Columbus Day

musicismylife78

lets remember columbus. The real one. Not the one your history books or your grade school teachers forced down your throats, but the actual, real life person.

Christopher Columbus was a crappy navigator and explorer. He was racist. When he met the Arawak, he had dogs siked on the population. Rape was a regular happening, gang rapes were ordinary occurances. And he would often tie the Arawak up, at the stake, with a fire burning close to them, making sure to tie them up in groups of 12, in accordance with the 12 apostles from the Bible. And uses wet wood to do it, in order to prolong the agony of the victims. When the screams made it so Columbus couldnt sleep, he had his men shove instruments through the chins of the victims.

He demanded the Indians come back with gold, which of course there was none, so when they came back without the gold, he chopped their hands off.

His men would get their laughs by shooting arrows into the trees and hitting monkeys, taking careful precaution to follow the orders of Columbus, who wanted the monkeys, with the arrow still in them, and very much alive still, thrown into the cargo hold of the ships, where the dogs were kept. Columbus and his men took great pleasure in seeing the monkeys literally being torn apart by these dogs.

He also set in motion, the genocide of the Native Americans, the impact of which can be felt today.

So, every Columbus Day, I wonder often, why we celebrate this thug and brute and killer of a man. Even if you want to just celebrate his navigating "accomplishments" you cant really do it, because as I said, he was a lousy sailor and navigator.

Additionally the idea that he discovered America or ANYTHING at all is completely a lie. How can he have dicovered a place, a land, a world, that had people, millions of people inhabiting it, for maybe ten thousand years or more.

Happy Indigenous Peoples day. Thats what I celebrate. I also on this day think of Leonard Peltier who continues to languish illegally in a jail cell for a crime he never committed.

South of Seattle

He was a crappy navigator? Were you on the Santa Maria or something?

gimmesometruth27

he did not discover america. he ran the fuck into it. how can one discover something that already had indigenous people here? some contend that vikings discovered the new world years before columbus landed here.

g under p

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

he did not discover america. he ran the fuck into it. how can one discover something that already had indigenous people here? some contend that vikings discovered the new world years before columbus landed here.

About the only good this day does is that it eases traffic around Washington DC for a fucking day. Thanks

Peace

musicismylife78

South of Seattle wrote:

He was a crappy navigator? Were you on the Santa Maria or something?

always surprised to see people who still swallow the b.s shoveled their way in terms of the columbus myth.

one of the main tenets of honoring columbus of course was that he "discovered" america and was a great navigator.

columbus was very poor at mathematics, and thus despite the idea that many people have, that MANY MANY people thought the world was flat, in actuality, MANY PEOPLE DIDNT think it was flat. Columbus was one of those who thought it flat. So theres this fact, which means he held a belief that was flat out wrong, and of course if you think the world is flat, you aint gonna make much of a navigator! Second, He didnt know where he was when he landed. Its a little hard to call someone a great navigator if they dont know where they are, and ignore the prevailing ideas at the time, which as I said, was that the world was round

anyways, the point is, in terms of what embodies the term evil and murderous and genocidal, I think that few individuals match these terms so perfectly.

musicismylife78

how about another nail in the columbus coffin. columbus had promised to give a lifetime pension to the first of his sailing men to spot land. One of the men spotted it. Then when Columbus woke up, he said he had actually seen land several hours before this one sailor. Nevermind the ethics of this, its been shown that it would hae been almost impossible for columbus to see land before this guy, as he would have had to have seen something like 30 miles ahead over the horizon. Great guy this columbus

or how about the fact that columbus and his men transmitted syhphallis

South of Seattle

musicismylife78 wrote:

South of Seattle wrote:

He was a crappy navigator? Were you on the Santa Maria or something?

always surprised to see people who still swallow the b.s shoveled their way in terms of the columbus myth.

one of the main tenets of honoring columbus of course was that he "discovered" america and was a great navigator.

columbus was very poor at mathematics, and thus despite the idea that many people have, that MANY MANY people thought the world was flat, in actuality, MANY PEOPLE DIDNT think it was flat. Columbus was one of those who thought it flat. So theres this fact, which means he held a belief that was flat out wrong, and of course if you think the world is flat, you aint gonna make much of a navigator! Second, He didnt know where he was when he landed. Its a little hard to call someone a great navigator if they dont know where they are, and ignore the prevailing ideas at the time, which as I said, was that the world was round

anyways, the point is, in terms of what embodies the term evil and murderous and genocidal, I think that few individuals match these terms so perfectly.

I'm not swallowing the BS. I know about everything you've posted.

People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything. People are just excited to get a paid day off.

musicismylife78

South of Seattle wrote:

musicismylife78 wrote:

South of Seattle wrote:

He was a crappy navigator? Were you on the Santa Maria or something?

always surprised to see people who still swallow the b.s shoveled their way in terms of the columbus myth.

one of the main tenets of honoring columbus of course was that he "discovered" america and was a great navigator.

columbus was very poor at mathematics, and thus despite the idea that many people have, that MANY MANY people thought the world was flat, in actuality, MANY PEOPLE DIDNT think it was flat. Columbus was one of those who thought it flat. So theres this fact, which means he held a belief that was flat out wrong, and of course if you think the world is flat, you aint gonna make much of a navigator! Second, He didnt know where he was when he landed. Its a little hard to call someone a great navigator if they dont know where they are, and ignore the prevailing ideas at the time, which as I said, was that the world was round

anyways, the point is, in terms of what embodies the term evil and murderous and genocidal, I think that few individuals match these terms so perfectly.

I'm not swallowing the BS. I know about everything you've posted.

People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything. People are just excited to get a paid day off.

well, the fact that you questioned my assesment of Columbus's navigation skills, seems to suggest otherwise. And secondly, its a national holiday, so by definition people do celebrate it.

Its more incidious and ingrained in american society, so the fact that people dont dress up ala Halloween, or as Santa during Christmas, that its more than that.

I think there are many people, millions, tens of millions of americans who still believe Christopher Columbus was a great navigator, actually discovered America, and is a hero and person to admire. Didnt the 1st season of The Sopranos have a part where Tony and the others visit an AntiColumbus day parade, and it touches off a whole discussion for Tony about how he felt that was disrespectful to him, because Columbus is looked at as an Italian hero.

My own hometown's conservative press, as recently as 2008, published an article criticizing a professor from the university who had called Columbus what he really was.

The fact that you, or anyone else, just accepts the day, even though columbus is a genocidal maniac, proves my point. Its so engrained in american culture, this mythical figure, that the truth about him, is drowned out.

And as I pointed out, Columbus's actions have ramifications even today. From the prison sentence of Lenoard Peltier, to the deplorable and horrific conditions of reservations in American society, to the Fighting Illini's sickening degradation of Native American's and their culture, the firing of Ward Churchill on the basis of public outrage when he suggests that Native Americans were given blankets with small pox on them by settlers and soldiers and his analysis of american foreign policy post 9/11

It sickens me to think anyone, anywhere would have anything good to say about Columbus.

SPEEDY MCCREADY

Whats wrong??

Didnt you get a paid holiday like everyone else???

Oh wait...Nevermind....

musicismylife78

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

Whats wrong??

Didnt you get a paid holiday like everyone else???

Oh wait...Nevermind....

speedy mccready is pretty smart and wise, right?

oh wait....nevermind thats someone else

Commy

we should have a hitler day. paid day off yeah?

SPEEDY MCCREADY

musicismylife78 wrote:

SPEEDY MCCREADY wrote:

Whats wrong??

Didnt you get a paid holiday like everyone else???

Oh wait...Nevermind....

speedy mccready is pretty smart and wise, right?

oh wait....nevermind thats someone else

I have common sense.....

Unlike some people I know.......

Byrnzie

Sounds like he wasn't much different from George Armstrong Custer - a rapist, and murderer of men, women, and children. Custer apparently took pleasure in killing pregnant Indian women and cutting out the fetus. He was even hated by his own men. Funny how so many people now regard the sick fuck as some sort of hero and icon.

Byrnzie

South of Seattle wrote:

He was a crappy navigator? Were you on the Santa Maria or something?

Are you suggesting that you need to have been present at every event in history in order to have an understanding of what occurred? Have you not heard of something called 'books'? They're a great invention. They help you to learn things about the world in which you live, including historical facts. You should check 'em out sometime.

Commy

columbus' diary wrote:

Weapons they have none, nor are acquainted with them, for I showed them swords which they grasped by the blades, and cut themselves through ignorance...It appears to me, that the people are ingenious, and would be good servants and I am of opinion that they would very readily become Christians, as they appear to have no religion.

sounds like a good guy. :roll:



http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/Columbus1.html

Byrnzie

South of Seattle wrote:

People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything.

South of Seattle

well, the fact that you questioned my assesment of Columbus's navigation skills, seems to suggest otherwise. And secondly, its a national holiday, so by definition people do celebrate it.

People don't celebrate it by choice or because it's Chris Columbus. It's a government holiday. If I worked at the bank and didn't celebrate Columbus, I can't just go to the closed bank and work my shift.

Its more incidious and ingrained in american society, so the fact that people dont dress up ala Halloween, or as Santa during Christmas, that its more than that.

I think there are many people, millions, tens of millions of americans who still believe Christopher Columbus was a great navigator, actually discovered America, and is a hero and person to admire. Didnt the 1st season of The Sopranos have a part where Tony and the others visit an AntiColumbus day parade, and it touches off a whole discussion for Tony about how he felt that was disrespectful to him, because Columbus is looked at as an Italian hero.

My own hometown's conservative press, as recently as 2008, published an article criticizing a professor from the university who had called Columbus what he really was.

"You think" there are Tens of Millions of American's who believe this. You don't know this. Just like you think no one has bought a CD and everyone just illegally downloads music.

The fact that you, or anyone else, just accepts the day, even though columbus is a genocidal maniac, proves my point. Its so engrained in american culture, this mythical figure, that the truth about him, is drowned out.

Didn't even know it was Columbus day until I looked in the Moving Train tonight. I wouldn't say that it's "ingrained" in American Culture. I just think no one gives a shit.

And as I pointed out, Columbus's actions have ramifications even today. From the prison sentence of Lenoard Peltier

I'm not seeing the link between Columbus and an FBI shootout in North Dakota

to the deplorable and horrific conditions of reservations in American society, to the Fighting Illini's sickening degradation of Native American's and their culture, the firing of Ward Churchill on the basis of public outrage when he suggests that Native Americans were given blankets with small pox on them by settlers and soldiers and his analysis of american foreign policy post 9/11

There are deplorable and horrific conditions of the Res. I'll give you that part.

It sickens me to think anyone, anywhere would have anything good to say about Columbus.

I'm not seeing these people that have good things to say about Columbus. I haven't talked about him since my 4th grade project where I had to glue a paper turkey on to construction paper.

South of Seattle

Byrnzie wrote:

South of Seattle wrote:

People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything.

Columbus day is celebrated as a holiday for the hard work of people who immigrated to the United States. It's mainly an Italian-American holiday which is why you're finding these pics from the East Coast of the US. It has little to do with Columbus in all reality.

Where I live & (Musicismylife78) lives there aren't giant parades like these.

Commy

South of Seattle wrote:

People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything.

seems they do.

South of Seattle

Commy wrote:

South of Seattle wrote:

Most People don't celebrate Columbus day, I've never seen people dressed up as Columbus or a boat or anything.

seems they do.

Is that better?

SPEEDY MCCREADY

I can only imagine....
The shit we will catch....
Next month....

When we celebrate Thanksgiving!!!!

hehehehehe