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The Democratic Presidential Debates

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  • CM189191CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    What if Monicas Apple-party has one third of the seats in congress and one third of the senate. And the republicans and democrats have one third each?

    For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government.  We are not a multi-party system.  We are not set up that way.  
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    CM189191 said:

    For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government.  We are not a multi-party system.  We are not set up that way.  
    So what happens?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,858
    So what happens?
    Considering you have yeas and nays on votes, you probably have a parliamentary style coalition building for actual legislation.  This is all well and good.  However, where it would show up more directly is in the electoral college.  If there are three candidates and no one gets 270 (majority) of the electoral votes, then the House of Reps gets to pick the president.  The last time this happened was 1824.  Because of that situation, the multi-party system faded away in the US.  
  • CM189191CM189191 Posts: 6,927

    Who in here said that was happening (here)?

    This was your hypothetical, you said this: 

    "So, what in your constitutional republic with your three branches of government stops Monica, who has 3 apples, from, in theory, starting a party, getting a lot of traction and, a strong organization and trying to run for Senator, or congressperson or President for her newly started party?"

    So again, you're conflating legality with a complete lack of understanding of how our political system works

    Let's use a simple analogy to help drive home the point:
    There's nothing illegal about drinking bleach to stop coronavirus.  I will go so far as to agree that if you drink enough bleach, you will absolutely eventually rid yourself of coronavirus.  But it's not illegal, it's just incredibly stupid and reflects a complete lack of understanding of bleach, coronavirus, and your immune system works.  By all means, please drink all the bleach you want.
  • what dreamswhat dreams Posts: 1,761
    CM189191 said:

    For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government.  We are not a multi-party system.  We are not set up that way.  
    And let's add:  there is no Congress AND Senate. Congress is made up of two legislative bodies -- a House of Representatives and a Senate. My trigger is when people call the House Congress. 
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    And let's add:  there is no Congress AND Senate. Congress is made up of two legislative bodies -- a House of Representatives and a Senate. My trigger is when people call the House Congress. 
    I bet it is like when people use DE and DEM wrong over here. One advice if you come over for the Pearl Jam show at Lollapalooza - do not make that mistake.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 10,506
    CM189191 said:

    For the hundredth time, our checks and balances are within the 3 branches of government.  We are not a multi-party system.  We are not set up that way.  
    The Libertarian Presidential candidate will be on the ballot in all 50 states and they will run candidates in many, many races across the country. Other than winning some local races, they just haven't gathered much traction. Same with the Greens. SC's scenario could certainly happen; it's not likely but it's most possible with a party that has an existing infrastructure. 

    Democratic Socialists have chosen to try and take hold of the Democratic Party rather than start their own party. Strategic choice, although an uphill battle either way.
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    edited March 2020
    mrussel1 said:
    Considering you have yeas and nays on votes, you probably have a parliamentary style coalition building for actual legislation.  This is all well and good.  However, where it would show up more directly is in the electoral college.  If there are three candidates and no one gets 270 (majority) of the electoral votes, then the House of Reps gets to pick the president.  The last time this happened was 1824.  Because of that situation, the multi-party system faded away in the US.  
    I don't see anything here that disputes my original post:





    Get yourself some more parties.


    Seems to be very much theoretically possible to get yourself some more parties. And switch things up. Even on the highest level.

    #democracyfuckyeah

    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • CM189191CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    pjl44 said:
    The Libertarian Presidential candidate will be on the ballot in all 50 states and they will run candidates in many, many races across the country. Other than winning some local races, they just haven't gathered much traction. Same with the Greens. SC's scenario could certainly happen; it's not likely but it's most possible with a party that has an existing infrastructure. 

    Democratic Socialists have chosen to try and take hold of the Democratic Party rather than start their own party. Strategic choice, although an uphill battle either way.
    meme



    America Isn’t Really Set Up For Third-Party Presidential Bids

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/america-isnt-really-set-up-for-third-party-presidential-bids/
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,858
    I don't see anything here that disputes my original post:


    Seems to be very much theoretically possible to get yourself some more parties. And switch things up. Even on the highest level.

    #democracyfuckyeah

    I don't know what that argument is all about, was busy having my own.  But I don't think having each election settled in the HOR is desirable.  Do you?
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 41,927
    But let me guess, you wouldn't uh-oh burn anything or think about burning anything if instead of Bernie in the pic was e.g. Verizons CEO?

    Wanting citizens to not die from not being able to afford health care because of prices set for the stockholders is scary stuff. 
    Why would I do that? I like my Verizon. Most dependable cell service I’ve ever had. Now, if it were the CEO of ticketbastard?! Bernie guarantees four more years of Team Trump Treason. SC tells us so.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;

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  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 10,506
    CM189191 said:
    meme



    America Isn’t Really Set Up For Third-Party Presidential Bids

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/america-isnt-really-set-up-for-third-party-presidential-bids/
    I point out the broad strokes of that article in my post. That headline and your answer to SC are bad, especially if you're an American trying to have a discussion with a Swede.
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 10,506
    Gary Johnson picked up 4.5 million votes in his 2016 Presidential bid. Nowhere near enough to win, but that's significant and a lot of people marking the box.
  • CM189191CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    pjl44 said:
    Gary Johnson picked up 4.5 million votes in his 2016 Presidential bid. Nowhere near enough to win, but that's significant and a lot of people marking the box.


    "Nowhere near enough to win, but that's significant"

    go look up the word significant, read that out loud to yourself, and tell me it still makes sense 
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    edited March 2020



    Obvious mistake..... I... gues....... but still.
    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,108
    Serious question that remains unanswered: why is Bernie Sanders allowed to run as a democrat when he is not a democrat? 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,748
    No question about that. 

    And what would a slight lead for Bernie do?

    Bernie is DC trying to make Justice League happen while Marvel is rolling out Avengers after Avengers. The bern has passed.

    There is a question. Bernie is favored in CA & TX, and they are the 2 biggest states voting today
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,748
    mrussel1 said:
    Yes, while it wasn't 50+1%, it was a thumping.  

    This is similar to what I've been saying. To add to the turnout issue in SC and SC is more if a bellwether than the other early states, bernie got a poor turnout in the states he finished at or near the top. That should be a warning to bernie. 

    The DNC is not solely looking at who won, but how they won and what the demos were.
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    edited March 2020
    mcgruff10 said:
    Serious question that remains unanswered: why is Bernie Sanders allowed to run as a democrat when he is not a democrat? 


    The DNC mandated that every candidate running for president in 2020 "affirm, in writing, to the National Chairperson of the Democratic National Committee that they: A. are a member of the Democratic Party; B. will accept the Democratic nomination; and C. will run and serve as a member of the Democratic Party."
    Sanders signed this affirmation document. (You can see it here.) He also filled out official paperwork with the Federal Election Commission stating that he was running for president as a Democrat. The DNC told PolitiFact that every other candidate who ran for the nomination signed it as well.
    Sanders "is recognized as a candidate for the Democratic nomination because the national party acknowledges him as one of the candidates," said Josh Putnam, a political scientist who specializes in delegate selection rules. As a practical matter, Putnam said, the Democratic Party was in something of a box for 2020, since it had already allowed him to run in 2016. The party "certainly couldn't or wouldn't backtrack on that now," he said.


    Doesn't seem unanswered?

    Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,858
    edited March 2020


    Do they hate Biden too?
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    edited March 2020
    mrussel1 said:


    Do they hate Biden too?
    CHRIS MATTHEWS RETIRES

    AND THE WHOLE PLACE FALL APART
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • CM189191CM189191 Posts: 6,927


    Hard to argue there's a media bias against Bernie
  • hedonisthedonist Posts: 24,524
    Ah, yes. Ms. Duntz. We must all revere her opinion just as with any other celebrity!
  • Spiritual_ChaosSpiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,413
    edited March 2020
    hedonist said:
    Ah, yes. Ms. Duntz. We must all revere her opinion just as with any other celebrity!
    I revere it. My brother helped her out with her wedding dress that got stuck, when she was here filming Melancholia and he was an extra. 





    Amy K has never thrown a stapler at someone here, that I know of.


    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • Lerxst1992Lerxst1992 Posts: 7,748
    VA called right away

    According to preliminary exit polls in Virginia, about half the electorate said they decided who to vote for in the last few days.

    Biden won 52% of that group compared to just 20% for Sanders.


  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 30,858
    VA called right away

    According to preliminary exit polls in Virginia, about half the electorate said they decided who to vote for in the last few days.

    Biden won 52% of that group compared to just 20% for Sanders.


    I’m continuously proud of my state.
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 44,240
    NC called for Biden....
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
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    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mcgruff10mcgruff10 New Jersey Posts: 29,108
    VA called right away

    According to preliminary exit polls in Virginia, about half the electorate said they decided who to vote for in the last few days.

    Biden won 52% of that group compared to just 20% for Sanders.


    This is great news. 
    I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
This discussion has been closed.