---President Elect Musk and Convicted Felon Donald J Trump---

Halifax2TheMax said:

cutz said:

Zod said:

Ok, so something I don't get.  Vince McMahon from the WWE did similar things.  He cheated on his wife, payed hush money to the women he had affairs with, and the hush money came from a publicly traded company (WWE).   All Vince had to do was lay low for a while and slowly come back.   I'm struggling to understand how was Trump did differs from that situation?

Maybe because he wouldn't have been Nominated, let alone elected, if the Public knew?

I think Gary Hart had to drop out of the Race because he had an affair?

He was photographed with a young woman on his lap on a boat named “Monkey Business.” Mere child’s play in this age of cancel culture.

mrussel1 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

cutz said:

Zod said:

Ok, so something I don't get.  Vince McMahon from the WWE did similar things.  He cheated on his wife, payed hush money to the women he had affairs with, and the hush money came from a publicly traded company (WWE).   All Vince had to do was lay low for a while and slowly come back.   I'm struggling to understand how was Trump did differs from that situation?

Maybe because he wouldn't have been Nominated, let alone elected, if the Public knew?

I think Gary Hart had to drop out of the Race because he had an affair?

He was photographed with a young woman on his lap on a boat named “Monkey Business.” Mere child’s play in this age of cancel culture.

Honestly, that was so awesome I can't even believe it.  He definitely could have been president too.  Same with John Edwards.  

On Sunday, May 3, The Miami Herald published a major story with the headline, "Miami Woman Is Linked to Hart". A few weeks later, a picture appeared in the National Enquirer, and then in hundreds of newspapers worldwide, showing Donna Rice sitting in Hart's lap with Hart in a Monkey Business T-shirt.[7][2]

In 2018, Democratic media consultant Raymond Strother made public a conversation he had with Republican operative Lee Atwater in the final weeks of Atwater's life in which he told Strother that the photograph of Hart and Rice had been arranged by Atwater to discredit Hart.[8]

The yacht made an appearance early in the film Smokey and the Bandit Part 3. It returned to popular culture in the film The Front Runner, a 2018 American biographical drama directed by Jason Reitman and starring Hugh Jackman as Gary Hart.[9]

mrussel1 said:

Of course I don't know if he cheated on his wife or not, but it was pretty stupid to put her on his lap, especially in the 80s.  Maybe it was a setup by Atwater, but a politician (or any married man) needs to be smarter. 

Halifax2TheMax said:

mrussel1 said:

Of course I don't know if he cheated on his wife or not, but it was pretty stupid to put her on his lap, especially in the 80s.  Maybe it was a setup by Atwater, but a politician (or any married man) needs to be smarter. 

So, knowing that this was done in the late 80's by a US political party in opposition to a front running candidate of the opposing party and that kompromat is a standard technique from the Soviet days, what do you suppose POOTWH has on the likes of Lindsey Flimsey Flip Flop Faloozy Graham and all of the other "establishment" repubs who have fallen in line, and to this day, refuse to condemn and repudiate him? Keeping in mind that several CPAC conferences and repub get togethers and fact-finding tours were held in either Russia, Russia, Russia or former Soviet states still aligned with putin on the ritz. If it can happen in Bimini, it can happen anywhere.

There's shit hanging over all of their heads, from POOTWH on down. Hence why Obama drove them nuts. Squeaky clean, nothing but a birth certificate, a reverend and a picture of him smoking dope in college to smear him with.

mrussel1 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

mrussel1 said:

Of course I don't know if he cheated on his wife or not, but it was pretty stupid to put her on his lap, especially in the 80s.  Maybe it was a setup by Atwater, but a politician (or any married man) needs to be smarter. 

So, knowing that this was done in the late 80's by a US political party in opposition to a front running candidate of the opposing party and that kompromat is a standard technique from the Soviet days, what do you suppose POOTWH has on the likes of Lindsey Flimsey Flip Flop Faloozy Graham and all of the other "establishment" repubs who have fallen in line, and to this day, refuse to condemn and repudiate him? Keeping in mind that several CPAC conferences and repub get togethers and fact-finding tours were held in either Russia, Russia, Russia or former Soviet states still aligned with putin on the ritz. If it can happen in Bimini, it can happen anywhere.

There's shit hanging over all of their heads, from POOTWH on down. Hence why Obama drove them nuts. Squeaky clean, nothing but a birth certificate, a reverend and a picture of him smoking dope in college to smear him with.

Honestly, I have no idea what you are asking me here.  

Merkin Baller said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mace1229 said:

Parksy said:

mace1229 said:

Lerxst1992 said:

mace1229 said:

mrussel1 said:

Go Beavers said:

tbergs said:

I just got back from a road trip through the deep south (Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee) and I think i saw about 2 of those dumb Trump flags and one large tipped wagon along the highway that said dump Trump so I don't think he has the support he, or even some on the left, believe. I didn't see it like I did locally here in MN a few years ago. I saw way more confederate flags.

He’s still republicans first choice and by the end of the week the indictment will give him another 3-5 point bump. 

So it seems like there is more than just Stormy here.  The Karen McDougal case is probably a part of it, considering David Pecker from the Enquirer testified to the Grand Jury as well.  

Everyone keeps saying that because campaign finance is a federal law, that's not in play.  But that doesn't mean NY doesn't have election laws.  Those are common in all states.  Anyone know specific about NY?

What I hear more than the federal issue, is what is the larger crime? I have to admit, watching some of the news highlights last night seemed odd.
I heard Bragg say more than once this is a felony because it was to cover up a larger crime, but declined to say what the larger crime was. If there was a larger crime, why is that not included? If there isn't, what does that mean for these charges?
"“Under New York state law, it is a felony to falsify business records with intent to defraud and intent to conceal another crime. That is exactly what this case is about: 34 false statements, made to cover up other crimes,” Bragg told reporters in a news conference. "

So the falsifying records in itself is not a felony without a larger crime to cover up? Why not indict for that too? Or is the intent to defraud the swaying voters?  I didn't think that was it, the impression I got was this was to cover up a bigger crime they they haven't listed. So what is it, why not list and charge for that too?

The bigger crime, the one that Michael Cohen plead to and was sentenced to three years in prison, was an illegal campaign contribution. So there is already a conviction related to the bigger crime. It’s also very similar to the case against democrat John Edwards. In that case the jury was deadlocked because he made the same argument as trump, that he did it to conceal from his wife. In edwards case, iirc his wife was very sick so there was compelling evidence that the campaign contribution was not to defraud the voters.

In trumps case, he has three things working against him, 1. timing before the contribution - it was immediately after trumps grabbing p*ssy comment, and 2. two weeks before the election. Trump was extremely motivated to keep this quiet only AFTER the grabbing p*ssy comment. He did “ this” with stormy ten years prior, and never once tried to bribe stormy. So that locks it very tightly to the attempt to defraud voters argument. Also, the third piece of evidence, I believe they have trump saying “who cares if anyone finds out after the election.” Not sure if that’s on recording or witness testimony.

I thought that illegal campaign contribution was part of this list of indictments? Wasn't it only illegal because they didn't record it properly? Therefore not the "bigger crime"? 
The campaign money, or lack of reporting it rather, can't be both the crime and the coverup which brings it to a felony. 

If I understood what the DA said in his press conference, the 34 charges all stemmed from fraudulent financial statements. I don't think the election crimes were listed.. but he did point out that it's what brings it to felony.  Basically:

34 small crimes: misleading statements and claims of fact.
1 big crime:  committed those 34 crimes to mislead the public during an election which apparently (and properly) is a federal crime.

What will be rather telling... and also lends 'some' credibility to this being a witch hunt... is how often does stuff like this happen amongst politicians that isn't followed up by the courts?   Example:  George Santos.  How the heck is this guy still in government and not behind bars?  

Let me see if I follow correctly.
You say the 34 indictments are the fraudulent financial statement.

But aren't the 34 fraudulent financial statements only a crime because they didn't report it correctly with campaign laws? That's what he is being charged with, not reporting election money finances correctly. There's nothing illegal about paying off a stripper to not talk. But since it was an election, it had to be reported a certain way. It was not. That is the fraud.
If the fraud is used to cover up a larger crime, it becomes a felony. The fraud can't be both what he is being charged with and the bigger crime that makes it into a felony. I wouldn't think so anyway. The bigger crime cover up would have to be separate from the false reporting of the money. 
So that still leaves me asking what's the bigger crime, and if there is one, why wasn't that included in the charges?

I believe the falsified financial records (and speaking publicly of them)  is a crime regardless. The “step up” with the bigger crime turns it into 34 felonies. But “regular” people definitely go jail for committing 34 misdemeanors. So the trump  argument now is essentially that trump is only a “minor” criminal. They are not denying that he is a potential criminal

this is the best I could find to summarize “ The offense is typically charged as a misdemeanor, punishable by up to one year in prison. But it rises to the level of a felony — with a penalty of up to four years in prison — when it is carried out with the intent to commit or hide another crime.”

what’s interesting is that it appears trump does not need to be found guilty of the other crime (how would he know that at the time without due process?) - it’s his intent to conceal the other activity that he believes could be a crime.

Halifax2TheMax said:

Ayup, POOTWH ain’t got a thing on ‘ok Lindsey Flimsey Flip Flop Faloozy Graham. Not. A. Thing.

Shortly after former president Donald Trump was charged on 34 felony counts of falsifying recordson Tuesday, Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.) apologized to Fox News host Sean Hannity for being so emotional following the historic arraignment.

Graham, one of Trump’s closest allies in Congress, has gone on TV in recent days to push for Trump supporters to give as much money as possible to the former president’s 2024 campaign, arguing that Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg and prosecutors were “trying to bleed him dry.” While Trump, who has pleaded not guilty to the charges, insisted during a speech at his Mar-a-Largo estate that he has “a lot of cash,” Graham returned to Fox on Tuesday to again plead for people to donate whatever money they could to the former president.

“I’m sorry, I’m so upset, but please help President Trump,” Graham said to Hannity, pushing for Trump supporters to give “five or 10 bucks” or “just pray” if they couldn’t donate. He then urged conservatives to vote — but also to give money if they can. “Make sure you vote as early as you can in your state. Don’t risk anything anymore. Vote as soon as you can, pray for this country, pray for this president. And if you got any money to give, give it. LindseyGraham.com — it doesn’t go to me. It goes to helping this president and taking back the Senate.”