psst...10/19/2023

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Comments

  • bicyclejoe
    bicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,203
    edited October 2023
    mace1229 said:
    bicyclejoe said:
    Abe Froman said:
    mace1229 said:
    Easy pass. With the original and box set, I have no desire for additional copies. Even if they are colored.
    Yeah, I finally decided when they put out the Yield red splattered that I don’t need every damn colored vinyl they release. Especially at these prices now. Why would I need a 5th copy of VS? (Have OG Vinyl, Box set, cd and og cassette)
    That said, these aren’t just new colors — they are different pressings, offering better fidelity with the way the lacquers are cut at 45rpm over two discs. If it were just new colors, I wouldn’t have ordered them. 
    You can cut and press it any way you want, but if the source isn’t a higher quality analog, I don’t see it making a difference.
    And even if it is, with my standard equipment and sub-standard ears, I doubt I could tell.
    Yes and no, but mostly no.

    Physics: More surface (4s/2LP+wider grooves)+Vibration (transducer(Stylus)/more information+more accurate electronic signal)+45rpm (Greater speed X less surface noise)=higher fidelity (less semblance/distortion)

    Also, you can have an incredible master, but if the pressing stinks, the record stinks. So it's not just about the master.


    P.S. -- Analog isn't always better. Indeed, every Pearl Jam album either involved a digital step or was recorded digitally. Transferring analog masters to digital is the only way to preserve not only the original master tapes for mass pressings but to maintain the quality of the recording. 

    P.S. 2 -- Yes, without a decent system, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. 
    Post edited by bicyclejoe on
    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 10,304
    edited October 2023
    Levi is confirmed to be cutting this new 2LP version (someone at the Hoffman forums reached out to him on IG)


     I’m Very optimistic for it. 
  • pjpitt89
    pjpitt89 Posts: 1,878
    Tim Simmons said:
    Levi is confirmed to be cutting this new 2LP version (someone at the Hoffman forums reached out to him on IG)


     I’m Very optimistic for it. 
    I posted in another thread that yes, Levi also posted on his facebook that he cut it. He replied to one of the comments which was cool and gave a little bit about his thoughts on 45RPM. Not sure if OK to copy and paste here, but it's on FB
    9/1/00, 4/28/03, 7/5/03, 7/6/03, 7/12/03, 10/1/04, 9/28/05, 5/27/06, 5/28/06, 6/1/06, 6/27/08, 6/30/08, 8/7/08 (EV), 6/12/09 (EV), 10/27/09, 10/28/09,10/30/09, 10/31/09, 5/21/10, 6/15/11 (EV), 9/2/12, 7/19/13, 10/21/13, 10/22/13, 10/27/13, 4/28/16, 4/29/16, 8/7/16, 11/4/16 (TOTD), 8/18/18, 8/20/18, 9/24/21 (EV&Earthlings), 9/26/21, 9/11/2022, 9/14/2022, 9/7/2024, 9/9/2024, 9/12/2024, 5/16/2025, 5/18/2025
  • Tim Simmons
    Tim Simmons Posts: 10,304
    I. Sure it’s fine to post here.not everyone is on FB. 
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 10,052
    bicyclejoe said:
    mace1229 said:
    bicyclejoe said:
    Abe Froman said:
    mace1229 said:
    Easy pass. With the original and box set, I have no desire for additional copies. Even if they are colored.
    Yeah, I finally decided when they put out the Yield red splattered that I don’t need every damn colored vinyl they release. Especially at these prices now. Why would I need a 5th copy of VS? (Have OG Vinyl, Box set, cd and og cassette)
    That said, these aren’t just new colors — they are different pressings, offering better fidelity with the way the lacquers are cut at 45rpm over two discs. If it were just new colors, I wouldn’t have ordered them. 
    You can cut and press it any way you want, but if the source isn’t a higher quality analog, I don’t see it making a difference.
    And even if it is, with my standard equipment and sub-standard ears, I doubt I could tell.
    Yes and no, but mostly no.

    Physics: More surface (4s/2LP+wider grooves)+Vibration (transducer(Stylus)/more information+more accurate electronic signal)+45rpm (Greater speed X less surface noise)=higher fidelity (less semblance/distortion)

    Also, you can have an incredible master, but if the pressing stinks, the record stinks. So it's not just about the master.


    P.S. -- Analog isn't always better. Indeed, every Pearl Jam album either involved a digital step or was recorded digitally. Transferring analog masters to digital is the only way to preserve not only the original master tapes for mass pressings but to maintain the quality of the recording. 

    P.S. 2 -- Yes, without a decent system, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. 
    Re-PS1: What I meant is aren't many of the new releases on vinyl (not necessarily PJ, but just what you find in the store) rumored and/or confirmed to be just CD recordings pressed to vinyl.
    Unless specific information is given that makes me believe the sources is as good or better than the original, I assume its worse.
  • bicyclejoe
    bicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,203
    mace1229 said:
    bicyclejoe said:
    mace1229 said:
    bicyclejoe said:
    Abe Froman said:
    mace1229 said:
    Easy pass. With the original and box set, I have no desire for additional copies. Even if they are colored.
    Yeah, I finally decided when they put out the Yield red splattered that I don’t need every damn colored vinyl they release. Especially at these prices now. Why would I need a 5th copy of VS? (Have OG Vinyl, Box set, cd and og cassette)
    That said, these aren’t just new colors — they are different pressings, offering better fidelity with the way the lacquers are cut at 45rpm over two discs. If it were just new colors, I wouldn’t have ordered them. 
    You can cut and press it any way you want, but if the source isn’t a higher quality analog, I don’t see it making a difference.
    And even if it is, with my standard equipment and sub-standard ears, I doubt I could tell.
    Yes and no, but mostly no.

    Physics: More surface (4s/2LP+wider grooves)+Vibration (transducer(Stylus)/more information+more accurate electronic signal)+45rpm (Greater speed X less surface noise)=higher fidelity (less semblance/distortion)

    Also, you can have an incredible master, but if the pressing stinks, the record stinks. So it's not just about the master.


    P.S. -- Analog isn't always better. Indeed, every Pearl Jam album either involved a digital step or was recorded digitally. Transferring analog masters to digital is the only way to preserve not only the original master tapes for mass pressings but to maintain the quality of the recording. 

    P.S. 2 -- Yes, without a decent system, you probably won't be able to tell the difference. 
    Re-PS1: What I meant is aren't many of the new releases on vinyl (not necessarily PJ, but just what you find in the store) rumored and/or confirmed to be just CD recordings pressed to vinyl.
    Unless specific information is given that makes me believe the sources is as good or better than the original, I assume its worse.
    The mastering for vinyl is different than CD. 
    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR
  • Loujoe
    Loujoe Posts: 12,102
    Tim Simmons said:
    Levi is confirmed to be cutting this new 2LP version (someone at the Hoffman forums reached out to him on IG)


     I’m Very optimistic for it. 
    I thought he made jeans.
  • demetrios
    demetrios Posts: 98,322
    https://instagram.com/p/Cz7CXfbPu6_/embed/

  • bicyclejoe
    bicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,203
    edited November 2023
    Amazing.

    I just gave the Dreamcicle pressing a spin. It sounded phenomenal on my system, right up there with the OG pressing, if not a little more dynamic in spots.

    (Played on a Thorens VN-150 with a Rega RB880 tonearm and Nagaoka MP300 cartridge, through a McIntoch MA252 integrated amp (tube pre) and Klipsch Heresey III speakers)

    Post edited by bicyclejoe on
    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR
  • GlowGirl
    GlowGirl New York, NY Posts: 12,292
    My Dreamsicle copy was delivered to NYC today. I am out of town but my neighbor who has a key to my apartment brought it in for me. 
  • bicyclejoe
    bicyclejoe USA Posts: 1,203
    mace1229 said:
    bicyclejoe said:
    Abe Froman said:
    mace1229 said:
    Easy pass. With the original and box set, I have no desire for additional copies. Even if they are colored.
    Yeah, I finally decided when they put out the Yield red splattered that I don’t need every damn colored vinyl they release. Especially at these prices now. Why would I need a 5th copy of VS? (Have OG Vinyl, Box set, cd and og cassette)
    That said, these aren’t just new colors — they are different pressings, offering better fidelity with the way the lacquers are cut at 45rpm over two discs. If it were just new colors, I wouldn’t have ordered them. 
    You can cut and press it any way you want, but if the source isn’t a higher quality analog, I don’t see it making a difference.
    And even if it is, with my standard equipment and sub-standard ears, I doubt I could tell.
    Why 45rpm pressings excel, by one of the great vinyl master masters:

    Why 45 rpm? by Kevin Gray, AcousTech Mastering

    "After 60 years the good ol’ analog LP is still one of the highest resolution sources of music distribution available. It has a solid, palpable, satisfying sound that no digital format has yet equaled, let alone surpassed. The most unfortunate thing about the LP is that it was really starting to flourish back in the mid 80s, just as the record companies tried to kill it.

    Advances in cutterheads (the device that etches the groove in the master lacquer disk) and cutting electronics reached a pinnacle in the early 80s. Digital computers arrived on the scene in their best role: Out of the audio chain, but doing machine-control to adjust the groove spacing on the record for maximum playing time and recorded volume. 180 gram virgin vinyl pressings were the next development, and last but not least, around the late 70s, 45 rpm 12” LPs started to appear.

    Why 45, you ask? Because it sounds better! In record mastering, the higher the recorded level and frequency, the greater the groove curvature. Curvature isn’t usually a problem, per se, on the outside of a 12” 33 1/3 record, but as the groove moves toward the center, its relative speed slows down and curvature increases. Yes, it is still turning at 33 1/3 revolutions per minute, but consider: one revolution takes 1.8 seconds. That 1.8 seconds at a 12” diameter is covering a lot more territory than at the minimum 4.75” diameter. The result is actually a loss in high frequencies, and increase in distortion as the groove moves to the center. The problems start when the curvature of the groove equals or exceeds the diameter of the playback stylus. What can be done about it? Many things have been tried, but there is no “magic bullet”. Keep the recorded volume to a reasonable level (read: On scale on the meters) is the first thing. Play the record back with an elliptical or line-contact stylus that has a smaller tip radius. And, if possible, make the record short enough to keep the music away from the very end of the disk. This isn’t always possible, of course.

    BUT, if we spin the disk at 45rpm we now have a 35% increase in groove velocity at any point on the disk. This is a huge advantage! Yes, the groove still slows down as it moves inward, but the effects are greatly reduced. The only problem is that the amount of recorded time is now also reduced by 35%. What do you do about that? (Hint: split up the LP into 4 sides on 2 records.) Now you’re cookin’ doc! Yep, twice the mastering cost, plating cost, pressing cost, label and jacket costs. It’s enough to make the bean-counters break down and cry. But the sound! Oooooh, yeah! This isn’t sales hype, it’s physics. Listen for yourself. You tell me if it’s worth it. A lot of music lovers think so…and they are right!"

    My Pearl Jam Road: 10/22/90 Seattle | 12/22/90 Seattle, Moore Theater | 9/29/92 Seattle, Magnusson Park, Drop in the Park | 9/5/93 The Gorge, with Neil Young and Blind Melon | 7/20/06 Portland, Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall with Sleater-Kinney | 7/22/06 The Gorge, 10/21/06 Mountain View, Shoreline Ampitheatre, Bridge School Benefit | 9/21/09 Seattle | 9/22/09 Seattle | 9/26/09 Portland, OR | 7/14/2011 Eddie Vedder, Portland, OR | 11/29/13 Portland, OR

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