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  • tbergs
    tbergs Posts: 10,437


    February 2, 2021

    Author Headshot

    By David Leonhardt

     

    Good morning. Why has the U.S. economy fared so much better under Democratic presidents than Republicans?

     

     

    President Franklin D. Roosevelt in the White House in 1944.Henry Burroughs/Associated Press

    Blue at the top, red at the bottom

     

    Has the economy fared better under Democratic presidents or Republican presidents over the past century? The sensible answer might seem to be: It’s probably been similar.

    Presidents, after all, have only limited control over the economy. They don’t have much influence over the millions of decisions every day, made by consumers and business executives, that shape economic growth, jobs, incomes and stock prices. Over the course of a century, it seems logical that the economy would have performed similarly under Democrats and Republicans.

     

    But it hasn’t.

    The economy has fared far better under Democrats. The gap, as one academic paper puts it, is “startlingly large.” Here are the headline numbers:

     

    And here is a ranking of presidents by average annual G.D.P. growth:

     

    The gap exists not only for G.D.P. and jobs but also for incomes, productivity and stock prices. The gap also exists if you assume that a president’s policies affect the economy with a lag and don’t start his economic clock until months after he takes office. Virtually any reasonable look at the data shows a big Democratic advantage.

     

    My colleague Yaryna Serkez and I have just published a piece documenting the pattern and the potential reasons. A few possibilities are easy to reject. It’s not about congressional control, nor is it about Democrats running up larger budget deficits. (Republican presidents have run up larger deficits in recent decades.)

    Coincidence surely plays some role — but it’s highly unlikely to account for the entire gap, given its size, breadth and duration. Yaryna’s and my piece explores some of the most plausible explanations:

     

    • Republican presidents have been slow to respond to recessions and other crises — Donald Trump and both George Bushes being examples. (Herbert Hoover was too, and the partisan gap would be even bigger if the data went back far enough to include him.)
    • Recent Democratic presidents have been more pragmatic, willing to listen to the evidence about when the economy would benefit from deficit reduction and when it needs government support for education, infrastructure, scientific research and more.

     

    • Republican presidents over the past 40 years have pursued one economic policy above all other — tax cuts, skewed heavily toward the affluent — and there is little evidence that they do much for economic growth.

    Our piece has more details and charts, as well as comments from both conservative and liberal economists. Find it all here.

     


    It's a hopeless situation...
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • cutz
    cutz Posts: 12,269
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    I agree, but either way it's not a good look.
  • cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    cutz said:
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    I agree, but either way it's not a good look.
    just like it's not a good look for bill clinton to be pictured with epstein, because everyone knows, a good chunk of society will look at a picture and say "guilty!". 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • cutz said:
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    I agree, but either way it's not a good look.
    just like it's not a good look for bill clinton to be pictured with epstein, because everyone knows, a good chunk of society will look at a picture and say "guilty!". 
    Is that an OK sign A white power symbol Or just a right-wing troll   Southern Poverty Law Center
    Here's a better look.
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    edited February 2021
    yeah, as I said and thought was clear, roger stone isn't sarah sanders. there's no doubt about stone's affiliations. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
  • cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
    There was someone that did this to a congresswoman or senator, asked for a selfie then he proceeded to tell her to "Go Fuck Herself".

    I thought that was classy, no matter how much you disagree with them should you do this...
  • tbergs
    tbergs Posts: 10,437
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
    There was someone that did this to a congresswoman or senator, asked for a selfie then he proceeded to tell her to "Go Fuck Herself".

    I thought that was classy, no matter how much you disagree with them should you do this...
    That was done to that QAnon psycho. Her name needs to quit getting press.
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
    So the entire admin is guilty. got it. 
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,586
    edited February 2021
    i guess conservatives are right then, if proud boys taking selfies with trump admin staff means they're all nazis, then michelle obama calling harvery weinstein a great man, not to mention the clintons cozying up to him as well, must mean that democrats ARE in fact baby eating pedophiles in a pizza parlour. 

    how interesting. :how_interesting:
    By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.




  • Merkin Baller
    Merkin Baller Posts: 12,818
    edited February 2021
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
    So the entire admin is guilty. got it. 
    Your suggestion that she wouldn't have taken the picture if she knew who Enrique Torres was doesn't hold much water. 

    If SHB had a problem with white supremacists, she wouldn't have taken on the role of press secretary for this administration. 

    EDIT: 'trump's' administration 
    Post edited by Merkin Baller on
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,887
    i guess conservatives are right then, if proud boys taking selfies with trump admin staff means they're all nazis, then michelle obama calling harvery weinstein a great man, not to mention the clintons cozying up to him as well, must mean that democrats ARE in fact baby eating pedophiles in a pizza parlour. 

    how interesting. :how_interesting:
    Did Michelle take that picture after it was known that he was a rapist?
  • Both sides are the same. Got it.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

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  • Both sides are the same. Got it.
    Seriously. 
  • Both sides are the same. Got it.
    Seriously. 
    According to some.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • i guess conservatives are right then, if proud boys taking selfies with trump admin staff means they're all nazis, then michelle obama calling harvery weinstein a great man, not to mention the clintons cozying up to him as well, must mean that democrats ARE in fact baby eating pedophiles in a pizza parlour. 

    how interesting. :how_interesting:
    Had the Clintons or Obamas defended Epstein or Weinstein as 'very fine people' after allegations of their conduct was made known to the public, I might see your point, but to my knowledge they didn't. 

    Also, proud boys are a real thing, pizzagate isn't. 
  • static111
    static111 Posts: 5,112
    cutz said:
    i honestly don't put any stock in these types of pictures. it could easily just be a "hey Sarah! mind taking a selfie with me?" and she says "sure" not having a clue who it actually is. 

    if it was a pic of them riding in a limo, or having dinner together, that would be something. 
    In a vacuum, I agree... these pictures may / could be nothing, but the Proud Boys connection to trump associates has been established. Do you really think this is just a whole lot of smoke & there’s no fire here? 
    roger stone is no sarah sanders. she's not stupid. my guess is she didn't know who he was at the time. 

    She was the press secretary for an administration that courted and cozied up to these "very fine people" - a job she performed with great skill, passion, and also dishonesty. The plausible deniability angle is valid, but how much benefit of the doubt should be extended, all things considered? 

    I do agree, in and of itself, this picture means nothing. 

    But when this & pictures of proud boys cozying up to the likes of Don Jr, Lindsey Graham & others are considered in the context of who and what this administration was, dismissing it as an innocent faux pas is a hard sell. 
    So the entire admin is guilty. got it. 
    Yes
    Scio me nihil scire

    There are no kings inside the gates of eden
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