/quote]
my point is you are assuming the comment was malicious and then extrapolating that to talk about the entire state of alabama. And since none of us were there, byrnzie is right in saying that this isn't as big of a deal as the media made it seem. If it as part of the culture than how on earth did this make it to the national media. If everyone there accepted this type of thing how did it get out? Probably because it was told to a few people and then someone took it out of context and put it on the news.[/quote]
hey mike
ever think there might have been a african-american in that classroom.
or are they invisible to you?
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
I work in HR for a government agency. Teachers are government employees. In all personnel issues, it doesn't matter what someone's intention was, it is how their actions or words are perceived by others that matters. This teacher should have fucking known better than to use that as an example. Now, while I suspect he's a racist at heart, I can't prove that, but I do know he's fucking stupid.
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Neither. Obstinate may be a better description:
ob·sti·nate
/ˈɒbstənɪt/ Show Spelled[ob-stuh-nit] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
firmly or stubbornly adhering to one's purpose, opinion, etc.; not yielding to argument, persuasion, or entreaty.
2.
characterized by inflexible persistence or an unyielding attitude; inflexibly persisted in or carried out: obstinate advocacy of high tariffs.
3.
not easily controlled or overcome: the obstinate growth of weeds.
4.
not yielding readily to treatment, as a disease.
Nope.
It was the kid that brought it up. The teacher just responded to the kids example. This teachers job is to teach physics, or maths (fucked if I know!) and a teacher will latch onto any example given by a student in order to better clarify a point. He shouldn't have to worry about whether what he's saying could be deemed politically incorrect.
He didn't. The kid used it as an example.
Good song that. Though maybe your post belongs in The Porch section?
It was a hypothetical question, was it not? But wouldn't that show that the student who asked the question initially was trying to understand the topic in a context that they could comprehend? It's not like he said "I'm going to shoot Obama and if I do it like this will I be successful?". Seriously, I don't get why things so innocently said could be blown so far out of proportion. Now if the kid had asked the same question in relation to the kid sitting next him, would people be getting so upset?
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
But then the animal rights groups would have gotten involved and declared that Mr Harrison was encouraging his students to breach some state law regarding the killing of a protected species.
Maybe he could have steered the conversation away from the President and used the example of clay pigeon shooting instead? Though maybe there are some clay enthusiasts who would protest?
if i was going to shoot my mother.....
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I like you Byrnzie, and usually, we fall on the same side of fence, but I totally disagree with you here. As a government employee in a public school teaching children from a variety of ethnic and racial backgrounds, yes you do need to have a sense of political correctness. Teachers need to understand what is an appropriate example to expound upon and what isn't. He should have steered that conversation in a different direction. He is an educator and should be smart enough to realize that. And something else people don't think about - not everyone who is offended has the nerve to speak out, especially when they are minorities who think they might be bringing unwanted attention upon themselves. I can provide numerous examples from the nursing staff(from a variety of backgrounds) working in my vet home (almost all old white men). Public schools have to create an environment where everyone feels safe and treated with equal respect.
Anyone who has ever read my posts knows that I am not a politically correct individual, far from it, however, I play one at work and understand when it is appropriate for a given situation.
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yep invisible to me...do you know if I am white black asian or latino? or do you just assume things
edit:
how on earth did you come to that conclusion by the way... at first i was a little pissed but as I read your reply to what I wrote again I just have to ask... how the fuck did you come up with that? what about what I wrote led you to believe that I think african americans are invisible? I am seriously interested. no bs, I really want to know. Did I mention that I want to know how you came up with that?
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
a student brought it up, he didn't bring it up as an example
and while he may be stupid, did he really do something worthy of all of the press it has gotten. I believe the way they handled it first, by taking him into an office and yelling at him was the proper way to do it. Not suspend him because the media picked up on it.
I work for the government as well, and I can tell you, no one here would be suspended for this. The union wouldn't allow it . . . I don't know how strong the teacher's union in alabama is, but I am pretty sure this suspension is with pay.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
edit:
how on earth did you come to that conclusion by the way... at first i was a little pissed but as I read your reply to what I wrote again I just have to ask... how the fuck did you come up with that? what about what I wrote led you to believe that I think african americans are invisible? I am seriously interested. no bs, I really want to know. Did I mention that I want to know how you came up with that?[/quote]
first you asked "how on earth did this make it to the national media".
like it was a classroom full of white obama hater's, laughing at the kid's AND the teacher's joke.
that is why i said there might have been an african-american in that class.
who did not keep his or her mouth shut, like you probably expect them to.
i don't know who said "everyone there accecpted this type of thing"
but with all you wrote, you never mentioned someone in that class who was offended by white people talking about shooting a black man like it was nothing.
and even though you bitch about the media coverage, like they are to blame, i've read in other posts how you love foxnews.
that tells me alot about you.
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
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WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
Your logic doesn't make any sense. You are accusing mike and Byrnzie of being racist and ignorant and whatever else, but its all based on a strong emotional reaction and no real evidence. Personally, I don't care for your rants about "white people" and "black people", but I will try to refrain from judging you as a person because of this. Quite frankly, a white person (or a black person) should be able to use whatever fucking example they want to use, without the PC police having to crash down to make them feel horrible. Yes, racism exists, but not in every single corner of every single dark place. Someone could have used the exact same example with a president besides Obama, and you probably wouldn't bat an eye.
first of all, please show me where i accuse mike or byrnzie of being racist.
and i do agree with you when you say a white or a black should be able to use whatever example they want to.
except in school.
reborn, let's assume that you are not racist.
and you have a child.
tell me you're good with sending your child to school to be exposed to this hate.
and if it was a white teacher talking about shooting any other president, then it wouldn't be racism now, would it?
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
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BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
But that's where we differ ... A white teacher using Obama as an example is NOT inherently racist. Such a behavior might be indicative of racism, but it might not be. Sorry, but intent and the person's attitude have to factor into this kind of decision. Let's say there's a movie or TV show, and a white person shoots a black person as part of the plot ... Does this somehow make the writer or director racist? Again, I don't follow your logic. I don't believe in a definition of racism to the effect of "anytime a white person comments on harm befalling a black person, its racist". That seems to be what you're saying. Unless you were there, or know this teacher personally, nothing more can be read into the example with any degree of certaintly.
To answer your other question, no, I would not want my kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example. The race of the people involved is unimportant to me. For some reason, that's your sore spot. Mine has more to do with the idea of the shooting of any president being used as an example in school. And keep in mind that I am just sharing my personal view here ... I still agree with Byrnzie's original point. Its being blown up into something major, and it doesn't have to be. It was a stupid, insensitive example, but its not clear to me that the teacher deserves to go to Gitmo because of it.
This is not an unreasonable argument, and I can see the wisdom in a teacher acting in a more sensitive fashion on a case by case basis. I might still question whether this needs to be national news.
Good points - but do you also see that some people are a little more sensitive to the race issue when America finally gets an African American president, and the death threats go up 400% and enrollment in hate groups increases? You may not have a racist bone in your body, and the teacher may not have had a racist bone in his body, but there are plenty of people walking around on eggshells because of the race issue. Even if race had nothing at all to do with this particular example, the fact that the number of death threats Obama receives daily is 4x what Bush received is not just because he's a Democrat - it's because, to some people out there, race is THE issue.
Personally, I think the teacher was just dumb - like you said, any discussion of killing the president is wrong, and the teacher should have cut the student off before he could finish his sentence, instead of continuing the example.
On the bright side though, it's forcing people to have discussions they may not have had otherwise, and a few things are being brought to the surface. Until the problem is brought out into the open it will never be solved.
To answer your other question, no, I would not want my kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example. The race of the people involved is unimportant to me. For some reason, that's your sore spot. Mine has more to do with the idea of the shooting of any president being used as an example in school. And keep in mind that I am just sharing my personal view here ... I still agree with Byrnzie's original point. Its being blown up into something major, and it doesn't have to be. It was a stupid, insensitive example, but its not clear to me that the teacher deserves to go to Gitmo because of it.[/quote]
help me out here.
you don't want your kids to hear a teacher use an example in which someone is shot. ANY example.
but if it's a white teacher talking about a black man, it would only be stupid and insensitive, and be blown up into something major.
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
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PJ20 9-3-11
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WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
No, my argument is that it COULD perhaps be "only stupid and insensitive". It could also be racially motivated, depending on the individual case in question. You are using a blanket, across the board logic in which white people simply cannot use certain examples or they must be racist (or do I misunderstand?) ... I am saying that such judgments need to be made on a case-by-case basis.
cajunkiwi raises some reasonable points, and I can concede that discussing these issues is critical. My view is that telling everyone that they MUST be racist if they do x, y, and z is a perfect way to foreclose reasonable discussion rather than encourage it. I think we can all agree on obvious cases (like the KKK). This isn't so obvious to me.
Yes the media has made this bigger then it is, along with the school, and along with certain people on here.
wow
i thought people from maine were only A LITTLE crazy
RED ROCKS 6-19-95
AUGUSTA 9-26-96
MANSFIELD 9-15-98
BOSTON 9-29-04
BOSTON 5-25-06
MANSFIELD 6-30-08
EV SOLO BOSTON 8-01-08
BOSTON 5-17-10
EV SOLO BOSTON 6-16-11
PJ20 9-3-11
PJ20 9-4-11
WRIGLEY 7-19-13
WORCESTER 10-15-13
WORCESTER 10-16-13
HARTFORD 10-25-13
Fair enough. If I was that teacher I'd have gone along with the kids example and used it to better explain/clarify the point I was trying to make re:physics, though I'd also have lightened the tone a bit by then asking the student if he himself was planning to bump off the President, and waited for his response. If it turned out he wasn't being at all serious then that would have been made apparent. If, on the other hand, the student actually did harbour some sort of dislike of Obama to the point where he actually had some unhealthy interest in the subject of his assassination, then I'd have taken him to account over it.
Anyway, from the way the teacher replied my guess is that he already knew that the students comment wasn't made with any sort of seriousness. The whole thing just reeks of over-sensitivity, political correctness, and media hyped bullshit.
Exactly