Police abuse
Comments
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I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield0 -
try using that defense in court.tbergs said:
Ever been in a situation like that? Ever been under heavy stress and have that adrenaline dump? People act all high and mighty like they'd never make a mistake. Good for all you better people arm chairing because you're perfect. People have hit the gas many times instead of the brake because they get tunnel vision and cognitive thought is non existent.gimmesometruth27 said:
when you hold a taser out in front of you and a gun out in front of you, when you aim down the sight, they both look different, right? the handles feel different in your hands, right? i mean, come on. that explanation is laughable.HughFreakingDillon said:
lol, yeah, that explanation isn't believable in the least (to me, anyway).gimmesometruth27 said:i don't know about you all, but when i eat soup i routinely accidently grab a fork instead of a spoon.
I'm sick of people making fun of it. Yeah, sure, she was supposed to be perfect because she's a cop, right? Humans fuck up, and that's what she did.
i used to work in surgery. i used to pass powered instruments to the surgeon. the drills and saws felt the same if you grabbed them by the handle. that is why when the doc asked for the reciprocating saw we made sure to look down and make sure we did not hand him the oscillating saw by mistake. it is a high pressure situation, but we double checked what we were handing him because we did not want to risk anything happening to the patient.
i have been in pressure situations like that, and i did not fuck up. so spare me that excuse. the grip on the taser is completely different than that of the gun by design. the gun is metal, the taser is a different material. if you show me someone who cannot tell the difference between the taser and the gun by tactile feel AND vision, i will show you someone who has no fucking business being a police officer."You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."0 -
making sure your taser is not, in fact, a glock is police 101. just the absolute basics."You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."0 -
nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield
Police have guns, tasers, tanks, teargas, etc.
Police do not have adequate training, sympathy, accountability
When all you have is hammer, every problem looks like a nail
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Don’t medical mistakes happen often? Isn’t that the reason doctors and staff get malpractice insurance? I’ve read stories of doctors amputating the wrong limb and so on.gimmesometruth27 said:
try using that defense in court.tbergs said:
Ever been in a situation like that? Ever been under heavy stress and have that adrenaline dump? People act all high and mighty like they'd never make a mistake. Good for all you better people arm chairing because you're perfect. People have hit the gas many times instead of the brake because they get tunnel vision and cognitive thought is non existent.gimmesometruth27 said:
when you hold a taser out in front of you and a gun out in front of you, when you aim down the sight, they both look different, right? the handles feel different in your hands, right? i mean, come on. that explanation is laughable.HughFreakingDillon said:
lol, yeah, that explanation isn't believable in the least (to me, anyway).gimmesometruth27 said:i don't know about you all, but when i eat soup i routinely accidently grab a fork instead of a spoon.
I'm sick of people making fun of it. Yeah, sure, she was supposed to be perfect because she's a cop, right? Humans fuck up, and that's what she did.
i used to work in surgery. i used to pass powered instruments to the surgeon. the drills and saws felt the same if you grabbed them by the handle. that is why when the doc asked for the reciprocating saw we made sure to look down and make sure we did not hand him the oscillating saw by mistake. it is a high pressure situation, but we double checked what we were handing him because we did not want to risk anything happening to the patient.
i have been in pressure situations like that, and i did not fuck up. so spare me that excuse. the grip on the taser is completely different than that of the gun by design. the gun is metal, the taser is a different material. if you show me someone who cannot tell the difference between the taser and the gun by tactile feel AND vision, i will show you someone who has no fucking business being a police officer.Now imagine in your scenario going from not even knowing there is surgery to a doctor yelling for a specific tool and you have 5 seconds to respond or everyone risks injury. Probably changes the dynamic of the operating room a little.
Now I haven’t seen anyone excuse this cop or say it’s okay. I just don’t see how anyone can think this is a cover up, that it was planned or mistakes can’t happen. Given how often tasers are used and how many times this happens, it’s got to be less than a one in million mistake. I’m sure doctors in surgery make mistakes far more often than that.
This went from a routine arrest to a dangerous situation in just a couple seconds. She made a mistake in the 2 or 3 seconds she had. It was her fault and she deserves the appropriate consequences. But I don’t know why anyone would pretend it’s anything more than a mistake.0 -
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
It's not a defense in court. You're still criminally liable for the manslaughter charge, but you and others seem to be trying to sell it off as intentional murder.gimmesometruth27 said:
try using that defense in court.tbergs said:
Ever been in a situation like that? Ever been under heavy stress and have that adrenaline dump? People act all high and mighty like they'd never make a mistake. Good for all you better people arm chairing because you're perfect. People have hit the gas many times instead of the brake because they get tunnel vision and cognitive thought is non existent.gimmesometruth27 said:
when you hold a taser out in front of you and a gun out in front of you, when you aim down the sight, they both look different, right? the handles feel different in your hands, right? i mean, come on. that explanation is laughable.HughFreakingDillon said:
lol, yeah, that explanation isn't believable in the least (to me, anyway).gimmesometruth27 said:i don't know about you all, but when i eat soup i routinely accidently grab a fork instead of a spoon.
I'm sick of people making fun of it. Yeah, sure, she was supposed to be perfect because she's a cop, right? Humans fuck up, and that's what she did.
i used to work in surgery. i used to pass powered instruments to the surgeon. the drills and saws felt the same if you grabbed them by the handle. that is why when the doc asked for the reciprocating saw we made sure to look down and make sure we did not hand him the oscillating saw by mistake. it is a high pressure situation, but we double checked what we were handing him because we did not want to risk anything happening to the patient.
i have been in pressure situations like that, and i did not fuck up. so spare me that excuse. the grip on the taser is completely different than that of the gun by design. the gun is metal, the taser is a different material. if you show me someone who cannot tell the difference between the taser and the gun by tactile feel AND vision, i will show you someone who has no fucking business being a police officer.
That's good you could look down to visually verify surgical tools, completely different setting. Thankfully the patient is sedated and unable to move so they can't physically harm you while you look down to verify what you're doing. Stressful situation, but completely different.
Yes, 99.9% of the time the cop does notice or is aware, but there is a chance of failure and mistake, especially under stress and adrenaline. This is one of those times and there should be a consequence beyond loss of job. Charges should be announced today and I expect manslaughter.It's a hopeless situation...0 -
Working in a surgery room does require a higher IQgimmesometruth27 said:
try using that defense in court.tbergs said:
Ever been in a situation like that? Ever been under heavy stress and have that adrenaline dump? People act all high and mighty like they'd never make a mistake. Good for all you better people arm chairing because you're perfect. People have hit the gas many times instead of the brake because they get tunnel vision and cognitive thought is non existent.gimmesometruth27 said:
when you hold a taser out in front of you and a gun out in front of you, when you aim down the sight, they both look different, right? the handles feel different in your hands, right? i mean, come on. that explanation is laughable.HughFreakingDillon said:
lol, yeah, that explanation isn't believable in the least (to me, anyway).gimmesometruth27 said:i don't know about you all, but when i eat soup i routinely accidently grab a fork instead of a spoon.
I'm sick of people making fun of it. Yeah, sure, she was supposed to be perfect because she's a cop, right? Humans fuck up, and that's what she did.
i used to work in surgery. i used to pass powered instruments to the surgeon. the drills and saws felt the same if you grabbed them by the handle. that is why when the doc asked for the reciprocating saw we made sure to look down and make sure we did not hand him the oscillating saw by mistake. it is a high pressure situation, but we double checked what we were handing him because we did not want to risk anything happening to the patient.
i have been in pressure situations like that, and i did not fuck up. so spare me that excuse. the grip on the taser is completely different than that of the gun by design. the gun is metal, the taser is a different material. if you show me someone who cannot tell the difference between the taser and the gun by tactile feel AND vision, i will show you someone who has no fucking business being a police officer.Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden0 -
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshieldScio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden0 -
I've had that same thought....make a different division for only traffic infractions. if they suspect other criminal behaviour, call it in without the perp's knowledge.static111 said:
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield
However, I'm no cop and I'm sure there's a myriad of reasons why that wouldn't be feasible.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
HughFreakingDillon said:
excellent postvant0037 said:Is anyone interesting in discussing this, or just arguing a point to win?
Let's strip away everything contextual about this: the officer's experience, the victim's race and warrants, social media. Take it all away.
Look at the raw facts of the case:
An officer - apparently accidentally - mistook a lethal weapon for a non-lethal one and shot someone who by rights she didn't think needed to be shot. You're left with a very poorly trained or poorly performing officer and a dead 20 year old who didn't need to be killed. That should piss you off, and outrage you because this is precisely the opposite of what we want in police officers. There are certain professions where some mistakes can't be tolerated, if only because the stakes are usually very high. Airline pilots, doctors, and people who carry deadly weapons as tools of the trade. Cops do NOT have a safe or easy job. They go into shitty situations and have lots of stress and tough calls to make. But until they are drafted involuntarily, it is a position that they choose to be in. If its a voluntary choice, then they need to be expected to be held to a higher standard of precision. In short, you cannot make a mistake like the one made here. Let's all agree on that.
Let's agree that this cop shouldn't have a job anymore (she doesn't), at minimum. Let's also agree that, if you review Minnesota's applicable laws on negligent homicide, it probably warrants a criminal investigation into her conduct. I've looked at the statute, and I can make a case that what we know to be true from this video COULD meet the elements of a negligent homicide/manslaughter etc. I make no guess as to whether charges will be filed or whether she could be convicted, but suffice it to say, an investigation is coming and justified.
Now, add in the mountain of context:
Daunte Wright had a criminal record, or at least, charges against him and warrants. He had possessed a weapon before. He probably wasn't, at all times in his life, a law abiding citizen. But in America, even murderers and pedophiles cannot be executed or killed outside of a state-sanctioned execution unless the officer's use of deadly force is authorized under state law. Again, looking at Minnesota's use-of-force statute, which was just revised in 2020 and applying it to the facts we know in this case, she simply wasn't authorized to use deadly force here.
Daunte Wright was an African-American. The officer was white. Daunte Wright was attempting to flee, and there's no evidence that he was reaching for a gun. You can reasonably infer that from the video and the officer's statements.
Meanwhile, about 10 miles away, the biggest trial in Minnesota history - and perhaps the biggest trial involving an officer charged with murder in modern US history - was in its 3rd week. There, the white officer was charged with killing an African-American man who also had a criminal history, but who, like Daunte Wright, probably wasn't a threat to the officer, or at least in a way that would warrant lethal force.
So...
We can debate all day about whether Lebron James is correct about black people being hunted or not, or semantically about whether Daunte Wright was a saint or not, or who said what or whether Trump is going to prove us all wrong. Let's all take a deep breath a set our political views aside for a second and agree on what we all should be able to agree on.
The bare facts of this killing should outrage you from a public safety standpoint. Cops are humans but their margin for error has to be much, much smaller than this. Let's agree on that.
Let's all also agree that whatever our politics are, it might understandable why people are outraged by Daunte Wright's death, if only because the actors all look so familiar, and the facts of the killing are arguably just as egregious as the Floyd case or the Philando Castile case or the Eric Garner case or the Breonna Taylor case. A black victim killed by an officer who was in most cases either white or a different color than the victim. If you're white and having a hard time agreeing with that statement, consider at least, that you have not lived the black experience in America. There are reams of studies and data that prove your white experience and your relationship with the criminal justice system is not the same as a person of colors. Let's all agree that its possible that persons of color might have had different experiences in their lives with law enforcement.
Are those positions so crazy?
Apologies for the novel. But the bickering about nitpicky little points seemed very beside the issue, when this case above many others seems so ripe for agreement that what the cop did - mistakenly or not - was really bad, perhaps criminally bad.
negligent homicide
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The idea definitely makes sense. But what if they don’t have a license? Getting pulled over without a license or a suspended license could get stressful. What if the vehicle is stolen? I understand the thought behind this but I just don’t think it’s 100% feasible, especially in bigger cities.static111 said:
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield0 -
Been around long enough and read enough of your posts to know you like to explain other people’s postings when it’s not necessary. I consider all of us intelligent enough to understand each other and if not to ask questions ourselves. I’m not sure how other people feel about that but I find it offensive at times, not polite. You’re like the forum expert and I don’t necessarily mean that in a bad way but sometimes you need to realize that people get highly emotional about certain subjects and post with those emotions not following all the forum rules, just like your tagging comment. The first time I posted you misconstrued the whole thing. The second time you “corrected” me for not understanding what the poster was saying when I clearly understood them. You bashed me for apologizing privately and you were right so I did it openly on here. I love this forum mostly because it’s sharing with people who have so much in common (not just the music but social issues). Ok you say it’s not personal so I’ll accept that. I don’t care who agrees or disagrees with me because I learn more about the subject and myself. I’ve clearly refrained from commenting on your posts unless I agree with you to avoid these issues. You don’t even give people enough time to correct themselves before you do it for them. You may think you don’t do that but I’ve noticed you do that to many of us. I’ll except that’s who you are and move on.HughFreakingDillon said:
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.What’s sad about our situation is I usually always agree with your responses but I’m apprehensive about saying so.Post edited by cblock4life on0 -
Take my silence as agreement, which is more often then not. We have way more in common than not.HughFreakingDillon said:
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.
I generally only comment when I disagree.
0 -
forum expert? a couple weeks ago someone referred to me as "the guy who always posts stupid shit". perspectives are interesting.cblock4life said:
Been around long enough and read enough of your posts to know you like to explain other people’s postings when it’s not necessary. I consider all of us intelligent enough to understand each other and if not to ask questions ourselves. I’m not sure how other people feel about that but I find it offensive at times, not polite. You’re like the forum expert and I don’t necessarily mean that in a bad way but sometimes you need to realize that people get highly emotional about certain subjects and post with those emotions not following all the forum rules, just like your tagging comment. The first time I posted you misconstrued the whole thing. The second time you “corrected” me for not understanding what the poster was saying when I clearly understood them. You bashed me for apologizing privately and you were right so I did it openly on here. I love this forum mostly because it’s sharing with people who have so much in common (not just the music but social issues). Ok you say it’s not personal so I’ll accept that. I don’t care who agrees or disagrees with me because I learn more about the subject and myself. I’ve clearly refrained from commenting on your posts unless I agree with you to avoid these issues. You don’t even give people enough time to correct themselves before you do it for them. You may think you don’t do that but I’ve noticed you do that to many of us. I’ll except that’s who you are and move on.HughFreakingDillon said:
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.What’s sad about our situation is I usually always agree with your responses but I’m apprehensive about saying so.
I'm not going to address all of this again as it's been done and explained before, and frankly, no one here wants to read this. I'll just say this, as politely as I can: if every time I make a comment you are going to take it this personally, then just put me on ignore.
By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
So funny, you always have to have the last word too. And there you go “knowing” that no one wants to read this. Unbelievable how people don’t see themselves as others do. Done and doneHughFreakingDillon said:
forum expert? a couple weeks ago someone referred to me as "the guy who always posts stupid shit". perspectives are interesting.cblock4life said:
Been around long enough and read enough of your posts to know you like to explain other people’s postings when it’s not necessary. I consider all of us intelligent enough to understand each other and if not to ask questions ourselves. I’m not sure how other people feel about that but I find it offensive at times, not polite. You’re like the forum expert and I don’t necessarily mean that in a bad way but sometimes you need to realize that people get highly emotional about certain subjects and post with those emotions not following all the forum rules, just like your tagging comment. The first time I posted you misconstrued the whole thing. The second time you “corrected” me for not understanding what the poster was saying when I clearly understood them. You bashed me for apologizing privately and you were right so I did it openly on here. I love this forum mostly because it’s sharing with people who have so much in common (not just the music but social issues). Ok you say it’s not personal so I’ll accept that. I don’t care who agrees or disagrees with me because I learn more about the subject and myself. I’ve clearly refrained from commenting on your posts unless I agree with you to avoid these issues. You don’t even give people enough time to correct themselves before you do it for them. You may think you don’t do that but I’ve noticed you do that to many of us. I’ll except that’s who you are and move on.HughFreakingDillon said:
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.What’s sad about our situation is I usually always agree with your responses but I’m apprehensive about saying so.
I'm not going to address all of this again as it's been done and explained before, and frankly, no one here wants to read this. I'll just say this, as politely as I can: if every time I make a comment you are going to take it this personally, then just put me on ignore.Post edited by cblock4life on0 -
nicknyr15 said:
The idea definitely makes sense. But what if they don’t have a license? Getting pulled over without a license or a suspended license could get stressful. What if the vehicle is stolen? I understand the thought behind this but I just don’t think it’s 100% feasible, especially in bigger cities.static111 said:
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshieldI definitely think it's less simple than some of us (myself included) would like it to be. The one thing I know won't work is "do nothing" and so far it's a problem that we're simply admiring. Lots of things are on my mind but I don't really know what to do.- What kind of people desire to become cops (Kyle Rittenhouse) and why (the power and "hunt" as opposed to protecting and serving?)
- Do we need the "armed cop" culture/presence? Do other countries have the same culture? But how can you change that and continue to have the same protections? One example in the Twin Cities is cops doing "fare checks" on the light-rail-transit lines (which are honor system). It's been suggested that this should be done by unarmed people but I don't actually think they'd successfully fine most people; most people would just shove them (or worse) and move on. My solution is to just let it go and live with the fact that some people will free ride. But the outrage amongst suburbanites who put mannequins in the HOV lane would be unreal.
- The USA incarcerates at an alarming rate. Is that part of what raises the temperature when cops interact with people? Hopefully, as we decriminalize marijuana, that will be mitigated some.
- Are there examples in other places that can be emulated?
1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine
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fair enough.dignin said:
Take my silence as agreement, which is more often then not. We have way more in common than not.HughFreakingDillon said:
it's an open forum. people respond to me I haven't directed anything to, I do the same. everyone here does that. when you responded to mace, was it because he specifically tagged you? I'm guessing not. you responded to him because you had something to say.cblock4life said:
Obviously this is not going to go down well but here goes...remember I’m the one that unfortunately remembers most things I’ve read (I don’t hunt for previous posts) and you’re the one that remembers things more from in person.HughFreakingDillon said:
well I don't generally tell people on a forum how many non-whites I've spoken to, I can't speak for mace.cblock4life said:
I did say that based on what police officers have told me (even one who posted here awhile ago said it’s an attitude thing that bothered him so bad he quit and went to work for a community college). I truly believe it’s part of the universal training no matter where they live. I’m not sure mace has ever spoken to a black person (at least I don’t believe he’s ever stated speaking to blacks) so how could he know they’re all told to fight. I’m not changing my statement about cops because I believe that is what all cops are taught based on what I know and have seen, where I know for a fact that all blacks aren’t told to fight.HughFreakingDillon said:
but....didn't you say a few posts back that all cops are taught to be aggressive assholes based on a few family members' assertions?cblock4life said:
Not all young black men are told to fight back (there’s no way for you to know that they are all told that). Many are told to comply....I’ll say it again, speak with a variety of blacks before making that assumption.mace1229 said:
I would completely agree. I will also add that does not mean there are not bad cops, that things aren't bad, that there isn't profiling or stereotyping going on. And I think its dangerous to keep playing that narrative. I remember when Rayshard Brooks was killed the coverage of it was ridiculous. I think it was CNN that had a guest on that said Rayshard fought back and used the taser because he knew if he got into that cop car they would take him out and murder him. So he did the only thing he could do and was right to do it. Then the TV anchor agreed with the guest! That level of hate is dangerous, and is going ot get more young black people killed when they keep being told cops are out there to murder them, so fight back.Ledbetterman10 said:
No, I don't.Halifax2TheMax said:
Do you not think that every time a black person leaves their home, they wonder if they'll come home alive?Ledbetterman10 said:Halifax2TheMax said:
Is that not true? Are you that fucking blind? To inherent, systemic racism through all levels of ‘Murican society? From birth to death, no less.Ledbetterman10 said:
That's fair enough, I attributed a LeBron James quote to this place based on a similar sentiments, which I shouldn't do.static111 said:
Literally no one has said that around here. What has been said over and over is that there is racism inherent in our policing system and that for some reason(racism) cops are more scared of their lives at a traffic stop with People of Color than they are with white mass shooters. People the. Bend over backwards to come up with any theory they can that doesn’t point to the issue, which is systemic racism and bad policing. Then obfuscate the facts with made up anecdotes about hunting people...Ledbetterman10 said:
I'd be pissed too if I were you in that scenario. And nobody think he should've been shot. But let's throw out the notion that it was an accidental discharge, and go with the popular narrative around here that cops hunt black people and want to murder them. And as a lot of people say, even if you comply, you can still get killed. Alright, well then if you don't comply, you're likely going to get killed. So why resist and put yourself at the mercy of racist cops? I don't know. It's horrible that he shot like that and the cop should face major consequences. But while you both got pulled for air-fresheners (which is dumb in it's own right), you didn't have an active warrant that would require an arrest. And if you did, I doubt you're trying to break from the handcuffs and speed away.CM189191 said:
Kim Potter....another responsible gun owner!
I own a gun and like blunts. Should I be murdered for an air freshener hanging from my rearview mirror?
The reason this pisses me off so much is because a similar scenario happened to me. Pulled over in MN for an air freshener. One of those stupid little pine trees.
I'm driving home from Des Moines to Minneapolis. I got my car washed in Iowa. They put the air freshener there, being unfamiliar with MN air freshener laws. I was a recent transplant, also unfamiliar with MN air freshener law.
Cop comes up to the car and the air freshener was an obvious excuse to stick his nose in my car and start poking around. He starts asking questions, trying find something, anything to pin on me. Unnecessarily and intentionally trying to get me riled up.
I'm professional, and was wearing a suit at the time. Being fresh out of college, they question me for being too young to be so professional. So many questions: who are you, where are you going, anything in the car, and so on.
It was never about the air freshener. It was about harassing someone just trying to get home from work.
Is it true that black people are, as James says here, "literally hunted EVERYDAY/EVERYTIME we step foot outside the comfort of our homes!"? No, it's not.And if you’re being accurate I never said aggressive.
All I'm saying is you are making a general assertion based on your own anecdotal evidence and generalizing that to an entire country, where mace is doing the same thing, and you are claiming you can and he can't. that's all I'm pointing out.I once defended the Greek guy with all the pj info (sorry I’m horrible at names) and you replied that he was a big boy and could stick up for himself (not word for word I’m sure) so mace is a big boy and can stick up for himself. Next, I didn’t ask if you ever spoke to non whites, I was saying I didn’t know if mace did or not but thanks (I guess) for your answer and what’s the problem with admitting that I’ve spoken to many blacks for 30 years? Maybe I’m proud of that and can help people see things differently. And finally, what is your deal with me? Second time asking because I’ve never directed anything to you until you’ve corrected me or made me feel bad. I told you I’d leave you alone and I have except once I agreed with you...god forbid won’t happen again
I have nothing against you. I don't know you. Just because I respectfully disagree with someone doesn't mean I have a "deal" with them.
I'm not sure how I could have stated what I did more politely. how you took that/your reaction is your responsibility. I specifically did that knowing your history of having issues with me.
I agree with people I don't like, I disagree with people I do like, and vice versa. my comments never (ok, rarely) have anything to do with the poster, just the comment. Just ask dignin, for example. we don't get along but I agree with him often. he doesn't with me, but that's fine. I can handle it.
I generally only comment when I disagree.
however I will say your disagreements are often....uh....quite direct. LOL. hence my perception.Post edited by HughFreakingDillon onBy The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
I don't agree with that. If you broke the law, all cops should be allowed to enforce it. If the law isnt worth enforcing, then don't have it.static111 said:
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield
But with all this talk on more gun control, stricter enforcements, etc., wouldn't we want a traffic cop to have the ability to arrest someone with a warrant for gun charges instead of just waiting for the gun police, ATF, or whoever has the authority to enforce the gun laws?
Seems not only inadequate, but also very expensive, to have a different unit of police for traffic and criminal law. A traffic cops sees an armed robbery and has to call in the robbery unit because he can only write tickets?
0 -
i view it as kind of the same function of a parking authority or a citizen's arrest, not an actual cop. I'll do it if I deem it safe enough, but if not, I'm calling the cops.mace1229 said:
I don't agree with that. If you broke the law, all cops should be allowed to enforce it. If the law isnt worth enforcing, then don't have it.static111 said:
Would people be so worried and high stress if they knew that traffic cops were only responsible for traffic and other vehicle infractions and couldn’t expand their scope beyond what they are pulling someone over for? Probably not. I mean let’s say I have a trash bag of weed in my trunk and I get pulled over for expired tags and know that I can only get a ticket for a traffic violation, tags, etc. I’m not gonna have an oh shot moment, I’m gonna take my ticket and go.nicknyr15 said:
I hear you but you never know who you’re pulling over. Plenty of examples of very minor traffic stops resulting in cops getting shot at. I recently got pulled over for having a mask hanging on the rear view mirror. I never keep it there I just happened to hang it up in between some errands.static111 said:
There should be a whole division that deals with minor infractions that don’t carry lethal weapons and can’t issue any other citations than the one being stopped for.CM189191 said:static111 said:Here’s a good thread about some of the problems we have that could be easily fixed.
Maybe
It's also a stupid MN law:
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/169.71Prohibitions generally; exceptions. (a) A person shall not drive or operate any motor vehicle with:(2) any objects suspended between the driver and the windshield
But with all this talk on more gun control, stricter enforcements, etc., wouldn't we want a traffic cop to have the ability to arrest someone with a warrant for gun charges instead of just waiting for the gun police, ATF, or whoever has the authority to enforce the gun laws?
Seems not only inadequate, but also very expensive, to have a different unit of police for traffic and criminal law. A traffic cops sees an armed robbery and has to call in the robbery unit because he can only write tickets?
however, not sure how impaired driving would work. so yeah, not sure how that would go.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0
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