How do you know that animal is innocent?! The mice shat in your cereal box...I saw him! Guilty F'er should be injected with HIV and tested. :twisted:
I feel ya..it is a bummer. I've seen it with my own eyes, bunch of lab geeks poking and prodding..and when they get their result they snap their little necks. And what's even more of a bummer is that about 99% of these tests don't amount to anything, but the ones that do improve our lives...they may save your grandma someday or even you. That's the tradeoff. Mice etc are cheap and easy to breed and you can breed A LOT of them.
I see the logic in your comparison of prisoners and lab animals, but the truth is people will never value an animal over a human life. Even Old Yeller. We'll claw and scratch our way to any possible way that will add some more time to the clock. If you were in the situation to flip the switch on a life so you could live longer... I think you would.
How do you know that animal is innocent?! The mice shat in your cereal box...I saw him! Guilty F'er should be injected with HIV and tested. :twisted:
Mice is plural. :twisted:
I'm sorry, I just a smart ass. :oops:
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.... why not use these prisoners for these tests? ...
... Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder...
The Nazis didn't seem to ponder too long about this. Their 'prisoners' were human guinea pigs. Shall we go back to that? I think not.
.... why not use these prisoners for these tests? ...
... Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder...
The Nazis didn't seem to ponder too long about this. Their 'prisoners' were human guinea pigs. Shall we go back to that? I think not.
and what if that person was later exonerated? :shock:
don't compete; coexist
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
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when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
.... why not use these prisoners for these tests? ...
... Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder...
The Nazis didn't seem to ponder too long about this. Their 'prisoners' were human guinea pigs. Shall we go back to that? I think not.
I'm definitely not for it, but it's just an interesting side to consider.
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.... why not use these prisoners for these tests? ...
... Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder...
The Nazis didn't seem to ponder too long about this. Their 'prisoners' were human guinea pigs. Shall we go back to that? I think not.
I'm definitely not for it, but it's just an interesting side to consider.
I've often thought of this option. That, lets say there's a death-row inmate. Guilty as hell. Maybe he even admits to killing a bunch of people. We'll start with Timothy McVey or something. Why not give the death-row inmate a choice. Either have his punishment carried out, or he can opt into serious medical testing, and if he opts into this, he can then enjoy TV and some other special amenities in his jail cell.
I don't see a problem with this. ...and at least these people got a trial, unlike the current system we use for testing.
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I've often thought of this option. That, lets say there's a death-row inmate. Guilty as hell. Maybe he even admits to killing a bunch of people. We'll start with Timothy McVey or something. Why not give the death-row inmate a choice. Either have his punishment carried out, or he can opt into serious medical testing, and if he opts into this, he can then enjoy TV and some other special amenities in his jail cell.
I don't see a problem with this. ...and at least these people got a trial, unlike the current system we use for testing.
capitalism breeds crime, and you want to treat its victims as animals.
when selfishness and greed rule you're going to get a percentage of the population that will either resist or play the game the only way they know how. violently, as they['ve been taught by the system.
... Either have his punishment carried out, or he can opt into serious medical testing, and if he opts into this, he can then enjoy TV and some other special amenities in his jail cell..
What are some of you PETA people's thoughts on lab animal testing geared in the direction of protecting the human race from, lets say, Anthrax?
I personally think if you value an animal life over a human life you are nuttier than squirrel shit. I once heard a PETA rep say after Steve Irwin died that they were glad to see him go because he pestered animals. Really?? Glad to see a wife and 2 kids grow up without a husband or father because of some souless animals. The guy brought awareness to animals not destruction.
I personally feel really badly for people who think of animals as "souless". Haven't you ever had a pet? I know, without a doubt in my mind, that my dog isn't some automaton, mindlessly completing involuntary tasks until he dies one day. He has a personality, moods, emotions, and most certainly feels pain the same as you or me. How ridiculous to think otherwise.
They act purely on reaction to us. You're mean to them they are mean to you, you give them treats they treat you with love. The pain they experience is a simple reaction, no depth or meaning. They cant determine why or why not this is happening to them.
I work with baboons and I guarantee that for their survival they wouldnt show you the same love and care that PETA people show them. Tell that to the families of the babies they steal in Africa every year.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
Intelligence doesn't give us the right to do whatever we please with any species of animal. We're humans and we share this world with animals. No matter what anybody says, we don't own it. If anything, we're going to be the cause of it's inability to sustain life. Just take into account how many species have gone extinct because of mankind's presence on earth.
I'm confident there are plenty of people out there that would be willing to be tested on for a good enough sum of money. Unfortunately for animals, because of our intelligence we feel that we can do what we please with them because. :roll:
While I'm not advocating that we should have free reign on destroying the earth and treating animals poorly, I am amused at how highly humans think of themselves.
Over 90% of all species that have ever graced the earth are extinct. Think about that for a second. And then think of how long humans have been present on Earth. If you were to condense the history of the earth into a single day, man has been around for all of 30 seconds.
We are insignificant in the grand scheme. The Earth was here looooooooooooooooooooooooong before us, and will be here long after us. And life, as it always has, will find a way to survive.
I agree with you. I was mostly just trying to point out, like you said, how highly humans think of themselves. We seem to be on this self-righteous mission to do whatever it takes to conquer every challenge in this world, even if that is to capture innocent and wild animals and unfairly subject them to medical testing for the advancement of our species.
Do you really think someone is going to volunteer for experimental testing for an HIV vaccine, antibiotic efficacy test, heart medications, or the swine flu? A raise of hands? *crickets*
Everyone has a price
Seriously though I understand the discrepencies in my suggestion, but we kill some of our own after being sentenced in a court of law. If we feel we have the authority to sentence someone, and then put them to death, why not use these prisoners for these tests? Hell, they're human...so the results may even be more accurate. You may think that these prisoners don't have a say, and we can't do that...but neither do animals, so how do we justify doing this to an innocent animal. Surely this prisoner isn't innocent...a judge and jury declared that. In fact, some people may argue that the prisoners are deserving. I find no logic behind anyone saying an animal deserves to be tested on. (I'm not saying you said that, but I'm just putting out a scenario here...even if it seems far-fetched.) Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder.
I know disease is something that we should always try to find a cure to, and shit...I'm very open to the possibility that there are some illnesses that may never be cureable...I guess what it boils down to for me is that I don't believe that just because we're human beings and are basically in control of the world momentarily that we can just do what we want with other species of animal and it breaks my heart that at this point our only option is to take advantage of nature like that.
Intelligence doesn't give us the right to do whatever we please with any species of animal. We're humans and we share this world with animals. No matter what anybody says, we don't own it. If anything, we're going to be the cause of it's inability to sustain life. Just take into account how many species have gone extinct because of mankind's presence on earth.
I'm confident there are plenty of people out there that would be willing to be tested on for a good enough sum of money. Unfortunately for animals, because of our intelligence we feel that we can do what we please with them because. :roll:
While I'm not advocating that we should have free reign on destroying the earth and treating animals poorly, I am amused at how highly humans think of themselves.
Over 90% of all species that have ever graced the earth are extinct. Think about that for a second. And then think of how long humans have been present on Earth. If you were to condense the history of the earth into a single day, man has been around for all of 30 seconds.
We are insignificant in the grand scheme. The Earth was here looooooooooooooooooooooooong before us, and will be here long after us. And life, as it always has, will find a way to survive.
I agree with you. I was mostly just trying to point out, like you said, how highly humans think of themselves. We seem to be on this self-righteous mission to do whatever it takes to conquer every challenge in this world, even if that is to capture innocent and wild animals and unfairly subject them to medical testing for the advancement of our species.
Do you really think someone is going to volunteer for experimental testing for an HIV vaccine, antibiotic efficacy test, heart medications, or the swine flu? A raise of hands? *crickets*
Everyone has a price
Seriously though I understand the discrepencies in my suggestion, but we kill some of our own after being sentenced in a court of law. If we feel we have the authority to sentence someone, and then put them to death, why not use these prisoners for these tests? Hell, they're human...so the results may even be more accurate. You may think that these prisoners don't have a say, and we can't do that...but neither do animals, so how do we justify doing this to an innocent animal. Surely this prisoner isn't innocent...a judge and jury declared that. In fact, some people may argue that the prisoners are deserving. I find no logic behind anyone saying an animal deserves to be tested on. (I'm not saying you said that, but I'm just putting out a scenario here...even if it seems far-fetched.) Now, I'm not advocating to cruely torture death-row inmates...I'm just simply providing something to ponder.
I know disease is something that we should always try to find a cure to, and shit...I'm very open to the possibility that there are some illnesses that may never be cureable...I guess what it boils down to for me is that I don't believe that just because we're human beings and are basically in control of the world momentarily that we can just do what we want with other species of animal and it breaks my heart that at this point our only option is to take advantage of nature like that.
First of all animals that are tested in research facilities arent just pulled from the wild. They are specifically bread for the purpose of testing. To survive they wouldnt take the same stance with you. Say you're on vacation in africa and a baboon grabbed your backpack with all your possesions. You would want it back correct? In trying to get it back this animal feels threatened, the same way a human would when terrorist decided to use anthrax for example. That baboon would do all he could to kill you to keep your possessions that it took from you without making any moral judgements.
What you believe or not the fact is humans are special. No other species in this world previous creates like the Creator creates.
I work with baboons and I guarantee that for their survival they wouldnt show you the same love and care that PETA people show them. Tell that to the families of the babies they steal in Africa every year.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
People don't have souls either, so lets ad them to the "studies" that they are the sole benefactor of.
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I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt.
I don't have any real-life experience with baboons, but I've seen footage of a mother baboon carrying around her infant for days after it has died. Looks like emotion!
And I've read studies on baboon troops that show the leaders of the group exhibit physical symptoms of high stress levels, whereas the lowest members are calm and content.
True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me?
I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt.
I don't have any real-life experience with baboons, but I've seen footage of a mother baboon carrying around her infant for days after it has died. Looks like emotion!
And I've read studies on baboon troops that show the leaders of the group exhibit physical symptoms of high stress levels, whereas the lowest members are calm and content.
True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me?
You have NEVER seen a pet get depressed?!?!
Yeah, I guess this is where I ultimately disagree...I can't just sit back and say that animals don't have emotions and honestly believe it. Just can't do it.
I've seen it first hand that animals do have emotion with my own dogs, and my parents dogs. Also, how do you observe elephants, tigers, lions, primates, deer, etc. and not notice the affection for their young?
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I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt.
I don't have any real-life experience with baboons, but I've seen footage of a mother baboon carrying around her infant for days after it has died. Looks like emotion!
And I've read studies on baboon troops that show the leaders of the group exhibit physical symptoms of high stress levels, whereas the lowest members are calm and content.
True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me?
You have NEVER seen a pet get depressed?!?!
Yeah, I guess this is where I ultimately disagree...I can't just sit back and say that animals don't have emotions and honestly believe it. Just can't do it.
I've seen it first hand that animals do have emotion with my own dogs, and my parents dogs. Also, how do you observe elephants, tigers, lions, primates, deer, etc. and not notice the affection for their young?
100% agree. Animals don't dwell or get depressed? This sounds so obtuse.
Cool video of the elephant rescuing the toddler. Saw a horse defend it's calf beyond the act of instinct and it was very interesting.
I once was walkign my dog near a ranch and I thought I saw a dead horse in the field. Turned out to be just an adult horse resting. There was a calf standing near me on the other side of the fence and my dog was very intrigued, but just as we stopped to admire that horse got up so quick I couldn't believe and he/she boldly took it's time walking over but kept it's head high and made some interesting noises that I have never heard a horse make. My dog mumbled a bit and shuffled off in what seem to be an episode of intimidation.
I think the only emotion that sets humans aside from the rest of the animal kingdom is remorse...but hey, I'm not expert.
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I work with baboons and I guarantee that for their survival they wouldnt show you the same love and care that PETA people show them. Tell that to the families of the babies they steal in Africa every year.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
I beg to differ on the dog issue..
What about my dog who would not eat or play for the 4 days that I was away?
What about the excitement in their eyes when you get home each day?
What about the dog who stands at the window each day at 5:45, wagging his tail and looking for his friend to come home? What about when he knows the difference between your car coming up the street and a zillion others?
What about the mother dog taking in an abandoned litter of kitttens?
What about the hugs and kisses I get from my dog when I'm not feeling well and he knows it?
I'm not handing out treats in exchange for any of this...just love..and getting it in return.
I for one most definitely believe that MY DOG posesses a soul, so if him, why not yours?
peace,
jo
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"How I choose to feel is how I am." ~ EV/MMc
"Some people hear their own inner voices with great clearness and they live by what they hear. Such people become crazy, or they become legends." ~ One Stab ~
Opinions are opinions, and I respect that. However, this statement seems odd. Maybe I'm wrong, or I'm just delusional, but even the most simple observation of human interaction clearly indicates to me that humans have emotion.
Anger
Jealousy
Remorse
Sorrow
Happiness
These are all very easy to identify in humans. What type of evidence is needed besides simply studying human behavior?
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What about my dog who would not eat or play for the 4 days that I was away?
What about the excitement in their eyes when you get home each day?
What about the dog who stands at the window each day at 5:45, wagging his tail and looking for his friend to come home? What about when he knows the difference between your car coming up the street and a zillion others?
What about the mother dog taking in an abandoned litter of kitttens?
What about the hugs and kisses I get from my dog when I'm not feeling well and he knows it?
I'm not handing out treats in exchange for any of this...just love..and getting it in return.
I for one most definitely believe that MY DOG posesses a soul, so if him, why not yours?
:thumbup: :thumbup:
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I work with baboons and I guarantee that for their survival they wouldnt show you the same love and care that PETA people show them. Tell that to the families of the babies they steal in Africa every year.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
I beg to differ on the dog issue..
What about my dog who would not eat or play for the 4 days that I was away?
What about the excitement in their eyes when you get home each day?
What about the dog who stands at the window each day at 5:45, wagging his tail and looking for his friend to come home? What about when he knows the difference between your car coming up the street and a zillion others?
What about the mother dog taking in an abandoned litter of kitttens?
What about the hugs and kisses I get from my dog when I'm not feeling well and he knows it?
I'm not handing out treats in exchange for any of this...just love..and getting it in return.
I for one most definitely believe that MY DOG posesses a soul, so if him, why not yours?
dog spelled backwards is God. So if you believe that tell hasslehoff up there that humans posses souls as well.
dog spelled backwards is God. So if you believe that tell hasslehoff up there that humans posses souls as well.
Could you elaborate what you meant by this? I guess I'm just confused..
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I work with baboons and I guarantee that for their survival they wouldnt show you the same love and care that PETA people show them. Tell that to the families of the babies they steal in Africa every year.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
I beg to differ on the dog issue..
What about my dog who would not eat or play for the 4 days that I was away?
What about the excitement in their eyes when you get home each day?
What about the dog who stands at the window each day at 5:45, wagging his tail and looking for his friend to come home? What about when he knows the difference between your car coming up the street and a zillion others?
What about the mother dog taking in an abandoned litter of kitttens?
What about the hugs and kisses I get from my dog when I'm not feeling well and he knows it?
I'm not handing out treats in exchange for any of this...just love..and getting it in return.
I for one most definitely believe that MY DOG posesses a soul, so if him, why not yours?
dog spelled backwards is God. So if you believe that tell hasslehoff up there that humans posses souls as well.
Sarcasm? I believe it was.
peace,
jo
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"How I choose to feel is how I am." ~ EV/MMc
"Some people hear their own inner voices with great clearness and they live by what they hear. Such people become crazy, or they become legends." ~ One Stab ~
Yes, but surely there is a motive. Perhaps I'm the obtuse one?
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a few years ago, before i reached the age of reason, while i was still regularly attending catholic church every year we would have a "blessing of the animals" where everyone would bring their animals, dogs, cats, horses, snakes, etc to the church and the pastor of my parish would bless each one of them. he spoke at length about their souls. so am i to believe that my pastor was a heretic and was going against church doctrine or am i to believe that animals have souls? they are sentient beings and i believe that they do have souls. especially when a 50 year old man who later became a bishop and a cardinal in the vatican says they do....in spite of what eddieledbetter says...
"You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
Opinions are opinions, and I respect that. However, this statement seems odd. Maybe I'm wrong, or I'm just delusional, but even the most simple observation of human interaction clearly indicates to me that humans have emotion.
Anger
Jealousy
Remorse
Sorrow
Happiness
These are all very easy to identify in humans. What type of evidence is needed besides simply studying human behavior?
It is an odd statement to be sure but it is not original to me. You can only sense the emotions you feel. You cannot be certain of what others feel. How can you know what "anger" or "happiness" feels like to me? I may exhibit the certain behaviors but how do you know I feel it? In all likelihood it is the same thing you feel but you can never really know. How do you know that when you see the color you call "red", I see it the same way? When we were kids we were told fire engines are "red", so we associate that color, however you, your eyes, your brain, etc. see it. Practically it is a somewhat pointless argument, however it leads to a type of critical thinking that is important.
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win ."
Comments
I feel ya..it is a bummer. I've seen it with my own eyes, bunch of lab geeks poking and prodding..and when they get their result they snap their little necks. And what's even more of a bummer is that about 99% of these tests don't amount to anything, but the ones that do improve our lives...they may save your grandma someday or even you. That's the tradeoff. Mice etc are cheap and easy to breed and you can breed A LOT of them.
I see the logic in your comparison of prisoners and lab animals, but the truth is people will never value an animal over a human life. Even Old Yeller. We'll claw and scratch our way to any possible way that will add some more time to the clock. If you were in the situation to flip the switch on a life so you could live longer... I think you would.
Mice is plural. :twisted:
I'm sorry, I just a smart ass. :oops:
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and a caveman hippy to boot!
Elaborate!!
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The Nazis didn't seem to ponder too long about this. Their 'prisoners' were human guinea pigs. Shall we go back to that? I think not.
and what if that person was later exonerated? :shock:
what are you but my reflection? who am i to judge or strike you down?
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when you told me 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'
i was thinkin 'death before dishonor'
I'm definitely not for it, but it's just an interesting side to consider.
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9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
I've often thought of this option. That, lets say there's a death-row inmate. Guilty as hell. Maybe he even admits to killing a bunch of people. We'll start with Timothy McVey or something. Why not give the death-row inmate a choice. Either have his punishment carried out, or he can opt into serious medical testing, and if he opts into this, he can then enjoy TV and some other special amenities in his jail cell.
I don't see a problem with this. ...and at least these people got a trial, unlike the current system we use for testing.
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capitalism breeds crime, and you want to treat its victims as animals.
when selfishness and greed rule you're going to get a percentage of the population that will either resist or play the game the only way they know how. violently, as they['ve been taught by the system.
violence at all hands embrace it if need be.
They already enjoy those.....
They act purely on reaction to us. You're mean to them they are mean to you, you give them treats they treat you with love. The pain they experience is a simple reaction, no depth or meaning. They cant determine why or why not this is happening to them.
We as humans act just as they do; do whatever it takes to survive. If that means breeding and euthanizing mass quanities of animals for anthrax studies to save a humans, so be it. I can assure you this baboons do not have souls. They act purely on instinct. They have no emotion and show no levels of pain when they are hurt. True a dog whines when they are hurt but its a simplistic reaction to a cause. They dont dwell or get depressed and think why me? Only things with souls can differentiate.
First of all animals that are tested in research facilities arent just pulled from the wild. They are specifically bread for the purpose of testing. To survive they wouldnt take the same stance with you. Say you're on vacation in africa and a baboon grabbed your backpack with all your possesions. You would want it back correct? In trying to get it back this animal feels threatened, the same way a human would when terrorist decided to use anthrax for example. That baboon would do all he could to kill you to keep your possessions that it took from you without making any moral judgements.
What you believe or not the fact is humans are special. No other species in this world previous creates like the Creator creates.
People don't have souls either, so lets ad them to the "studies" that they are the sole benefactor of.
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I don't have any real-life experience with baboons, but I've seen footage of a mother baboon carrying around her infant for days after it has died. Looks like emotion!
And I've read studies on baboon troops that show the leaders of the group exhibit physical symptoms of high stress levels, whereas the lowest members are calm and content.
You have NEVER seen a pet get depressed?!?!
Yeah, I guess this is where I ultimately disagree...I can't just sit back and say that animals don't have emotions and honestly believe it. Just can't do it.
I've seen it first hand that animals do have emotion with my own dogs, and my parents dogs. Also, how do you observe elephants, tigers, lions, primates, deer, etc. and not notice the affection for their young?
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
100% agree. Animals don't dwell or get depressed? This sounds so obtuse.
Here's elephants grieving
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjtrdpSwEUY
Here's elephants rescuing a drowning toddler elephant
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cd-LtWtN ... re=related
*NYC 9/28/96 *NYC 9/29/96 *NJ 9/8/98 (front row "may i play drums with you")
*MSG 9/10/98 (backstage) *MSG 9/11/98 (backstage)
*Jones Beach 8/23/00 *Jones Beach 8/24/00 *Jones Beach 8/25/00
*Mansfield 8/29/00 *Mansfield 8/30/00 *Nassau 4/30/03 *Nissan VA 7/1/03
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*Bristow VA 5/13/10 *MSG 5/20/10 *MSG 5/21/10
Cool video of the elephant rescuing the toddler. Saw a horse defend it's calf beyond the act of instinct and it was very interesting.
I once was walkign my dog near a ranch and I thought I saw a dead horse in the field. Turned out to be just an adult horse resting. There was a calf standing near me on the other side of the fence and my dog was very intrigued, but just as we stopped to admire that horse got up so quick I couldn't believe and he/she boldly took it's time walking over but kept it's head high and made some interesting noises that I have never heard a horse make. My dog mumbled a bit and shuffled off in what seem to be an episode of intimidation.
I think the only emotion that sets humans aside from the rest of the animal kingdom is remorse...but hey, I'm not expert.
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
"With our thoughts we make the world"
I beg to differ on the dog issue..
What about my dog who would not eat or play for the 4 days that I was away?
What about the excitement in their eyes when you get home each day?
What about the dog who stands at the window each day at 5:45, wagging his tail and looking for his friend to come home? What about when he knows the difference between your car coming up the street and a zillion others?
What about the mother dog taking in an abandoned litter of kitttens?
What about the hugs and kisses I get from my dog when I'm not feeling well and he knows it?
I'm not handing out treats in exchange for any of this...just love..and getting it in return.
I for one most definitely believe that MY DOG posesses a soul, so if him, why not yours?
jo
http://www.Etsy.com/Shop/SimpleEarthCreations
"How I choose to feel is how I am." ~ EV/MMc
"Some people hear their own inner voices with great clearness and they live by what they hear. Such people become crazy, or they become legends." ~ One Stab ~
Opinions are opinions, and I respect that. However, this statement seems odd. Maybe I'm wrong, or I'm just delusional, but even the most simple observation of human interaction clearly indicates to me that humans have emotion.
Anger
Jealousy
Remorse
Sorrow
Happiness
These are all very easy to identify in humans. What type of evidence is needed besides simply studying human behavior?
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
:thumbup: :thumbup:
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
dog spelled backwards is God. So if you believe that tell hasslehoff up there that humans posses souls as well.
Could you elaborate what you meant by this? I guess I'm just confused..
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
Sarcasm? I believe it was.
jo
http://www.Etsy.com/Shop/SimpleEarthCreations
"How I choose to feel is how I am." ~ EV/MMc
"Some people hear their own inner voices with great clearness and they live by what they hear. Such people become crazy, or they become legends." ~ One Stab ~
Yes, but surely there is a motive. Perhaps I'm the obtuse one?
6/12/08 - Tampa, FL
8/23/09 - Chicago, IL
9/28/09 - Salt Lake City, UT (11 years too long!!!)
9/03/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 1
9/04/11 - East Troy, WI - PJ20 - Night 2
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
It is an odd statement to be sure but it is not original to me. You can only sense the emotions you feel. You cannot be certain of what others feel. How can you know what "anger" or "happiness" feels like to me? I may exhibit the certain behaviors but how do you know I feel it? In all likelihood it is the same thing you feel but you can never really know. How do you know that when you see the color you call "red", I see it the same way? When we were kids we were told fire engines are "red", so we associate that color, however you, your eyes, your brain, etc. see it. Practically it is a somewhat pointless argument, however it leads to a type of critical thinking that is important.
"With our thoughts we make the world"