HughFreakingDillon said:

i'm so giddy for a landslide and for that entire Dump family to start pointing fingers and each other, public meltdown for the ages. 

I'm hoping to see a meltdown on my facebook feed.  These fuckers that keep posting "TRUMP2020LANDSLIDE" better be wrong.

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1323272425577000960?s=20

Sen. Bernie Sanders Calls Out the Democratic Party's Neglect of the Working Class
https://youtu.be/TmJnP3VXqSc

The problem is that the working class despises our positions on social issues.  So what do you do?  Do you advocate for your actual constituency, or change your social stances?

This is misleading man.  I’m working class as are millions of other people that support the social issues of the democrat party.  Not everyone that isn’t a CPA or PMP votes for Trump and the Repubs.  The reason Trump got elected is because he promised t working class something.  Granted he had no intention to deliver but he did at least make the effort to lie.  Abandoning working class as it were because they don’t share your social positions is not smart politics.  Honestly if you provide policies that help lower class and working class out In their lives it will be easier for people like me to talk to the people you are thinking of about the social issues.  A rising tide floats all boats.  If you provide the policies And not just hollow promises for the “working class“ whatever that actually means, They will come and the Democrats. Will have that old faithful reliable voting block in the pocket again.   When unions were strong and wages were high and property was affordable the working class vote was a given. 

“A given?” How do you explain Reagan, then?

Jimmy Carter being a weak president.  Also began deregulating industries Which angered many unions.

And yet he fired unionized air traffic controllers, weakened unions and overwhelming won re-election with support of the "working class." Some "given."

He did a handful
of good things but was overall very conservative and weak for the working class.  As wonderful of a philanthropist as he is now does not negate that he was a weak president that was very conservative by democrat standards and would likely not have been supported had not a flux of conservatives fled the republicans after Nixon.  But sure let’s discount millions of working people cause a small drooling minority of them support trump.  

Who's discounting "millions of working people?" You claimed that if the democratic ideals are embraced and promoted, "working class" would be a given. The "working class" is a large diverse group and the white, non-educated, the largest bloc, have increasingly left the dems because of the "other." They're not nor have they ever really been, a "given."

I tried to find some statistics.  The best I could find was that NCWs make up approximately 40% of the “working class” this according to an article from CBS in 2019.  According to PEW election data 60% of NCW “working class” support Trump.  So that makes up what 24% of NCW “working class” that support trump.   I would say yes working class policies would make working class votes a given.   Now if instead of actually saying “working class” and instead saying NCWs that support Trump I would agree that isn’t a given, but NCW Trump voters are actually a minority of the working class.

How do you define "working class?" I work, am I working class? Is it by type of job, blue collar versus white collar, for example? Or is it by income range? If so, what's the range? And who makes up the other 60% of "working class?"

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1323272425577000960?s=20

Sen. Bernie Sanders Calls Out the Democratic Party's Neglect of the Working Class
https://youtu.be/TmJnP3VXqSc

The problem is that the working class despises our positions on social issues.  So what do you do?  Do you advocate for your actual constituency, or change your social stances?

This all started in response to @mrussel1 a comment about the working class.  Let’s ask him what definition he was meaning?  I think usually it refers to people that aren’t in middle management and above and do actual labor.  What do you traditionally think of when you think of the working class @halifax2t@Halifax2TheMax ?
is there a political scientist approved definition?

I typically think blue collar within a defined income range. But I'm not sure what the low and high ends of that are. $35K to $60K? I'm just trying to understand why you would say if dems cared about "working class" issues, the "working class" would be a given to go dem. That has not been the case since at least Reagan.

Ok so we agree that the problems are 60% of NCWs and not the entire working class.  It’s really a language thing. I mean conservative non college white conservatives is a voting block for sure. But their power and influence is waning as more and more integration are taking place within families, neighborhoods, and work places.  I’d venture to say that the really problematic NCWs are the ones that live in rural mostly white areas and have no or limited intercultural reactions. I still think that the working class of today is largely voting dem and largely progressive.  It is just that really loud 60% of NCWs.  Would policies that benefit working class Americans and by extension the 60% NCW that are the real problem here do more to sway those NCWs back to Dem, I still think so.  I’m not talking one election cycle I’m talking 10 ish years of actual progress along with very straightforward messaging in plain language about how regressive Republican policies got them there in the first place. All of this is out the window if Democracy dies tomorrow.  Then everybody is gonna get screwed.

mrussel1 said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

static111 said:

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1323272425577000960?s=20

Sen. Bernie Sanders Calls Out the Democratic Party's Neglect of the Working Class
https://youtu.be/TmJnP3VXqSc

The problem is that the working class despises our positions on social issues.  So what do you do?  Do you advocate for your actual constituency, or change your social stances?

This is misleading man.  I’m working class as are millions of other people that support the social issues of the democrat party.  Not everyone that isn’t a CPA or PMP votes for Trump and the Repubs.  The reason Trump got elected is because he promised t working class something.  Granted he had no intention to deliver but he did at least make the effort to lie.  Abandoning working class as it were because they don’t share your social positions is not smart politics.  Honestly if you provide policies that help lower class and working class out In their lives it will be easier for people like me to talk to the people you are thinking of about the social issues.  A rising tide floats all boats.  If you provide the policies And not just hollow promises for the “working class“ whatever that actually means, They will come and the Democrats. Will have that old faithful reliable voting block in the pocket again.   When unions were strong and wages were high and property was affordable the working class vote was a given. 

“A given?” How do you explain Reagan, then?

Jimmy Carter being a weak president.  Also began deregulating industries Which angered many unions.

And yet he fired unionized air traffic controllers, weakened unions and overwhelming won re-election with support of the "working class." Some "given."

He did a handful
of good things but was overall very conservative and weak for the working class.  As wonderful of a philanthropist as he is now does not negate that he was a weak president that was very conservative by democrat standards and would likely not have been supported had not a flux of conservatives fled the republicans after Nixon.  But sure let’s discount millions of working people cause a small drooling minority of them support trump.  

Who's discounting "millions of working people?" You claimed that if the democratic ideals are embraced and promoted, "working class" would be a given. The "working class" is a large diverse group and the white, non-educated, the largest bloc, have increasingly left the dems because of the "other." They're not nor have they ever really been, a "given."

I tried to find some statistics.  The best I could find was that NCWs make up approximately 40% of the “working class” this according to an article from CBS in 2019.  According to PEW election data 60% of NCW “working class” support Trump.  So that makes up what 24% of NCW “working class” that support trump.   I would say yes working class policies would make working class votes a given.   Now if instead of actually saying “working class” and instead saying NCWs that support Trump I would agree that isn’t a given, but NCW Trump voters are actually a minority of the working class.

How do you define "working class?" I work, am I working class? Is it by type of job, blue collar versus white collar, for example? Or is it by income range? If so, what's the range? And who makes up the other 60% of "working class?"

mrussel1 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1323272425577000960?s=20

Sen. Bernie Sanders Calls Out the Democratic Party's Neglect of the Working Class
https://youtu.be/TmJnP3VXqSc

The problem is that the working class despises our positions on social issues.  So what do you do?  Do you advocate for your actual constituency, or change your social stances?

This all started in response to @mrussel1 a comment about the working class.  Let’s ask him what definition he was meaning?  I think usually it refers to people that aren’t in middle management and above and do actual labor.  What do you traditionally think of when you think of the working class @halifax2t@Halifax2TheMax ?
is there a political scientist approved definition?

I typically think blue collar within a defined income range. But I'm not sure what the low and high ends of that are. $35K to $60K? I'm just trying to understand why you would say if dems cared about "working class" issues, the "working class" would be a given to go dem. That has not been the case since at least Reagan.

Ok so we agree that the problems are 60% of NCWs and not the entire working class.  It’s really a language thing. I mean conservative non college white conservatives is a voting block for sure. But their power and influence is waning as more and more integration are taking place within families, neighborhoods, and work places.  I’d venture to say that the really problematic NCWs are the ones that live in rural mostly white areas and have no or limited intercultural reactions. I still think that the working class of today is largely voting dem and largely progressive.  It is just that really loud 60% of NCWs.  Would policies that benefit working class Americans and by extension the 60% NCW that are the real problem here do more to sway those NCWs back to Dem, I still think so.  I’m not talking one election cycle I’m talking 10 ish years of actual progress along with very straightforward messaging in plain language about how regressive Republican policies got them there in the first place. All of this is out the window if Democracy dies tomorrow.  Then everybody is gonna get screwed.

Agree on your ending part about 10 years and democracy dying tomorrow.  I absolutely support progressive tax policies and tax credits that favor the middle and lower class, balancing the country out.  I also favor free community college and state for "in demand" type professions, for those that qualify financially.  In particular I want that to happen for retraining of people mid career so that there isn't the (understandable) fear of change with our global and digital economy. We're not going to stop it, so let's adjust to it. 

Those are some fine ideas that I think would get broad support amongst voters.  Fuck I hope trump doesn’t pull a coup tomorrow

hedonist said:

What does NCW mean?

Non college educated whites

MayDay10 said:

Those 127,000 ballots in Texas will be counted now.  Fuck you Trump

Hell yes!!!

mfc2006 said:

MayDay10 said:

Those 127,000 ballots in Texas will be counted now.  Fuck you Trump

Hell yes!!!

How ridiculous that anyone thinks it would be a good thing not to...

mrussel1 said:

mcgruff10 said:

MayDay10 said:

Those 127,000 ballots in Texas will be counted now.  Fuck you Trump

Wow!!!! If Biden wins Texas then @mrussel1 will be buying the first five rounds at the next us pj show.

See you in Baltimore with my credit line increased.  I'll gladly buy a round or two. 

Edit - or 5. I'll give you all some Colorado candy to make it a real party 

My man!!! Nice work.  

MayDay10 said:

Those 127,000 ballots in Texas will be counted now.  Fuck you Trump

How fucked up that this is even something we have to consider a victory. It should have been a no Brainerd not even up for debate. Alas, here we are celebrating the "victory". That's how normalized his fuckery has become.

The Juggler said:

darwinstheory said:

MayDay10 said:

Those 127,000 ballots in Texas will be counted now.  Fuck you Trump

How fucked up that this is even something we have to consider a victory. It should have been a no Brainerd not even up for debate. Alas, here we are celebrating the "victory". That's how normalized his fuckery has become.

We're putting an end to it tomorrow. 

Isn't this more of a republican thing than a Trump thing...