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Your opinion about Immigration.

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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    I saw at one point it was said the week before 42 ended was the highest week on record. I can't find that now. But found many that give other numbers, here they say it was over 10,000 a day
    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/migrants-rush-across-u-s-border-in-final-hours-before-title-42-asylum-restrictions-are-lifted

    So top record or not, there was definitely a big influx the final days before 42 ended. That's not a secret, even saw CNN report that.

    The funny part is no one seems to care that the facilities are way above capacity anymore. Wonder why AOC isn't down there complaining? 
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    edited May 2023
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    That's also a big part of it. Teens aren't driving anymore and working a lot less. Jobs that used to be staffed by mostly high school students (like McDonalds) had to raise wages to appeal to adults to get employees.

    Drive by a high school that had adequate parking 10-15 years ago and it will be half empty now. A lot were over crowded, so it looks right now, but if it had enough spaces in 2005, its half empty now. 

    It looks funny, my last hight school in Colorado had a ton of parking. There was a huge paved lot, then a giant dirt lot, but the dirt lot had street lights and curbs all around it, it just looked weird. Come to find it, somewhere around 2010, they were short on student parking. They started to build a second lot. They did the curb first, then put in the lights. But before they got to paving it, students stopped driving. Now the one we had that was cramped, goes half empty every day. And the dirt lot that's half made, just sits there abandoned. 
    Post edited by mace1229 on
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    mickeyratmickeyrat up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 36,027
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?

    digital means of earning now....
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Options
    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    That's also a big part of it. Teens aren't driving anymore and working a lot less. Jobs that used to be staffed by mostly high school students (like McDonalds) had to raise wages to appeal to adults to get employees.

    Drive by a high school that had adequate parking 10-15 years ago and it will be half empty now. A lot were over crowded, so it looks right now, but if it had enough spaces in 2005, its half empty now. 

    It looks funny, my last hight school in Colorado had a ton of parking. There was a huge paved lot, then a giant dirt lot, but the dirt lot had street lights and curbs all around it, it just looked weird. Come to find it, somewhere around 2010, they were short on student parking. They started to build a second lot. They did the curb first, then put in the lights. But before they got to paving it, students stopped driving. Now the one we had that was cramped, goes half empty every day. And the dirt lot that's half made, just sits there abandoned. 
    Kids aren't driving now?  They don't want to get out and go places now?
  • Options
    cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,136
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    That's also a big part of it. Teens aren't driving anymore and working a lot less. Jobs that used to be staffed by mostly high school students (like McDonalds) had to raise wages to appeal to adults to get employees.

    Drive by a high school that had adequate parking 10-15 years ago and it will be half empty now. A lot were over crowded, so it looks right now, but if it had enough spaces in 2005, its half empty now. 

    It looks funny, my last hight school in Colorado had a ton of parking. There was a huge paved lot, then a giant dirt lot, but the dirt lot had street lights and curbs all around it, it just looked weird. Come to find it, somewhere around 2010, they were short on student parking. They started to build a second lot. They did the curb first, then put in the lights. But before they got to paving it, students stopped driving. Now the one we had that was cramped, goes half empty every day. And the dirt lot that's half made, just sits there abandoned. 
    Kids aren't driving now?  They don't want to get out and go places now?
    It's kinda werid....lots of kids waiting longer and longer to get driver's license.  I think it seems to be starting to shift a bit back to kids wanting the license...but man did it shift away from where it was in the 90's
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Options
    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    edited May 2023
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    That's also a big part of it. Teens aren't driving anymore and working a lot less. Jobs that used to be staffed by mostly high school students (like McDonalds) had to raise wages to appeal to adults to get employees.

    Drive by a high school that had adequate parking 10-15 years ago and it will be half empty now. A lot were over crowded, so it looks right now, but if it had enough spaces in 2005, its half empty now. 

    It looks funny, my last hight school in Colorado had a ton of parking. There was a huge paved lot, then a giant dirt lot, but the dirt lot had street lights and curbs all around it, it just looked weird. Come to find it, somewhere around 2010, they were short on student parking. They started to build a second lot. They did the curb first, then put in the lights. But before they got to paving it, students stopped driving. Now the one we had that was cramped, goes half empty every day. And the dirt lot that's half made, just sits there abandoned. 
    Kids aren't driving now?  They don't want to get out and go places now?
    Nope. Lots of threes why. The one I buy the most is they don't need their freedom anymore. Their phone is their freedom. They just spend all their time on it. Even when a group of teens get together, they're just on their phones in a group now. So no desire to get that license and have that freedom that us 90s kids had.
  • Options
    cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,136
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    Well....there is also what we have done to our kids in regards to activities. Sports and activities are now basically year round for many with club sports, traveling teams, etc.  There is not enough time in the week for all the school and activities and then adding in work?

    I have a teenage daughter who kinda wants to work...but not sure how she would even fit it in to her schedule.  She only has 1 day a week with no activity.  And TBH....I want her to have time to be a kid and not have to do anything that day.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Options
    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    Well....there is also what we have done to our kids in regards to activities. Sports and activities are now basically year round for many with club sports, traveling teams, etc.  There is not enough time in the week for all the school and activities and then adding in work?

    I have a teenage daughter who kinda wants to work...but not sure how she would even fit it in to her schedule.  She only has 1 day a week with no activity.  And TBH....I want her to have time to be a kid and not have to do anything that day.
    Great point.  I forget about the year round sports themes now.
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    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    So NY is a sanctuary state but not every city is a sanctuary city.  

    Schools in Brooklyn had their gymnasiums taken away to house the bussed in asylum seekers.  6 schools so far.

    Other towns are speaking out that they don't have the infrastructure to absorb them.

    It is pretty nuts that we have a housing shortage and we are accepting all of these people here.  Doesn't seem like the proper thing to do but what do I know?
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    mickeyratmickeyrat up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 36,027
    So NY is a sanctuary state but not every city is a sanctuary city.  

    Schools in Brooklyn had their gymnasiums taken away to house the bussed in asylum seekers.  6 schools so far.

    Other towns are speaking out that they don't have the infrastructure to absorb them.

    It is pretty nuts that we have a housing shortage and we are accepting all of these people here.  Doesn't seem like the proper thing to do but what do I know?

    so, what's the solution? dont let em off the bus and do to some other place what Tx , Fla and at one time Az did?
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    What do most other countries do? Don't they just turn them away and send them back? 
    I don't know if I necessarily agree with just shipping them to random cities, but part of the reason for doing that was to show what it actually does to the local community. Its a little funny seeing the rcities now complain that they aren't built for this. Well, many border cities or even high destination cities have been doing this for decades with minimal support.
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    Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom's Posts: 18,022
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    Well....there is also what we have done to our kids in regards to activities. Sports and activities are now basically year round for many with club sports, traveling teams, etc.  There is not enough time in the week for all the school and activities and then adding in work?

    I have a teenage daughter who kinda wants to work...but not sure how she would even fit it in to her schedule.  She only has 1 day a week with no activity.  And TBH....I want her to have time to be a kid and not have to do anything that day.
    We went through that stuff with sports on our older two kids. If I had to do it all over again I would have just had them stick to club sports. The travel was a lot of fun but it was just too much. 
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    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    Kids not driving as much after age 21 is definitely Uber.  My son is 35 and hates driving.  Always has.  He has a car but he averages about 500 miles a year.  I’m telling you that young adults think our moral compasses are all facing south and basically are making their choices based on the opposite of their elders. 

    It amazes me how most people think they have a right to say who lives where, when. I’M ALL FOR LEGAL IMMIGRATION but who are we to say that our land belongs only to us (not in my community!).  What a joke.  Our relatives completely took over this land illegally.  Such hypocrites.  I own the property I pay for and that’s it!  
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    Kids not driving as much after age 21 is definitely Uber.  My son is 35 and hates driving.  Always has.  He has a car but he averages about 500 miles a year.  I’m telling you that young adults think our moral compasses are all facing south and basically are making their choices based on the opposite of their elders. 

    It amazes me how most people think they have a right to say who lives where, when. I’M ALL FOR LEGAL IMMIGRATION but who are we to say that our land belongs only to us (not in my community!).  What a joke.  Our relatives completely took over this land illegally.  Such hypocrites.  I own the property I pay for and that’s it!  
    So do you believe the border and immigration should not be monitored at all? 
    I think (almost) everyone is for legal immigration. I also believe there needs to be some regulations on it. I don't think there is a developed country on this planet that doesn't control their immigration far more than we do. Why is it so wrong for us?
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    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    Mace, didn’t I just write that I’m for legal immigration?  I’ll go one step further agreeing that there should be specific ways and places to enter. 

    If someone disagrees with you one time you assume all future postings by that individual can’t possibly be in line with your thinking.  I’m agreeing with you mace. 

    As for how other countries handle immigration you need to remember that our country was founded on immigration.  Read up on the Statue of Liberty.  That helps in understanding why we are who we were.  Our freedoms including our legal right to bear arms sound extremely enticing to immigrants.  Food, shelter, medical benefits, and so on are enticing as well. 
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    Mace, didn’t I just write that I’m for legal immigration?  I’ll go one step further agreeing that there should be specific ways and places to enter. 

    If someone disagrees with you one time you assume all future postings by that individual can’t possibly be in line with your thinking.  I’m agreeing with you mace. 

    As for how other countries handle immigration you need to remember that our country was founded on immigration.  Read up on the Statue of Liberty.  That helps in understanding why we are who we were.  Our freedoms including our legal right to bear arms sound extremely enticing to immigrants.  Food, shelter, medical benefits, and so on are enticing as well. 
    I didn't assume anything. I asked what you thought about illegal immigration.

    Yes, you did write you're for legal immigration. I was confused because you followed that up by saying who are we to say who can and can't come here. I was uncertain what you meant, because legal immigration is still the government decided who and how many gets in, is it not? SO I did not know your thoughts on illegal immigration and wanted to ask. 
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    nicknyr15nicknyr15 Posts: 7,880
    My only gripe is when people mockingly act as if we don’t have an immigration problem and then just point fingers across the aisle. We have a big problem here in NYC and people are not happy. I don’t have kids in schools and I’m not really invested in how our hotels are being used so this largely doesn’t affect me, but there seems to be a lot of outrage here. 
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    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    mace1229 said:
    Mace, didn’t I just write that I’m for legal immigration?  I’ll go one step further agreeing that there should be specific ways and places to enter. 

    If someone disagrees with you one time you assume all future postings by that individual can’t possibly be in line with your thinking.  I’m agreeing with you mace. 

    As for how other countries handle immigration you need to remember that our country was founded on immigration.  Read up on the Statue of Liberty.  That helps in understanding why we are who we were.  Our freedoms including our legal right to bear arms sound extremely enticing to immigrants.  Food, shelter, medical benefits, and so on are enticing as well. 
    I didn't assume anything. I asked what you thought about illegal immigration.

    Yes, you did write your for legal immigration. I was confused because you followed that up by saying who are we to say who can and can't come here. I was uncertain what you meant, because legal immigration is still the government decided who and how many gets in, is it not? SO I did not know your thoughts on illegal immigration and wanted to ask. 
    my apologies for saying you assume.  I get that you were confused 🫤 sorry.  I can be ok with immigration and still think rules are necessary. 

    It is the government’s ultimate choice to decide how to handle, but the truth is we put those elected officials there to decide for us.  And since we know politicians don’t lie they must be representing their constituents wishes, right? 

    And finally, if Trump and his constituents wanted a wall then so be it if they think that’s the answer, but don’t piss down my back and tell me it’s raining.  He lied.  He said Mexico would pay for it.  Have they?  Just say we’re building a wall and leave it at that.  You can tell when trump says something he probably doesn’t believe because he over excuses his actions.  

    So basically we control the border by voting.  
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    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    nicknyr15 said:
    My only gripe is when people mockingly act as if we don’t have an immigration problem and then just point fingers across the aisle. We have a big problem here in NYC and people are not happy. I don’t have kids in schools and I’m not really invested in how our hotels are being used so this largely doesn’t affect me, but there seems to be a lot of outrage here. 
    I can tell you what schools are like in my experience. I have worked in multiple districts where the majority of the population was ESL (English as a Second Language).
    Schools are already over crowded and underfunded. We had requirements to have co-teachers in some of the rooms to help with the language barrier. I would have a co-teacher in half of my classrooms. This is a teacher who gets the same salary as any other teacher, but just assists students who struggle with English in the classroom. 
    So a school with a budget for 100 teachers will only have about 85 as a regular classroom teacher, and 15 as roaming co-teachers. And we end up with 35-40 kids in a classroom.
    Now the school across town without a huge immigrant population and the same budget, puts all 100 teachers as classroom teachers, can get class sizes down to 28-30. No language barrier and smaller classes, tests scores are going to be better. Less pressure on the teachers because test scores are okay. They getter more recognition, more donations for being a higher performing school, etc.
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    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    My immigration thoughts are definitely tainted.  
    I processed free and reduced meal applications for a school district with over 4500 students and something like 17 different languages being spoken.  If I had questions about the application a family member (usually one of the kids) would translate the answers or I would have them come in for a meeting with an ESL teacher/counselor so they could assist them.  I remember about 90% of them telling me “god bless you”.  American citizens were rude, ignorant, and entitled.  So whether a new citizen child or an American child that’s all I could see.  The children.  If taking shit from an American citizen parent meant their child could eat that day well so be it. 
     
    Start looking at individuals in front of you as a single human rather than as someone from a group.  
  • Options
    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    My immigration thoughts are definitely tainted.  
    I processed free and reduced meal applications for a school district with over 4500 students and something like 17 different languages being spoken.  If I had questions about the application a family member (usually one of the kids) would translate the answers or I would have them come in for a meeting with an ESL teacher/counselor so they could assist them.  I remember about 90% of them telling me “god bless you”.  American citizens were rude, ignorant, and entitled.  So whether a new citizen child or an American child that’s all I could see.  The children.  If taking shit from an American citizen parent meant their child could eat that day well so be it. 
     
    Start looking at individuals in front of you as a single human rather than as someone from a group.  
    NYC doesn't like to close the schools down for any reason.  Do you know why?  Most inner city kids are fed through the schools.  Feeding the kids doesn't bother me in the slightest, we've been doing this for years.

    It's the strain on the teachers in the schools where it becomes a problem.  Kids need structure to learn.  Take that from them and you'll get chaos just like the ones the people in charge are doing thinking it's for the best.
  • Options
    tempo_n_groovetempo_n_groove Posts: 39,136
    mickeyrat said:
    So NY is a sanctuary state but not every city is a sanctuary city.  

    Schools in Brooklyn had their gymnasiums taken away to house the bussed in asylum seekers.  6 schools so far.

    Other towns are speaking out that they don't have the infrastructure to absorb them.

    It is pretty nuts that we have a housing shortage and we are accepting all of these people here.  Doesn't seem like the proper thing to do but what do I know?

    so, what's the solution? dont let em off the bus and do to some other place what Tx , Fla and at one time Az did?
    I'll tell you that a gymnasium at a school currently being used by students isn't it.

    I figure NYC is letting them in for money reasons but since they aren't getting what they applied for the mayor is shipping the people out to other places or doing it on the very cheap.

    If you want to let the number of people in that we are then the government has to make sure that money and facilities are in place for doing so and so far they aren't.
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    Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 36,717
    Let me know when the other side announces their immigration and budget to support immigration reform. Thus far, it’s been crickets. It takes two to tango and building a wall and demonization of immigrants are not the solution. Seems some anger is misdirected.

    While these steps will help address some of the most acute challenges at the Southwest border, they will not solve all of the problems in an immigration system that has been broken for far too long. That can only happen if Republicans in Congress who have spent the past two years talking about border security quit blocking the comprehensive immigration reform and border security measures President Biden proposed on his first day in office, and opposing the billions of dollars in additional funds the President has requested for border security and management.

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2023/01/05/fact-sheet-biden-harris-administration-announces-new-border-enforcement-actions/

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    Merkin BallerMerkin Baller Posts: 10,554
    Let me know when the other side announces their immigration and budget to support immigration reform. Thus far, it’s been crickets. It takes two to tango and building a wall and demonization of immigrants are not the solution. Seems some anger is misdirected.

    While these steps will help address some of the most acute challenges at the Southwest border, they will not solve all of the problems in an immigration system that has been broken for far too long. That can only happen if Republicans in Congress who have spent the past two years talking about border security quit blocking the comprehensive immigration reform and border security measures President Biden proposed on his first day in office, and opposing the billions of dollars in additional funds the President has requested for border security and management.

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2023/01/05/fact-sheet-biden-harris-administration-announces-new-border-enforcement-actions/

    Spoiler: they don't want to solve the problem. 

    It's far too good of a talking point / rallying cry when it comes election time. 

    Conservatives have been talking about immigrants coming across the southern border and taking our jobs since the 1800s, why would they want to give that up? 
  • Options
    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    edited May 2023
    My immigration thoughts are definitely tainted.  
    I processed free and reduced meal applications for a school district with over 4500 students and something like 17 different languages being spoken.  If I had questions about the application a family member (usually one of the kids) would translate the answers or I would have them come in for a meeting with an ESL teacher/counselor so they could assist them.  I remember about 90% of them telling me “god bless you”.  American citizens were rude, ignorant, and entitled.  So whether a new citizen child or an American child that’s all I could see.  The children.  If taking shit from an American citizen parent meant their child could eat that day well so be it. 
     
    Start looking at individuals in front of you as a single human rather than as someone from a group.  
    NYC doesn't like to close the schools down for any reason.  Do you know why?  Most inner city kids are fed through the schools.  Feeding the kids doesn't bother me in the slightest, we've been doing this for years.

    It's the strain on the teachers in the schools where it becomes a problem.  Kids need structure to learn.  Take that from them and you'll get chaos just like the ones the people in charge are doing thinking it's for the best.
    This is well said.

    Illegal (and probably legal too) immigration disproportionally effects certain communities more and does create a big strain on the services, including education. 

    Two different schools can have the same budget. One uses a large portion of it for co-teachers and ESL support which leads to over crowded conditions, high teacher turnover, fewer elective options for students, slower pacing for classes, etc. The other can reduce class sizes and keep the building up to date with it, offer more advance classes, keep up with technology, etc. Its a big strain that is rarely acknowledged. And if that other school is in a different district, chances are it will have better pay and retain better teachers as well. Ignoring the stress it creates doesn't help anyone. 

    And acknowledging it isn't bad. I can see them as individuals and have empathy for what them and understand the strain on resources at the same time. 
  • Options
    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    mace1229 said:
    My immigration thoughts are definitely tainted.  
    I processed free and reduced meal applications for a school district with over 4500 students and something like 17 different languages being spoken.  If I had questions about the application a family member (usually one of the kids) would translate the answers or I would have them come in for a meeting with an ESL teacher/counselor so they could assist them.  I remember about 90% of them telling me “god bless you”.  American citizens were rude, ignorant, and entitled.  So whether a new citizen child or an American child that’s all I could see.  The children.  If taking shit from an American citizen parent meant their child could eat that day well so be it. 
     
    Start looking at individuals in front of you as a single human rather than as someone from a group.  
    NYC doesn't like to close the schools down for any reason.  Do you know why?  Most inner city kids are fed through the schools.  Feeding the kids doesn't bother me in the slightest, we've been doing this for years.

    It's the strain on the teachers in the schools where it becomes a problem.  Kids need structure to learn.  Take that from them and you'll get chaos just like the ones the people in charge are doing thinking it's for the best.
    This is well said.

    Illegal (and probably legal too) immigration disproportionally effects certain communities more and does create a big strain on the services, including education. 

    Two different schools can have the same budget. One uses a large portion of it for co-teachers and ESL support which leads to over crowded conditions, high teacher turnover, fewer elective options for students, slower pacing for classes, etc. The other can reduce class sizes and keep the building up to date with it, offer more advance classes, keep up with technology, etc. Its a big strain that is rarely acknowledged. And if that other school is in a different district, chances are it will have better pay and retain better teachers as well. Ignoring the stress it creates doesn't help anyone. 

    And acknowledging it isn't bad. I can see them as individuals and have empathy for what them and understand the strain on resources at the same time. 
    Oh yes you can just like I can believe in allowing immigrants in while enforcing laws and having structure. 

    Why isn’t your district or district A above not receiving extra money for ESL students?  We had so many grants approved that not one penny of residents money was used for immigrants food or ESL teachers.  Now this was ten years ago but I’m fairly certain it’s still budgeted that way.  
  • Options
    cblock4lifecblock4life Posts: 1,425
    Let me know when the other side announces their immigration and budget to support immigration reform. Thus far, it’s been crickets. It takes two to tango and building a wall and demonization of immigrants are not the solution. Seems some anger is misdirected.

    While these steps will help address some of the most acute challenges at the Southwest border, they will not solve all of the problems in an immigration system that has been broken for far too long. That can only happen if Republicans in Congress who have spent the past two years talking about border security quit blocking the comprehensive immigration reform and border security measures President Biden proposed on his first day in office, and opposing the billions of dollars in additional funds the President has requested for border security and management.

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2023/01/05/fact-sheet-biden-harris-administration-announces-new-border-enforcement-actions/

    Spoiler: they don't want to solve the problem. 

    It's far too good of a talking point / rallying cry when it comes election time. 

    Conservatives have been talking about immigrants coming across the southern border and taking our jobs since the 1800s, why would they want to give that up? 
    Deep down inside they know the country needs those immigrants, except they were never supposed to become successful or birth children who go to college, etc. They were supposed to remain a convenience for us.  It’s a dirty form of racism akin to slavery. 
     Using illegals to change the sheets and clean the bathrooms sounds like a person all for illegal immigration.  
  • Options
    mace1229mace1229 Posts: 9,041
    edited May 2023
    mace1229 said:
    My immigration thoughts are definitely tainted.  
    I processed free and reduced meal applications for a school district with over 4500 students and something like 17 different languages being spoken.  If I had questions about the application a family member (usually one of the kids) would translate the answers or I would have them come in for a meeting with an ESL teacher/counselor so they could assist them.  I remember about 90% of them telling me “god bless you”.  American citizens were rude, ignorant, and entitled.  So whether a new citizen child or an American child that’s all I could see.  The children.  If taking shit from an American citizen parent meant their child could eat that day well so be it. 
     
    Start looking at individuals in front of you as a single human rather than as someone from a group.  
    NYC doesn't like to close the schools down for any reason.  Do you know why?  Most inner city kids are fed through the schools.  Feeding the kids doesn't bother me in the slightest, we've been doing this for years.

    It's the strain on the teachers in the schools where it becomes a problem.  Kids need structure to learn.  Take that from them and you'll get chaos just like the ones the people in charge are doing thinking it's for the best.
    This is well said.

    Illegal (and probably legal too) immigration disproportionally effects certain communities more and does create a big strain on the services, including education. 

    Two different schools can have the same budget. One uses a large portion of it for co-teachers and ESL support which leads to over crowded conditions, high teacher turnover, fewer elective options for students, slower pacing for classes, etc. The other can reduce class sizes and keep the building up to date with it, offer more advance classes, keep up with technology, etc. Its a big strain that is rarely acknowledged. And if that other school is in a different district, chances are it will have better pay and retain better teachers as well. Ignoring the stress it creates doesn't help anyone. 

    And acknowledging it isn't bad. I can see them as individuals and have empathy for what them and understand the strain on resources at the same time. 
    Oh yes you can just like I can believe in allowing immigrants in while enforcing laws and having structure. 

    Why isn’t your district or district A above not receiving extra money for ESL students?  We had so many grants approved that not one penny of residents money was used for immigrants food or ESL teachers.  Now this was ten years ago but I’m fairly certain it’s still budgeted that way.  
    My understanding is a lot of that money is for teacher training, certifications and PD, or after school programs and tutoring, things like that. Not staffing and salaries. 
    I could be wrong, but that's how I always thought it worked with that. Food is paid for by a different budget, you are correct about that.

    Either way, my point was there is a lot more money that goes into poorer communities than people realize. Those communities with a higher migrant population are often in the lower-income areas.

    Schools with low-income families often don't charge for busses, will pay for fees associated with class, will provide students with electronic devices and computers and so many more things other schools don't need to even consider. Schools in upper middle class areas will charge for bussing, don't provide electronics because they can rely on families supplying them. Don't need to provide basic school supplies or personal sporting equipment. Leaves more money for building maintenance and updates. Money for sports and fields and club sponsorship. More money for more elective classes. Money for custodians and providing a cleaner school. And teacher salaries.
    Those schools are often all around much better places to attend and work. When money from the budget is being used to provide bussing, class fees, student supplies, student devices, personal sporting equipment, there is no money left for custodians and teacher salaries. The school is outdated, not cleaned, offers fewer electives and honors classes.

    That's exactly how 2 schools a few miles from each other can look completely different. Both get the same state and federal funding. One has to use more resources on the students, the other has more to use on the school as a whole. 
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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,903
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    I don’t know why we’re joking about this and pretending it’s not a problem. Just because it didn’t look like a zombie hoard from TWD doesn’t mean it’s not a big problem.

    “Migrant border crossings in fiscal year 2022 topped 2.76 million, breaking previous record”

    that’s some big numbers right there.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna53517


    Mace, I just want a logical answer.  Restaurants around me are cutting their hours because no one wants to work in the food industry any longer. Old folks around me can’t find anyone to cut their grass for less than 50.  Waste management had to purchase garbage trucks that can auto lift and empty the cans because no one wants to be a garbage man.  You know where I’m going with this. We expect and ensure that our children are doing better than each generation before.  So first, who do you think will start filling all these jobs?  Farmers, laborers, etc.  And second, what’s wrong with other mothers and fathers just like us wanting more for their children.  
    I’m on your side that something has to be done and so are these people you’re getting upset with.  Everyone acts and thinks differently about everything going on.  I don’t think anyone means to upset you.  
    Cheap paying jobs that should pay more.  Lots of people got out during the pandemic because they could afford to.

    Why teens don't do this work anymore is a mystery to me though.  As a teen you aren't expected to make a ton of money, just make some beer money.  I landscaped for years my friends all washed dishes.  Are kids that spoiled that they don't want to work?
    That's also a big part of it. Teens aren't driving anymore and working a lot less. Jobs that used to be staffed by mostly high school students (like McDonalds) had to raise wages to appeal to adults to get employees.

    Drive by a high school that had adequate parking 10-15 years ago and it will be half empty now. A lot were over crowded, so it looks right now, but if it had enough spaces in 2005, its half empty now. 

    It looks funny, my last hight school in Colorado had a ton of parking. There was a huge paved lot, then a giant dirt lot, but the dirt lot had street lights and curbs all around it, it just looked weird. Come to find it, somewhere around 2010, they were short on student parking. They started to build a second lot. They did the curb first, then put in the lights. But before they got to paving it, students stopped driving. Now the one we had that was cramped, goes half empty every day. And the dirt lot that's half made, just sits there abandoned. 
    Kids aren't driving now?  They don't want to get out and go places now?
    my nearly 17 year old has no interest in driving. and literally NONE of her friends do either. my wife and I find it BAFFLING
    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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