my point is, that most people defended it (whether its a song or not) because it has "meaning". Someone can place meaning on anything, so is it the meaning that makes it good? or is the appeasing to the ear?
if its meaning, then the moment of silence would be just as good, if its the sound itself, then i still say its crap and shoulda been cut.
my point is, that most people defended it (whether its a song or not) because it has "meaning". Someone can place meaning on anything, so is it the meaning that makes it good? or is the appeasing to the ear?
if its meaning, then the moment of silence would be just as good, if its the sound itself, then i still say its crap and shoulda been cut.
good thing you didn't get a vote, then, eh?
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
ive read all the comments, and what i take out of it is, that if Eddie made a 1 min moment of silence track on Riot Act instead of ARC, would you all feel just as moved and attached to that kind of song because it had "meaning"?
No, because silence doesn't make the hair stand up on the back of my neck the way Arc does.
If you don't feel it, that's fine ... but I kind of feel sorry for you that you've never had that feeling.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
why is everyone so crazy about this song? its garbage, trash, its not even a song. why does everyone make a big deal about it?
i dont get it
While I wouldn't exactly call it "garbage"...I know where you're coming from. I've never really understood the hype either. But, eh, we all have own taste and our own likes/dislikes.
"Some people are into that...who am I to say?"
This is the greatest band in the world -- Ben Harper
No, because silence doesn't make the hair stand up on the back of my neck the way Arc does.
If you don't feel it, that's fine ... but I kind of feel sorry for you that you've never had that feeling.
i did see ARC live (mansfield 03) and it did nothing for me other than making me wish i used that time to hit the head rather than missing i believe in miracles.
and as far as hair standing up, nothing like thumbing my way, breath, present tense or tremor christ to turn those curlies to spikes
When Ed sings certain parts in songs its instant warm intense feeling...instant comfort
When I was in labor with my daughter and in so much pain the nurses let me listen to a pearl jam mix (seriously) and Arc was the only thing that could relax me..
his voice is just so intense and so soothing
"Well I guess there's nothing wrong with what you say, but dont sell me there can't be better ways"
~Pearl Jam
Well, here's my take: Not that it's worth your time, but if you check my history of posts, I'm a pretty positive guy. Don't really like when people bash something seemingly because they enjoy the shitstorm that will follow. That being said, I didn't think the original posts were out of line. I thought that the topic created some interesting debate, and just wanted to chime in.
I happen to think that most people are too thin skinned when it comes to artists they enjoy. I come to this board, as well as a few others, to see what other people think of the things I enjoy, and to pick up a little extra info. When I see a post that I feel is BS, I usually just move along to the next one and forget it. There a positives AND negatives when it comes to any band, and to think Pearl Jam is an exception to this is nonsensense.
Yes, if you went to Alan Jackson's site and your first post was a negative one, you most likely would get slammed by a bunch of over-sensitive wussies. I'm sure of it. But it wouldn't make your point any less valid.
I don't care for the "Post a Pic of Ed Where His Eyes Look Dreamy" threads, but if others want to share there opinions on something that has NOTHING to do with the music, I'm certainly not going to get offended by it either.
Peace.
I am definitely thin skinned when it comes to someone saying that any pearl jam song is trash, or garbage in this forum. I just feel that this is the place that we can discuss what we like and don't like but do we really need to go as far as to say that it is garbage and doesn't belong on the album?
I am starting to realize that I may have more of a problem with people who think that there opinion of what should be on an album actually matters. Pearl Jam are artists, they put it out, we listen to it, we like it or don't like it. But for some individuals they have to go on and on about girl should have been on and arc taken off. Who the fuck do you think you are, and if you are so fucking talented, write your own fucking album!
If you met me on the street and said the exact same thing, it wouldn't even phase me, but here-I just have a hard time letting someone say that and not letting them know that I think they are an idiot.
I do appreciate the debate back and forth, I learn as well. pjgirl2010 and I went at it all afternoon, but we agree to disagree. Pulaski on the other hand, just doesn't get it, at all-in my opinion.
I personally like conversation that makes you think, such as today. I don't always have to be right, I see other points of view, just not his and I can't help it but to let him know.
If you met me on the street and said the exact same thing, it wouldn't even phase me, but here-I just have a hard time letting someone say that and not letting them know that I think they are an idiot.
I do appreciate the debate back and forth, I learn as well. pjgirl2010 and I went at it all afternoon, but we agree to disagree. Pulaski on the other hand, just doesn't get it, at all-in my opinion.
I personally like conversation that makes you think, such as today. I don't always have to be right, I see other points of view, just not his and I can't help it but to let him know.
I agree (yay!) with what you're saying about debating and making you think about things in a different way...that's a great thing, even if it's hard to get what you're trying to say in writing...sometimes it doesn't come across the same (like sarcasm or NOT sounding sarcastic!!)
i enjoyed going back and forth--got my brain working! thanks :-)
I agree (yay!) with what you're saying about debating and making you think about things in a different way...that's a great thing, even if it's hard to get what you're trying to say in writing...sometimes it doesn't come across the same (like sarcasm or NOT sounding sarcastic!!)
i enjoyed going back and forth--got my brain working! thanks :-)
I got your name wrong! Won't happen again.
I also suck because I assumed Pulaski is a guy, sorry.
surreal. he sounded out of this world. unforgettable moment.
i know right... did you get goosebumps as well?
not many people between us looked like fans... very few anyways... i dont think they realised how lucky they were....
I know their are not alot of musicians on this board, but as one, I will tell you Arc is innovative and not easy to play. I don't love it, but I deeply respect it....
I never thought I'd get a second chance to see this song again after Montreal '03, where I bawled like a baby when I heard it then. Well, imagine my awe and gratitude to hear this song again two nights ago. It is so raw and beautiful, and again I cried. The difference between these two performances was that in '03 Ed still seemed (understandably) tortured when singing it, where '08 it definitley was sung more "playfully", lab coat experiment and all. But equally stunning. I love this song, and catch my breath every time I hear it.
i know right... did you get goosebumps as well?
not many people between us looked like fans... very few anyways... i dont think they realised how lucky they were....
I totally got goosebumps!!! I had never heard it before and didn't even realize why he wrote it until I asked yahamita about it later. Even so, I knew it was beautiful and special and want to hear it again!!!
I never thought I'd get a second chance to see this song again after Montreal '03, where I bawled like a baby when I heard it then. Well, imagine my awe and gratitude to hear this song again two nights ago. It is so raw and beautiful, and again I cried. The difference between these two performances was that in '03 Ed still seemed (understandably) tortured when singing it, where '08 it definitley was sung more "playfully", lab coat experiment and all. But equally stunning. I love this song, and catch my breath every time I hear it.
that's awesome!
i love arc, but honestly, as far as i'm concerned, the wolf is better.
2006: Hartford
2008: MSG 1, Hartford, Mansfield 2, Ed Solo NYC 1
2009: London (O2), Philly 1, 2, 3, & 4
2010: Hartford, Boston, MSG 1 & 2
2011: Ed Solo Hartford
2012: Philly (MIA Fest)
2013: Worcester 2, Brooklyn 1 & 2, Hartford
im not saying the only way to express feelings/emotions is through words...rather just that i have a difficult time understanding the TRUE meaning of a song without any words in it.
who knew arc was about Copenhagen?...when you heard it for the first time did you automatically say "oh, thats about Copehagen"? i didn't.
personally speaking i have a hard time knowing what a song is about without any words. sure it's still a song, but not necessarily everyone thinks the same way as me.
keep in mind some classical songs/instrumentals are actually about actual specific things...not just merely aboutconveying general emotions/feelings.
Right, but what about hearing a song in a foreign language? Although it has lyrics you don’t immediately (or will never) understand what it’s about. You don’t know the meaning, but does that mean you can’t enjoy or even love it?
I guess most of you are native-english-speakers, and most songs on the radio etc. are in English, so you can understand the lyrics at first or second listen. But people whose mother tongue isn’t English, sometimes never know what all the songs on the radio are about. The still have favourite songs etc.
I’m not saying that lyrics aren’t important. A big factor about my love for pj are the lyrics, but it’s not the lyrics you respond to first. If it where, people would never enjoy songs they don’t understand.
ive read all the comments, and what i take out of it is, that if Eddie made a 1 min moment of silence track on Riot Act instead of ARC, would you all feel just as moved and attached to that kind of song because it had "meaning"? even though the track is nothing but dead air (no pun intended).
Like many have said before, “arc” gives me goosebumps. I really like it. It touches me emotionally, and this has not so much to do with it’s originally meaning. Songs should touch you emotionally; they should make you dance, sing or cry. If they do, they’re good.
Even if you don’t know the initial meaning of a chant like “wolf” or “arc”, you can feel the emotion. Words wouldn’t describe the feelings (pain etc.) better.
Alright, that’s my two cents. I just love ed’s chants and I wouldn’t mind if he’d make a whole record with songs (or whatever you will call them ;-) ) like this.
I guess I was feeling a little sensitive to the first person calling Arc a piece of garbage as it just seemed designed to create a big furor (which it clearly did), despite the fact that they probably DID know the significance of the piece. I wasn't going to get into it. But fine, call it whatever you want.
R.i.p. Rigoberto Alpizar.
R.i.p. My Dad - May 28, 2007
R.i.p. Black Tail (cat) - Sept. 20, 2008
I know, a little bit late to respond to this, but i gotta say something. ;-)
Right, but what about hearing a song in a foreign language? Although it has lyrics you don’t immediately (or will never) understand what it’s about. You don’t know the meaning, but does that mean you can’t enjoy or even love it?
I guess most of you are native-english-speakers, and most songs on the radio etc. are in English, so you can understand the lyrics at first or second listen. But people whose mother tongue isn’t English, sometimes never know what all the songs on the radio are about. The still have favourite songs etc.
I’m not saying that lyrics aren’t important. A big factor about my love for pj are the lyrics, but it’s not the lyrics you respond to first. If it where, people would never enjoy songs they don’t understand.
Like many have said before, “arc” gives me goosebumps. I really like it. It touches me emotionally, and this has not so much to do with it’s originally meaning. Songs should touch you emotionally; they should make you dance, sing or cry. If they do, they’re good.
Even if you don’t know the initial meaning of a chant like “wolf” or “arc”, you can feel the emotion. Words wouldn’t describe the feelings (pain etc.) better.
Alright, that’s my two cents. I just love ed’s chants and I wouldn’t mind if he’d make a whole record with songs (or whatever you will call them ;-) ) like this.
right, foreign language songs are something i forgot about and i am a fan of them(spanish cumbias). i guess what im saying is that if i dont know/understand the lyrics the song doesn't usually hit on the same level as it could when i know/understand the words. bottomline is that it's a personal thing and some people have to have lyrics to be able to fully connect to the song.
right, foreign language songs are something i forgot about and i am a fan of them(spanish cumbias). i guess what im saying is that if i dont know/understand the lyrics the song doesn't usually hit on the same level as it could when i know/understand the words. bottomline is that it's a personal thing and some people have to have lyrics to be able to fully connect to the song.
see, for me, like for so many people around the world, most of the songs i/we hear - whether it's cds or radio - are in a foreign language. i always wondered what it's like to understand all the sh** that gets airtime everywhere. i'm often very thankful that i don't understand everything on the radio. bad songs would be even worse. ;-)
but of course you're right: meaningful and awesome lyrics raise a song to another level. they turn the song to a poem. but they are not necessary to feel the emotion.
see, for me, like for so many people around the world, most of the songs i/we hear - whether it's cds or radio - are in a foreign language. i always wondered what it's like to understand all the sh** that gets airtime everywhere. i'm often very thankful that i don't understand everything on the radio. bad songs would be even worse. ;-)
but of course you're right: meaningful and awesome lyrics raise a song to another level. they turn the song to a poem. but they are not necessary to feel the emotion.
imagine...loving a song...not knowing what the words mean...and then, finding out one day, what the words mean...only to be disappointed that it wasn't as great as you originally thought...
I now understand the deal with Arc. After hearing it live 2 times now and especially after how intense it was at Berkeley last night, I need to hear it some more! UNREAL!!!!
why is everyone so crazy about this song? its garbage, trash, its not even a song. why does everyone make a big deal about it?
i dont get it
Nice respect for those 9 fans lost at Roskilde, jerk as you might say!!
My PJ shows:
London 28/10/96, Las Vegas 11/7/98, London 29/5/00, Nurnburg 11/6/00, Prague 14/6/00, Salzburg 18/6/00, Verona 20/6/00, Milan 22/6/00, Zurich 23/6/00, New York 8-9/7/03, Boston 11/7/03, Reading Festival 27/8/06, Shepards Bush 11/8/09, Berlin 15/8/09, Manchester 17/8/09, London 18/8/09, Dublin 22/6/10, Belfast 23/6/10, London (HRC) 25/6/10, Alpine Valley (PJ20) 3-4/9/11, Manchester 20-21/6/12, Leeds 8/7/14, Milton Keynes 11/7/14 To be continued....
Comments
I think that is a very valid point.
Whatever you are, be a good one --Lincoln
good thing you didn't get a vote, then, eh?
for the least they could possibly do
No, because silence doesn't make the hair stand up on the back of my neck the way Arc does.
If you don't feel it, that's fine ... but I kind of feel sorry for you that you've never had that feeling.
for the least they could possibly do
Eddie singing it now takes away, just a little, from that now.
His key to the locks on the chains he saw everywhere" GTF
04/03/08 - I was There
While I wouldn't exactly call it "garbage"...I know where you're coming from. I've never really understood the hype either. But, eh, we all have own taste and our own likes/dislikes.
"Some people are into that...who am I to say?"
i did see ARC live (mansfield 03) and it did nothing for me other than making me wish i used that time to hit the head rather than missing i believe in miracles.
and as far as hair standing up, nothing like thumbing my way, breath, present tense or tremor christ to turn those curlies to spikes
When I was in labor with my daughter and in so much pain the nurses let me listen to a pearl jam mix (seriously) and Arc was the only thing that could relax me..
his voice is just so intense and so soothing
~Pearl Jam
I am definitely thin skinned when it comes to someone saying that any pearl jam song is trash, or garbage in this forum. I just feel that this is the place that we can discuss what we like and don't like but do we really need to go as far as to say that it is garbage and doesn't belong on the album?
I am starting to realize that I may have more of a problem with people who think that there opinion of what should be on an album actually matters. Pearl Jam are artists, they put it out, we listen to it, we like it or don't like it. But for some individuals they have to go on and on about girl should have been on and arc taken off. Who the fuck do you think you are, and if you are so fucking talented, write your own fucking album!
If you met me on the street and said the exact same thing, it wouldn't even phase me, but here-I just have a hard time letting someone say that and not letting them know that I think they are an idiot.
I do appreciate the debate back and forth, I learn as well. pjgirl2010 and I went at it all afternoon, but we agree to disagree. Pulaski on the other hand, just doesn't get it, at all-in my opinion.
I personally like conversation that makes you think, such as today. I don't always have to be right, I see other points of view, just not his and I can't help it but to let him know.
I agree (yay!) with what you're saying about debating and making you think about things in a different way...that's a great thing, even if it's hard to get what you're trying to say in writing...sometimes it doesn't come across the same (like sarcasm or NOT sounding sarcastic!!)
i enjoyed going back and forth--got my brain working! thanks :-)
Whatever you are, be a good one --Lincoln
I got your name wrong! Won't happen again.
I also suck because I assumed Pulaski is a guy, sorry.
yeah...I can't believe you called me pjgirl2010 and not pearljgirl2010...the nerve of you
(see, this is one of those times when you can't hear the sarcasm)
Whatever you are, be a good one --Lincoln
imho: WHAAAAAAT?
arc was beautiful last night.
completely, utterly, unquestionably beautiful.
everyone has their opinion as always... but i do think calling it trash is a little harsh, given the circumstances of the song...
surreal. he sounded out of this world. unforgettable moment.
not many people between us looked like fans... very few anyways... i dont think they realised how lucky they were....
Have you seen/heard it live? Its been a while since the hair on my neck has stood up like it did at Vancouver II...
"Sometimes life should be consumed in measured doses"
6-01-06
6/25/08
Free Speedy
and Metsy!
I totally got goosebumps!!! I had never heard it before and didn't even realize why he wrote it until I asked yahamita about it later. Even so, I knew it was beautiful and special and want to hear it again!!!
that's awesome!
i love arc, but honestly, as far as i'm concerned, the wolf is better.
2008: MSG 1, Hartford, Mansfield 2, Ed Solo NYC 1
2009: London (O2), Philly 1, 2, 3, & 4
2010: Hartford, Boston, MSG 1 & 2
2011: Ed Solo Hartford
2012: Philly (MIA Fest)
2013: Worcester 2, Brooklyn 1 & 2, Hartford
Right, but what about hearing a song in a foreign language? Although it has lyrics you don’t immediately (or will never) understand what it’s about. You don’t know the meaning, but does that mean you can’t enjoy or even love it?
I guess most of you are native-english-speakers, and most songs on the radio etc. are in English, so you can understand the lyrics at first or second listen. But people whose mother tongue isn’t English, sometimes never know what all the songs on the radio are about. The still have favourite songs etc.
I’m not saying that lyrics aren’t important. A big factor about my love for pj are the lyrics, but it’s not the lyrics you respond to first. If it where, people would never enjoy songs they don’t understand.
Like many have said before, “arc” gives me goosebumps. I really like it. It touches me emotionally, and this has not so much to do with it’s originally meaning. Songs should touch you emotionally; they should make you dance, sing or cry. If they do, they’re good.
Even if you don’t know the initial meaning of a chant like “wolf” or “arc”, you can feel the emotion. Words wouldn’t describe the feelings (pain etc.) better.
Alright, that’s my two cents. I just love ed’s chants and I wouldn’t mind if he’d make a whole record with songs (or whatever you will call them ;-) ) like this.
Munich, Germany 2007
I guess I was feeling a little sensitive to the first person calling Arc a piece of garbage as it just seemed designed to create a big furor (which it clearly did), despite the fact that they probably DID know the significance of the piece. I wasn't going to get into it. But fine, call it whatever you want.
R.i.p. My Dad - May 28, 2007
R.i.p. Black Tail (cat) - Sept. 20, 2008
right, foreign language songs are something i forgot about and i am a fan of them(spanish cumbias). i guess what im saying is that if i dont know/understand the lyrics the song doesn't usually hit on the same level as it could when i know/understand the words. bottomline is that it's a personal thing and some people have to have lyrics to be able to fully connect to the song.
see, for me, like for so many people around the world, most of the songs i/we hear - whether it's cds or radio - are in a foreign language. i always wondered what it's like to understand all the sh** that gets airtime everywhere. i'm often very thankful that i don't understand everything on the radio. bad songs would be even worse. ;-)
but of course you're right: meaningful and awesome lyrics raise a song to another level. they turn the song to a poem. but they are not necessary to feel the emotion.
Munich, Germany 2007
imagine...loving a song...not knowing what the words mean...and then, finding out one day, what the words mean...only to be disappointed that it wasn't as great as you originally thought...
i think i'd rather know the words up front
Nice respect for those 9 fans lost at Roskilde, jerk as you might say!!
London 28/10/96, Las Vegas 11/7/98, London 29/5/00, Nurnburg 11/6/00, Prague 14/6/00, Salzburg 18/6/00, Verona 20/6/00, Milan 22/6/00, Zurich 23/6/00, New York 8-9/7/03, Boston 11/7/03, Reading Festival 27/8/06, Shepards Bush 11/8/09, Berlin 15/8/09, Manchester 17/8/09, London 18/8/09, Dublin 22/6/10, Belfast 23/6/10, London (HRC) 25/6/10, Alpine Valley (PJ20) 3-4/9/11, Manchester 20-21/6/12, Leeds 8/7/14, Milton Keynes 11/7/14 To be continued....
I think I counted 8 tracks being looped. Anybody else have any thoughts on the number of tracks he lays down.