Springsteen did it right!

SKELLER

Just bought tickets for the Springsteen concert. I had to agree to the following before I hit submit:

"I understand that the Miley Cyrus tour is a paperless ticketing tour, that I will not receive a physical ticket for entry, and that I am required to bring the credit card I used to buy my ticket and a government-issued ID to the venue, where my credit card will be swiped to gain me and my party access to the event.If I do not have my credit card and government-issued ID in hand at the event, I will not gain access to the event. No exceptions will be made."

Very cool way of stopping scalpers and ticket brookers from getting tickets, jacking up the price, and then selling them to fans who weren't lucky enough to get tickets.

cajunkiwi

Miley Cyrus and Springsteen are touring together?

spearhead

That is so weird, because I Just bought tickets to the Miley Cyrus show and I had to agree to this before I hit the accept button:

"I understand that the Bruce Springsteen tour is a paperless ticketing tour, that I will not receive a physical ticket for entry, and that I am required to bring the credit card I used to buy my ticket and a government-issued ID to the venue, where my credit card will be swiped to gain me and my party access to the event.If I do not have my credit card and government-issued ID in hand at the event, I will not gain access to the event. No exceptions will be made."

SKELLER

cajunkiwi wrote:

Miley Cyrus and Springsteen are touring together?

Saw that too! Anyway.... wouldn't that be something

littlewingfridays

Good idea, a bit onconvenient, but good

thunderDAN

next year, all Cleveland Cavs games are like this I believe

Dollar

From the scalper standpoint....yes. From the consumer standpoint...not so sure...paperless GAs were available until 11:35 today for the 20th,they are still available for the 19th. People have no options when they buy paperless,thus the slowness of sales(also Bruce has reached the saturation point in this area & this is coming from someone who has gone to 150+ Bruce shows!)

Evolver

Wow, this is great, amazing it hasn't been done earlier. Probably just a matter if developing the logistics of the credit card swiping system, but otherwise brilliant! Can you imagine if this concept took off large scale? StubHub and the like would cease to exist! :shock:

And I'll take a bit of inconvenience if it means taking the scalpers out of the equation. Plus I'm sure with time they can develop ways to improve the system for efficiency.

RyGuy

There are several other threads on this exact topic...

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

I'm all for preventing scalper access, but it can't be this sweeping. There are lots of situations where people buy tickets legitimately and are not able to attend - you can't punish them for that.

SKELLER

Evolver wrote:

Wow, this is great, amazing it hasn't been done earlier. Probably just a matter if developing the logistics of the credit card swiping system, but otherwise brilliant! Can you imagine if this concept took off large scale? StubHub and the like would cease to exist! :shock:

And I'll take a bit of inconvenience if it means taking the scalpers out of the equation. Plus I'm sure with time they can develop ways to improve the system for efficiency.

It would never happen because companies like stub hub would start paying artist and sporting teams not to do so. I know some of us (myself included) put certain people on a pedestal when it comes to integrity but the all mighty dollar has a way of know some people off it.

I would be nice to see it happen for a least one of the shows the artist is giving.

qontheboard

AC/DC did the paperless ticket thing, and scalpers still made a killing. They simply met their customers at the Gate swiped the card and then handed over the paper tickets they give you when you enter. Venue staff have to start enforcing new rules otherwise the scalper can still operate within the paperless system.

q

SVRDhand13

I got a paperless ticket to NIN and went searching to see if it stopped scalpers...it didn't. Tickets are going for hundreds and thousands. I feel bad for the people who wanted to but won't get to see NIN on their "final tour".

ManUnited

BustedDownPretext wrote:

There are several other threads on this exact topic...

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

I'm all for preventing scalper access, but it can't be this sweeping. There are lots of situations where people buy tickets legitimately and are not able to attend - you can't punish them for that.

I agree.

With this system you can't even give them away which I have done.

littlewingfridays

True, all good points, ho hum, damn scalpers

dimitrispearljam

great and sweet avatar btw

Ryan_WFC

SVRDhand13 wrote:

I got a paperless ticket to NIN and went searching to see if it stopped scalpers...it didn't. Tickets are going for hundreds and thousands. I feel bad for the people who wanted to but won't get to see NIN on their "final tour".

Same thing happened for the Green Day show in NYC in May -- but there would have been more scalped tickets if they were mailed (or printed at home) as usual.

At least with the ticketless system, the scalper actually has to attend the show and make arrangements to meet the scalpee. That cuts down on much, if not all, of the problem.

ponner1us

My humble opinion is that the only way to "stop" scalpers is for the ticket companies to be forced out of the secondary markets they are in bed with, e.g. Ticketmaster/Ticketsnow, and to start selling their tickets to the fans, instead of holding the primo tickets for the secondary sellers. I don't think anything will "stop" scalping, but it might slow it down.

Evolver

BustedDownPretext wrote:

There are several other threads on this exact topic...

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

I'm all for preventing scalper access, but it can't be this sweeping. There are lots of situations where people buy tickets legitimately and are not able to attend - you can't punish them for that.

Understood, but it's not punishing, its just the rules. And if you think there is ANY reason why you wouldn't be able to make it, just don't buy the tickets. Same is true for a lot of other non-refundable tickets that a person could buy - travel, etc. Perhaps they could charge an additional optional fee, almost like a trip insurance type thing, so that if you think you might not be able to make it, it would allow you at least a partial refund or something. Otherwise without purchasing this "insurance" the risk is yours.

And as far as the "parent's credit card issue", the fact that you don't have a credit card is not the venue's problem, or anyone elses quite frankly. Bottom line, this issue is certainly nowhere near reason enough for them not to do this. The effectiveness and overall impact this would have on eliminating scalpers from the equation FAR outweighs these smaller issues, hands down.

chromiam

Evolver wrote:

BustedDownPretext wrote:

There are several other threads on this exact topic...

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

I'm all for preventing scalper access, but it can't be this sweeping. There are lots of situations where people buy tickets legitimately and are not able to attend - you can't punish them for that.

Understood, but it's not punishing, its just the rules. And if you think there is ANY reason why you wouldn't be able to make it, just don't buy the tickets. Same is true for a lot of other non-refundable tickets that a person could buy - travel, etc. Perhaps they could charge an additional optional fee, almost like a trip insurance type thing, so that if you think you might not be able to make it, it would allow you at least a partial refund or something. Otherwise without purchasing this "insurance" the risk is yours.

And as far as the "parent's credit card issue", the fact that you don't have a credit card is not the venue's problem, or anyone elses quite frankly. Bottom line, this issue is certainly nowhere near reason enough for them not to do this. The effectiveness and overall impact this would have on eliminating scalpers from the equation FAR outweighs these smaller issues, hands down.

The problem is (as mentioned above) this doesn't stop or even limit scalping. If anything, it could, create a rise in prices that are paid to scalpers since the tickets become harder to get and thus more in demand.

And how am I to know what is going on 3 months from now?? When you purchase a ticket to an event 3 months ahead of time, I would hope that you have a fairly good outlook on going. But as that time nears there could be a multitude of reasons why you can't attend and would like to pass the tickets off to someone (a friend, relative, neighbor, hell a total stranger) for free or cost or whatever... but with this system you cannot do that.

EBowie

Ok...sounds like a pretty good idea...I was just thinking: How do you prove where your seat is? For example, you get into the venue, grab a couple beers, head to your seat and then find other people sitting in them. How does this aspect of it work?

benjs

EBowie wrote:

Ok...sounds like a pretty good idea...I was just thinking: How do you prove where your seat is? For example, you get into the venue, grab a couple beers, head to your seat and then find other people sitting in them. How does this aspect of it work?

The way it works is that when you swipe your credit card at the venue, I believe they print out your ticket and you must walk into the venue so you can't try and scalp it outside.

EBowie

benjs wrote:

EBowie wrote:

Ok...sounds like a pretty good idea...I was just thinking: How do you prove where your seat is? For example, you get into the venue, grab a couple beers, head to your seat and then find other people sitting in them. How does this aspect of it work?

The way it works is that when you swipe your credit card at the venue, I believe they print out your ticket and you must walk into the venue so you can't try and scalp it outside.

Thanks...I figured there was a logical explanation...it just hadn't been touched upon in this thread yet.

RyGuy

The sad truth is that if there WERE a way to eliminate scalpers, I'd like to think that it would already be implemented. I think the reason TM has created a company like TicketsNow is because "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em." The fact of the matter is that as long as demand exceeds supply, there will always be a secondary market for tickets. Scalpers have figured out a way to get around limitations before, haven't they?

RyGuy

Evolver wrote:

Understood, but it's not punishing, its just the rules. And if you think there is ANY reason why you wouldn't be able to make it, just don't buy the tickets. Same is true for a lot of other non-refundable tickets that a person could buy - travel, etc. Perhaps they could charge an additional optional fee, almost like a trip insurance type thing, so that if you think you might not be able to make it, it would allow you at least a partial refund or something. Otherwise without purchasing this "insurance" the risk is yours.

Come on, now. Do you really think that does ANYTHING to prevent scalping? All they'll do is pay for the additional insurance, and we're right back where we started.

I think people need, at the very least, the option to transfer tickets through the legitimate service they purchased them from. It makes things more complicated, but it's not fair so tell someone "Sorry you had to go out of town for a funeral, but you're still stuck with the tickets."

Moreover, what happens if your buddy buys a pair for the two of you and then he needs to leave town? Should you be screwed there too?

I love the paperless ticket system in theory, but there are too many issues that, in practice, make the consumer's life too difficult.

Ryan_WFC

BustedDownPretext wrote:

Come on, now. Do you really think that does ANYTHING to prevent scalping? All they'll do is pay for the additional insurance, and we're right back where we started.

I think people need, at the very least, the option to transfer tickets through the legitimate service they purchased them from. It makes things more complicated, but it's not fair so tell someone "Sorry you had to go out of town for a funeral, but you're still stuck with the tickets."

You have it backwards.

The "insurance" thing would mean if your plans changed, your ticket would be voided and you'd get your money back. Then Ticketmaster (or whomever) would sell it to another fan, paperless, and that person would have to present ID. No scalping possibility.

But if you allowed transfers, a scalper could scalp the ticket for $500 and "transfer" it to the guy who bought it.

No system is perfect, but paperless ensures the most amount of tickets going into the hands of actual fans for face value.

benjs

BustedDownPretext wrote:

Evolver wrote:

Understood, but it's not punishing, its just the rules. And if you think there is ANY reason why you wouldn't be able to make it, just don't buy the tickets. Same is true for a lot of other non-refundable tickets that a person could buy - travel, etc. Perhaps they could charge an additional optional fee, almost like a trip insurance type thing, so that if you think you might not be able to make it, it would allow you at least a partial refund or something. Otherwise without purchasing this "insurance" the risk is yours.

Come on, now. Do you really think that does ANYTHING to prevent scalping? All they'll do is pay for the additional insurance, and we're right back where we started.

I think people need, at the very least, the option to transfer tickets through the legitimate service they purchased them from. It makes things more complicated, but it's not fair so tell someone "Sorry you had to go out of town for a funeral, but you're still stuck with the tickets."

Moreover, what happens if your buddy buys a pair for the two of you and then he needs to leave town? Should you be screwed there too?

I love the paperless ticket system in theory, but there are too many issues that, in practice, make the consumer's life too difficult.

Paperless or not - neither solution has the ability to satisfy everyone. The reality of the situation is that, as you stated, under extenuating circumstances, people need the ability to transfer ownership of a ticket to another owner. But if you allow that, then the scalpers win, as that's all they do is transfer ownership. I think it's an idea that does have a lot of potential, but there are kinks to be worked out. Perhaps Ticketmaster could offer a service where for a small portion (well, let's be honest - they're Ticketmaster, they're not going to do this for free) the ticketholder can have the ownership changed. Or, what if Ticketmaster had a service where they issued their own identification cards? You could go to a Ticketmaster outlet, present two pieces of valid ID, give them a thumbnail sized photo of you, and have them issue a Ticketmaster ID card, to be presented to claim your tickets in lieu of a credit card.

drew0

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

QFT.

I am all against regulating scalpers as they piss me off to no end, but there is no real way to prevent it in the long run without pissing just as many people off. There have been a couple times where I haven't been able to make it to a concert (or a friend wasn't able to make it) so we gave our tickets (for face value) to a friend. A death in the family, last minute business trip, children are sick, car isn't working, etc.

We'll see how it goes, but I can see this causing a lot of headaches....

slightofjeff

That's really weird. I just bought tickets to the Miley Cyrus tour and got this email:

The cops are on their way to your house as we speak, you child molestor

slightofjeff

drew0 wrote:

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

QFT.

I am all against regulating scalpers as they piss me off to no end, but there is no real way to prevent it in the long run without pissing just as many people off. There have been a couple times where I haven't been able to make it to a concert (or a friend wasn't able to make it) so we gave our tickets (for face value) to a friend. A death in the family, last minute business trip, children are sick, car isn't working, etc.

We'll see how it goes, but I can see this causing a lot of headaches....

What if I wanted to buy my granpa Miley Cyrus tickets for his birthday. Am I forced to accompany him to the show? What if I have a prior commitment? What if my grandpa lives in a different state than me?

This is a horrible, horrible idea, however well-intentioned.

High Fidelity 2000

I can't imagine the line to get in at a paperless Springsteen show. I saw Tom Waits last year and it was the first time Ticketmaster had done that paperless routine (the people at the entrances have these little machines where they swipe your card, then it prints out a little receipt with your seat location on it). The lines got a little long, so you had to wait maybe 5 minutes. But this was at a little 2,000 seat theater. Not 20,000 seats. Or bigger.

Evolver

chromiam wrote:

Evolver wrote:

BustedDownPretext wrote:

There are several other threads on this exact topic...

Too many issues with this type of ticketing. What if you don't have a credit card and borrow a parent's to get the tickets - how do you get in then? What happens if you buy a ticket and end up having a business commitment that prevents you from going? You can't sell it to a friend at face value?

I'm all for preventing scalper access, but it can't be this sweeping. There are lots of situations where people buy tickets legitimately and are not able to attend - you can't punish them for that.

Understood, but it's not punishing, its just the rules. And if you think there is ANY reason why you wouldn't be able to make it, just don't buy the tickets. Same is true for a lot of other non-refundable tickets that a person could buy - travel, etc. Perhaps they could charge an additional optional fee, almost like a trip insurance type thing, so that if you think you might not be able to make it, it would allow you at least a partial refund or something. Otherwise without purchasing this "insurance" the risk is yours.

And as far as the "parent's credit card issue", the fact that you don't have a credit card is not the venue's problem, or anyone elses quite frankly. Bottom line, this issue is certainly nowhere near reason enough for them not to do this. The effectiveness and overall impact this would have on eliminating scalpers from the equation FAR outweighs these smaller issues, hands down.

The problem is (as mentioned above) this doesn't stop or even limit scalping. If anything, it could, create a rise in prices that are paid to scalpers since the tickets become harder to get and thus more in demand.

And how am I to know what is going on 3 months from now?? When you purchase a ticket to an event 3 months ahead of time, I would hope that you have a fairly good outlook on going. But as that time nears there could be a multitude of reasons why you can't attend and would like to pass the tickets off to someone (a friend, relative, neighbor, hell a total stranger) for free or cost or whatever... but with this system you cannot do that.

Well for that matter, what if you book a trip for 3 months from now, you don't know what might happen between now and then...but if something comes up, unless you've paid for trip insurance, you're outta luck. Its just the risk you take, unless like I said they offer some sort of ticket insurance.

And as far as how this relates to scalpers, under this new concept, the one who purchased the ticket (let's say the scalper) would have to be present AND entering the venue with their credit card at the time of the show. Any and all tickets would have to be accompanied by the credit card that was used to purchase them. So even if you bought a ticket from a scalper, it would be useless with out 1) them being there with you, and 2) them having their credit card/ID with you too.